Goldfan wrote: ↑21 Dec 2025 20:46 pm
Bloom attempting to Corner the market for 5th starters???
Does he have some sort contractual obligation with Boston to exclusively trade with them and take their middling or worst pitchers??
Please repeat after me: “THE CARDINALS 2026 WIN / LOSS RECORD IS NOT BLOOM’S TOP PRIORITY THIS OFFSEASON. HE IS REBUILDING FOR THE LONG TERM.”
I can’t believe we have to keep repeating this. There have been dozens of articles written and interviews given that explain this plan.
Bloom has also consistently stated he plans on competing, while not sacrificing the long term goal. That can be interpreted differently based on what degree he means by “competing”. Assuming he didn’t mean competing with the Pirates for 4th place, then it’s safe to assume there is a correlation to win/loss record.
I think the Dustin May move infers he at least meant compete for a wildcard, otherwise, why spend 12mil and not just go full cheap tank mode? In the current state, the Cards are not wildcard contenders, but I doubt the May acquisition is the only move, otherwise why even bother? The offseason is still early.
Goldfan wrote: ↑21 Dec 2025 20:46 pm
Bloom attempting to Corner the market for 5th starters???
Does he have some sort contractual obligation with Boston to exclusively trade with them and take their middling or worst pitchers??
Did you prefer Mo's acquisitions of Fedde, Lynn, Gibson?
I think we’ve been in progressive Salary Dump for awhile now…..preferring Fedde, Lynn, Gibson??
Not sure what thats has to do whats going on here. These prospect are no more going to lead the Cardinals to playoff promise land than the Fedde Lynn and Gibson you list.
BDW is crafting a narrative that this is a “rebuild” and all substantial contracts must move to bring back those “prospects” to launch Cards to success sometime in the future. This bides him time to go extremely cheap and same MILLIONS. As I stated yesterday in a few threads. The return for what the Cards are attempting to trade will NOT lead the Cardinals to the promise land. More middling talent albeit cheap
Bloom has a strategy and we may not all agree with it. It is better than not having a strategy like MO the last 3-4 years. MO's strategy was acquire one player in the off season and hoped it worked. It did for a while until the system imploded. Will these pitchers lead us to the promised land? In the aggregate, maybe. One of the trades being proposed for Donovan was the KC pitcher of Noah Cameron. He is mostly considered a #4/#5. We now have May, Fitts, Dobbins, McGreevy and Liberatore who all profile as that, plus Doyle, Mathews, Clark, Roby, Henderson, Hence and Hjerpe who project as that or better. That is 12 guys. Plus there are a few more. If 7 of the 12 become that or better in the next 2 years, that means we should be able to get 2 Donovan equivalents back in trades as well as have a younger better overall pitching staff. If Donovan nets 2 hitting prospects back and 1 of them becomes good, we could potentially end up with 3 Donovans by 2027. That is the strategy. But, it is going to be a painful process getting there.
The Cardinals were in a place that almost every pitching prospect needed to work out.
Roby or Mathews stumbling was a setback to the organization. They are getting to a
position that if 25%-30% emerge they'll be in a place where they might not
have to add a SG, KG, and LL in the same off-season just to tape a rotation together
at $50M/year along with Matz and Mikolas and $30M.
This just increases the need of almost every prospect needing to emerge.
I've no knowledge what future budgets might be but having to piece together rotations
like that subtracts from the ability to improve. Those were spent just to maintain.
Goldfan wrote: ↑21 Dec 2025 20:46 pm
Bloom attempting to Corner the market for 5th starters???
Does he have some sort contractual obligation with Boston to exclusively trade with them and take their middling or worst pitchers??
Did you prefer Mo's acquisitions of Fedde, Lynn, Gibson?
I think we’ve been in progressive Salary Dump for awhile now…..preferring Fedde, Lynn, Gibson??
Not sure what thats has to do whats going on here. These prospect are no more going to lead the Cardinals to playoff promise land than the Fedde Lynn and Gibson you list.
BDW is crafting a narrative that this is a “rebuild” and all substantial contracts must move to bring back those “prospects” to launch Cards to success sometime in the future. This bides him time to go extremely cheap and same MILLIONS. As I stated yesterday in a few threads. The return for what the Cards are attempting to trade will NOT lead the Cardinals to the promise land. More middling talent albeit cheap
Bloom has a strategy and we may not all agree with it. It is better than not having a strategy like MO the last 3-4 years. MO's strategy was acquire one player in the off season and hoped it worked. It did for a while until the system imploded. Will these pitchers lead us to the promised land? In the aggregate, maybe. One of the trades being proposed for Donovan was the KC pitcher of Noah Cameron. He is mostly considered a #4/#5. We now have May, Fitts, Dobbins, McGreevy and Liberatore who all profile as that, plus Doyle, Mathews, Clark, Roby, Henderson, Hence and Hjerpe who project as that or better. That is 12 guys. Plus there are a few more. If 7 of the 12 become that or better in the next 2 years, that means we should be able to get 2 Donovan equivalents back in trades as well as have a younger better overall pitching staff. If Donovan nets 2 hitting prospects back and 1 of them becomes good, we could potentially end up with 3 Donovans by 2027. That is the strategy. But, it is going to be a painful process getting there.
The Cardinals were in a place that almost every pitching prospect needed to work out.
Roby or Mathews stumbling was a setback to the organization. They are getting to a
position that if 25%-30% emerge they'll be in a place where they might not
have to add a SG, KG, and LL in the same off-season just to tape a rotation together
at $50M/year along with Matz and Mikolas and $30M.
This just increases the need of almost every prospect needing to emerge.
I've no knowledge what future budgets might be but having to piece together rotations
like that subtracts from the ability to improve. Those were spent just to maintain.
That too. In any case, the talent base overall is higher today than it was 12 months ago. I am hoping the hit rate is higher than 25-30% for our top 10 prospects...But even that is probably an improvement on the hit rate over the last 10 years. I think that is why so many posters are jaded because the hit rate has been awful/very low.
Goldfan wrote: ↑21 Dec 2025 20:46 pm
Bloom attempting to Corner the market for 5th starters???
Does he have some sort contractual obligation with Boston to exclusively trade with them and take their middling or worst pitchers??
Did you prefer Mo's acquisitions of Fedde, Lynn, Gibson?
I think we’ve been in progressive Salary Dump for awhile now…..preferring Fedde, Lynn, Gibson??
Not sure what thats has to do whats going on here. These prospect are no more going to lead the Cardinals to playoff promise land than the Fedde Lynn and Gibson you list.
BDW is crafting a narrative that this is a “rebuild” and all substantial contracts must move to bring back those “prospects” to launch Cards to success sometime in the future. This bides him time to go extremely cheap and same MILLIONS. As I stated yesterday in a few threads. The return for what the Cards are attempting to trade will NOT lead the Cardinals to the promise land. More middling talent albeit cheap
Bloom has a strategy and we may not all agree with it. It is better than not having a strategy like MO the last 3-4 years. MO's strategy was acquire one player in the off season and hoped it worked. It did for a while until the system imploded. Will these pitchers lead us to the promised land? In the aggregate, maybe. One of the trades being proposed for Donovan was the KC pitcher of Noah Cameron. He is mostly considered a #4/#5. We now have May, Fitts, Dobbins, McGreevy and Liberatore who all profile as that, plus Doyle, Mathews, Clark, Roby, Henderson, Hence and Hjerpe who project as that or better. That is 12 guys. Plus there are a few more. If 7 of the 12 become that or better in the next 2 years, that means we should be able to get 2 Donovan equivalents back in trades as well as have a younger better overall pitching staff. If Donovan nets 2 hitting prospects back and 1 of them becomes good, we could potentially end up with 3 Donovans by 2027. That is the strategy. But, it is going to be a painful process getting there.
The Cardinals were in a place that almost every pitching prospect needed to work out.
Roby or Mathews stumbling was a setback to the organization. They are getting to a
position that if 25%-30% emerge they'll be in a place where they might not
have to add a SG, KG, and LL in the same off-season just to tape a rotation together
at $50M/year along with Matz and Mikolas and $30M.
This just increases the need of almost every prospect needing to emerge.
I've no knowledge what future budgets might be but having to piece together rotations
like that subtracts from the ability to improve. Those were spent just to maintain.
That too. In any case, the talent base overall is higher today than it was 12 months ago. I am hoping the hit rate is higher than 25-30% for our top 10 prospects...But even that is probably an improvement on the hit rate over the last 10 years. I think that is why so many posters are jaded because the hit rate has been awful/very low.
Poorly articulated on my part.
Any given year, ETA aren't all the same.
Goldfan wrote: ↑21 Dec 2025 20:46 pm
Bloom attempting to Corner the market for 5th starters???
Does he have some sort contractual obligation with Boston to exclusively trade with them and take their middling or worst pitchers??
Did you prefer Mo's acquisitions of Fedde, Lynn, Gibson?
I think we’ve been in progressive Salary Dump for awhile now…..preferring Fedde, Lynn, Gibson??
Not sure what thats has to do whats going on here. These prospect are no more going to lead the Cardinals to playoff promise land than the Fedde Lynn and Gibson you list.
BDW is crafting a narrative that this is a “rebuild” and all substantial contracts must move to bring back those “prospects” to launch Cards to success sometime in the future. This bides him time to go extremely cheap and same MILLIONS. As I stated yesterday in a few threads. The return for what the Cards are attempting to trade will NOT lead the Cardinals to the promise land. More middling talent albeit cheap
Bloom has a strategy and we may not all agree with it. It is better than not having a strategy like MO the last 3-4 years. MO's strategy was acquire one player in the off season and hoped it worked. It did for a while until the system imploded. Will these pitchers lead us to the promised land? In the aggregate, maybe. One of the trades being proposed for Donovan was the KC pitcher of Noah Cameron. He is mostly considered a #4/#5. We now have May, Fitts, Dobbins, McGreevy and Liberatore who all profile as that, plus Doyle, Mathews, Clark, Roby, Henderson, Hence and Hjerpe who project as that or better. That is 12 guys. Plus there are a few more. If 7 of the 12 become that or better in the next 2 years, that means we should be able to get 2 Donovan equivalents back in trades as well as have a younger better overall pitching staff. If Donovan nets 2 hitting prospects back and 1 of them becomes good, we could potentially end up with 3 Donovans by 2027. That is the strategy. But, it is going to be a painful process getting there.
The Cardinals were in a place that almost every pitching prospect needed to work out.
Roby or Mathews stumbling was a setback to the organization. They are getting to a
position that if 25%-30% emerge they'll be in a place where they might not
have to add a SG, KG, and LL in the same off-season just to tape a rotation together
at $50M/year along with Matz and Mikolas and $30M.
This just increases the need of almost every prospect needing to emerge.
I've no knowledge what future budgets might be but having to piece together rotations
like that subtracts from the ability to improve. Those were spent just to maintain.
That too. In any case, the talent base overall is higher today than it was 12 months ago. I am hoping the hit rate is higher than 25-30% for our top 10 prospects...But even that is probably an improvement on the hit rate over the last 10 years. I think that is why so many posters are jaded because the hit rate has been awful/very low.
Poorly articulated on my part.
Any given year, ETA aren't all the same.
I knew what you meant. I agree with your point. I also think it dove tails my point. They need both to happen to make this work out.
Goldfan wrote: ↑21 Dec 2025 20:46 pm
Bloom attempting to Corner the market for 5th starters???
Does he have some sort contractual obligation with Boston to exclusively trade with them and take their middling or worst pitchers??
Did you prefer Mo's acquisitions of Fedde, Lynn, Gibson?
I think we’ve been in progressive Salary Dump for awhile now…..preferring Fedde, Lynn, Gibson??
Not sure what thats has to do whats going on here. These prospect are no more going to lead the Cardinals to playoff promise land than the Fedde Lynn and Gibson you list.
BDW is crafting a narrative that this is a “rebuild” and all substantial contracts must move to bring back those “prospects” to launch Cards to success sometime in the future. This bides him time to go extremely cheap and same MILLIONS. As I stated yesterday in a few threads. The return for what the Cards are attempting to trade will NOT lead the Cardinals to the promise land. More middling talent albeit cheap
Bloom has a strategy and we may not all agree with it. It is better than not having a strategy like MO the last 3-4 years. MO's strategy was acquire one player in the off season and hoped it worked. It did for a while until the system imploded. Will these pitchers lead us to the promised land? In the aggregate, maybe. One of the trades being proposed for Donovan was the KC pitcher of Noah Cameron. He is mostly considered a #4/#5. We now have May, Fitts, Dobbins, McGreevy and Liberatore who all profile as that, plus Doyle, Mathews, Clark, Roby, Henderson, Hence and Hjerpe who project as that or better. That is 12 guys. Plus there are a few more. If 7 of the 12 become that or better in the next 2 years, that means we should be able to get 2 Donovan equivalents back in trades as well as have a younger better overall pitching staff. If Donovan nets 2 hitting prospects back and 1 of them becomes good, we could potentially end up with 3 Donovans by 2027. That is the strategy. But, it is going to be a painful process getting there.
The Cardinals were in a place that almost every pitching prospect needed to work out.
Roby or Mathews stumbling was a setback to the organization. They are getting to a
position that if 25%-30% emerge they'll be in a place where they might not
have to add a SG, KG, and LL in the same off-season just to tape a rotation together
at $50M/year along with Matz and Mikolas and $30M.
This just increases the need of almost every prospect needing to emerge.
I've no knowledge what future budgets might be but having to piece together rotations
like that subtracts from the ability to improve. Those were spent just to maintain.
That too. In any case, the talent base overall is higher today than it was 12 months ago. I am hoping the hit rate is higher than 25-30% for our top 10 prospects...But even that is probably an improvement on the hit rate over the last 10 years. I think that is why so many posters are jaded because the hit rate has been awful/very low.
Poorly articulated on my part.
Any given year, ETA aren't all the same.
I knew what you meant. I agree with your point. I also think it dove tails my point. They need both to happen to make this work out.
Goldfan wrote: ↑21 Dec 2025 20:46 pm
Bloom attempting to Corner the market for 5th starters???
Does he have some sort contractual obligation with Boston to exclusively trade with them and take their middling or worst pitchers??
Please repeat after me: “THE CARDINALS 2026 WIN / LOSS RECORD IS NOT BLOOM’S TOP PRIORITY THIS OFFSEASON. HE IS REBUILDING FOR THE LONG TERM.”
I can’t believe we have to keep repeating this. There have been dozens of articles written and interviews given that explain this plan.
And you think Dobbins May Fitts is that rebuilding Future??
When your priority is to dump large contracts for now then yes it is the right move.... now if we can only get rid of Nado somehow... when rebuilding you go cheap cheap cheap and invest in youth awhile.. hopefully in a few years a few of your young ones become major studs . when this happens you sign them up and then and only then do you start spending around your core 3 or 4 young stars.. its all about timing your window for a run these days and resetting when necessary .. we are not the Dodgers or Yankees so in order to have a real chance these sort of rebuild windows is how a team without deep pockets must prepare. even the Cubs and Braves have used this same strategy.... its a shame it took us this long to finally come around on it instead of beating ourselves up each year on bad contracts.this is the way for us to compete until MLB finally wises up and implements a salary cap.
Goldfan wrote: ↑21 Dec 2025 20:46 pm
Bloom attempting to Corner the market for 5th starters???
Does he have some sort contractual obligation with Boston to exclusively trade with them and take their middling or worst pitchers??
You have a lot to learn from Chauncey Gardener.
And frankly, when it comes to baseball, you have a lot to learn from everyone.
Are the players that we got back for Contreras top prospects? No they aren’t but they have the potential to provide innings and depth at a low cost which is very important. IMO the most important part of trading Contreras is it clears the way for Burly or someone else younger to play 1B. Personally I would tell Herrera to spend the offseason getting good at playing 1B because that is your new position. Same for Raniel Rodriquez in the minors.
