Next Year's Cardinal Outfield

[CorneliusWolfe]

I know this is a bit out of the box and might be borderline insane. But, what if next year's outfield was: Herrera in LF, JJ Wetherholt in CF, and Alec Burleson in RF? I believe the offensive output from these 3 could be near the top of the league. Now, I know this calls for putting 1 known not good outfielder in RF, and 2 completely unknowns in LF and CF, but I'd give it a whirl. JJ can play CF if he can play SS, 2b and 3b. Edman did it, Saggesse's done it. Heck, Kolten Wong did it.

That leaves you with Contreras at 1b, Donnie at 2b, Winn at SS, Arenado at 3rd, Crooks/Pages behind the dish, Saggesse and Church as IF/OF bench players and then go spend money on a big time bat that can play both 3rd base and DH.

Thoughts?

This would’ve been the year to experiment. For all the talk of runway and finding out what we have, they didn’t really answer any questions. Lost year.

No. There were a lot of answered questions they just may not like the answers they were given. Gorman can’t hit or field and should be traded. The bullpen has multiple closer options so don’t need to search for a closer. Herrera is a keeper just need to DH him. Pallante isn’t a very good starter. Walker sucks in the field and hitting and should be traded or if kept started in the minors until he hits his way to the big leagues. Donovan should be traded or signed to an extension in the offseason. No way you keep him and let him just walk as a free agent. Noot should be traded. The only unanswered questions have a lot to do with Sonny Contreras and arenado and if they will waive and be traded

I feel like most of the things you cited were pretty much already known. Gorman didn’t even get 400 PAs and his play time was still sporadic and never got to play a position steadily, not defending him because he does appear to suck, and NA blocked him, but they could’ve benched NA sooner or traded Burleson at the deadline.

Walker should’ve long been sent down. Pallante….never understood that experiment in the first place, and why he got the nod over McGreevy or maybe Curtis Taylor from Memphis. Fedde blocked other starters for too long too. Can Herrera stay healthy? Can he hit for extra bases like a DH should? There were other options they could’ve/should’ve tried out. Wetherholt could’ve been an option but they were so worried about their 40-man JAG roster.

I agree Donovan should be traded or extended, probably traded because the team would basically be paying him for his over age 30 years, which hasn’t been a good formula the past several years.

Gorman would have played a lot more if he hadn’t had his yearly back injury he posted his second consecutive sub .700 ops season he’s also had almost 1600 plate appearances and hasn’t grown as a player at all. He still has short hot streaks and long long streaks of futility and still flails helplessly at the high fastballs. If people don’t know what kind of player they have in Gorman by now they haven’t been watching his career

At this point I should probably concede the point on Gorman. But Melville has proven beyond a reasonable doubt that he has produced at an elite level. So your mumbers are just lies!! Lol

[Braund241]

Will suck.

[Cusecards]

What's wrong with playing Donovan in the outfield,since we have plenty of infielders? Donny doesn't look to bad out there,does he?

Then who plays 3B (not a fan of him there) or 2B? Does he SLG enough to play corner OF or 3B?

I don’t get this, he doesn’t slug enough to play 3rd base. Just how many slugging 3rd basemen are there in MLB? If Wetherholt plays 2nd base and hits over 20 homers, and Donovan plays 3rd base hits 12-15, what difference offensively does it make which one plays where? You play them where they fit best Defensively.
They are going to try Herrera at catcher again, and if he doesn’t he’ll mostly DH again. Burleson will play 1stbase if Contreras is dealt otherwise he’ll be in LF or RF.
Arenado is the key, but I think he’ll be gone.
The only offensive player they might add will be an outfielder, but he won’t cost much. Probably less than what Nootbaar makes.

Agree 100%
Find everyday players who are plus hitters and plus defenders.
Donovan and JJ can both hit and play quality defense.
And if they only hit 35 HR’s between them so what????
We’ve been jacking around waiting for Gorman’s power for years.
How has that worked out.
Sounds like they also messed with Walker’s swing to hit for more power and how has that worked out?
Before that it was TO.
Give me RISP bats and 15/20 HR’s is perfectly fine!!

And he would replace arenado who isn’t a slugging third baseman either or a good hitter

Correct!
We’re not replacing Mike Schmidt over there.

[Talkin' Baseball]

What's wrong with playing Donovan in the outfield,since we have plenty of infielders? Donny doesn't look to bad out there,does he?

Then who plays 3B (not a fan of him there) or 2B? Does he SLG enough to play corner OF or 3B?

I don’t get this, he doesn’t slug enough to play 3rd base. Just how many slugging 3rd basemen are there in MLB? If Wetherholt plays 2nd base and hits over 20 homers, and Donovan plays 3rd base hits 12-15, what difference offensively does it make which one plays where? You play them where they fit best Defensively.
They are going to try Herrera at catcher again, and if he doesn’t he’ll mostly DH again. Burleson will play 1stbase if Contreras is dealt otherwise he’ll be in LF or RF.
Arenado is the key, but I think he’ll be gone.
The only offensive player they might add will be an outfielder, but he won’t cost much. Probably less than what Nootbaar makes.

Agree 100%
Find everyday players who are plus hitters and plus defenders.
Donovan and JJ can both hit and play quality defense.
And if they only hit 35 HR’s between them so what????
We’ve been jacking around waiting for Gorman’s power for years.
How has that worked out.
Sounds like they also messed with Walker’s swing to hit for more power and how has that worked out?
Before that it was TO.
Give me RISP bats and 15/20 HR’s is perfectly fine!!

And he would replace arenado who isn’t a slugging third baseman either or a good hitter

Correct!
We’re not replacing Mike Schmidt over there.

Nolan Arenado, even in his current form, is still the best 3B in the Cardinals system.

[Cusecards]

What's wrong with playing Donovan in the outfield,since we have plenty of infielders? Donny doesn't look to bad out there,does he?

Then who plays 3B (not a fan of him there) or 2B? Does he SLG enough to play corner OF or 3B?

I don’t get this, he doesn’t slug enough to play 3rd base. Just how many slugging 3rd basemen are there in MLB? If Wetherholt plays 2nd base and hits over 20 homers, and Donovan plays 3rd base hits 12-15, what difference offensively does it make which one plays where? You play them where they fit best Defensively.
They are going to try Herrera at catcher again, and if he doesn’t he’ll mostly DH again. Burleson will play 1stbase if Contreras is dealt otherwise he’ll be in LF or RF.
Arenado is the key, but I think he’ll be gone.
The only offensive player they might add will be an outfielder, but he won’t cost much. Probably less than what Nootbaar makes.

Agree 100%
Find everyday players who are plus hitters and plus defenders.
Donovan and JJ can both hit and play quality defense.
And if they only hit 35 HR’s between them so what????
We’ve been jacking around waiting for Gorman’s power for years.
How has that worked out.
Sounds like they also messed with Walker’s swing to hit for more power and how has that worked out?
Before that it was TO.
Give me RISP bats and 15/20 HR’s is perfectly fine!!

And he would replace arenado who isn’t a slugging third baseman either or a good hitter

Correct!
We’re not replacing Mike Schmidt over there.

Nolan Arenado, even in his current form, is still the best 3B in the Cardinals system.

Oh I completely agree.
The assumption seems to be to go younger with Arenado also costing in $$ along with declining productivity.

[Talkin' Baseball]

I'm not opposed to moving him out, but Gorman is not a step up. It could be that our third baseman of the future is not with the Cardinals yet.

[Ozziesfan41]

I'm not opposed to moving him out, but Gorman is not a step up. It could be that our third baseman of the future is not with the Cardinals yet.

That I agree with.

[No-Mo-Mo]

I'm not opposed to moving him out, but Gorman is not a step up. It could be that our third baseman of the future is not with the Cardinals yet.

It's time to move on from Gorman. IIt's what you see what you get with this guy. He's had a few years to show what he can do and he hasn't.

[icon]

They are not moving their top prospect, an IF, to CF. Already tried that with Walker in RF. But Wetherholt looks for real as a hitter. No reason to mess with his head by dramatically changing his position at the MLB level.

What would be wrong with Wetherholt replacing Arenado at 3B if they keep Donovan for 2B?

And forget about both Herrera and Burly in the OF.

[PadsFS07]

They are not moving their top prospect, an IF, to CF. Already tried that with Walker in RF. But Wetherholt looks for real as a hitter. No reason to mess with his head by dramatically changing his position at the MLB level.

What would be wrong with Wetherholt replacing Arenado at 3B if they keep Donovan for 2B?

And forget about both Herrera and Burly in the OF.

Wetherholt hasn’t shown the arm strength and defensive chops to stay at SS and the same issues would follow at 3B.

He makes up for it by quickly getting rid of the ball, but that’s not going to get better at 3B. 2B should be his home, where he’d be (bleep) good imo.

[Talkin' Baseball]

They are not moving their top prospect, an IF, to CF. Already tried that with Walker in RF. But Wetherholt looks for real as a hitter. No reason to mess with his head by dramatically changing his position at the MLB level.

What would be wrong with Wetherholt replacing Arenado at 3B if they keep Donovan for 2B?

And forget about both Herrera and Burly in the OF.

Wetherholt hasn’t shown the arm strength and defensive chops to stay at SS and the same issues would follow at 3B.

He makes up for it by quickly getting rid of the ball, but that’s not going to get better at 3B. 2B should be his home, where he’d be (drat) good imo.

I would consider it a surprise if Wetherholt is anywhere except 2B next year.

[TraveledLessRoad]

I hope we find a taker for Nado and just plant Gorman at 3rd base for 140-145 games. Legitimately give him one season of full runway at one position. If we did that and stuck to it, we'd: A.) Finally have given him a true, fair shake. No excuses after next year. B.) From a production standpoint, I predict we'd see a large drop-off on D from Nado to him, a strikeout rate of 40%, maybe a .225 average, but probably 40 home runs and 85-100 RBI

[Bomber1]

I know this is a bit out of the box and might be borderline insane. But, what if next year's outfield was: Herrera in LF, JJ Wetherholt in CF, and Alec Burleson in RF? I believe the offensive output from these 3 could be near the top of the league. Now, I know this calls for putting 1 known not good outfielder in RF, and 2 completely unknowns in LF and CF, but I'd give it a whirl. JJ can play CF if he can play SS, 2b and 3b. Edman did it, Saggesse's done it. Heck, Kolten Wong did it.

That leaves you with Contreras at 1b, Donnie at 2b, Winn at SS, Arenado at 3rd, Crooks/Pages behind the dish, Saggesse and Church as IF/OF bench players and then go spend money on a big time bat that can play both 3rd base and DH.

Thoughts?

This would’ve been the year to experiment. For all the talk of runway and finding out what we have, they didn’t really answer any questions. Lost year.

No. There were a lot of answered questions they just may not like the answers they were given. Gorman can’t hit or field and should be traded. The bullpen has multiple closer options so don’t need to search for a closer. Herrera is a keeper just need to DH him. Pallante isn’t a very good starter. Walker sucks in the field and hitting and should be traded or if kept started in the minors until he hits his way to the big leagues. Donovan should be traded or signed to an extension in the offseason. No way you keep him and let him just walk as a free agent. Noot should be traded. The only unanswered questions have a lot to do with Sonny Contreras and arenado and if they will waive and be traded

Nice synopsis.

[ecleme22]

I hope we find a taker for Nado and just plant Gorman at 3rd base for 140-145 games. Legitimately give him one season of full runway at one position. If we did that and stuck to it, we'd: A.) Finally have given him a true, fair shake. No excuses after next year. B.) From a production standpoint, I predict we'd see a large drop-off on D from Nado to him, a strikeout rate of 40%, maybe a .225 average, but probably 40 home runs and 85-100 RBI

To your point, let's say they do this. What is the worst that can happen?

1. "Gorman horrible on 3B defense!" The team will stop playing him there.
2. "Gorman not good at the plate!" The team will stop giving him ABs.

Gorman's 2026 might turn into Carlson's 2024. Oh well. If Arenado is traded, he is blocking no one on the roster...

[Talkin' Baseball]

I know this is a bit out of the box and might be borderline insane. But, what if next year's outfield was: Herrera in LF, JJ Wetherholt in CF, and Alec Burleson in RF? I believe the offensive output from these 3 could be near the top of the league. Now, I know this calls for putting 1 known not good outfielder in RF, and 2 completely unknowns in LF and CF, but I'd give it a whirl. JJ can play CF if he can play SS, 2b and 3b. Edman did it, Saggesse's done it. Heck, Kolten Wong did it.

That leaves you with Contreras at 1b, Donnie at 2b, Winn at SS, Arenado at 3rd, Crooks/Pages behind the dish, Saggesse and Church as IF/OF bench players and then go spend money on a big time bat that can play both 3rd base and DH.

Thoughts?

This would’ve been the year to experiment. For all the talk of runway and finding out what we have, they didn’t really answer any questions. Lost year.

No. There were a lot of answered questions they just may not like the answers they were given. Gorman can’t hit or field and should be traded. The bullpen has multiple closer options so don’t need to search for a closer. Herrera is a keeper just need to DH him. Pallante isn’t a very good starter. Walker sucks in the field and hitting and should be traded or if kept started in the minors until he hits his way to the big leagues. Donovan should be traded or signed to an extension in the offseason. No way you keep him and let him just walk as a free agent. Noot should be traded. The only unanswered questions have a lot to do with Sonny Contreras and arenado and if they will waive and be traded

Nice synopsis.

+1

[Talkin' Baseball]

I hope we find a taker for Nado and just plant Gorman at 3rd base for 140-145 games. Legitimately give him one season of full runway at one position. If we did that and stuck to it, we'd: A.) Finally have given him a true, fair shake. No excuses after next year. B.) From a production standpoint, I predict we'd see a large drop-off on D from Nado to him, a strikeout rate of 40%, maybe a .225 average, but probably 40 home runs and 85-100 RBI

To your point, let's say they do this. What is the worst that can happen?

1. "Gorman horrible on 3B defense!" The team will stop playing him there.
2. "Gorman not good at the plate!" The team will stop giving him ABs.

Gorman's 2026 might turn into Carlson's 2024. Oh well. If Arenado is traded, he is blocking no one on the roster...

Why re-ask questions that have been answered? Search for a true answer. It would be better to have a hole at 3B next season than to put Gorman there and tell yourself you might have something, when you don't.