The solution to tanking?

[Jeff Goldblum]

Once again, tanking in baseball isn't a thing. MLB draft is completely different from the other 3 sports.

Once again, it's the same thing. Tanking is the deliberate losing that some teams do for various reasons but mostly because they're cheap. You might be the only person in the world to say that tanking isn't a thing in baseball. Check google or the internet anywhere that baseball is a topic and you'll find out how wrong you are.

Tanking usually implies a better draft slot. The NBA is notorious for it. NFL to a lesser extent.

Teams that lose have a higher chance to pick in the draft. It's a fact. That's how the Cards got JJ and LIam. There is a lottery system in the NBA also.

Why do the NBA and NHL have a draft lottery and the NFL and MLB do not?

The NBA and NHL probably don't have very strong unions. That would be my guess that there just isn't enough player solidarity at this point. The NFL and MLB do have fairly strong unions and player solidarity. Beyond that I don't really know.

Because MLB and NFL teams don't tank for draft picks. Class dismissed.

Not going to argue with you. There's plenty of articles discussing tanking in baseball. If you can figure out how to use Google then you can easily find them. Class dismissed.

There are also plenty of articles discussing lizard people if you Google lizard people.

[cosmo.kramer]

Once again, tanking in baseball isn't a thing. MLB draft is completely different from the other 3 sports.

Once again, it's the same thing. Tanking is the deliberate losing that some teams do for various reasons but mostly because they're cheap. You might be the only person in the world to say that tanking isn't a thing in baseball. Check google or the internet anywhere that baseball is a topic and you'll find out how wrong you are.

Tanking usually implies a better draft slot. The NBA is notorious for it. NFL to a lesser extent.

Teams that lose have a higher chance to pick in the draft. It's a fact. That's how the Cards got JJ and LIam. There is a lottery system in the NBA also.

Why do the NBA and NHL have a draft lottery and the NFL and MLB do not?

The NBA and NHL probably don't have very strong unions. That would be my guess that there just isn't enough player solidarity at this point. The NFL and MLB do have fairly strong unions and player solidarity. Beyond that I don't really know.

Because MLB and NFL teams don't tank for draft picks. Class dismissed.

Not going to argue with you. There's plenty of articles discussing tanking in baseball. If you can figure out how to use Google then you can easily find them. Class dismissed.

There are also plenty of articles discussing lizard people if you Google lizard people.

I feel like the tanking in baseball is more about owners running low payrolls and pocketing revenue sharing, while the tanking is basketball is more about the high draft pick. A top 3 pick in the NBA draft virtually guarantees an immediate contributor, but a top 3 pick in the MLB draft still takes years of development. Plus one NBA player has more impact on the game than one MLB player due to the roster, so the impact is greater.

[mattmitchl44]

The simple truth is that, without a significant change to the MLB environment - a salary cap/floor, more revenue sharing between teams, etc. - there are going to be a lot of teams, maybe half the league, that are going to make hard choices between (1) competing and (2) economics every year.

Fans can sit back and claim that all the owners should be rich enough to not care about economics, to not care about negative, annual cash flow as long as the value of their team is (presumably) increasing, etc., but the reality is that these owners did not become billionaires by thinking that way and you aren't going to find 30 owners who are interested in owning teams and running them like Steve Cohen.

Whether you call it "tanking" or fiscally responsible restraint in a year when a team knows it can't compete with the Dodgers, Yankees, Phillies, etc. anyway, given the current structure of baseball economics, many small market teams and an increasing number of mid-market teams are going to have to make hard choices about timing their windows of when to go all-in to "win now" and when to make decisions to back off ("tank", if that's what you call it) and conserve resources.

Based on what you are writing, I have no confidence in the viability of the league.
Basically, maybe 10 (and I am being generous) teams could compete in this environment.
The other 20 will have very little chance of being a WS competitor.
And that is boring and won't make the league any popular going forward.

That's why this CBA negotiation needs to significantly change the environment of MLB.

In short, the "few" - the largest MLB teams and their owners; and likely the superstar players and their agents - need to "lose" somewhat so that the "many" - the small/mid market MLB teams and owners; and the vast majority of journeyman and just regular players - can "win" somewhat to balance the overall competitiveness and health of MLB going forward.

[ScotchMIrish]

The lottery has been an answer to tanking but I would argue low revenue teams don't have to intentionally tank to lose 100 games. After the WS win Kansas City didn't have a winning record for 8 years including 3 100 loss seasons. 2 of those 100 loss teams were managed by Yost who managed them to the WS win.

They weren't trying to be lousy. They just didn't have the players to win.

[CCard]

Once again, tanking in baseball isn't a thing. MLB draft is completely different from the other 3 sports.

Once again, it's the same thing. Tanking is the deliberate losing that some teams do for various reasons but mostly because they're cheap. You might be the only person in the world to say that tanking isn't a thing in baseball. Check google or the internet anywhere that baseball is a topic and you'll find out how wrong you are.

Tanking usually implies a better draft slot. The NBA is notorious for it. NFL to a lesser extent.

Teams that lose have a higher chance to pick in the draft. It's a fact. That's how the Cards got JJ and LIam. There is a lottery system in the NBA also.

The difference is that a single player can impact a team immediately in the nba or nfl

A great hoops player plays and contributes their first season…….cooper Flagg is an example…

A great running back plays immediately in the nfl

The top pick in baseball is usually at least two, three years away……

You really think a team is going to tank to get a shot at a player three years from now?…….

So in your opinion "tanking doesn't happen". Is that your opinion because it's easy to find plenty of material about teams tanking. The Cards have already gotten two premium picks and now are aiming for more I guess. That and the CBA is probably a combination of why they're gutting payroll so much.

In your opinion, what’s the difference between tanking and rebuilding?

IMO, every team in baseball rebuilds every year to some extent. Even the Dodgers rebuilt some. Tanking on the other hand is not giving your best effort to field a competitive team in preparation for losing a large amount of games. In essence, intentionally fielding a bad team without care of winning. The Cards could have brought up some young guys while still signing some veteran top tier talent and competed for the Central. They've chosen not to. Gutting payroll will have the intended effect most likely, barring some kind of miracle where multiple minor league players show up as stars and untested, unproven pitchers become some cohesive dominant rotation. Not likely.

I think you’re asking too much. Not a cohesive dominant rotation, but maybe one Ace. Same for the infielders. One will emerge, hopefully at third.

Then we turn out attention to the outfield. That’s why there has been no additions- it’s Walkers, Scott’s and Churches audition.

Once this is done we add the missing pieces. Next off season.

The problem with that is two fold. One... the pieces that we want to add may not be available then. Two...That's no excuse to shirk the responsibility to field a competitive team now, this year.

[Cusecards]

Looking forward to another season of Cards baseball.
Should prove to be interesting regardless of the W/L record.
And Thank God for the “anonymous” Internet so we don’t have to deal with some of these rocket scientists in real life.
Play ball!!!

[AnExParrot]

Looking forward to another season of Cards baseball.
Should prove to be interesting regardless of the W/L record.
And Thank God for the “anonymous” Internet so we don’t have to deal with some of these rocket scientists in real life.
Play ball!!!

Pre-smart phones, I used to love it at my "home" bar when guys would say some stupid [shirt], and I had stats to prove just how stupid that [shirt] was. Funny how smart phones kinda ended most of those guys saying the stupid [shirt] in real-life settings, knowing their take could be shot down with a couple easy searches. Weird that this place seems immune to it, though.

[Cusecards]

Looking forward to another season of Cards baseball.
Should prove to be interesting regardless of the W/L record.
And Thank God for the “anonymous” Internet so we don’t have to deal with some of these rocket scientists in real life.
Play ball!!!

Pre-smart phones, I used to love it at my "home" bar when guys would say some stupid [shirt], and I had stats to prove just how stupid that [shirt] was. Funny how smart phones kinda ended most of those guys saying the stupid [shirt] in real-life settings, knowing their take could be shot down with a couple easy searches. Weird that this place seems immune to it, though.

This is only my 4th year posting and I readily admit to making changes every year.
“Venting” to some degree is done by everyone.
I know I do at times and always try limiting it.
I admit to going overboard at times especially after a frustrating loss! LOL
I also get the “frustration” aspect but while most of us limit that I still don’t get those who appear to be miserable about the team on a daily basis??

[CCard]

Looking forward to another season of Cards baseball.
Should prove to be interesting regardless of the W/L record.
And Thank God for the “anonymous” Internet so we don’t have to deal with some of these rocket scientists in real life.
Play ball!!!

Pre-smart phones, I used to love it at my "home" bar when guys would say some stupid [shirt], and I had stats to prove just how stupid that [shirt] was. Funny how smart phones kinda ended most of those guys saying the stupid [shirt] in real-life settings, knowing their take could be shot down with a couple easy searches. Weird that this place seems immune to it, though.

LOL...I figured you were part of the "Fake News" crowd. Some, even when confronted with facts, just deny them. It's one of the worst things to happen to this country.

[Jeff Goldblum]

Looking forward to another season of Cards baseball.
Should prove to be interesting regardless of the W/L record.
And Thank God for the “anonymous” Internet so we don’t have to deal with some of these rocket scientists in real life.
Play ball!!!

Pre-smart phones, I used to love it at my "home" bar when guys would say some stupid [shirt], and I had stats to prove just how stupid that [shirt] was. Funny how smart phones kinda ended most of those guys saying the stupid [shirt] in real-life settings, knowing their take could be shot down with a couple easy searches. Weird that this place seems immune to it, though.

LOL...I figured you were part of the "Fake News" crowd. Some, even when confronted with facts, just deny them. It's one of the worst things to happen to this country.

One of the worst things to happen to this country is teaching dumb, angry old men how to use the internet.

[CCard]

Looking forward to another season of Cards baseball.
Should prove to be interesting regardless of the W/L record.
And Thank God for the “anonymous” Internet so we don’t have to deal with some of these rocket scientists in real life.
Play ball!!!

Pre-smart phones, I used to love it at my "home" bar when guys would say some stupid [shirt], and I had stats to prove just how stupid that [shirt] was. Funny how smart phones kinda ended most of those guys saying the stupid [shirt] in real-life settings, knowing their take could be shot down with a couple easy searches. Weird that this place seems immune to it, though.

LOL...I figured you were part of the "Fake News" crowd. Some, even when confronted with facts, just deny them. It's one of the worst things to happen to this country.

One of the worst things to happen to this country is teaching dumb, angry old men how to use the internet.

I wish that were true but the state of the matter is that some people can't be taught. I think it might be heavy metal poisoning as the cause of the "fake news" crowd. ....sees facts ....runs from them...while screaming about fake news.

[imyourhuckleberry]

Looking forward to another season of Cards baseball.
Should prove to be interesting regardless of the W/L record.
And Thank God for the “anonymous” Internet so we don’t have to deal with some of these rocket scientists in real life.
Play ball!!!

Pre-smart phones, I used to love it at my "home" bar when guys would say some stupid [shirt], and I had stats to prove just how stupid that [shirt] was. Funny how smart phones kinda ended most of those guys saying the stupid [shirt] in real-life settings, knowing their take could be shot down with a couple easy searches. Weird that this place seems immune to it, though.

LOL...I figured you were part of the "Fake News" crowd. Some, even when confronted with facts, just deny them. It's one of the worst things to happen to this country.

One of the worst things to happen to this country is teaching dumb, angry old men how to use the internet.

You didn't ask for an amen, but I'm giving you one anyway.

[AnExParrot]

Looking forward to another season of Cards baseball.
Should prove to be interesting regardless of the W/L record.
And Thank God for the “anonymous” Internet so we don’t have to deal with some of these rocket scientists in real life.
Play ball!!!

Pre-smart phones, I used to love it at my "home" bar when guys would say some stupid [shirt], and I had stats to prove just how stupid that [shirt] was. Funny how smart phones kinda ended most of those guys saying the stupid [shirt] in real-life settings, knowing their take could be shot down with a couple easy searches. Weird that this place seems immune to it, though.

LOL...I figured you were part of the "Fake News" crowd. Some, even when confronted with facts, just deny them. It's one of the worst things to happen to this country.

That's hilarious coming from the guy who admits to arguing points out of his own ignorance.

As for the "fake news crowd" you couldn't be farther from the truth, which should be a pretty comfortable feeling for you, but coming to that conclusion after what I posted is a real head scratcher since I talked about actually having stats to prove the stupid [shirt] they said was, in fact, stupid [shirt].

[Barksdale's People]

There is no solution to bad teams chasing the best available young players via the draft. The four major leagues have four different draft formats, yet all four leagues also have some level of tanking or “keeping the powder dry” for the future.

This is all very obvious. Draft lotteries are dumb and ultimately ineffective. The worst teams should get the best picks. Not because it will end tanking but because it is the fairest solution. Fair makes sense to me.

[CCard]

Looking forward to another season of Cards baseball.
Should prove to be interesting regardless of the W/L record.
And Thank God for the “anonymous” Internet so we don’t have to deal with some of these rocket scientists in real life.
Play ball!!!

Pre-smart phones, I used to love it at my "home" bar when guys would say some stupid [shirt], and I had stats to prove just how stupid that [shirt] was. Funny how smart phones kinda ended most of those guys saying the stupid [shirt] in real-life settings, knowing their take could be shot down with a couple easy searches. Weird that this place seems immune to it, though.

LOL...I figured you were part of the "Fake News" crowd. Some, even when confronted with facts, just deny them. It's one of the worst things to happen to this country.

That's hilarious coming from the guy who admits to arguing points out of his own ignorance.

As for the "fake news crowd" you couldn't be farther from the truth, which should be a pretty comfortable feeling for you, but coming to that conclusion after what I posted is a real head scratcher since I talked about actually having stats to prove the stupid [shirt] they said was, in fact, stupid [shirt].

No proof so we'll all never know the truth, but I know what it sounds like.

[CCard]

Looking forward to another season of Cards baseball.
Should prove to be interesting regardless of the W/L record.
And Thank God for the “anonymous” Internet so we don’t have to deal with some of these rocket scientists in real life.
Play ball!!!

Pre-smart phones, I used to love it at my "home" bar when guys would say some stupid [shirt], and I had stats to prove just how stupid that [shirt] was. Funny how smart phones kinda ended most of those guys saying the stupid [shirt] in real-life settings, knowing their take could be shot down with a couple easy searches. Weird that this place seems immune to it, though.

LOL...I figured you were part of the "Fake News" crowd. Some, even when confronted with facts, just deny them. It's one of the worst things to happen to this country.

One of the worst things to happen to this country is teaching dumb, angry old men how to use the internet.

LOL...I'd say one of the worst things to happen to this country is corrupt, dumb, angry old men.