11WSChamps wrote: ↑27 Aug 2026 10:05 am
Bullpen has a chance to be pretty good next year even if there are no major additions although I'm sure there will be at least one.
O'Brien, Gastelum, Soriano, Stanek, Bruihl, Hjerpe and Graceffo as your long man. If not worked to death and being cheap thats not a bad group.
Like I say there will be some help coming but as a base to start from and for the cost not bad.
people thought same going ibto this year but it was terrible. even before being overworked.
relievers can be inconsistent year to yesr outside elite. obrien has faded. soriano has heavily faded after a hot start and had unimpressive minor league career. soriano could easily fade back to being terrible. i could see that group being okay or being worst bullpen in majors. need more arms.
rockondlouie wrote: ↑27 Aug 2026 08:55 amLast 8 GP
9 1/3 IP
1 ER (when Oli tried to have him go two innings, not a bad idea)
0.96 ERA
-0.45 FiP
4 Hits
1 BB
18 STRIKEOUTS! D A M N
This kid has really settled in after getting adjusted to MLB.
11WSChamps wrote: ↑27 Aug 2026 10:05 am
Bullpen has a chance to be pretty good next year even if there are no major additions although I'm sure there will be at least one.
O'Brien, Gastelum, Soriano, Stanek, Bruihl, Hjerpe and Graceffo as your long man. If not worked to death and being cheap thats not a bad group.
Like I say there will be some help coming but as a base to start from and for the cost not bad.
people thought same going ibto this year but it was terrible. even before being overworked.
relievers can be inconsistent year to yesr outside elite. obrien has faded. soriano has heavily faded after a hot start and had unimpressive minor league career. soriano could easily fade back to being terrible. i could see that group being okay or being worst bullpen in majors. need more arms.
That’s the way bullpen arms are. Last season they had one of the best bullpens in the majors if they had brought the same players back it would be a worse bullpen than it is now
11WSChamps wrote: ↑27 Aug 2026 10:05 am
Bullpen has a chance to be pretty good next year even if there are no major additions although I'm sure there will be at least one.
O'Brien, Gastelum, Soriano, Stanek, Bruihl, Hjerpe and Graceffo as your long man. If not worked to death and being cheap thats not a bad group.
Like I say there will be some help coming but as a base to start from and for the cost not bad.
people thought same going ibto this year but it was terrible. even before being overworked.
relievers can be inconsistent year to yesr outside elite. obrien has faded. soriano has heavily faded after a hot start and had unimpressive minor league career. soriano could easily fade back to being terrible. i could see that group being okay or being worst bullpen in majors. need more arms.
Bullpen arms are fragile because of their daily use/overuse. It's hard to perfect optimal availability. I think our bullpen arms have been serviceable...but vulnerable. For the pen to be truly good, it requires starter durability. We haven't had that. For that, see the Brewers.
Basil Shabazz wrote: ↑27 Aug 2026 09:47 am
Luis Gastelum’s changeup is legitimately elite, not just “good for a prospect.” Now that we have MLB Statcast data on it, there’s evidence that it can be a true high-leverage, closer-quality weapon.
In his 2026 MLB work, Gastelum’s changeup has produced:
52.1% whiff rate
43.9% strikeout rate in plate appearances ending on the pitch
.184 batting average
.169 xBA
.321 xSLG
.230 xwOBA
Only 19.0% hard-hit rate
He throws it 38.8% of the time, making it his most-used pitch.
A 52% whiff rate is monster territory. More than half of swings against the pitch are missing.
The pitch averages only 81.8 mph, compared with his 94.2 mph four-seamer—a massive 12+ mph velocity separation. But velocity differential isn't the only thing happening.
Statcast has the changeup at 44.6 inches of total vertical drop, about 5.7 inches more drop than comparable changeups. It also gets about 12 inches of arm-side movement.
That's essentially the profile you want: fastball arm speed, big velocity separation, tremendous depth and enough arm-side action that it isn't merely dropping—it is moving away from a left-handed hitter while it falls.
And this isn't something that suddenly appeared in MLB. In 2025, Baseball America reported a 54% whiff rate and 42.7% chase rate on the changeup in the minors. MLB scouts put a 70 grade on it—the scouting definition of a plus-plus pitch.
Great legwork Basil
53% wiff rate on that baby is sick.
And if he does catch them "sitting" on the change-up, then he blows that 94+ mph four-seamer past them!
Given RO'B's struggles lately, I'd like to see Oli give L-Gas a closing opportunity or two just to 1) see how he handles the 9th and 2) not a demotion but gives RO'B a chance to re-group throwing in the 8th for a game or two.
He's been nails and seems to have the right mental temperament and calmness to eventually take on a closer role. I believe Oli said he had the calmest look on his face the first time he took the ball than anyone else he has seen.
Basil Shabazz wrote: ↑27 Aug 2026 09:47 am
Luis Gastelum’s changeup is legitimately elite, not just “good for a prospect.” Now that we have MLB Statcast data on it, there’s evidence that it can be a true high-leverage, closer-quality weapon.
In his 2026 MLB work, Gastelum’s changeup has produced:
52.1% whiff rate
43.9% strikeout rate in plate appearances ending on the pitch
.184 batting average
.169 xBA
.321 xSLG
.230 xwOBA
Only 19.0% hard-hit rate
He throws it 38.8% of the time, making it his most-used pitch.
A 52% whiff rate is monster territory. More than half of swings against the pitch are missing.
The pitch averages only 81.8 mph, compared with his 94.2 mph four-seamer—a massive 12+ mph velocity separation. But velocity differential isn't the only thing happening.
Statcast has the changeup at 44.6 inches of total vertical drop, about 5.7 inches more drop than comparable changeups. It also gets about 12 inches of arm-side movement.
That's essentially the profile you want: fastball arm speed, big velocity separation, tremendous depth and enough arm-side action that it isn't merely dropping—it is moving away from a left-handed hitter while it falls.
And this isn't something that suddenly appeared in MLB. In 2025, Baseball America reported a 54% whiff rate and 42.7% chase rate on the changeup in the minors. MLB scouts put a 70 grade on it—the scouting definition of a plus-plus pitch.
Great legwork Basil
53% wiff rate on that baby is sick.
And if he does catch them "sitting" on the change-up, then he blows that 94+ mph four-seamer past them!
Given RO'B's struggles lately, I'd like to see Oli give L-Gas a closing opportunity or two just to 1) see how he handles the 9th and 2) not a demotion but gives RO'B a chance to re-group throwing in the 8th for a game or two.
He's been nails and seems to have the right mental temperament and calmness to eventually take on a closer role. I believe Oli said he had the calmest look on his face the first time he took the ball than anyone else he has seen.
Basil Shabazz wrote: ↑27 Aug 2026 09:24 am
Luis Gastelum has a world-class changeup. I think a big reason he got hit around early was that he was too predictable and hadn't yet learned how to properly set it up.
In the minors, he could probably get away with throwing the changeup whenever he wanted because the pitch itself was good enough to overwhelm hitters. That doesn't work nearly as well in the majors. MLB hitters will adjust, sit on it, and punish you if they know what's coming.
What has impressed me lately is how much better he's become at commanding his other pitches and using them to set up the changeup. Once he became less predictable, that changeup went from being a great pitch to an absolutely devastating one.
Hopefully it continues, because we've seen some really good closers over the years build their success around an elite changeup. L-Gas absolutely has that caliber of changeup. If he continues developing the pitches around it and keeps hitters from sitting on it, I think there's legitimate late-inning potential there.
Wow, forgive me if I spelled any names wrong. Didn’t have time to spell check.
And if sandro Santana continues to dominate he will definitely be up at some point next season and he’s probably going to be the best of all of them
I'd give Santana, Rincon, and Findlay a run at the BP next spring training....we need better LHP in the BP...Findlay and Santana could give us that...if not 2027, then definitely a chance in 2028
11WSChamps wrote: ↑27 Aug 2026 10:05 am
Bullpen has a chance to be pretty good next year even if there are no major additions although I'm sure there will be at least one.
O'Brien, Gastelum, Soriano, Stanek, Bruihl, Hjerpe and Graceffo as your long man. If not worked to death and being cheap thats not a bad group.
Like I say there will be some help coming but as a base to start from and for the cost not bad.
people thought same going ibto this year but it was terrible. even before being overworked.
relievers can be inconsistent year to yesr outside elite. obrien has faded. soriano has heavily faded after a hot start and had unimpressive minor league career. soriano could easily fade back to being terrible. i could see that group being okay or being worst bullpen in majors. need more arms.
Some people did.
I predicted they'd be toast by August due to overuse of the more reliable relievers.
They had stretches where the bullpen speaking of the top 4 guys after a rough start were pretty good. There just weren't enough arms to count on.
To your point I've already added Hjerpe and a full season of Gastelum which should be better than Swanson plus needing to add at least one more so thats at least three guys we didn't have this year.
Great to see L. Gas settle in, which hopefully gets him ready to be a major piece out of the BP in 2027 from the get go.
Some of us tried to mention some patience needed when he was getting lit up.
Gotta give Oli some credit for seeing the kid had potential during those early blow ups and kept using him, and also credit to those posters now seeing their early reactions were a bit premature.
Hoping Baez also shows some growth and adjustment to the bigs in September. I think he will. It's a tough league.
11WSChamps wrote: ↑27 Aug 2026 10:05 am
Bullpen has a chance to be pretty good next year even if there are no major additions although I'm sure there will be at least one.
O'Brien, Gastelum, Soriano, Stanek, Bruihl, Hjerpe and Graceffo as your long man. If not worked to death and being cheap thats not a bad group.
Like I say there will be some help coming but as a base to start from and for the cost not bad.
people thought same going ibto this year but it was terrible. even before being overworked.
relievers can be inconsistent year to yesr outside elite. obrien has faded. soriano has heavily faded after a hot start and had unimpressive minor league career. soriano could easily fade back to being terrible. i could see that group being okay or being worst bullpen in majors. need more arms.
Bullpen arms are fragile because of their daily use/overuse. It's hard to perfect optimal availability. I think our bullpen arms have been serviceable...but vulnerable. For the pen to be truly good, it requires starter durability. We haven't had that. For that, see the Brewers.
cards starters havent been iron men, but they dont actually rank that bad in the league. cardinals are 12th our of 30 teams in the mahors in innings pitched. now a few teams have played 1 or less games but it looks like if i were to calculate innings per start then it would still probably be around the same or maybe 1 slot difference that will sink down the stretch here with the pallante dobbins injuries and leahy limitations, but for most the year our starters were doing fine
11WSChamps wrote: ↑27 Aug 2026 10:05 am
Bullpen has a chance to be pretty good next year even if there are no major additions although I'm sure there will be at least one.
O'Brien, Gastelum, Soriano, Stanek, Bruihl, Hjerpe and Graceffo as your long man. If not worked to death and being cheap thats not a bad group.
Like I say there will be some help coming but as a base to start from and for the cost not bad.
people thought same going ibto this year but it was terrible. even before being overworked.
relievers can be inconsistent year to yesr outside elite. obrien has faded. soriano has heavily faded after a hot start and had unimpressive minor league career. soriano could easily fade back to being terrible. i could see that group being okay or being worst bullpen in majors. need more arms.
Bullpen arms are fragile because of their daily use/overuse. It's hard to perfect optimal availability. I think our bullpen arms have been serviceable...but vulnerable. For the pen to be truly good, it requires starter durability. We haven't had that. For that, see the Brewers.
cards starters havent been iron men, but they dont actually rank that bad in the league. cardinals are 12th our of 30 teams in the mahors in innings pitched. now a few teams have played 1 or less games but it looks like if i were to calculate innings per start then it would still probably be around the same or maybe 1 slot difference that will sink down the stretch here with the pallante dobbins injuries and leahy limitations, but for most the year our starters were doing fine
I think that's true. In fact we did pretty well until trading May and the injuries to Dobbins and Pallante. That's been a real trial for us because the replacement starters have left us with bullpen games and extra innings demands.
11WSChamps wrote: ↑27 Aug 2026 10:05 am
Bullpen has a chance to be pretty good next year even if there are no major additions although I'm sure there will be at least one.
O'Brien, Gastelum, Soriano, Stanek, Bruihl, Hjerpe and Graceffo as your long man. If not worked to death and being cheap thats not a bad group.
Like I say there will be some help coming but as a base to start from and for the cost not bad.
people thought same going ibto this year but it was terrible. even before being overworked.
relievers can be inconsistent year to yesr outside elite. obrien has faded. soriano has heavily faded after a hot start and had unimpressive minor league career. soriano could easily fade back to being terrible. i could see that group being okay or being worst bullpen in majors. need more arms.
Bullpen arms are fragile because of their daily use/overuse. It's hard to perfect optimal availability. I think our bullpen arms have been serviceable...but vulnerable. For the pen to be truly good, it requires starter durability. We haven't had that. For that, see the Brewers.
cards starters havent been iron men, but they dont actually rank that bad in the league. cardinals are 12th our of 30 teams in the mahors in innings pitched. now a few teams have played 1 or less games but it looks like if i were to calculate innings per start then it would still probably be around the same or maybe 1 slot difference that will sink down the stretch here with the pallante dobbins injuries and leahy limitations, but for most the year our starters were doing fine
I think that's true. In fact we did pretty well until trading May and the injuries to Dobbins and Pallante. That's been a real trial for us because the replacement starters have left us with bullpen games and extra innings demands.
Nice outing for "Q" last night, hopefully he helps in that regard.
