Mathews

[Cranny]

First up may be Zimmerman.

Who?

Bruce Zimmerman. 31 year old lefty at Memphis, signed as a FA in the off season to provide some fill in experience for the younger guys. Has been the ace of the staff, with an ERA of 3.15.

Laugh all you want, 11, but he’s pitching well, and has some major league experience. I took your question as being sincere. My bad.

I am looking for honesty.

Where's all this depth people were talking about?

Hes just another guy off the street discarded by other teams. That's his history.

How many times have the Cards had a former Minor League Pitcher of the Year in the system. Ace potential if he can return to form. Keep him.

This organizations road for the last decade has been paved with hope and pray, hope and pray.

Nothing new. That’s the way it is for prospects in all organizations.

Yeah sure.

Picking up every low hanging has been for a bag of shells.

You'll have to do better than that.

Has led all the minor leagues in strike outs in the past. This season, 11WS, he has had 4 starts for Memphis, and in 15 2/3 innings has given up only 11 hits and struck out 23. His walks are brutal, but the high ceiling is still there. Maybe a little patience on your part is warranted.

[11WSChamps]

First up may be Zimmerman.

Who?

Bruce Zimmerman. 31 year old lefty at Memphis, signed as a FA in the off season to provide some fill in experience for the younger guys. Has been the ace of the staff, with an ERA of 3.15.

Laugh all you want, 11, but he’s pitching well, and has some major league experience. I took your question as being sincere. My bad.

I am looking for honesty.

Where's all this depth people were talking about?

Hes just another guy off the street discarded by other teams. That's his history.

How many times have the Cards had a former Minor League Pitcher of the Year in the system. Ace potential if he can return to form. Keep him.

This organizations road for the last decade has been paved with hope and pray, hope and pray.

Nothing new. That’s the way it is for prospects in all organizations.

Yeah sure.

Picking up every low hanging has been for a bag of shells.

You'll have to do better than that.

Has led all the minor leagues in strike outs in the past. This season, 11WS, he has had 4 starts for Memphis, and in 15 2/3 innings has given up only 11 hits and struck out 23. His walks are brutal, but the high ceiling is still there. Maybe a little patience on your part is warranted.

How old is he and why at this stage in his career he cant throw strikes?

[casey1024]

A long way away.
Now 16 BB's issued in 15.2 innings this year.
After 74 in 99 innings a year ago.
I warned last offseason that he should be traded as part of a package before his stock fell even further.
Those who were foolishly expecting to see him in STL this year and contributing are going to be very disappointed.

I'm not sure if you are aware....but a lot of pitchers are learning and throwing new pitches in the minors and learning new adjustments in things like their deliveries and such. This can sometimes cause walk rates to rise. That's what the minors are for. He may not make it....but I doubt it is time to throw the towel in. Am I wrong?

[Clubmaker2]

Mathews seems to be one year younger than Liberatore, so its about time for him to show something.

[Melville]

A long way away.
Now 16 BB's issued in 15.2 innings this year.
After 74 in 99 innings a year ago.
I warned last offseason that he should be traded as part of a package before his stock fell even further.
Those who were foolishly expecting to see him in STL this year and contributing are going to be very disappointed.

I'm not sure if you are aware....but a lot of pitchers are learning and throwing new pitches in the minors and learning new adjustments in things like their deliveries and such. This can sometimes cause walk rates to rise. That's what the minors are for. He may not make it....but I doubt it is time to throw the towel in. Am I wrong?

I am aware of everything.
Mathews could become a quality MLB starter
But odds are against it currently.

[casey1024]

A long way away.
Now 16 BB's issued in 15.2 innings this year.
After 74 in 99 innings a year ago.
I warned last offseason that he should be traded as part of a package before his stock fell even further.
Those who were foolishly expecting to see him in STL this year and contributing are going to be very disappointed.

I'm not sure if you are aware....but a lot of pitchers are learning and throwing new pitches in the minors and learning new adjustments in things like their deliveries and such. This can sometimes cause walk rates to rise. That's what the minors are for. He may not make it....but I doubt it is time to throw the towel in. Am I wrong?

I am aware of everything.
Mathews could become a quality MLB starter
But odds are against it currently.

Atta boy........now at least you are finally admitting that you don't know for sure! Welcome to the rest of us normal ordinary people. Good job.

[smilinjoefission]

Mathews seems to be one year younger than Liberatore, so its about time for him to show something.

I know he needs to be up here for a look...time is running out on him. He could be a decent long man this season, worked into a starter next season or he flames out and we move on.

[Talkin' Baseball]

Mathews seems to be one year younger than Liberatore, so its about time for him to show something.

I know he needs to be up here for a look...time is running out on him. He could be a decent long man this season, worked into a starter next season or he flames out and we move on.

Whatever gets him to 140-150 IP.

[Melville]

A long way away.
Now 16 BB's issued in 15.2 innings this year.
After 74 in 99 innings a year ago.
I warned last offseason that he should be traded as part of a package before his stock fell even further.
Those who were foolishly expecting to see him in STL this year and contributing are going to be very disappointed.

I'm not sure if you are aware....but a lot of pitchers are learning and throwing new pitches in the minors and learning new adjustments in things like their deliveries and such. This can sometimes cause walk rates to rise. That's what the minors are for. He may not make it....but I doubt it is time to throw the towel in. Am I wrong?

I am aware of everything.
Mathews could become a quality MLB starter
But odds are against it currently.

Atta boy........now at least you are finally admitting that you don't know for sure! Welcome to the rest of us normal ordinary people. Good job.

I was the only person on the planet calling for him to be traded 2 years ago when he was ridiculously overvalued.
Right then.
Obvious now.

[riff raff]

A long way away.
Now 16 BB's issued in 15.2 innings this year.
After 74 in 99 innings a year ago.
I warned last offseason that he should be traded as part of a package before his stock fell even further.
Those who were foolishly expecting to see him in STL this year and contributing are going to be very disappointed.

I'm not sure if you are aware....but a lot of pitchers are learning and throwing new pitches in the minors and learning new adjustments in things like their deliveries and such. This can sometimes cause walk rates to rise. That's what the minors are for. He may not make it....but I doubt it is time to throw the towel in. Am I wrong?

I am aware of everything.
Mathews could become a quality MLB starter
But odds are against it currently.

Atta boy........now at least you are finally admitting that you don't know for sure! Welcome to the rest of us normal ordinary people. Good job.

I was the only person on the planet calling for him to be traded 2 years ago when he was ridiculously overvalued.
Right then.
Obvious now.

ok

[Cranny]

First up may be Zimmerman.

Who?

Bruce Zimmerman. 31 year old lefty at Memphis, signed as a FA in the off season to provide some fill in experience for the younger guys. Has been the ace of the staff, with an ERA of 3.15.

Laugh all you want, 11, but he’s pitching well, and has some major league experience. I took your question as being sincere. My bad.

I am looking for honesty.

Where's all this depth people were talking about?

Hes just another guy off the street discarded by other teams. That's his history.

How many times have the Cards had a former Minor League Pitcher of the Year in the system. Ace potential if he can return to form. Keep him.

This organizations road for the last decade has been paved with hope and pray, hope and pray.

Nothing new. That’s the way it is for prospects in all organizations.

Yeah sure.

Picking up every low hanging has been for a bag of shells.

You'll have to do better than that.

Has led all the minor leagues in strike outs in the past. This season, 11WS, he has had 4 starts for Memphis, and in 15 2/3 innings has given up only 11 hits and struck out 23. His walks are brutal, but the high ceiling is still there. Maybe a little patience on your part is warranted.

How old is he and why at this stage in his career he cant throw strikes?

Do your homework, 11WS.

Mathews -

2020 - Stanford
2021 - Stanford
2022 - Stanford
2023 - Stanford

2024 - Palm Beach promoted to Peoria promoted to Springfield promoted to Memphis
2025 - Memphis (22 starts)
2026 - Memphis (starts so far)

Born in October, 2000. Stayed at Stanford for 4 years. Promoted too early as a pro. Actually still developing now.
Have some patience, 11WS.

[11WSChamps]

Who?

Bruce Zimmerman. 31 year old lefty at Memphis, signed as a FA in the off season to provide some fill in experience for the younger guys. Has been the ace of the staff, with an ERA of 3.15.

Laugh all you want, 11, but he’s pitching well, and has some major league experience. I took your question as being sincere. My bad.

I am looking for honesty.

Where's all this depth people were talking about?

Hes just another guy off the street discarded by other teams. That's his history.

How many times have the Cards had a former Minor League Pitcher of the Year in the system. Ace potential if he can return to form. Keep him.

This organizations road for the last decade has been paved with hope and pray, hope and pray.

Nothing new. That’s the way it is for prospects in all organizations.

Yeah sure.

Picking up every low hanging has been for a bag of shells.

You'll have to do better than that.

Has led all the minor leagues in strike outs in the past. This season, 11WS, he has had 4 starts for Memphis, and in 15 2/3 innings has given up only 11 hits and struck out 23. His walks are brutal, but the high ceiling is still there. Maybe a little patience on your part is warranted.

How old is he and why at this stage in his career he cant throw strikes?

Do your homework, 11WS.

Mathews -

2020 - Stanford
2021 - Stanford
2022 - Stanford
2023 - Stanford

2024 - Palm Beach promoted to Peoria promoted to Springfield promoted to Memphis
2025 - Memphis (22 starts)
2026 - Memphis (starts so far)

Born in October, 2000. Stayed at Stanford for 4 years. Promoted too early as a pro. Actually still developing now.
Have some patience, 11WS.

We were talking about Zimmerman remember?

I always do my homework .

What's he done at the ML level, and in case you didn't catch it earlier and apparently you didnt that was a rhetorical question.

Enjoy.

[Cranny]

In case you didn’t notice, 11WS,
the conversation we were having was about Mathews. The conversation about Zimmerman was earlier in the thread.

[ICCFIM2]

A long way away.
Now 16 BB's issued in 15.2 innings this year.
After 74 in 99 innings a year ago.
I warned last offseason that he should be traded as part of a package before his stock fell even further.
Those who were foolishly expecting to see him in STL this year and contributing are going to be very disappointed.

I'm not sure if you are aware....but a lot of pitchers are learning and throwing new pitches in the minors and learning new adjustments in things like their deliveries and such. This can sometimes cause walk rates to rise. That's what the minors are for. He may not make it....but I doubt it is time to throw the towel in. Am I wrong?

You are correct, pitchers work on pitches at AAA, in particular if they are being sent down from the MLs or if it is their first year in AAA. Mathews got promoted to AAA at the end of 2024 when he made 4 starts and gave up 14 walks in 16 innings. In 2025 he spent most of the year in AAA where he had 22 starts and gave up 74 walks in 94 innings. This year, 4 starts and 16 walks in 15 innings. While he is only 25 years old, he has reached the point where he needs to get results to take the next step. This isn't a situation like Liam Doyle where they might tell him to throw 50% offspeed pitches in a game to get better at them. He is going to be working on a repeatable delivery that harnesses his command at this point while avoiding pitch tipping. That is the finishing school at AAA. If he can't succeed at this, hopefully he is at least as good as Gordon Graceffo out of the pen. Because this is where it looks like it is headed.

The reason why starting pitchers are so valuable is because they are so hard to develop. We are not the only team to have a lot of good looking pitching prospects stall out or fall by the wayside along the way. The Brewers and Mariners seem to be the most consistent at developing starters. This year we had Doyle, Mathews, Cijntje, Clarke, Roby, Franklin and Henderson coming into the season as top 15 prospects. We knew Roby was going to be out most of the year. Now Clark and Henderson are hurt as well. Only Franklin is performing. I am not yet concerned about Doyle. But, I and a lot of other people believed the Cardinals would have a lot of near term starting pitching depth with Dobbin, Fitts, Mathews and Henderson. That depth has been reduced to Dobbins...

[Cranny]

A long way away.
Now 16 BB's issued in 15.2 innings this year.
After 74 in 99 innings a year ago.
I warned last offseason that he should be traded as part of a package before his stock fell even further.
Those who were foolishly expecting to see him in STL this year and contributing are going to be very disappointed.

I'm not sure if you are aware....but a lot of pitchers are learning and throwing new pitches in the minors and learning new adjustments in things like their deliveries and such. This can sometimes cause walk rates to rise. That's what the minors are for. He may not make it....but I doubt it is time to throw the towel in. Am I wrong?

You are correct, pitchers work on pitches at AAA, in particular if they are being sent down from the MLs or if it is their first year in AAA. Mathews got promoted to AAA at the end of 2024 when he made 4 starts and gave up 14 walks in 16 innings. In 2025 he spent most of the year in AAA where he had 22 starts and gave up 74 walks in 94 innings. This year, 4 starts and 16 walks in 15 innings. While he is only 25 years old, he has reached the point where he needs to get results to take the next step. This isn't a situation like Liam Doyle where they might tell him to throw 50% offspeed pitches in a game to get better at them. He is going to be working on a repeatable delivery that harnesses his command at this point while avoiding pitch tipping. That is the finishing school at AAA. If he can't succeed at this, hopefully he is at least as good as Gordon Graceffo out of the pen. Because this is where it looks like it is headed.

The reason why starting pitchers are so valuable is because they are so hard to develop. We are not the only team to have a lot of good looking pitching prospects stall out or fall by the wayside along the way. The Brewers and Mariners seem to be the most consistent at developing starters. This year we had Doyle, Mathews, Cijntje, Clarke, Roby, Franklin and Henderson coming into the season as top 15 prospects. We knew Roby was going to be out most of the year. Now Clark and Henderson are hurt as well. Only Franklin is performing. I am not yet concerned about Doyle. But, I and a lot of other people believed the Cardinals would have a lot of near term starting pitching depth with Dobbin, Fitts, Mathews and Henderson. That depth has been reduced to Dobbins...

Why give up on Mathews? He’s only several good starts away from being a very viable potential call up.

[2ninr]

A long way away.
Now 16 BB's issued in 15.2 innings this year.
After 74 in 99 innings a year ago.
I warned last offseason that he should be traded as part of a package before his stock fell even further.
Those who were foolishly expecting to see him in STL this year and contributing are going to be very disappointed.

I'm not sure if you are aware....but a lot of pitchers are learning and throwing new pitches in the minors and learning new adjustments in things like their deliveries and such. This can sometimes cause walk rates to rise. That's what the minors are for. He may not make it....but I doubt it is time to throw the towel in. Am I wrong?

You are correct, pitchers work on pitches at AAA, in particular if they are being sent down from the MLs or if it is their first year in AAA. Mathews got promoted to AAA at the end of 2024 when he made 4 starts and gave up 14 walks in 16 innings. In 2025 he spent most of the year in AAA where he had 22 starts and gave up 74 walks in 94 innings. This year, 4 starts and 16 walks in 15 innings. While he is only 25 years old, he has reached the point where he needs to get results to take the next step. This isn't a situation like Liam Doyle where they might tell him to throw 50% offspeed pitches in a game to get better at them. He is going to be working on a repeatable delivery that harnesses his command at this point while avoiding pitch tipping. That is the finishing school at AAA. If he can't succeed at this, hopefully he is at least as good as Gordon Graceffo out of the pen. Because this is where it looks like it is headed.

The reason why starting pitchers are so valuable is because they are so hard to develop. We are not the only team to have a lot of good looking pitching prospects stall out or fall by the wayside along the way. The Brewers and Mariners seem to be the most consistent at developing starters. This year we had Doyle, Mathews, Cijntje, Clarke, Roby, Franklin and Henderson coming into the season as top 15 prospects. We knew Roby was going to be out most of the year. Now Clark and Henderson are hurt as well. Only Franklin is performing. I am not yet concerned about Doyle. But, I and a lot of other people believed the Cardinals would have a lot of near term starting pitching depth with Dobbin, Fitts, Mathews and Henderson. That depth has been reduced to Dobbins...

Why give up on Mathews? He’s only several good starts away from being a very viable potential call up.

Matthews just needs to find the plate more often. He's not the only one.