No one cares about batting average or ERA anymore?

[Bully4you]

How come?
What are the most relevant stats today
to assess hitting and pitching performance?
I always used RBI's HR's and batting average.
And ERA walks and strikeouts.
Now what is the best measure and
what are good numbers to attain?

[Monsieur De Treville]

How come?
What are the most relevant stats today
to assess hitting and pitching performance?
I always used RBI's HR's and batting average.
And ERA walks and strikeouts.
Now what is the best measure and
what are good numbers to attain?

OPS & OPS+ are excellent ways to evaluate a hitter.
ERA, ERA+, and WHIP are solid ways to look at pitching.

No stat is perfect or tells the whole story of a player's performance. Best to look at various data points in order to get the complete picture.

[Jatalk]

All stats are important if they don’t include subjective factors. One of the most overrated is WAR or any version thereof.

[Melville]

All stats are important if they don’t include subjective factors. One of the most overrated is WAR or any version thereof.

WAR is a complete fiction invented by fantasy baseball participants who never played the game.

[Melville]

How come?
What are the most relevant stats today
to assess hitting and pitching performance?
I always used RBI's HR's and batting average.
And ERA walks and strikeouts.
Now what is the best measure and
what are good numbers to attain?

BA is a far better measurement of a hitter than OBP (walks, while possessing some limited value, over-inflate OBP and OPS since they are often to the advantage of the pitcher and the defense,
Though rarely referenced anymore, "total bases" is the best offensive counting stat (though I would include SB in that total).
Run Production (Runs + RBI - HR) is best at measuring individual value to the offense.
Those 3 are the gold standard for hitters and always will be.
For starting pitchers, ERA, WHIP, number of starts, and innings pitched are the 4 most important metrics.
K's/9 and (of course) Wins are important.

[AnExParrot]

Sure people care about them, but batting average is not the only hitting stat. Some of these new fangled stats are<gasp>more important than batting average or, failing that, simply help paint a fuller picture about what a player did/is doing at the plate.

Same thing with ERA. With this team's defense so far this season, don't you think the pitchers' ERAs are benefiting? There are more informative or more telling stats regarding what a pitcher does on the mound.

[WeeVikes]

How come?
What are the most relevant stats today
to assess hitting and pitching performance?
I always used RBI's HR's and batting average.
And ERA walks and strikeouts.
Now what is the best measure and
what are good numbers to attain?

BA is a far better measurement of a hitter than OBP (walks, while possessing some limited value, over-inflate OBP and OPS since they are often to the advantage of the pitcher and the defense,
Though rarely referenced anymore, "total bases" is the best offensive counting stat (though I would include SB in that total).
Run Production (Runs + RBI - HR) is best at measuring individual value to the offense.
Those 3 are the gold standard for hitters and always will be.
For starting pitchers, ERA, WHIP, number of starts, and innings pitched are the 4 most important metrics.
K's/9 and (of course) Wins are important.

Mel — do you tweak your assessment of pitcher effectiveness for relievers?

[An Old Friend]

All stats are important if they don’t include subjective factors. One of the most overrated is WAR or any version thereof.

WAR is a complete fiction invented by fantasy baseball participants who never played the game.

WAR is not used in fantasy baseball.

[An Old Friend]

How come?
What are the most relevant stats today
to assess hitting and pitching performance?
I always used RBI's HR's and batting average.
And ERA walks and strikeouts.
Now what is the best measure and
what are good numbers to attain?

BA is a far better measurement of a hitter than OBP (walks, while possessing some limited value, over-inflate OBP and OPS since they are often to the advantage of the pitcher and the defense,
Though rarely referenced anymore, "total bases" is the best offensive counting stat (though I would include SB in that total).
Run Production (Runs + RBI - HR) is best at measuring individual value to the offense.
Those 3 are the gold standard for hitters and always will be.
For starting pitchers, ERA, WHIP, number of starts, and innings pitched are the 4 most important metrics.
K's/9 and (of course) Wins are important.

Mel — do you tweak your assessment of pitcher effectiveness for relievers?

Relievers are all trash because they abysmally fail the critically important "number of starts" metric.

In all seriousness, first thing I look at in relievers is K/9, second is HR/9. I want a guy out there who can miss bats and isn't overly susceptible to a big inning.

[3dender]

Sure people care about them, but batting average is not the only hitting stat. Some of these new fangled stats are<gasp>more important than batting average or, failing that, simply help paint a fuller picture about what a player did/is doing at the plate.

Same thing with ERA. With this team's defense so far this season, don't you think the pitchers' ERAs are benefiting? There are more informative or more telling stats regarding what a pitcher does on the mound.

Good answer which I'm sure will not be lost at all on OP, who definitely started this thread in good faith!

[Wattage]

How come?
What are the most relevant stats today
to assess hitting and pitching performance?
I always used RBI's HR's and batting average.
And ERA walks and strikeouts.
Now what is the best measure and
what are good numbers to attain?

Era is used by people plenty albeit not as an end all. Its especially used with starting pitchers still. People tend to place equal importance in whip for relievers because the sample size can be influenced too much by a few blow up outings and vecause of inherited runners not counting against reliever or reliever being bailed out by another reliever.

Batting avg cam be useful but is far overrated. Ops is the best and ops+, but you can still evaluate batting avg cuz not all stats are one fit all. But in lookjng at batting avg, keep in mind when evaluating players that league batting avg is only like .240 now

Also while walks are not as good as a hit in many situations even though equal as some. Batting avg ignores them completely. Also with batting avg- doubles are not equal to singles.

Rbis and homeruns are flawed in because they are dependent on other hitters and influenced by where ypu are in the lineup. You could put your 6th best hitter in 3rd or 4th in ljmeup and he wpuld end up among ypur team leaders in rbis even if he was mediocre. Also runs scored for some reaspn is ignored by rbi lovers even though it should at best be an equal part and opposite half ofnthe equation.

Homeruns are fine but shouldnt be used as end all stat. If just looking at just ba and homeruns, you ignore doubles and triples likenthey are equal to singles. Matt carpenter in his 2nd season wa sone of the best players in the league off of his extreme doubles power, not homeruns that year.

Ips is good cuz it factors in obp, and slg percentage component factors in both batting avg and extra base hits

[Absolut]

How come?
What are the most relevant stats today
to assess hitting and pitching performance?
I always used RBI's HR's and batting average.
And ERA walks and strikeouts.
Now what is the best measure and
what are good numbers to attain?

BA is a far better measurement of a hitter than OBP (walks, while possessing some limited value, over-inflate OBP and OPS since they are often to the advantage of the pitcher and the defense,
Though rarely referenced anymore, "total bases" is the best offensive counting stat (though I would include SB in that total).
Run Production (Runs + RBI - HR) is best at measuring individual value to the offense.
Those 3 are the gold standard for hitters and always will be.
For starting pitchers, ERA, WHIP, number of starts, and innings pitched are the 4 most important metrics.
K's/9 and (of course) Wins are important.

Mel — do you tweak your assessment of pitcher effectiveness for relievers?

Relievers are all trash because they abysmally fail the critically important "number of starts" metric.

In all seriousness, first thing I look at in relievers is K/9, second is HR/9. I want a guy out there who can miss bats and isn't overly susceptible to a big inning.

BB/9 too. Hate delivers who come in and give up free passes.

[WeeVikes]

How come?
What are the most relevant stats today
to assess hitting and pitching performance?
I always used RBI's HR's and batting average.
And ERA walks and strikeouts.
Now what is the best measure and
what are good numbers to attain?

BA is a far better measurement of a hitter than OBP (walks, while possessing some limited value, over-inflate OBP and OPS since they are often to the advantage of the pitcher and the defense,
Though rarely referenced anymore, "total bases" is the best offensive counting stat (though I would include SB in that total).
Run Production (Runs + RBI - HR) is best at measuring individual value to the offense.
Those 3 are the gold standard for hitters and always will be.
For starting pitchers, ERA, WHIP, number of starts, and innings pitched are the 4 most important metrics.
K's/9 and (of course) Wins are important.

Mel — do you tweak your assessment of pitcher effectiveness for relievers?

Relievers are all trash because they abysmally fail the critically important "number of starts" metric.

In all seriousness, first thing I look at in relievers is K/9, second is HR/9. I want a guy out there who can miss bats and isn't overly susceptible to a big inning.

Brilliant!

Seriously, though, I concur with your opinion. And as suggested later, BB/9 makes sense, too. I just wanted to see if Mel made a distinction.

[rockondlouie]

While BA has been minimalized given OPS is better gauge (IMO), I still think ERA (and FiP ERA) is/are as valid as ever and so is WHiP.

How many earned runs a pitcher allows and how many hits/walks shows all you really need to know about their effectiveness.

[An Old Friend]

How come?
What are the most relevant stats today
to assess hitting and pitching performance?
I always used RBI's HR's and batting average.
And ERA walks and strikeouts.
Now what is the best measure and
what are good numbers to attain?

BA is a far better measurement of a hitter than OBP (walks, while possessing some limited value, over-inflate OBP and OPS since they are often to the advantage of the pitcher and the defense,
Though rarely referenced anymore, "total bases" is the best offensive counting stat (though I would include SB in that total).
Run Production (Runs + RBI - HR) is best at measuring individual value to the offense.
Those 3 are the gold standard for hitters and always will be.
For starting pitchers, ERA, WHIP, number of starts, and innings pitched are the 4 most important metrics.
K's/9 and (of course) Wins are important.

Mel — do you tweak your assessment of pitcher effectiveness for relievers?

Relievers are all trash because they abysmally fail the critically important "number of starts" metric.

In all seriousness, first thing I look at in relievers is K/9, second is HR/9. I want a guy out there who can miss bats and isn't overly susceptible to a big inning.

Brilliant!

Seriously, though, I concur with your opinion. And as suggested later, BB/9 makes sense, too. I just wanted to see if Mel made a distinction.

Yes, BB/9 have importance... I just don't give them much weight with RP. If a guy has a low BB/9 but his K/9 is under 8, I'm probably not using that guy at the back end as a high leverage guy. That's more a bulk innings middle reliever. A fireman has to be able to get a strikeout.

[BrummerStealsHome]

Still the first things I go to.