Donovan to Mariners

[Cusecards]

Not much left to say that hasn't been said.

Appears to be a great return

And we'll not really know whether it was a good trade or a bad trade for a few years.

Agree Rock!
I follow the team daily but readily admit I don’t have a knowledgeable feel for the talent received.
So far I have read more positive comments/grades than negative.
So that gives me cause for optimism.
But then again I always lean that way anyway.
Just me....not telling anyone else how to lean.
Go Cards!

[Bomber1]

It won't take some of you tools, maybe 2 years, 3 tops to realize Mo wasn't so bad.

Sorry but yes, Mozeliak was bad.

[rockondlouie]

Not much left to say that hasn't been said.

Appears to be a great return

And we'll not really know whether it was a good trade or a bad trade for a few years.

Agree Rock!
I follow the team daily but readily admit I don’t have a knowledgeable feel for the talent received.
So far I have read more positive comments/grades than negative.
So that gives me cause for optimism.
But then again I always lean that way anyway.
Just me....not telling anyone else how to lean.
Go Cards!

Same here Cuse

I've seen nothing lower than a "B+" grade.

I'm happy w/the haul from all the trades.

I'll wait for my CT source for our minor league prospects (duce') to have a chance to actually put his eye's on all these kids C. Blooms has acquired this coming minor league season and let him educate me (all of us) on what he thinks we actually received.

[Cusecards]

Not much left to say that hasn't been said.

Appears to be a great return

And we'll not really know whether it was a good trade or a bad trade for a few years.

Agree Rock!
I follow the team daily but readily admit I don’t have a knowledgeable feel for the talent received.
So far I have read more positive comments/grades than negative.
So that gives me cause for optimism.
But then again I always lean that way anyway.
Just me....not telling anyone else how to lean.
Go Cards!

Same here Cuse

I've seen nothing lower than a "B+" grade.

I'm happy w/the haul from all the trades.

I'll wait for my CT source for our minor league prospects (duce') to have a chance to actually put his eye's on all these kids C. Blooms has acquired this coming minor league season and let him educate me (all of us) on what he thinks we actually received.

Duce does provide a lot of great info. Always appreciate his posts!
Everyone wanted FO changes- got it!
Most wanted Arenado, Gray, and possibly WC dealt- got it!
Most wanted a form of rebuild based mostly around youth- Appears they have BEGUN that.

Time will tell....fingers always crossed!

[rockondlouie]

Not much left to say that hasn't been said.

Appears to be a great return

And we'll not really know whether it was a good trade or a bad trade for a few years.

Agree Rock!
I follow the team daily but readily admit I don’t have a knowledgeable feel for the talent received.
So far I have read more positive comments/grades than negative.
So that gives me cause for optimism.
But then again I always lean that way anyway.
Just me....not telling anyone else how to lean.
Go Cards!

Same here Cuse

I've seen nothing lower than a "B+" grade.

I'm happy w/the haul from all the trades.

I'll wait for my CT source for our minor league prospects (duce') to have a chance to actually put his eye's on all these kids C. Blooms has acquired this coming minor league season and let him educate me (all of us) on what he thinks we actually received.

Duce does provide a lot of great info. Always appreciate his posts!
Everyone wanted FO changes- got it!
Most wanted Arenado, Gray, and possibly WC dealt- got it!
Most wanted a form of rebuild based mostly around youth- Appears they have BEGUN that.

Time will tell....fingers always crossed!

It's not going to be pretty but it was absolutely necessary given the mess BDWJr/Mo had made of the entire organization.

They both got fat & lazy living off past success while being comfortable w/the status quo as long as 3+M kept coming.

I think C. Bloom has done exactly what he said he'd do, the re-build has fully begun.

[Cusecards]

Not much left to say that hasn't been said.

Appears to be a great return

And we'll not really know whether it was a good trade or a bad trade for a few years.

Agree Rock!
I follow the team daily but readily admit I don’t have a knowledgeable feel for the talent received.
So far I have read more positive comments/grades than negative.
So that gives me cause for optimism.
But then again I always lean that way anyway.
Just me....not telling anyone else how to lean.
Go Cards!

Same here Cuse

I've seen nothing lower than a "B+" grade.

I'm happy w/the haul from all the trades.

I'll wait for my CT source for our minor league prospects (duce') to have a chance to actually put his eye's on all these kids C. Blooms has acquired this coming minor league season and let him educate me (all of us) on what he thinks we actually received.

Duce does provide a lot of great info. Always appreciate his posts!
Everyone wanted FO changes- got it!
Most wanted Arenado, Gray, and possibly WC dealt- got it!
Most wanted a form of rebuild based mostly around youth- Appears they have BEGUN that.

Time will tell....fingers always crossed!

It's not going to be pretty but it was absolutely necessary given the mess BDWJr/Mo had made of the entire organization.

They both got fat & lazy living off past success while being comfortable w/the status quo as long as 3+M kept coming.

I think C. Bloom has done exactly what he said he'd do, the re-build has fully begun.

+1

[ramfandan]

Bloom LIVE presser on Donovant trade ... upcoming 11:15 a.m on radio 101 ESPN

posted as separate thread too for those not on this thread only

[icon]

ugghhhh….I would rather have gotten one top 50 prospect than 5 average ones.

I was hoping for quality over quantity as well.

Agree with both of you.

lol very doubtful anyone was willing to give up a top 50 prospect for Donovan he’s not the kind of player who would get that. He’s a .650 ops hitter career against left handers with a .614 ops last season against them so he is heading toward platoon player territory doesn’t have much power or speed. He’s way overvalued by cards fans. A team would be dumb to trade a top 50 for donovan. The Cardinals have Doyle Rodriguez and JJ in the top 50 only an idiot would trade one of them for Donovan

No kidding. The overvaluation of Donovan by some is kind of funny.

[renostl]

ugghhhh….I would rather have gotten one top 50 prospect than 5 average ones.

I was hoping for quality over quantity as well.

Agree with both of you.

lol very doubtful anyone was willing to give up a top 50 prospect for Donovan he’s not the kind of player who would get that. He’s a .650 ops hitter career against left handers with a .614 ops last season against them so he is heading toward platoon player territory doesn’t have much power or speed. He’s way overvalued by cards fans. A team would be dumb to trade a top 50 for donovan. The Cardinals have Doyle Rodriguez and JJ in the top 50 only an idiot would trade one of them for Donovan

No kidding. The overvaluation of Donovan by some is kind of funny.

These trades create very mixed and polar emotions that can be in the same fan. Myself.

Teams IMO should always play in the present without crippling the future.
Compete.

These trades as wise, logical, and as needed as they are, depart from that.
The players moved were rational moves individually and as a group. The players
each had a weakness and a strength that we can both take a position with that
might make a post sound as an overvaluation or undervaluation. They were
competent MLB players with some certainty replaced by uncertainty.

Since these trades were not the old style baseball trade where a player comes back
that will be on the OD roster it creates the empty feel that is the root
to debate here, and the fact the rebuilds fail just like reloads fail.

[RamFan08NY]

Not much left to say that hasn't been said.

Appears to be a great return

And we'll not really know whether it was a good trade or a bad trade for a few years.

Agree Rock!
I follow the team daily but readily admit I don’t have a knowledgeable feel for the talent received.
So far I have read more positive comments/grades than negative.
So that gives me cause for optimism.
But then again I always lean that way anyway.
Just me....not telling anyone else how to lean.
Go Cards!

Same here Cuse

I've seen nothing lower than a "B+" grade.

I'm happy w/the haul from all the trades.

I'll wait for my CT source for our minor league prospects (duce') to have a chance to actually put his eye's on all these kids C. Blooms has acquired this coming minor league season and let him educate me (all of us) on what he thinks we actually received.

Duce does provide a lot of great info. Always appreciate his posts!
Everyone wanted FO changes- got it!
Most wanted Arenado, Gray, and possibly WC dealt- got it!
Most wanted a form of rebuild based mostly around youth- Appears they have BEGUN that.

Time will tell....fingers always crossed!

It's not going to be pretty but it was absolutely necessary given the mess BDWJr/Mo had made of the entire organization.

They both got fat & lazy living off past success while being comfortable w/the status quo as long as 3+M kept coming.

I think C. Bloom has done exactly what he said he'd do, the re-build has fully begun.

Great assessment. Its kind of like a yard that has gone neglected for a few years. Its a total mess, and when you do tear it up to fix it, it looks even worse at first, but then at some point you see it all coming together.

[rockondlouie]

Not much left to say that hasn't been said.

Appears to be a great return

And we'll not really know whether it was a good trade or a bad trade for a few years.

Agree Rock!
I follow the team daily but readily admit I don’t have a knowledgeable feel for the talent received.
So far I have read more positive comments/grades than negative.
So that gives me cause for optimism.
But then again I always lean that way anyway.
Just me....not telling anyone else how to lean.
Go Cards!

Same here Cuse

I've seen nothing lower than a "B+" grade.

I'm happy w/the haul from all the trades.

I'll wait for my CT source for our minor league prospects (duce') to have a chance to actually put his eye's on all these kids C. Blooms has acquired this coming minor league season and let him educate me (all of us) on what he thinks we actually received.

Duce does provide a lot of great info. Always appreciate his posts!
Everyone wanted FO changes- got it!
Most wanted Arenado, Gray, and possibly WC dealt- got it!
Most wanted a form of rebuild based mostly around youth- Appears they have BEGUN that.

Time will tell....fingers always crossed!

It's not going to be pretty but it was absolutely necessary given the mess BDWJr/Mo had made of the entire organization.

They both got fat & lazy living off past success while being comfortable w/the status quo as long as 3+M kept coming.

I think C. Bloom has done exactly what he said he'd do, the re-build has fully begun.

Great assessment. Its kind of like a yard that has gone neglected for a few years. Its a total mess, and when you do tear it up to fix it, it looks even worse at first, but then at some point you see it all coming together.

Thx RFNY

And great analogy!

[icon]

Not much left to say that hasn't been said.

Appears to be a great return

And we'll not really know whether it was a good trade or a bad trade for a few years.

Agree Rock!
I follow the team daily but readily admit I don’t have a knowledgeable feel for the talent received.
So far I have read more positive comments/grades than negative.
So that gives me cause for optimism.
But then again I always lean that way anyway.
Just me....not telling anyone else how to lean.
Go Cards!

Same here Cuse

I've seen nothing lower than a "B+" grade.

I'm happy w/the haul from all the trades.

I'll wait for my CT source for our minor league prospects (duce') to have a chance to actually put his eye's on all these kids C. Blooms has acquired this coming minor league season and let him educate me (all of us) on what he thinks we actually received.

Duce does provide a lot of great info. Always appreciate his posts!
Everyone wanted FO changes- got it!
Most wanted Arenado, Gray, and possibly WC dealt- got it!
Most wanted a form of rebuild based mostly around youth- Appears they have BEGUN that.

Time will tell....fingers always crossed!

It's not going to be pretty but it was absolutely necessary given the mess BDWJr/Mo had made of the entire organization.

They both got fat & lazy living off past success while being comfortable w/the status quo as long as 3+M kept coming.

I think C. Bloom has done exactly what he said he'd do, the re-build has fully begun.

Great assessment. Its kind of like a yard that has gone neglected for a few years. Its a total mess, and when you do tear it up to fix it, it looks even worse at first, but then at some point you see it all coming together.

I like that analogy as well. I just gutted and remodeled 2 bathrooms. I had a vision of what they would look like when finished, but it sure was ugly after demolition. Then again, it was ugly before demolition.

Unfortunately, though, there is a whole lot more uncertainty in trying to project future performance of prospects in baseball. We shall see.

[icon]

ugghhhh….I would rather have gotten one top 50 prospect than 5 average ones.

I was hoping for quality over quantity as well.

Agree with both of you.

lol very doubtful anyone was willing to give up a top 50 prospect for Donovan he’s not the kind of player who would get that. He’s a .650 ops hitter career against left handers with a .614 ops last season against them so he is heading toward platoon player territory doesn’t have much power or speed. He’s way overvalued by cards fans. A team would be dumb to trade a top 50 for donovan. The Cardinals have Doyle Rodriguez and JJ in the top 50 only an idiot would trade one of them for Donovan

No kidding. The overvaluation of Donovan by some is kind of funny.

These trades create very mixed and polar emotions that can be in the same fan. Myself.

Teams IMO should always play in the present without crippling the future.
Compete.

These trades as wise, logical, and as needed as they are, depart from that.
The players moved were rational moves individually and as a group. The players
each had a weakness and a strength that we can both take a position with that
might make a post sound as an overvaluation or undervaluation. They were
competent MLB players with some certainty replaced by uncertainty.

Since these trades were not the old style baseball trade where a player comes back
that will be on the OD roster it creates the empty feel that is the root
to debate here, and the fact the rebuilds fail just like reloads fail.

That's a fair assessment of these kinds of trades. On the other hand, that empty feeling you describe could be replaced by the promise of a better future. But that is open to a debate that won't be resolved anytime soon.

[Goldfan]

ugghhhh….I would rather have gotten one top 50 prospect than 5 average ones.

I was hoping for quality over quantity as well.

Agree with both of you.

lol very doubtful anyone was willing to give up a top 50 prospect for Donovan he’s not the kind of player who would get that. He’s a .650 ops hitter career against left handers with a .614 ops last season against them so he is heading toward platoon player territory doesn’t have much power or speed. He’s way overvalued by cards fans. A team would be dumb to trade a top 50 for donovan. The Cardinals have Doyle Rodriguez and JJ in the top 50 only an idiot would trade one of them for Donovan

No kidding. The overvaluation of Donovan by some is kind of funny.

BAAAAADDD
4yr MLB career
.282, .361, .772OPS GG, Allstar
GGOOOODDD
Peete
.217, .288, .692OPS
Cijntje
5-7, 4.00ERA,

[renostl]

ugghhhh….I would rather have gotten one top 50 prospect than 5 average ones.

I was hoping for quality over quantity as well.

Agree with both of you.

lol very doubtful anyone was willing to give up a top 50 prospect for Donovan he’s not the kind of player who would get that. He’s a .650 ops hitter career against left handers with a .614 ops last season against them so he is heading toward platoon player territory doesn’t have much power or speed. He’s way overvalued by cards fans. A team would be dumb to trade a top 50 for donovan. The Cardinals have Doyle Rodriguez and JJ in the top 50 only an idiot would trade one of them for Donovan

No kidding. The overvaluation of Donovan by some is kind of funny.

These trades create very mixed and polar emotions that can be in the same fan. Myself.

Teams IMO should always play in the present without crippling the future.
Compete.

These trades as wise, logical, and as needed as they are, depart from that.
The players moved were rational moves individually and as a group. The players
each had a weakness and a strength that we can both take a position with that
might make a post sound as an overvaluation or undervaluation. They were
competent MLB players with some certainty replaced by uncertainty.

Since these trades were not the old style baseball trade where a player comes back
that will be on the OD roster it creates the empty feel that is the root
to debate here, and the fact the rebuilds fail just like reloads fail.

That's a fair assessment of these kinds of trades. On the other hand, that empty feeling you describe could be replaced by the promise of a better future. But that is open to a debate that won't be resolved anytime soon.

I'll be fine before ST opens. AZ this year.

[Strummer Jones]

Not much left to say that hasn't been said.

Appears to be a great return

And we'll not really know whether it was a good trade or a bad trade for a few years.

Agree Rock!
I follow the team daily but readily admit I don’t have a knowledgeable feel for the talent received.
So far I have read more positive comments/grades than negative.
So that gives me cause for optimism.
But then again I always lean that way anyway.
Just me....not telling anyone else how to lean.
Go Cards!

Same here Cuse

I've seen nothing lower than a "B+" grade.

I'm happy w/the haul from all the trades.

I'll wait for my CT source for our minor league prospects (duce') to have a chance to actually put his eye's on all these kids C. Blooms has acquired this coming minor league season and let him educate me (all of us) on what he thinks we actually received.

Duce does provide a lot of great info. Always appreciate his posts!
Everyone wanted FO changes- got it!
Most wanted Arenado, Gray, and possibly WC dealt- got it!
Most wanted a form of rebuild based mostly around youth- Appears they have BEGUN that.

Time will tell....fingers always crossed!

It's not going to be pretty but it was absolutely necessary given the mess BDWJr/Mo had made of the entire organization.

They both got fat & lazy living off past success while being comfortable w/the status quo as long as 3+M kept coming.

I think C. Bloom has done exactly what he said he'd do, the re-build has fully begun.

Great assessment. Its kind of like a yard that has gone neglected for a few years. Its a total mess, and when you do tear it up to fix it, it looks even worse at first, but then at some point you see it all coming together.

I like that analogy as well. I just gutted and remodeled 2 bathrooms. I had a vision of what they would look like when finished, but it sure was ugly after demolition. Then again, it was ugly before demolition.

Unfortunately, though, there is a whole lot more uncertainty in trying to project future performance of prospects in baseball. We shall see.

Fair points all around.

Regardless...there's a direction now. I, and many others here, had said that we can tolerate some down years if there's a plan to get out of the wilderness. I stand by what I said then, and I stand by it now.

Maybe it works and we start having semi-regular parades and regular Octobers again. Maybe it doesn't. But at least we TRIED. As much as others have tried to fight it, baseball is a random sport. You never know who blows out a shoulder and is never right again. Or who comes back from surgery better than before. You never know what unknown comes in and lights the town up. Or someone who can't stand up under those lights. Mo leaned into that too much, that randomness. I don't feel like Bloom does. We've gotten a lot of pitchers. Some of them aren't going to be anything. Some of them might be something. If you get enough tickets to the dance, eventually the girl WILL dance with you.