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RunSup wrote: ↑22 Oct 2025 14:38 pm

renostl wrote: ↑22 Oct 2025 14:18 pm

RunSup wrote: ↑22 Oct 2025 13:45 pm

renostl wrote: ↑19 Oct 2025 01:15 am

RunSup wrote: ↑18 Oct 2025 22:26 pm

renostl wrote: ↑18 Oct 2025 13:02 pm

RunSup wrote: ↑18 Oct 2025 08:31 am Gee, Mike Shildt used foul language and was irritable with coaches and players that relied on analytics rather than focus on and teach good fundamentals. Golly! Gosh! Gee Wilakers!

Was Shildt abusive? Or was he just too staunchly old school and crochety for this over sensitive generation? Does anybody really care anymore?

Yes he could've been more accepting of modern tech and methods. But his focus on fundamentals and the good way to play baseball helped turn 2 underachieving teams around and into the playoffs.

And God only knows what Bernie is crowing about. It was widely reported in StL that Shildt had little patience and a short temper when he had it out with Mo. I don't remember Bernie adding anything more to the conversation. But if he needs to claim victory, fine. Whatever Bernie said back then was easy-obvious-correct. Congratulations.

Who cares?

Do we really think that a coach was fired twice because he uses foul language?
Seems equally disingenuous. Fired because of being competitive or having standards.

Seems insulting to every coach in the country.

We don't know what happened in MO's office either. Possibly nothing but not
MO's behavior to say either way. I actually agree with Cranny in thinking he should have been suspended when he asked
the umpire "you want to go". Come on.


I'll be of the opinion that Mike has went above the acceptable normal until proven otherwise
because as people point out, he put teams in position to win.

I'm not a Bernie fan either although he can do good work. He chooses to be less complete IMO, than
in his past.

I think Shildt does not have a job because

1. He insisted on a right way to play the game that valued fundamentals over technology.

2. He doesn't believe in selling out for power and believed there were many ways to score runs by being able to execute sound baseball.

3. When he thought something was wrong in management or coaching approach he called it out.

4. He may have dismissed state of the art approaches and differing ideas.

5. He had a blunt, gruff style and swore like a sailor. Some could accept or responded to its. Others were offended and threatened to leave.

6. He pointed out a declining development organization and bad approaches. Apparently he did that by cursing out his boss in a staff meeting that was scheduled right after the team was bounced out of the playoffs in the first round when passions were still high.

He was not wrong on fundamentals. He's also not a patient and sensitive communicator that this generation needs.

I laugh at any in StL media who claim they reported that Shildt was abusive towards his coaches at the time. I have not bothered to listen to what Bernie said this week, so I really don't know what he is claiming.

Derick Goold himself said in his BPiBB podcast that he did not report coach abuse because that's not what his sources told him. There was a heated exchange with Jeff Albert at mid season about hitting approaches in 2022. The approach was modified and the Cardinals made it to the playoffs.

There is more speculation here than I care to continue with. It’s how this topic has to go. I responded to it because the thought that foul language, being gruff, too rough for today's standards, teaching fundamentals, situational hitting got him fired
I disagree.

His issues, IF he does have them, are not stand alone in St. Louis now for he is now retired.
He may well be out of baseball with little to do with foul language, or disagreement in approach or strategy.
Hopefully for Mike he can work in his career if he desires to.

Agreed that the whole topic is speculation. Even reports from a SD reporter with named sources. Nobody here was in the room.

Shildt has a good baseball mind. Hopefully if he wants to continue a career in baseball he can without being black balled.

Also I didn't say he got fired for foul language. You said I said that. So that's your straw man.

But really like I said earlier and you say here. Who cares?

The bolded along with comments throughout the thread might be reason to
think that you were among those with that opinion. Sorry for the misunderstanding but not really strawman.

Sorry for sarcasm. Just heard a lot of post-Cardinal life bashing of Shildt last week. Stuff you never really saw in his public persona.

I speculate that he holds the Cardinal Way manual as baseball development scripture and may be unwilling to appreciate modern methods then dismissing anyone who doesn't cite The Way.

Pure speculation on my part. Doesn't mean The Way is wrong.

In DG's podcast he mentioned that Oli was the peacemaker. At least with the coaches. None of what he said was clear enough to know what happened. So that's all you'll get.

I don't need to keep talking about it. Peace.