Mathews

[11WSChamps]

In case you didn’t notice, 11WS,
the conversation we were having was about Mathews. The conversation about Zimmerman was earlier in the thread.

I was never talking about Mathews.

[ICCFIM2]

A long way away.
Now 16 BB's issued in 15.2 innings this year.
After 74 in 99 innings a year ago.
I warned last offseason that he should be traded as part of a package before his stock fell even further.
Those who were foolishly expecting to see him in STL this year and contributing are going to be very disappointed.

I'm not sure if you are aware....but a lot of pitchers are learning and throwing new pitches in the minors and learning new adjustments in things like their deliveries and such. This can sometimes cause walk rates to rise. That's what the minors are for. He may not make it....but I doubt it is time to throw the towel in. Am I wrong?

You are correct, pitchers work on pitches at AAA, in particular if they are being sent down from the MLs or if it is their first year in AAA. Mathews got promoted to AAA at the end of 2024 when he made 4 starts and gave up 14 walks in 16 innings. In 2025 he spent most of the year in AAA where he had 22 starts and gave up 74 walks in 94 innings. This year, 4 starts and 16 walks in 15 innings. While he is only 25 years old, he has reached the point where he needs to get results to take the next step. This isn't a situation like Liam Doyle where they might tell him to throw 50% offspeed pitches in a game to get better at them. He is going to be working on a repeatable delivery that harnesses his command at this point while avoiding pitch tipping. That is the finishing school at AAA. If he can't succeed at this, hopefully he is at least as good as Gordon Graceffo out of the pen. Because this is where it looks like it is headed.

The reason why starting pitchers are so valuable is because they are so hard to develop. We are not the only team to have a lot of good looking pitching prospects stall out or fall by the wayside along the way. The Brewers and Mariners seem to be the most consistent at developing starters. This year we had Doyle, Mathews, Cijntje, Clarke, Roby, Franklin and Henderson coming into the season as top 15 prospects. We knew Roby was going to be out most of the year. Now Clark and Henderson are hurt as well. Only Franklin is performing. I am not yet concerned about Doyle. But, I and a lot of other people believed the Cardinals would have a lot of near term starting pitching depth with Dobbin, Fitts, Mathews and Henderson. That depth has been reduced to Dobbins...

Why give up on Mathews? He’s only several good starts away from being a very viable potential call up.

I never said I gave up on him. Given what has happened to him, he is far from a few good starts away from being a viable call up. If he rights the ship and makes 10-12 good starts in Memphis, then lets revisit the issue. But control issues at AAA get worse at the ML level, not better. Given where he is at, I am just stating he is more likely a bullpen arm now than a starter. For Graceffo, that is now working well and there is nothing wrong with that.