Save This Season, Fire The Marmot NOW

[cardinalsfever44]

"Pothetic". Love it.

At a glance the Cards lost today primarily because Helsley walked the house. How could Marmol have avoided that?

By leaving Maton in to finish the game

Haha. Genius!

20/20 managing at its finest.

#RiffRaff4Manager

Whatever. Maton was razor sharp and threw hardly any pitches. Oli overmanages a lot.

So your managerial decision is to NOT pitch your closer, who is one of the best in MLB, in a 4-2 lead in Boston?

I think you should apply to be an MLB manager ASAP. Seriously. Absolute genius in the making.

It’s not that crazy of an idea. It’s doubtful he would have used maton in both games he certainty wouldnt have used helsely in both and if he would have used maton in the second game it would have been to close instead of helsely so why not just let maton Finish this one? In double headers you have to sometimes you can’t just paint by numbers which is the only way oli can win.

There isn't a single coach in the history of MLB that doesn't bring Helsley in with a 4-2 lead in the 9th. Just stop.

lol you can’t speak for every coach in the history of MLB just stop. You’re a paint by numbers guy also cool

Phil Maton

This place is so stupid.

[riff raff]

"Pothetic". Love it.

At a glance the Cards lost today primarily because Helsley walked the house. How could Marmol have avoided that?

By leaving Maton in to finish the game

Haha. Genius!

20/20 managing at its finest.

#RiffRaff4Manager

Whatever. Maton was razor sharp and threw hardly any pitches. Oli overmanages a lot.

So your managerial decision is to NOT pitch your closer, who is one of the best in MLB, in a 4-2 lead in Boston?

I think you should apply to be an MLB manager ASAP. Seriously. Absolute genius in the making.

It’s not that crazy of an idea. It’s doubtful he would have used maton in both games he certainty wouldnt have used helsely in both and if he would have used maton in the second game it would have been to close instead of helsely so why not just let maton Finish this one? In double headers you have to sometimes you can’t just paint by numbers which is the only way oli can win.

There isn't a single coach in the history of MLB that doesn't bring Helsley in with a 4-2 lead in the 9th. Just stop.

He effectively burned his best relievers in one fell swoop. Who closes tonight? Roycroft you're up.

Maton threw 6 pitches.

Just for the record, you are still sticking with the "Phil Maton should have closed this game out" narrative.

My god this place is so freaking dumb.

No, just you. And Oli

[woofy25]

people here screamed to fire shildt.

Shildt wasn't great but I don't remember people screaming for him to be fired.

Shildt was very good.

[Ozziesfan41]

"Pothetic". Love it.

At a glance the Cards lost today primarily because Helsley walked the house. How could Marmol have avoided that?

By leaving Maton in to finish the game

Haha. Genius!

20/20 managing at its finest.

#RiffRaff4Manager

Whatever. Maton was razor sharp and threw hardly any pitches. Oli overmanages a lot.

So your managerial decision is to NOT pitch your closer, who is one of the best in MLB, in a 4-2 lead in Boston?

I think you should apply to be an MLB manager ASAP. Seriously. Absolute genius in the making.

It’s not that crazy of an idea. It’s doubtful he would have used maton in both games he certainty wouldnt have used helsely in both and if he would have used maton in the second game it would have been to close instead of helsely so why not just let maton Finish this one? In double headers you have to sometimes you can’t just paint by numbers which is the only way oli can win.

There isn't a single coach in the history of MLB that doesn't bring Helsley in with a 4-2 lead in the 9th. Just stop.

He effectively burned his best relievers in one fell swoop. Who closes tonight? Roycroft you're up.

Maton threw 6 pitches.

Just for the record, you are still sticking with the "Phil Maton should have closed this game out" narrative.

My god this place is so freaking dumb.

So Phil maton would have closed the second game so it’s cool to use maton to close the second game but dumb to use him to close this one in which he was pitching well already? God that’s dumb logic

[cardinalsfever44]

"Pothetic". Love it.

At a glance the Cards lost today primarily because Helsley walked the house. How could Marmol have avoided that?

By leaving Maton in to finish the game

Haha. Genius!

20/20 managing at its finest.

#RiffRaff4Manager

Whatever. Maton was razor sharp and threw hardly any pitches. Oli overmanages a lot.

So your managerial decision is to NOT pitch your closer, who is one of the best in MLB, in a 4-2 lead in Boston?

I think you should apply to be an MLB manager ASAP. Seriously. Absolute genius in the making.

It’s not that crazy of an idea. It’s doubtful he would have used maton in both games he certainty wouldnt have used helsely in both and if he would have used maton in the second game it would have been to close instead of helsely so why not just let maton Finish this one? In double headers you have to sometimes you can’t just paint by numbers which is the only way oli can win.

There isn't a single coach in the history of MLB that doesn't bring Helsley in with a 4-2 lead in the 9th. Just stop.

He effectively burned his best relievers in one fell swoop. Who closes tonight? Roycroft you're up.

Maton threw 6 pitches.

Just for the record, you are still sticking with the "Phil Maton should have closed this game out" narrative.

My god this place is so freaking dumb.

So Phil maton would have closed the second game so it’s cool to use maton to close the second game but dumb to use him to close this one in which he was pitching well already? God that’s dumb logic

Ah, so you know the 2nd game is going to be a save situation in the Cards favor? You are seriously dumb dude.

You win the game in front of you.

I can't believe I'm actually responding to this idiocy. Enjoy your evening.

[Bob Kunush]

What genius smilinjoefission managerial decisions would have won this game?

Any other manager in MLB would have either moved Contreras down in the lineup or given him a day or two off to find himself.

-Oli basically cost us the season in 23 when he refused to move the .150 avg/.500 OPS WIlly Long Con out of the cleanup spot and the team dug an insurmountable hole in April/May.
-Oli DID cost us the season in 22 when he pulled Quintana after 74 pitches and put a closer who jammed a finger on his throwing 3-days before in for 2 innings.
-Oli is once again being the stubborn sack of sh*t refusing to move Contreras again. My bad, he did move him Game 1, though, from the 2-spot to the 3!

I've never despised a manager more in my life. He has done nothing but lose, lose, lose his entire managing career.

First of all, your point is not true. In fact; Devers started the year out horribly the Red Sox didn’t move him down. In fact, several good hitters started out the season poorly and when I looked none were moved down significantly if at all in the order.

Your last point is also false. Ollie has a winning record as a manager despite the horrible 2023 and a very underachieving team in 2024.


Lastly, this thread proves that MDS (Marmol Derangement Syndrome) is alive and well with a large number of Cards Talk posters.

Ryan Helsley lost today’s game, not Ollie Marmol.

[Ozziesfan41]

"Pothetic". Love it.

At a glance the Cards lost today primarily because Helsley walked the house. How could Marmol have avoided that?

By leaving Maton in to finish the game

Haha. Genius!

20/20 managing at its finest.

#RiffRaff4Manager

Whatever. Maton was razor sharp and threw hardly any pitches. Oli overmanages a lot.

So your managerial decision is to NOT pitch your closer, who is one of the best in MLB, in a 4-2 lead in Boston?

I think you should apply to be an MLB manager ASAP. Seriously. Absolute genius in the making.

It’s not that crazy of an idea. It’s doubtful he would have used maton in both games he certainty wouldnt have used helsely in both and if he would have used maton in the second game it would have been to close instead of helsely so why not just let maton Finish this one? In double headers you have to sometimes you can’t just paint by numbers which is the only way oli can win.

There isn't a single coach in the history of MLB that doesn't bring Helsley in with a 4-2 lead in the 9th. Just stop.

He effectively burned his best relievers in one fell swoop. Who closes tonight? Roycroft you're up.

Maton threw 6 pitches.

Just for the record, you are still sticking with the "Phil Maton should have closed this game out" narrative.

My god this place is so freaking dumb.

So Phil maton would have closed the second game so it’s cool to use maton to close the second game but dumb to use him to close this one in which he was pitching well already? God that’s dumb logic

Ah, so you know the 2nd game is going to be a save situation in the Cards favor? You are seriously dumb dude.

You win the game in front of you.

I can't believe I'm actually responding to this idiocy. Enjoy your evening.

So you don’t think good managers plan ahead inning by inning game by game series by series? I can’t believe I actually respond to this idiocy lol if a manager is only planning on how to win one game of a double header then he is a dumb manager. Especially with a 2 run lead he should have let maton try to close it out

[alw80]

people here screamed to fire shildt.

Shildt wasn't great but I don't remember people screaming for him to be fired.

Shildt was very good.

He was very similar to Matheny.

[Mort Gage]

Bloom will choose his own manager next offseason. Barring a complete collapse firing Oli during the season wouldn't accomplish much.

[Dazepster]

people here screamed to fire shildt.

Shildt wasn't great but I don't remember people screaming for him to be fired.

Shildt was very good.

He was very similar to Matheny.

He was nothing at all like Matheny!!!

[alw80]

people here screamed to fire shildt.

Shildt wasn't great but I don't remember people screaming for him to be fired.

Shildt was very good.

He was very similar to Matheny.

He was nothing at all like Matheny!!!

Made the same bad moves with the BP and was just as bad at double switches as MM. Much more likeable guy though.

[Dazepster]

people here screamed to fire shildt.

Shildt wasn't great but I don't remember people screaming for him to be fired.

Shildt was very good.

He was very similar to Matheny.

He was nothing at all like Matheny!!!

Made the same bad moves with the BP and was just as bad at double switches as MM. Much more likeable guy though.

For a dude that made a living off his defense he eschewed it as a MLB manager. Smart and advantageous base running he couldn't give a toss.

Shildt restored those Core Cardinal Fundamentals.

Started following in the mid 70's. 1975-77.

Bad years, good years, ups, downs. Independent of what blip or dip you may have been in you could be certain of 1 thing. The Cards were going to play sound ball. Were not going to beat themselves too often. Sure, underpowered or underfunded all too often. But were well schooled fundamentally. Kissell. And what came to be known as the Cardinal Way.

Matheny and Moe burned the last vestiges of it Post Steroid Larussa.

Shildt, a former student and disciple of The Kissell Way, cause that is what it really was, restored some semblance of it..as much as one could/can in today's baseball environment.

And it was good. And exciting. And his Reyes move was no better than Matheny/Wacha. I will concede that.

But he was No Matheny!!!

[alw80]

people here screamed to fire shildt.

Shildt wasn't great but I don't remember people screaming for him to be fired.

Shildt was very good.

He was very similar to Matheny.

He was nothing at all like Matheny!!!

Made the same bad moves with the BP and was just as bad at double switches as MM. Much more likeable guy though.

For a dude that made a living off his defense he eschewed it as a MLB manager. Smart and advantageous base running he couldn't give a toss.

Shildt restored those Core Cardinal Fundamentals.

Started following in the mid 70's. 1975-77.

Bad years, good years, ups, downs. Independent of what blip or dip you may have been in you could be certain of 1 thing. The Cards were going to play sound ball. Were not going to beat themselves too often. Sure, underpowered or underfunded all too often. But were well schooled fundamentally. Kissell. And what came to be known as the Cardinal Way.

Matheny and Moe burned the last vestiges of it Post Steroid Larussa.

Shildt, a former student and disciple of The Kissell Way, cause that is what it really was, restored some semblance of it..as much as one could/can in today's baseball environment.

And it was good. And exciting. And his Reyes move was no better than Matheny/Wacha. I will concede that.

But he was No Matheny!!!

As an in game manager, both are less than ideal. I don't watch Padres games so maybe hes improved but he wasn't great here.

[Rocket Scientist]

When you have a player not doing his job someone called a manager got to correct the immediate problem.

The manager failed the pitcher, the fans and the players, by not doing his job, evaluation the situations and make change attempt to happen. Pitchers just have bad days and someone with balls needs to recognize when they do and take them out.

[Goldfan]

Oli has no feel for the game……he’s programmed…..Helsley is the closer so close he does…..walk……walk……walk….hes the the closer same [nonsense] in Philly playoff game

[woofy25]

people here screamed to fire shildt.

Shildt wasn't great but I don't remember people screaming for him to be fired.

Shildt was very good.

He was very similar to Matheny.

Completely wrong. He immediately turned around the defense and base running, mid season. It was a glaring difference and are big reasons why they finished so much better than they started.
Please tell me how they were so similar