Libby, maybe time to re-eval 'the trade' again

[Jobu's Rum]

I know I know only late May but what an absolute 180, he figured it out and is still only 25.

May need to be one of the ones to get an ext. and along with Winn and Herrera before they get too pricey.

[Ozziesfan41]

I know I know only late May but what an absolute 180, he figured it out and is still only 25.

May need to be one of the ones to get an ext. and along with Winn and Herrera before they get too pricey.

Let us hope the cards make the playoffs and Libby pitches the cardinals to the World Series like Randy hit the rays to the World Series. I think it’s just a shame they took this long to give him a legitimate shot at starting in the majors instead of jerking him around

[Alex Reyes Cy Young]

I know I know only late May but what an absolute 180, he figured it out and is still only 25.

May need to be one of the ones to get an ext. and along with Winn and Herrera before they get too pricey.

Let us hope the cards make the playoffs and Libby pitches the cardinals to the World Series like Randy hit the rays to the World Series. I think it’s just a shame they took this long to give him a legitimate shot at starting in the majors instead of jerking him around

People act like Randy isn't keeping pace this year, I find that odd. He has a 1.7 bWAR and a OPS+ 126 or if you prefer wRC+ 130. I understand he's not a superstar, but he is a 150 game starter year after year. That's not easy to do in MLB.

With that said, if he can keep this pace going (Libby) it'll start to look A LOT better and that would be a very good thing.

[2ninr]

Randy doesn't have to be bad in order for that trade to trend toward the Cardinals some. Because it was really one sided for a Long time.

[Colotiger]

He’s an example of why it is often wise not to give up too early on a young guy who is struggling.

[Ozziesfan41]

I know I know only late May but what an absolute 180, he figured it out and is still only 25.

May need to be one of the ones to get an ext. and along with Winn and Herrera before they get too pricey.

Let us hope the cards make the playoffs and Libby pitches the cardinals to the World Series like Randy hit the rays to the World Series. I think it’s just a shame they took this long to give him a legitimate shot at starting in the majors instead of jerking him around

People act like Randy isn't keeping pace this year, I find that odd. He has a 1.7 bWAR and a OPS+ 126 or if you prefer wRC+ 130. I understand he's not a superstar, but he is a 150 game starter year after year. That's not easy to do in MLB.

With that said, if he can keep this pace going (Libby) it'll start to look A LOT better and that would be a very good thing.

What I worry about with Libby is him hitting an innings wall.

[hugeCardfan]

I know I know only late May but what an absolute 180, he figured it out and is still only 25.

May need to be one of the ones to get an ext. and along with Winn and Herrera before they get too pricey.

Let us hope the cards make the playoffs and Libby pitches the cardinals to the World Series like Randy hit the rays to the World Series. I think it’s just a shame they took this long to give him a legitimate shot at starting in the majors instead of jerking him around

I don't. Libby has matured formidably. His command is so much better than even last year and eons better than 2 or3 years ago. He's only in his 2d ML season (re: contract control) leaving him 4 more after 2025. He is jelling at a critical time as the Redbirds break out from their caterpillar doldrums of '23-24. This year and the next 4 (plus?) years should dramatically benefit the Cardinals.

Timing has been perfect for St Louis.

We may have missed Arozarena significantly over the past 4 years, but, going forward Libby adds more value than Randy could.

[Alex Reyes Cy Young]

I know I know only late May but what an absolute 180, he figured it out and is still only 25.

May need to be one of the ones to get an ext. and along with Winn and Herrera before they get too pricey.

Let us hope the cards make the playoffs and Libby pitches the cardinals to the World Series like Randy hit the rays to the World Series. I think it’s just a shame they took this long to give him a legitimate shot at starting in the majors instead of jerking him around

People act like Randy isn't keeping pace this year, I find that odd. He has a 1.7 bWAR and a OPS+ 126 or if you prefer wRC+ 130. I understand he's not a superstar, but he is a 150 game starter year after year. That's not easy to do in MLB.

With that said, if he can keep this pace going (Libby) it'll start to look A LOT better and that would be a very good thing.

What I worry about with Libby is him hitting an innings wall.

Spoken like someone who understands this campaign is very very long.

[Ronnie Dobbs]

Isn't this how many trades work, though? You trade one guy who is good already for a guy who is is a few years off from being good? You don't always have to completely rip off the team you trade the good player for.

I mean, I remember Adam had some initial rough years in the minors with the Cardinals and JD Drew was a really (bleep) good player who they traded for him.

[Alex Reyes Cy Young]

Isn't this how many trades work, though? You trade one guy who is good already for a guy who is is a few years off from being good? You don't always have to completely rip off the team you trade the good player for.

I mean, I remember Adam had some initial rough years in the minors with the Cardinals and JD Drew was a really (drat) good player who they traded for him.

Good post, in fact the best trades are ones were you build win wins. People will want to continue to trade with you, but if you are consistently dumping trash in trades teams will eventually stop wanting to trade with you.

[hugeCardfan]

I know I know only late May but what an absolute 180, he figured it out and is still only 25.

May need to be one of the ones to get an ext. and along with Winn and Herrera before they get too pricey.

Let us hope the cards make the playoffs and Libby pitches the cardinals to the World Series like Randy hit the rays to the World Series. I think it’s just a shame they took this long to give him a legitimate shot at starting in the majors instead of jerking him around

People act like Randy isn't keeping pace this year, I find that odd. He has a 1.7 bWAR and a OPS+ 126 or if you prefer wRC+ 130. I understand he's not a superstar, but he is a 150 game starter year after year. That's not easy to do in MLB.

With that said, if he can keep this pace going (Libby) it'll start to look A LOT better and that would be a very good thing.

What I worry about with Libby is him hitting an innings wall.

Spoken like someone who understands this campaign is very very long.

This is a valid concern. I believe that at some point it might be good to introduce McGreevy in his place and give Libby a breather.

[Alex Reyes Cy Young]

I know I know only late May but what an absolute 180, he figured it out and is still only 25.

May need to be one of the ones to get an ext. and along with Winn and Herrera before they get too pricey.

Let us hope the cards make the playoffs and Libby pitches the cardinals to the World Series like Randy hit the rays to the World Series. I think it’s just a shame they took this long to give him a legitimate shot at starting in the majors instead of jerking him around

People act like Randy isn't keeping pace this year, I find that odd. He has a 1.7 bWAR and a OPS+ 126 or if you prefer wRC+ 130. I understand he's not a superstar, but he is a 150 game starter year after year. That's not easy to do in MLB.

With that said, if he can keep this pace going (Libby) it'll start to look A LOT better and that would be a very good thing.

What I worry about with Libby is him hitting an innings wall.

Spoken like someone who understands this campaign is very very long.

This is a valid concern. I believe that at some point it might be good to introduce McGreevy in his place and give Libby a breather.

Absolutely. Instead of turning him into the next Soroka or Strider, manage his innings with other pitchers, the one whom you named would be excellent, IMO.

[Rosie's Rule]

If Libby pitches with an ERA of 3ish or less for four more years (mirrors this year) and Randy A continues to perform at his current level - does the end result favor the Cards?

[ICCFIM2]

I know I know only late May but what an absolute 180, he figured it out and is still only 25.

May need to be one of the ones to get an ext. and along with Winn and Herrera before they get too pricey.

Let us hope the cards make the playoffs and Libby pitches the cardinals to the World Series like Randy hit the rays to the World Series. I think it’s just a shame they took this long to give him a legitimate shot at starting in the majors instead of jerking him around

People act like Randy isn't keeping pace this year, I find that odd. He has a 1.7 bWAR and a OPS+ 126 or if you prefer wRC+ 130. I understand he's not a superstar, but he is a 150 game starter year after year. That's not easy to do in MLB.

With that said, if he can keep this pace going (Libby) it'll start to look A LOT better and that would be a very good thing.

What I worry about with Libby is him hitting an innings wall.

Spoken like someone who understands this campaign is very very long.

This is a valid concern. I believe that at some point it might be good to introduce McGreevy in his place and give Libby a breather.

Absolutely. Instead of turning him into the next Soroka or Strider, manage his innings with other pitchers, the one whom you named would be excellent, IMO.

Didn't Oli manage to this today? He took him out after 88 pitches? He didn't labor at all. It was really 88 very easy looking pitches. He did not have a lot of high stress work. Given that his WHIP is around 1.0, it lowers the stress. While it is a long season, they appear to be monitoring his pitch count and stress level quite well. He is on track to pitch around 180 innings, which is a lot by today's standards. But, I wouldn't mess with success at this point. Give him a break at the all star break. Maybe take him out early in 1 or 2 starts, in particular if they build a big lead. If he gets in trouble in a game and starts building a pitch count, then yank him early. I think that would be a better way to manage his innings rather than skipping starts.

[imyourhuckleberry]

It's possible for both teams to win a trade

[3dender]

Arozarena will be worth about 20 WAR at the end of his 6 years of initial control. At his current rate, Libby will be worth 4 at the end of this year, with 4 more years of control to get to 20.

That's gonna be a tall order, but if he can get to say 15 then I'd say the trade ended up reasonable.