Is this rebuild essentially complete?

[rockondlouie]

Not even close......

-Donny deal coming

-JoJo deal coming

-NADO deal likely coming?

-Possible WillyC deal coming?

-Noot, Burleson, ????? could be had sometime this season or in the offseason?

-Likely a FA RP or two added?

-More wheeling & dealing next winter?

[RichieRichSTL]

Why do you/would you think this is a single year endeavor?

You are probably correct.
We won't know if the rebuild is finished until they start winning again.
Looks like with a couple more modifications, this year's rebuild is nearly finished.
We will have to see what happens with 2026 as to whether the rebuild is ongoing.
Beautiful, just lovely.

There is no "this season's rebuild" - there is THE rebuild. It took years to f^<k, gonna take at least a couple years to unf^>k.

I agree with you.
But if they happen to somehow win 90+ games next year (farfetched).
Then this year would have completed the rebuild, right?
Isn't it all dependent on wins?

There's really not much to talk about if you don't understand what the team is trying to do. What you've posted so far in this thread shows no indication you have any idea of what a rebuild is, why it's being done, or just how it gets done. Get back to us when you figure that out.

Fair enough.
Explain it to me then.
Or not.

You don't know/remember what the Cubs did? You don't know/remember what the Astros did? You don't know what the Nats have been doing for the last few seasons?

You don't read what posters like mattmitch and rbirules have said/have been saying, for years, regarding this team, its need to rebuild, and just how it would/should be done?

It sure feels like you're feigning ignorance(for whatever end you have in mind), but I'll give you a little hand to get you started.

It isn't all dependent on wins - at this point the '26 win total is basically irrelevant. That was how the team got into this mess - winning enough just to get into the playoffs, in what most consider to be a weak division, and making a quick exit out of the playoffs because they just can't match talent with the likes of the coastal giants. The intent is to build a young core that can be supplemented by trades/FA signings to give the team a real shot at a ring. That wasn't the case in the last decade, and trying to patch the team year-over-year, to that end, just put them deeper in a hole as evidenced the last 2-3 seasons.

mattmitch(and rbi) have outlined this over and over, here, for several years. Like them or not, they were absolutely correct that it needed to happen and have a good grasp on how it needs to get done, and have shared it repeatedly for anyone wanting to know.

So, what should we do big guy?
Should we sell every asset we have and get prospects?
Accumulate tons of prospects and see what happens?
You do realize the success rate of prospects don't you?
And so, why sign May if that is the plan?
Makes zero sense.
Because he isn't planning on following Mattmitch or you or rbi etc.
I don't think this is a real rebuild.
That's why I said what I did as sarcasm.

You arent going to keep all of them and without spending a lot of cash/draft pics, you arent contending. So, you pick an asset or two like a Burleson to keep to have stability, look for a few good prospects out of your stash and leverage others later in trade. Signing May is a buy low, flip if successful asset. Besides you have to have some major league arms to not be a White Sox/Rockies unwatchable disaster and to buy time for not quite ready arms.

[RichieRichSTL]

I expect them to trade more chips, otherwise it is a half-&ssed Mo special

Point of a rebuild is to leverage short term assets to try to find/bring in longer term ones. Without spending a lot of $$ and draft pics, the Cardinals will not be contenders this season and likely next season. 2024 showed that they were not willing to do what it took. They needed more than Gray and a couple of bum SPs to contend.

Let's face it, they need to stock their farm system with promising assets that will be ready within two years or close to it.. You dont do that by holding onto players that probably wont be long termers for you.

If Donovan, Contreras, Romero, Arenado, Noot and Burleson are all in this team going into next season, Bloom will have failed. I do not expect them all to be traded, some should if the rebuild is serious.

Why not trade them all. Done with some luck, the team would be super young. Then if we receive athletes, combine with a young stable core, we might compete.

Not necessarily opposed. I meant to include Gorman too. However, Arenado exception, you expect to get more than salary relief. If you are offered a bag of balls for a player, why trade them? But if you are offered promising future assets.. Lets face it, a Gallegos type while not flashy would be better asset in two years than a Noot or similar dont have to be all top prospects to succeed.

[Ronnie Dobbs]

I don't think it's complete, but I have the belief that it will not take as long as some other teams. They got started early with their rebuild by having Bloom come in and evaluate the system. Then they had all last year to build on his vision for the system. We already have some young prospects waiting to come up this year, and possibly a few more in 2027, and I think the trades this offseason will help get there even more. It's not like they had a bunch of huge, multi-year contracts that they have to offload. Yes, they may have to send some more money, like they did with Gray, but it's not a backbreaking amount on a bunch of guys who are past their prime and no one wants them. The only one they really have to dump is Arenado, and he is still great defensively, at least.

Now, I understand that there is still uncertainty with the upcoming CBA and whatnot, but I will join a lot of those complaining about the direction of the team if they use this as an excuse to lower they pay for good, rather than get back to top third, top ten like they maintained for decades. If that is the case, then I do hope they get called out on it and fans stay away. But they have promised that this is temporary, so we should hold them to that.

[Bully4you]

Not even close......

-Donny deal coming

-JoJo deal coming

-NADO deal likely coming?

-Possible WillyC deal coming?

-Noot, Burleson, ????? could be had sometime this season or in the offseason?

-Likely a FA RP or two added?

-More wheeling & dealing next winter?

So, he will turn us into the Colorado Rockies his first year as POBO?
Don't see it happening.
Just don't.

[Jatalk]

With the dump of Gray and signing of his replacement?
Sure, Arenado needs to be dealt with, but nothing of significance coming back there.
Don't necessarily need to trade Donovan, as he could be part of rebuild.
So, if this is nearly all that will be done, it was a short and sweet rebuild.
At this juncture, does anyone call this a "Major Change"?
Even if they trade Donovan, it really isn't all that major.

Well let’s see.

Assuming Donovan gone you need a 2nd or third baseman preferably with some pop.

You need both corner outfielders

Need some veterans in pitching staff and you need a closer.

And you need to continue to beef up minor leagues.

Also you need to clean house of mediocre players. Gorman, Walker, Noot, etc.

Like you said we are almost done.

[Carp4Cy]

Why do you/would you think this is a single year endeavor?

This is year 4. Next year will be blooms third year with the organization. The minor leagues have been at this for a while. Heck most of the org has. They just won’t get rid of Oli and his coaches though.

[Talkin' Baseball]

Why do you/would you think this is a single year endeavor?

This is year 4. Next year will be blooms third year with the organization. The minor leagues have been at this for a while. Heck most of the org has. They just won’t get rid of Oli and his coaches though.

The part Bloom has been in charge of is vastly improved and rising.

[AnExParrot]

Why do you/would you think this is a single year endeavor?

You are probably correct.
We won't know if the rebuild is finished until they start winning again.
Looks like with a couple more modifications, this year's rebuild is nearly finished.
We will have to see what happens with 2026 as to whether the rebuild is ongoing.
Beautiful, just lovely.

There is no "this season's rebuild" - there is THE rebuild. It took years to f^<k, gonna take at least a couple years to unf^>k.

I agree with you.
But if they happen to somehow win 90+ games next year (farfetched).
Then this year would have completed the rebuild, right?
Isn't it all dependent on wins?

There's really not much to talk about if you don't understand what the team is trying to do. What you've posted so far in this thread shows no indication you have any idea of what a rebuild is, why it's being done, or just how it gets done. Get back to us when you figure that out.

Fair enough.
Explain it to me then.
Or not.

You don't know/remember what the Cubs did? You don't know/remember what the Astros did? You don't know what the Nats have been doing for the last few seasons?

You don't read what posters like mattmitch and rbirules have said/have been saying, for years, regarding this team, its need to rebuild, and just how it would/should be done?

It sure feels like you're feigning ignorance(for whatever end you have in mind), but I'll give you a little hand to get you started.

It isn't all dependent on wins - at this point the '26 win total is basically irrelevant. That was how the team got into this mess - winning enough just to get into the playoffs, in what most consider to be a weak division, and making a quick exit out of the playoffs because they just can't match talent with the likes of the coastal giants. The intent is to build a young core that can be supplemented by trades/FA signings to give the team a real shot at a ring. That wasn't the case in the last decade, and trying to patch the team year-over-year, to that end, just put them deeper in a hole as evidenced the last 2-3 seasons.

mattmitch(and rbi) have outlined this over and over, here, for several years. Like them or not, they were absolutely correct that it needed to happen and have a good grasp on how it needs to get done, and have shared it repeatedly for anyone wanting to know.

So, what should we do big guy?
Should we sell every asset we have and get prospects?
Accumulate tons of prospects and see what happens?
You do realize the success rate of prospects don't you?
And so, why sign May if that is the plan?
Makes zero sense.
Because he isn't planning on following Mattmitch or you or rbi etc.
I don't think this is a real rebuild.
That's why I said what I did as sarcasm.

Why sign May? It's a one year deal - they didn't sign him to a long term deal. He can be traded at the deadline for, wait for it, more prospects. He gives the team a veteran starter with some upside, and his stuff is electric which might get some folks to the ballpark just to watch him pitch.

Yes, I realize the success rate of prospects. That's why they want as many of them as they can get their hands on - the only way to counter the low success rate is with numbers.

Bloom has been POBO for all of a couple months. He's planning on rebuilding the minor league system with the intent of creating a young, cost-controlled core of players. That is absolutely following matt/rbi's suggestions.

So feigning ignorance it isis what it was - no need to respond, we're done here.

[ecleme22]

Why do you/would you think this is a single year endeavor?

You are probably correct.
We won't know if the rebuild is finished until they start winning again.
Looks like with a couple more modifications, this year's rebuild is nearly finished.
We will have to see what happens with 2026 as to whether the rebuild is ongoing.
Beautiful, just lovely.

There is no "this season's rebuild" - there is THE rebuild. It took years to f^<k, gonna take at least a couple years to unf^>k.

I agree with you.
But if they happen to somehow win 90+ games next year (farfetched).
Then this year would have completed the rebuild, right?
Isn't it all dependent on wins?

There's really not much to talk about if you don't understand what the team is trying to do. What you've posted so far in this thread shows no indication you have any idea of what a rebuild is, why it's being done, or just how it gets done. Get back to us when you figure that out.

Fair enough.
Explain it to me then.
Or not.

You don't know/remember what the Cubs did? You don't know/remember what the Astros did? You don't know what the Nats have been doing for the last few seasons?

You don't read what posters like mattmitch and rbirules have said/have been saying, for years, regarding this team, its need to rebuild, and just how it would/should be done?

It sure feels like you're feigning ignorance(for whatever end you have in mind), but I'll give you a little hand to get you started.

It isn't all dependent on wins - at this point the '26 win total is basically irrelevant. That was how the team got into this mess - winning enough just to get into the playoffs, in what most consider to be a weak division, and making a quick exit out of the playoffs because they just can't match talent with the likes of the coastal giants. The intent is to build a young core that can be supplemented by trades/FA signings to give the team a real shot at a ring. That wasn't the case in the last decade, and trying to patch the team year-over-year, to that end, just put them deeper in a hole as evidenced the last 2-3 seasons.

mattmitch(and rbi) have outlined this over and over, here, for several years. Like them or not, they were absolutely correct that it needed to happen and have a good grasp on how it needs to get done, and have shared it repeatedly for anyone wanting to know.

So, what should we do big guy?
Should we sell every asset we have and get prospects?
Accumulate tons of prospects and see what happens?
You do realize the success rate of prospects don't you?
And so, why sign May if that is the plan?
Makes zero sense.
Because he isn't planning on following Mattmitch or you or rbi etc.
I don't think this is a real rebuild.
That's why I said what I did as sarcasm.

Rebuilds often involve signing vets to one year deals. Then flipping them at the deadline.

Also, cards can theoretically, for example, start a struggling Jordan Walker 160 games next year.

You can’t do that with starting pitching. If you have to have your starters accumulate innings.

[mattmitchl44]

The "rebuild" phase likely isn't over until at least Wetherholt and Doyle have made it to the majors AND demonstrated at least near All-Star levels of performance.

When that happens, along with the development of some presumably lesser, but still important, young players, then you can consider the "rebuild" phase to be essentially complete.

[45s]

You better hope not…

[mattmitchl44]

With Bloom adding May, it appears he might just be trying to compete in 2026.

Signing May has nothing to do with really competing in 2026.

As FA signings go, May is a relatively cheap FA "lottery ticket" which, if he realizes his upside in the 1st half of 2026, likely gets traded for more prospects in July.

Even if May is great, the rest of this roster isn't going to be good enough for him to "lead them" to an NL pennant, WS championship, etc.

[AZ_Cardsfan]

The goal is obvious. Be a contender. The path is:

1) Repair the neglected farm system. That means hire more/better scouts and coaches and purchase state of the art technology systems etc. I believe and hope this part is already done. Of course if a superior scout or coach becomes available I hope they spend to add them.

2) Restock the farm system with higher end talent. No longer should they shoot for the easiest to project but ceiling limited talent. Shoot for the moon and get the next Pujols/Wainwright/Ozzie level talent. This began 2 years ago with a change in draft strategies IMO and is ongoing. This part will be continuous and part of it means the trading currently being discussed ala Donovan and Romero. Will be complete enough to call done after Donovan is traded. Of course the strategy continues ad infinitum.

3) In 1-2 years when the farm begins producing real ML talent again set focus on signing high end free agents to fill areas of need building salary levels back up to previous levels and higher if revenues will support. How high will depend on whatever happens in the new contract with baseball and how much TV revenues STL can expect.

At that point team is no longer in a rebuild rather is in a new state of function that hopefully makes them a stronger competitor. IMO.

[ecleme22]

With Bloom adding May, it appears he might just be trying to compete in 2026.

Signing May has nothing to do with really competing in 2026.

As FA signings go, May is a relatively cheap FA "lottery ticket" which, if he realizes his upside in the 1st half of 2026, likely gets traded for more prospects in July.

Even if May is great, the rest of this roster isn't going to be good enough for him to "lead them" to an NL pennant, WS championship, etc.

Just when I think Bully is starting to understand...

[rockondlouie]

Not even close......

-Donny deal coming

-JoJo deal coming

-NADO deal likely coming?

-Possible WillyC deal coming?

-Noot, Burleson, ????? could be had sometime this season or in the offseason?

-Likely a FA RP or two added?

-More wheeling & dealing next winter?

So, he will turn us into the Colorado Rockies his first year as POBO?
Don't see it happening.
Just don't.

Not hardly bully, Rockies? Get real.

The 2026 team will be better than the 2025 team and after the new CBA is settled Dewitt will likely open up the wallet.