What did I just witness?

[TheJackBurton]

It starts with cluster and ends with Firetruck! If this continues how long a leash does Monty have?

It wasn't Berube and its not Montgomery.

Its leadership and want to.

Its set by example and we have poor examples.

Schenn was -4 and deflected one into his own goal. Nothing is going to change with this team while they still consider him a 2C. My biggest fear last year was that roll 25 and 81 went on last year would dupe the FO into thinking Schenn was still viable in that role. He isn’t. He is a 3rd LW and probably very effective in that rile. However as a 2C, he hurts this team.

There wasn't a 2nd line center to acquire this off season. Right now they are being held onto like gold, just like we are with Dvorsky.

[Ziggy3]

From my vantage point I think the #1 issue this season will be that they don't have a true NHL-quality 3rd pairing D.

Tucker has been oversold, and I honestly believe that if he hadn't scored that clutch (at the time) one-timer in the playoffs last year, nobody would've been looking at him like a solid every day guy. He is a far below average skater, and is really only mid-sized. He does play with sandpaper, but that's about his only true positive. Should be a #7 at best.

Mailloux is not ready. And I'm not even despairing over the trade just yet; it may still work out. But he's not helping this season.

Kessel is AHL/depth.

That is bright red warning lights to have 1/3 of your D every game consisting of the above. Somebody mentioned they've only been averaging 10 minutes lately? Completely unsustainable. And if there's an injury to any of the top 4?

They are going to have to start looking outside for some help, or maybe catch lightning in a bottle from a call-up? Does Skinner deserve a look?

[DawgDad]

From my vantage point I think the #1 issue this season will be that they don't have a true NHL-quality 3rd pairing D.

Tucker has been oversold, and I honestly believe that if he hadn't scored that clutch (at the time) one-timer in the playoffs last year, nobody would've been looking at him like a solid every day guy. He is a far below average skater, and is really only mid-sized. He does play with sandpaper, but that's about his only true positive. Should be a #7 at best.

Mailloux is not ready. And I'm not even despairing over the trade just yet; it may still work out. But he's not helping this season.

Kessel is AHL/depth.

That is bright red warning lights to have 1/3 of your D every game consisting of the above. Somebody mentioned they've only been averaging 10 minutes lately? Completely unsustainable. And if there's an injury to any of the top 4?

They are going to have to start looking outside for some help, or maybe catch lightning in a bottle from a call-up? Does Skinner deserve a look?

Nothing here I don't agree with. If the scouts and coaches believe Mailloux is physically ready then he needs to be on a fast-track program to get mentally ready. You cannot teach experience but he's done stuff you just don't see in the NHL, stuff that signals to me he's got some issues taking coaching.

[MRK]

Last time I saw a game almost that bad, Mike Keenan got fired.

[blackinkbiz]

From my vantage point I think the #1 issue this season will be that they don't have a true NHL-quality 3rd pairing D.

Tucker has been oversold, and I honestly believe that if he hadn't scored that clutch (at the time) one-timer in the playoffs last year, nobody would've been looking at him like a solid every day guy. He is a far below average skater, and is really only mid-sized. He does play with sandpaper, but that's about his only true positive. Should be a #7 at best.

Mailloux is not ready. And I'm not even despairing over the trade just yet; it may still work out. But he's not helping this season.

Kessel is AHL/depth.

That is bright red warning lights to have 1/3 of your D every game consisting of the above. Somebody mentioned they've only been averaging 10 minutes lately? Completely unsustainable. And if there's an injury to any of the top 4?

They are going to have to start looking outside for some help, or maybe catch lightning in a bottle from a call-up? Does Skinner deserve a look?

Nothing here I don't agree with. If the scouts and coaches believe Mailloux is physically ready then he needs to be on a fast-track program to get mentally ready. You cannot teach experience but he's done stuff you just don't see in the NHL, stuff that signals to me he's got some issues taking coaching.

I've seen some bad trades but this, as of now, is easily the biggest fleece job I've ever seen the Blues do to themselves. Habs fans were 100% stunned that they got anything in return for Mailoux. Seems like most of them had written him off as a bust and lost cause, not because he isn't talented, but because as a defenseman, "he has the worst defensive and offensive instincts we've ever seen in a Dman."

Low and behold, that's precisely what we've witnessed. Bad jumps, missed reads, untimely pinches, I mean, 0 points and a -9 +/- for a kid who's upside is supposed to be his offensive ability is straight up jaw-dropping.

And the fact we sent a first-rounder with 20 goals in his rookie season and he also possesses a world-class shot. I've never been a fan of the greenstink poster but, dude, he's dead on with this travesty.

What a chitshow.

[Younghopp1991]

From my vantage point I think the #1 issue this season will be that they don't have a true NHL-quality 3rd pairing D.

Tucker has been oversold, and I honestly believe that if he hadn't scored that clutch (at the time) one-timer in the playoffs last year, nobody would've been looking at him like a solid every day guy. He is a far below average skater, and is really only mid-sized. He does play with sandpaper, but that's about his only true positive. Should be a #7 at best.

Mailloux is not ready. And I'm not even despairing over the trade just yet; it may still work out. But he's not helping this season.

Kessel is AHL/depth.

That is bright red warning lights to have 1/3 of your D every game consisting of the above. Somebody mentioned they've only been averaging 10 minutes lately? Completely unsustainable. And if there's an injury to any of the top 4?

They are going to have to start looking outside for some help, or maybe catch lightning in a bottle from a call-up? Does Skinner deserve a look?

Nothing here I don't agree with. If the scouts and coaches believe Mailloux is physically ready then he needs to be on a fast-track program to get mentally ready. You cannot teach experience but he's done stuff you just don't see in the NHL, stuff that signals to me he's got some issues taking coaching.

I've seen some bad trades but this, as of now, is easily the biggest fleece job I've ever seen the Blues do to themselves. Habs fans were 100% stunned that they got anything in return for Mailoux. Seems like most of them had written him off as a bust and lost cause, not because he isn't talented, but because as a defenseman, "he has the worst defensive and offensive instincts we've ever seen in a Dman."

Low and behold, that's precisely what we've witnessed. Bad jumps, missed reads, untimely pinches, I mean, 0 points and a -9 +/- for a kid who's upside is supposed to be his offensive ability is straight up jaw-dropping.

And the fact we sent a first-rounder with 20 goals in his rookie season and he also possesses a world-class shot. I've never been a fan of the greenstink poster but, dude, he's dead on with this travesty.

What a chitshow.

Sometimes you have to take chances. To nevif wevwould have gotten a 2nd also i would have been happier. But im not going to dump on the trade this early on.

[Ziggy3]

From my vantage point I think the #1 issue this season will be that they don't have a true NHL-quality 3rd pairing D.

Tucker has been oversold, and I honestly believe that if he hadn't scored that clutch (at the time) one-timer in the playoffs last year, nobody would've been looking at him like a solid every day guy. He is a far below average skater, and is really only mid-sized. He does play with sandpaper, but that's about his only true positive. Should be a #7 at best.

Mailloux is not ready. And I'm not even despairing over the trade just yet; it may still work out. But he's not helping this season.

Kessel is AHL/depth.

That is bright red warning lights to have 1/3 of your D every game consisting of the above. Somebody mentioned they've only been averaging 10 minutes lately? Completely unsustainable. And if there's an injury to any of the top 4?

They are going to have to start looking outside for some help, or maybe catch lightning in a bottle from a call-up? Does Skinner deserve a look?

Nothing here I don't agree with. If the scouts and coaches believe Mailloux is physically ready then he needs to be on a fast-track program to get mentally ready. You cannot teach experience but he's done stuff you just don't see in the NHL, stuff that signals to me he's got some issues taking coaching.

I've seen some bad trades but this, as of now, is easily the biggest fleece job I've ever seen the Blues do to themselves. Habs fans were 100% stunned that they got anything in return for Mailoux. Seems like most of them had written him off as a bust and lost cause, not because he isn't talented, but because as a defenseman, "he has the worst defensive and offensive instincts we've ever seen in a Dman."

Low and behold, that's precisely what we've witnessed. Bad jumps, missed reads, untimely pinches, I mean, 0 points and a -9 +/- for a kid who's upside is supposed to be his offensive ability is straight up jaw-dropping.

And the fact we sent a first-rounder with 20 goals in his rookie season and he also possesses a world-class shot. I've never been a fan of the greenstink poster but, dude, he's dead on with this travesty.

What a chitshow.

I guess I'm choosing to remain hesitantly optimistic. Won't argue much with what you say, though.

One thing I'll say is that at least no one reasonable is counting on LM to become the next Parayko or Petro, etc. The gap between what he is and what can reasonably be hoped for (reliable 3rd-2nd pairing D with some PP duty) isn't insurmountable, and even if he completely busts it's not great, but the risk can be understood. We dealt from strength.

The problem for me is that they put themselves in a situation where they were much too reliant on him flourishing THIS season. Hoping he would either be solid enough in his own right or would somehow be covered for by Tucker seems pretty foolish in hindsight. It's not a good situation for the team or for LM. I had reserved judgement before the season simply because I'd never seen LM and figured perhaps they had found something. But now it seems downright reckless to have entered the regular season with so little at the bottom of the D lineup.

[ForumPolice]

My eyes..... It's burning my eyes

[Cahokanut]

From my vantage point I think the #1 issue this season will be that they don't have a true NHL-quality 3rd pairing D.

Tucker has been oversold, and I honestly believe that if he hadn't scored that clutch (at the time) one-timer in the playoffs last year, nobody would've been looking at him like a solid every day guy. He is a far below average skater, and is really only mid-sized. He does play with sandpaper, but that's about his only true positive. Should be a #7 at best.

Mailloux is not ready. And I'm not even despairing over the trade just yet; it may still work out. But he's not helping this season.

Kessel is AHL/depth.

That is bright red warning lights to have 1/3 of your D every game consisting of the above. Somebody mentioned they've only been averaging 10 minutes lately? Completely unsustainable. And if there's an injury to any of the top 4?

They are going to have to start looking outside for some help, or maybe catch lightning in a bottle from a call-up? Does Skinner deserve a look?

Nothing here I don't agree with. If the scouts and coaches believe Mailloux is physically ready then he needs to be on a fast-track program to get mentally ready. You cannot teach experience but he's done stuff you just don't see in the NHL, stuff that signals to me he's got some issues taking coaching.

I've seen some bad trades but this, as of now, is easily the biggest fleece job I've ever seen the Blues do to themselves. Habs fans were 100% stunned that they got anything in return for Mailoux. Seems like most of them had written him off as a bust and lost cause, not because he isn't talented, but because as a defenseman, "he has the worst defensive and offensive instincts we've ever seen in a Dman."

Low and behold, that's precisely what we've witnessed. Bad jumps, missed reads, untimely pinches, I mean, 0 points and a -9 +/- for a kid who's upside is supposed to be his offensive ability is straight up jaw-dropping.

And the fact we sent a first-rounder with 20 goals in his rookie season and he also possesses a world-class shot. I've never been a fan of the greenstink poster but, dude, he's dead on with this travesty.

What a chitshow.

Sometimes you have to take chances. To nevif wevwould have gotten a 2nd also i would have been happier. But im not going to dump on the trade this early on.

You have drunk the koolaid.
The only ones around the league that thought Mailx could pull a Bolduc is Army, his cabinet members, and his loud cult.

They only value board battles.
Even though more then 80%? of goals are, 'to the net. Even from their own team.

[Hazelwood72]

If they can't win games when they score 4 goals it's going go be a loooooong season! In my opinion this team was built to win games 2-1, 3-2, etc. I hope they get their act together soon because I thought at the beginning of the season that they were a playoff team. I'm pretty sure that they can't compete with the upper echelon teams but if you play solid defense and get good goaltending (see 2019) you've got a chance.

They had the best backend in the world in 2019.

They did, and they still have Parayko who is in his prime still. Fowler has another 6 game point streak going and can run a PP in a way that JayBo couldn't. I've been focused on RHD as the #1 thing this team needs. They're not super far away. I've actually found Broberg to be one of the brighter spots this year. He is skating with more force IMO and I'm comfortable with him defensively, also Parayko and Fowler. Faulk of course is Mr Up and Down but is a fading part.

They quite obviously know they are weak at RHD and they tried to do something about it. Thus far the trade looks brutal, and all of this baby Pronger baby Parayko nonsense is delusional, and was delusional. At least Jiricek on RHD can supply much stronger natural offense than Faulk, and he's larger and a much better skater. Right now the Blues better hope Jiricek has a consistent year. He's off to a good start, he was highly involved again yesterday and I'll watch him today. Real physical this year. We may have to wait, the NHL roster was supposed to compete at least for a playoff spot. To bridge the gap and give these younger guys another 1-2 more years to develop.

The good news is we know they're not this bad, and you know how hockey ebbs and flows, and suddenly a team can come together. You haven't liked Buch but have backed Kyrou. At least in 21-22 and 22-23 Buch was a top player, but he has really allowed the flaws in his game to start to define his game a lot more the past several seasons and it looks to continue. Kyrou I always saw as a "you have it or you don't" guy with true next level competitiveness. In fairness to him he has a 6 game point streak going and has looked dangerous and to my eyes better offensively this year in a sustainable way ... however, it's alarming he doesn't seem to have the bear-down that the top competitors on other teams have. When they were up 4-0 and he was in the slot with a golden chance he kind of flipped it casually backhand as a shot, like "the game is won, let's scrimmage a bit" sort of energy and it immediately caught my attention. Like I said in a thread last night I thought maybe I was being too harsh at first thinking "that is not a Game 7 type game on the line effort for that golden slot opportunity" since they were up 4-0 and he'd contributed. And then I saw it again. I started thinking maybe I would have to take back vouching for him to his major vocal hater Harry.

And as the game progressed you could just feel once that second goal went in and definitely once the third went in they were going to possibly and then definitely lose that game. And just knowing that the team craters like this right after a whole offseason supposedly spent stewing about having cratered in May, and right after cratering three times on home ice to division opponents who did not make the postseason last year, it was going to crater ... that is an indictment of their character. I don't think this falls on Monty tbh. Hofer really has hurt the team badly with an unacceptable terrible performance so far, and a lot of this wouldn't look as bad without this, and Binnington looks like he doesn't want the Canada net this year. When the going gets tough it exposes who you are. And the going is tough right now and they're exposed.

Far away from what though? The level they played last year? Perhaps. But people underestimate the trio they had in 2019. They will never have something near that imo in our lifetime. I just think it was really special. Look at Elliott, Allen and Hslak’s numbers. It’s funny stuff

Totally agree with ya’, Theo. And it wasn’t just “the trio”. Sure, we had Petro, JayBo, and Parayko, but Edmundson, Bortuzzo, Dunn, and Gunnarsson were good contributors as well. Dunn was the smallest at 6’0” and the rest were 6’2” to 6’6”. Very big, strong, and mobile D-corps. Far fewer back door goals scored on us than now.

One other point is that we also had more 2-way forwards who put pressure on the opponents at the other end with heavy forechecking, yet still got back to help our D-men.

Army couldn’t do anything about JayBo’s heart attack, but IMO, he’s made far more missteps than wins after 2019. Team makeup is totally different and not for the better.

[dhsux]

From my vantage point I think the #1 issue this season will be that they don't have a true NHL-quality 3rd pairing D.

Tucker has been oversold, and I honestly believe that if he hadn't scored that clutch (at the time) one-timer in the playoffs last year, nobody would've been looking at him like a solid every day guy. He is a far below average skater, and is really only mid-sized. He does play with sandpaper, but that's about his only true positive. Should be a #7 at best.

Mailloux is not ready. And I'm not even despairing over the trade just yet; it may still work out. But he's not helping this season.

Kessel is AHL/depth.

That is bright red warning lights to have 1/3 of your D every game consisting of the above. Somebody mentioned they've only been averaging 10 minutes lately? Completely unsustainable. And if there's an injury to any of the top 4?

They are going to have to start looking outside for some help, or maybe catch lightning in a bottle from a call-up? Does Skinner deserve a look?

Well not sure how in the world you put the #1 problem on those two guys.

I'm sure you are sincere about it but when you look at the losses, and not necessarily the gobs of goals going through our goalies, then consider you have excluded the forwards and goalies from being any potential #1 problem children then lastly there's no way two young 13-14 min players are the #1 reason why this team has faltered.

I'm actually seeing Mailloux progress the past number of games as well. That's me. The only way he will meet your "ready" status is to play him and please remember there is presently a number of other players, vast majority, "not helping" this team win games.

[Ziggy3]

From my vantage point I think the #1 issue this season will be that they don't have a true NHL-quality 3rd pairing D.

Tucker has been oversold, and I honestly believe that if he hadn't scored that clutch (at the time) one-timer in the playoffs last year, nobody would've been looking at him like a solid every day guy. He is a far below average skater, and is really only mid-sized. He does play with sandpaper, but that's about his only true positive. Should be a #7 at best.

Mailloux is not ready. And I'm not even despairing over the trade just yet; it may still work out. But he's not helping this season.

Kessel is AHL/depth.

That is bright red warning lights to have 1/3 of your D every game consisting of the above. Somebody mentioned they've only been averaging 10 minutes lately? Completely unsustainable. And if there's an injury to any of the top 4?

They are going to have to start looking outside for some help, or maybe catch lightning in a bottle from a call-up? Does Skinner deserve a look?

Well not sure how in the world you put the #1 problem on those two guys.

I'm sure you are sincere about it but when you look at the losses, and not necessarily the gobs of goals going through our goalies, then consider you have excluded the forwards and goalies from being any potential #1 problem children then lastly there's no way two young 13-14 min players are the #1 reason why this team has faltered.

I'm actually seeing Mailloux progress the past number of games as well. That's me. The only way he will meet your "ready" status is to play him and please remember there is presently a number of other players, vast majority, "not helping" this team win games.

I said it WILL be their #1 issue.

Right now I would love for it to be their biggest problem. Instead it's simply one of a long list, with goaltending at the top. I expect the others to right themselves, although it's more concerning as games go by... I was just making an observation based on the first handful of games about an issue I think will continue to hinder a team that should otherwise be competitive. I don't think they set the situation up well for either the team and it's aspirations or for LM in particular himself.

[dhsux]

From my vantage point I think the #1 issue this season will be that they don't have a true NHL-quality 3rd pairing D.

Tucker has been oversold, and I honestly believe that if he hadn't scored that clutch (at the time) one-timer in the playoffs last year, nobody would've been looking at him like a solid every day guy. He is a far below average skater, and is really only mid-sized. He does play with sandpaper, but that's about his only true positive. Should be a #7 at best.

Mailloux is not ready. And I'm not even despairing over the trade just yet; it may still work out. But he's not helping this season.

Kessel is AHL/depth.

That is bright red warning lights to have 1/3 of your D every game consisting of the above. Somebody mentioned they've only been averaging 10 minutes lately? Completely unsustainable. And if there's an injury to any of the top 4?

They are going to have to start looking outside for some help, or maybe catch lightning in a bottle from a call-up? Does Skinner deserve a look?

Well not sure how in the world you put the #1 problem on those two guys.

I'm sure you are sincere about it but when you look at the losses, and not necessarily the gobs of goals going through our goalies, then consider you have excluded the forwards and goalies from being any potential #1 problem children then lastly there's no way two young 13-14 min players are the #1 reason why this team has faltered.

I'm actually seeing Mailloux progress the past number of games as well. That's me. The only way he will meet your "ready" status is to play him and please remember there is presently a number of other players, vast majority, "not helping" this team win games.

I said it WILL be their #1 issue.

Right now I would love for it to be their biggest problem. Instead it's simply one of a long list, with goaltending at the top. I expect the others to right themselves, although it's more concerning as games go by... I was just making an observation based on the first handful of games about an issue I think will continue to hinder a team that should otherwise be competitive. I don't think they set the situation up well for either the team and it's aspirations or for LM in particular himself.

My bad.

On LM, we just disagree. But play him and find out.

[Ziggy3]

On LM, we just disagree. But play him and find out.

Yeah, I mean right now I don't think there's a better choice. I had just hoped they would've found a vet D of some sort to either mentor him along on a line or at least allow him to move in and out of the lineup more comfortably. Tucker ain't it, IMO, he compounds the problem.

[Mr.Snuggleupagus]

I've seen some bad trades but this, as of now, is easily the biggest fleece job I've ever seen the Blues do to themselves. Habs fans were 100% stunned that they got anything in return for Mailoux. Seems like most of them had written him off as a bust and lost cause, not because he isn't talented, but because as a defenseman, "he has the worst defensive and offensive instincts we've ever seen in a Dman."

Low and behold, that's precisely what we've witnessed. Bad jumps, missed reads, untimely pinches, I mean, 0 points and a -9 +/- for a kid who's upside is supposed to be his offensive ability is straight up jaw-dropping.

And the fact we sent a first-rounder with 20 goals in his rookie season and he also possesses a world-class shot. I've never been a fan of the greenstink poster but, dude, he's dead on with this travesty.

What a chitshow.

Harry Deals is gonna need some swaddling in a cry room if he reads this post.