Can we all agree that NA and PG are not HOF material

[nighthawk]

The HOF is mirroring the current playoff format as they will accept pretty much anyone who had a decent career. No way either one should even be placed on the ballot but as I said they'll accept pretty much anyone these days.

The HOF has always made dubious selections. It is not a recent thing.

[OldRed]

Neither of them are first ballot. Goldschmidt may get in as he was rated among the top three players in the league four times in MVP voting, winning it once. So, the writers thought he was excellent. He also has gold gloves and seemed to be steady presence on his teams. He's ending his career like Johnny Mize, but isn't the hitter that Mize was.

Arenado was rated among the top three players only twice and never won it and I'm not sure the Gold Gloves are enough to overcome the "Coors Effect." He's basically a great fielding Vinny Castillo who really had zero consideration.

How with the Yankees? Otherwise, he is nowhere close to the player Mize was.

[Quincy Varnish]

Are Adrian Gonzalez & Evan Longoria HOFers?

Moving on....

Adrian Gonzalez - 43.6 bWAR
Paul Goldschmidt- 63.8 bWAR

They aren’t close.

Arenado and Longoria are, but the only black type Longo has is grounding into double plays and sacrifice flies. Arenado led the league in HR 3x, RBI 2x, TB 2x, 2B 1x. Longoria has 3 GGs to Arenado’s TEN. Nado has 8x AS appearances to Longo’s 3, and hella more MVP votes.

[hugeCardfan]

Nolan Arenado will be in the HOF.

[CorneliusWolfe]

Arenado’s hitting stats compare very well to other 3B, but that aside, I’d like to see him rewarded for his commitment to defensive excellence that few ever achieved. Started his career with 10 gold gloves, that he actually earned. Add that to his hitting stats and I think his lack of championship will be overlooked, kind of like Dan Marino in the NFL.

Goldschmidt, I think he gets in too. He was really good on both sides of the ball from a long time. There are others in the Hall with less impressive resumes.

[Swuhgen]

Now that both are gone.
Is it the consensus that they should or should not be in the Hall?
Terrible in the playoffs.
Neither are leaders of men.
Both have stats that are vastly overrated due to ball parks they played in.
I'm not sold on either going to the hall.

What?
Arenado is a lock for the Hall. It's not debatable. He's in.

Goldy is borderline. I can see him getting in after a few years. Certainly has a case.

[nighthawk]

Neither of them are first ballot. Goldschmidt may get in as he was rated among the top three players in the league four times in MVP voting, winning it once. So, the writers thought he was excellent. He also has gold gloves and seemed to be steady presence on his teams. He's ending his career like Johnny Mize, but isn't the hitter that Mize was.

Arenado was rated among the top three players only twice and never won it and I'm not sure the Gold Gloves are enough to overcome the "Coors Effect." He's basically a great fielding Vinny Castillo who really had zero consideration.

How with the Yankees? Otherwise, he is nowhere close to the player Mize was.

Mize was acquired by the Yankees in 1949 at age 36 and succeeded best as a platoon player against righties for which he did well for the remaining five years of his career. Goldschmidt was acquired by the Yankees at age 37 and succeeded best a platoon role against lefties for which he performed well.

Note the "...but isn't the hitter that Mize was." Or do you need hand puppets?

[HorseTrader]

Goldy:

Hall of Fame Monitor
Batting - Goldy 109 (158th), Likely HOFer ≈ 100

JAWS
First Base (15th):
Goldy 63.8 career WAR | 45.0 7yr-peak WAR | 54.4 JAWS | 5.0 WAR/162
Average HOF 1B (out of 25):
65.0 career WAR | 42.0 7yr-peak WAR | 53.5 JAWS | 4.8 WAR/162


NADO:

Hall of Fame Monitor
NADO Batting - 122 (127th), Likely HOFer ≈ 100

JAWS
Third Base (20th):
NADO 57.8 career WAR | 44.2 7yr-peak WAR | 51.0 JAWS | 5.2 WAR/162
Average HOF 3B (out of 18):
68.9 career WAR | 43.4 7yr-peak WAR | 56.1 JAWS | 5.1 WAR/162


I think both get in eventually but neither is 1st ballot.

JMO

I agree with that.

Goldy put up 1.2 WAR this year. If he does that again next year, he will match the 65 career WAR of an average HOF 1b. He already has the 7 year peak and the 162 game average.

Arenado, needs 11.1 WAR to reach the career average, that's going to be tough but I think his GG will carry the day

[rockondlouie]

Goldy:

Hall of Fame Monitor
Batting - Goldy 109 (158th), Likely HOFer ≈ 100

JAWS
First Base (15th):
Goldy 63.8 career WAR | 45.0 7yr-peak WAR | 54.4 JAWS | 5.0 WAR/162
Average HOF 1B (out of 25):
65.0 career WAR | 42.0 7yr-peak WAR | 53.5 JAWS | 4.8 WAR/162


NADO:

Hall of Fame Monitor
NADO Batting - 122 (127th), Likely HOFer ≈ 100

JAWS
Third Base (20th):
NADO 57.8 career WAR | 44.2 7yr-peak WAR | 51.0 JAWS | 5.2 WAR/162
Average HOF 3B (out of 18):
68.9 career WAR | 43.4 7yr-peak WAR | 56.1 JAWS | 5.1 WAR/162


I think both get in eventually but neither is 1st ballot.

JMO

I agree with that.

Goldy put up 1.2 WAR this year. If he does that again next year, he will match the 65 career WAR of an average HOF 1b. He already has the 7 year peak and the 162 game average.

Arenado, needs 11.1 WAR to reach the career average, that's going to be tough but I think his GG will carry the day

Goldy (IMO) was a slam dunk to get in once he got the MVP award.

NADO's 10 GG's, 5 SS's and 8 all-star appearances will get him in as well.

[ramfandan]

Think they both get in the HOF . Not 1st ballot slam dunk like a Pujols far from it but they will move up the balloting thru the years.
Nado's 10 Gold Gloves is very special and considered one of the best all time defensively to ever play 3rd base .

[gocards04]

Nolan Arenado will be in the hall of fame. Offensive stats aside, he his one of the best, if not the best, defensive 3rd baseman the game has ever seen.

I believe Goldschmidt will be in the hall of fame, but that’s more of a debate than Arenado is.

[Goldfan]

Let everyone in…..like the Red Jackets
The luster is gone……
“Baseball is SOOOOO hard the last decade or so…..er the PITCHING IS SOOOO GOOD…..that neither hitter or PITCHER can produce numbers
Let that one sink in.
Neither Can……even though Pitchers are SOOOO dominant…..
If you look real close and pay attention. The talent isn’t as good as it once was….but the excuses sure are.

[kscardsfan]

Hall of Great Players. Just a notch below HOF. My opinion is that the Hall is too watered down as it is.

[Ozziesfan41]

Now that both are gone.
Is it the consensus that they should or should not be in the Hall?
Terrible in the playoffs.
Neither are leaders of men.
Both have stats that are vastly overrated due to ball parks they played in.
I'm not sold on either going to the hall.

No we can’t.

[Carp4Cy]

Now that both are gone.
Is it the consensus that they should or should not be in the Hall?
Terrible in the playoffs.

Goldy has 8 HRs and a .909 OPS in the playoffs. I'd like a whole lineup that terrible.

[C-Unit]

Are Adrian Gonzalez & Evan Longoria HOFers?

Moving on....

Adrian Gonzalez - 43.6 bWAR
Paul Goldschmidt- 63.8 bWAR

They aren’t close.

Arenado and Longoria are, but the only black type Longo has is grounding into double plays and sacrifice flies. Arenado led the league in HR 3x, RBI 2x, TB 2x, 2B 1x. Longoria has 3 GGs to Arenado’s TEN. Nado has 8x AS appearances to Longo’s 3, and hella more MVP votes.

you said it