Will Schenn trade bring equal to Brock Nelson?

[seattleblue]

And tbh, I didn’t think Tarasenko was worth a 1st at the time and we were lucky to get that. Likely why he had to include Mikkola to get the Rangers’ 1st. To me, it was clear the wheels were about to fall off Tarasenko as he was declining hard. His goals for %, Corsi and Fenwick were all hovering around 45% that year (meaning the Blues were getting outscored and outchaned 45 to 55% whenever Tarasenko was on the ice). I was pretty ecstatic to get a 1st for him tbh.

You know I can nitpick Armstrong but I was impressed that deadline how he jumped the market to lock down that 1st. It was a great draft to stockpile 1sts and for this exact reason you articulate with Tarasenko's play in 22-23 (Tarasenko's 21-22 was impressive and Masterton worthy to me), him jumping the market to lock down the more difficult 1st to get was a low key shrewd move that I personally appreciated then and now.

[Pierre McGuire]

Ritchie is a really good player. I’m still shocked the Av’s gave him up but they truly believed they had a shot at the Cup. Pretty good trade for the Islanders

Armstrong wanted to trade Schenn at the trade deadline. Do you think that that Avs tried to get Schenn first, over Nelson?

I see that the Avs are trying to sign Nelson longer-term now.

No…pretty sure Army was discussing Schenn with Toronto.

if I had to guess, it was more TOR asking about Schenn than Army shopping him

again, just a guess

It was more than asking..they had a deal agreed upon.

I hadn't heard that.

I had heard that Army asked Schenn if he'd be willing to waive and he said yes if he would be united with his brother, otherwise he wasn't interested.

Army was on record before the deadline that he wouldn’t ask anybody to waive unless he had a deal that he liked.

[STL fan in MN]

And tbh, I didn’t think Tarasenko was worth a 1st at the time and we were lucky to get that. Likely why he had to include Mikkola to get the Rangers’ 1st. To me, it was clear the wheels were about to fall off Tarasenko as he was declining hard. His goals for %, Corsi and Fenwick were all hovering around 45% that year (meaning the Blues were getting outscored and outchaned 45 to 55% whenever Tarasenko was on the ice). I was pretty ecstatic to get a 1st for him tbh.

You know I can nitpick Armstrong but I was impressed that deadline how he jumped the market to lock down that 1st. It was a great draft to stockpile 1sts and for this exact reason you articulate with Tarasenko's play in 22-23 (Tarasenko's 21-22 was impressive and Masterton worthy to me), him jumping the market to lock down the more difficult 1st to get was a low key shrewd move that I personally appreciated then and now.

That’s a good point and a very key detail I omitted. Tarasenko had a full NTC and it was pretty well known he wanted to go to the NYR. Patrick Kane was also rumored to NYR but was recovering from a hip injury. Army traded Tarasenko to the Rangers about a month before the trade deadline, as you said, jumping the market. I think a lot of GMs would’ve waited until the last minute to see if they could get a better deal but Army weighed the risk very well. The Rangers met his price so he made the deal. If he had waited, maybe Kane goes to the Rangers for a 1st and the offer for Tarasenko goes off the table. And then Tarasenko says no to being traded anywhere else and it’s a disaster. Or maybe Tarasenko gets injured in that month and all of a sudden you have no asset to trade anymore. That’s the kind of risk a GM has to weigh and I agree with you that Army read the market perfectly in that situation.

A few weeks later, Kane (a better player than Tarasenko) was also traded to the Rangers but for a lesser package - the main piece bring a conditional 2nd (because a 2024 1st if the Rangers advanced to the 2023 ECF). The condition was not met and the Hawks got a 2nd round pick for Patrick Kane, which they used to select Martin Misiak. Army got a guaranteed 1st for Tarasenko and the Hawks got a maybe 1st (that ultimately became a 2nd) for a better player. Army jumped the market and got a quality asset for a declining Tarasenko that clearly wasn’t returning to the Blues anyway.

[a smell of green grass]

And tbh, I didn’t think Tarasenko was worth a 1st at the time and we were lucky to get that. Likely why he had to include Mikkola to get the Rangers’ 1st. To me, it was clear the wheels were about to fall off Tarasenko as he was declining hard. His goals for %, Corsi and Fenwick were all hovering around 45% that year (meaning the Blues were getting outscored and outchaned 45 to 55% whenever Tarasenko was on the ice). I was pretty ecstatic to get a 1st for him tbh.

You know I can nitpick Armstrong but I was impressed that deadline how he jumped the market to lock down that 1st. It was a great draft to stockpile 1sts and for this exact reason you articulate with Tarasenko's play in 22-23 (Tarasenko's 21-22 was impressive and Masterton worthy to me), him jumping the market to lock down the more difficult 1st to get was a low key shrewd move that I personally appreciated then and now.

That’s a good point and a very key detail I omitted. Tarasenko had a full NTC and it was pretty well known he wanted to go to the NYR. Patrick Kane was also rumored to NYR but was recovering from a hip injury. Army traded Tarasenko to the Rangers about a month before the trade deadline, as you said, jumping the market. I think a lot of GMs would’ve waited until the last minute to see if they could get a better deal but Army weighed the risk very well. The Rangers met his price so he made the deal. If he had waited, maybe Kane goes to the Rangers for a 1st and the offer for Tarasenko goes off the table. And then Tarasenko says no to being traded anywhere else and it’s a disaster. Or maybe Tarasenko gets injured in that month and all of a sudden you have no asset to trade anymore. That’s the kind of risk a GM has to weigh and I agree with you that Army read the market perfectly in that situation.

A few weeks later, Kane (a better player than Tarasenko) was also traded to the Rangers but for a lesser package - the main piece bring a conditional 2nd (because a 2024 1st if the Rangers advanced to the 2023 ECF). The condition was not met and the Hawks got a 2nd round pick for Patrick Kane, which they used to select Martin Misiak. Army got a guaranteed 1st for Tarasenko and the Hawks got a maybe 1st (that ultimately became a 2nd) for a better player. Army jumped the market and got a quality asset for a declining Tarasenko that clearly wasn’t returning to the Blues anyway.

I was happy with what we got for ROR and Tarasenko, but I had grand hopes for what they would be parlayed into. Hopefully, the 3 prospects will start taking the stage soon. I'm OK with a slower development, but I'm going to be very disappointed if we come away with 3 more Perunoviches.

If at least 1 hits the big and makes an impact, I would be happy. Armstrong chosing to call the re-whatever "over" threw me over the edge.

I admire your knowledge and intelligence, and you're content, so I'll be more content.

[MiamiLaw]

Tarasenko had to be traded. I do think he jumped the gun on ROR and could’ve gotten more if he would’ve played hard ball.

[STL fan in MN]

Tarasenko had to be traded. I do think he jumped the gun on ROR and could’ve gotten more if he would’ve played hard ball.

What more did you want from the ROR trade? We got picks we turned into Otto Stenberg, Lukas Fischer and Juraj Pekarcik. All 3 are developing well.

[STL fan in MN]

And tbh, I didn’t think Tarasenko was worth a 1st at the time and we were lucky to get that. Likely why he had to include Mikkola to get the Rangers’ 1st. To me, it was clear the wheels were about to fall off Tarasenko as he was declining hard. His goals for %, Corsi and Fenwick were all hovering around 45% that year (meaning the Blues were getting outscored and outchaned 45 to 55% whenever Tarasenko was on the ice). I was pretty ecstatic to get a 1st for him tbh.

You know I can nitpick Armstrong but I was impressed that deadline how he jumped the market to lock down that 1st. It was a great draft to stockpile 1sts and for this exact reason you articulate with Tarasenko's play in 22-23 (Tarasenko's 21-22 was impressive and Masterton worthy to me), him jumping the market to lock down the more difficult 1st to get was a low key shrewd move that I personally appreciated then and now.

That’s a good point and a very key detail I omitted. Tarasenko had a full NTC and it was pretty well known he wanted to go to the NYR. Patrick Kane was also rumored to NYR but was recovering from a hip injury. Army traded Tarasenko to the Rangers about a month before the trade deadline, as you said, jumping the market. I think a lot of GMs would’ve waited until the last minute to see if they could get a better deal but Army weighed the risk very well. The Rangers met his price so he made the deal. If he had waited, maybe Kane goes to the Rangers for a 1st and the offer for Tarasenko goes off the table. And then Tarasenko says no to being traded anywhere else and it’s a disaster. Or maybe Tarasenko gets injured in that month and all of a sudden you have no asset to trade anymore. That’s the kind of risk a GM has to weigh and I agree with you that Army read the market perfectly in that situation.

A few weeks later, Kane (a better player than Tarasenko) was also traded to the Rangers but for a lesser package - the main piece bring a conditional 2nd (because a 2024 1st if the Rangers advanced to the 2023 ECF). The condition was not met and the Hawks got a 2nd round pick for Patrick Kane, which they used to select Martin Misiak. Army got a guaranteed 1st for Tarasenko and the Hawks got a maybe 1st (that ultimately became a 2nd) for a better player. Army jumped the market and got a quality asset for a declining Tarasenko that clearly wasn’t returning to the Blues anyway.

I was happy with what we got for ROR and Tarasenko, but I had grand hopes for what they would be parlayed into. Hopefully, the 3 prospects will start taking the stage soon. I'm OK with a slower development, but I'm going to be very disappointed if we come away with 3 more Perunoviches.

If at least 1 hits the big and makes an impact, I would be happy. Armstrong chosing to call the re-whatever "over" threw me over the edge.

I admire your knowledge and intelligence, and you're content, so I'll be more content.

Appreciate that.

You thought the picks would be parlayed into some other assets or something? And not used to draft future players? Not sure I’m understanding what it is you were hoping for.

And you seem oddly fixed on Perunovich. He was a risky pick at 45th overall. The other 3 are 1st round picks. Sure, no pick is guaranteed but all 3 have way more potential than Peru ever had or was expected to have. The pick on Peru was a miss. It happens. It happens a lot actually. To all teams. If what’s expected is for a team to draft the player that ends up being the best player available once all their careers are over at every pick they have then no team has been successful any year ever. It just doesn’t happen. It’s just super hard to predict how a lot of these kids will turn out in 5-6 years when the scouts have to make the call on them in either their age 17 or age 18 year (the draft cutoff is Sept 15 so for about 75% of first time eligible kids, it’s their 17 year old season that’s being evaluated for the draft).

I can’t predict the future but I feel much much more comfortable with the futures of Dvorsky, Stenberg and Lindstein than I ever did Perunovich.

[MiamiLaw]

Tarasenko had to be traded. I do think he jumped the gun on ROR and could’ve gotten more if he would’ve played hard ball.

What more did you want from the ROR trade? We got picks we turned into Otto Stenberg, Lukas Fischer and Juraj Pekarcik. All 3 are developing well.

I think a center like ROR should get you an NHL ready prospect which I’ll take all day over picks. No need to trade him a month before the deadline for a deal that would’ve been there any time.

Glad they used them well though.

[a smell of green grass]

And tbh, I didn’t think Tarasenko was worth a 1st at the time and we were lucky to get that. Likely why he had to include Mikkola to get the Rangers’ 1st. To me, it was clear the wheels were about to fall off Tarasenko as he was declining hard. His goals for %, Corsi and Fenwick were all hovering around 45% that year (meaning the Blues were getting outscored and outchaned 45 to 55% whenever Tarasenko was on the ice). I was pretty ecstatic to get a 1st for him tbh.

You know I can nitpick Armstrong but I was impressed that deadline how he jumped the market to lock down that 1st. It was a great draft to stockpile 1sts and for this exact reason you articulate with Tarasenko's play in 22-23 (Tarasenko's 21-22 was impressive and Masterton worthy to me), him jumping the market to lock down the more difficult 1st to get was a low key shrewd move that I personally appreciated then and now.

That’s a good point and a very key detail I omitted. Tarasenko had a full NTC and it was pretty well known he wanted to go to the NYR. Patrick Kane was also rumored to NYR but was recovering from a hip injury. Army traded Tarasenko to the Rangers about a month before the trade deadline, as you said, jumping the market. I think a lot of GMs would’ve waited until the last minute to see if they could get a better deal but Army weighed the risk very well. The Rangers met his price so he made the deal. If he had waited, maybe Kane goes to the Rangers for a 1st and the offer for Tarasenko goes off the table. And then Tarasenko says no to being traded anywhere else and it’s a disaster. Or maybe Tarasenko gets injured in that month and all of a sudden you have no asset to trade anymore. That’s the kind of risk a GM has to weigh and I agree with you that Army read the market perfectly in that situation.

A few weeks later, Kane (a better player than Tarasenko) was also traded to the Rangers but for a lesser package - the main piece bring a conditional 2nd (because a 2024 1st if the Rangers advanced to the 2023 ECF). The condition was not met and the Hawks got a 2nd round pick for Patrick Kane, which they used to select Martin Misiak. Army got a guaranteed 1st for Tarasenko and the Hawks got a maybe 1st (that ultimately became a 2nd) for a better player. Army jumped the market and got a quality asset for a declining Tarasenko that clearly wasn’t returning to the Blues anyway.

I was happy with what we got for ROR and Tarasenko, but I had grand hopes for what they would be parlayed into. Hopefully, the 3 prospects will start taking the stage soon. I'm OK with a slower development, but I'm going to be very disappointed if we come away with 3 more Perunoviches.

If at least 1 hits the big and makes an impact, I would be happy. Armstrong chosing to call the re-whatever "over" threw me over the edge.

I admire your knowledge and intelligence, and you're content, so I'll be more content.

Appreciate that.

You thought the picks would be parlayed into some other assets or something? And not used to draft future players? Not sure I’m understanding what it is you were hoping for.

And you seem oddly fixed on Perunovich. He was a risky pick at 45th overall. The other 3 are 1st round picks. Sure, no pick is guaranteed but all 3 have way more potential than Peru ever had or was expected to have. The pick on Peru was a miss. It happens. It happens a lot actually. To all teams. If what’s expected is for a team to draft the player that ends up being the best player available once all their careers are over at every pick they have then no team has been successful any year ever. It just doesn’t happen. It’s just super hard to predict how a lot of these kids will turn out in 5-6 years when the scouts have to make the call on them in either their age 17 or age 18 year (the draft cutoff is Sept 15 so for about 75% of first time eligible kids, it’s their 17 year old season that’s being evaluated for the draft).

I can’t predict the future but I feel much much more comfortable with the futures of Dvorsky, Stenberg and Lindstein than I ever did Perunovich.

I'm hoping for young prospects that turn heads around the NHL.

The aspect of Perunovich that hangs with me is that it took us a long time (8 years ?) to figure out it was going nowhere. I realize that he was a 2nd etc., but the Blues should have moved on faster.

[DawgDad]

And tbh, I didn’t think Tarasenko was worth a 1st at the time and we were lucky to get that. Likely why he had to include Mikkola to get the Rangers’ 1st. To me, it was clear the wheels were about to fall off Tarasenko as he was declining hard. His goals for %, Corsi and Fenwick were all hovering around 45% that year (meaning the Blues were getting outscored and outchaned 45 to 55% whenever Tarasenko was on the ice). I was pretty ecstatic to get a 1st for him tbh.

You know I can nitpick Armstrong but I was impressed that deadline how he jumped the market to lock down that 1st. It was a great draft to stockpile 1sts and for this exact reason you articulate with Tarasenko's play in 22-23 (Tarasenko's 21-22 was impressive and Masterton worthy to me), him jumping the market to lock down the more difficult 1st to get was a low key shrewd move that I personally appreciated then and now.

That’s a good point and a very key detail I omitted. Tarasenko had a full NTC and it was pretty well known he wanted to go to the NYR. Patrick Kane was also rumored to NYR but was recovering from a hip injury. Army traded Tarasenko to the Rangers about a month before the trade deadline, as you said, jumping the market. I think a lot of GMs would’ve waited until the last minute to see if they could get a better deal but Army weighed the risk very well. The Rangers met his price so he made the deal. If he had waited, maybe Kane goes to the Rangers for a 1st and the offer for Tarasenko goes off the table. And then Tarasenko says no to being traded anywhere else and it’s a disaster. Or maybe Tarasenko gets injured in that month and all of a sudden you have no asset to trade anymore. That’s the kind of risk a GM has to weigh and I agree with you that Army read the market perfectly in that situation.

A few weeks later, Kane (a better player than Tarasenko) was also traded to the Rangers but for a lesser package - the main piece bring a conditional 2nd (because a 2024 1st if the Rangers advanced to the 2023 ECF). The condition was not met and the Hawks got a 2nd round pick for Patrick Kane, which they used to select Martin Misiak. Army got a guaranteed 1st for Tarasenko and the Hawks got a maybe 1st (that ultimately became a 2nd) for a better player. Army jumped the market and got a quality asset for a declining Tarasenko that clearly wasn’t returning to the Blues anyway.

I was happy with what we got for ROR and Tarasenko, but I had grand hopes for what they would be parlayed into. Hopefully, the 3 prospects will start taking the stage soon. I'm OK with a slower development, but I'm going to be very disappointed if we come away with 3 more Perunoviches.

If at least 1 hits the big and makes an impact, I would be happy. Armstrong chosing to call the re-whatever "over" threw me over the edge.

I admire your knowledge and intelligence, and you're content, so I'll be more content.

Appreciate that.

You thought the picks would be parlayed into some other assets or something? And not used to draft future players? Not sure I’m understanding what it is you were hoping for.

And you seem oddly fixed on Perunovich. He was a risky pick at 45th overall. The other 3 are 1st round picks. Sure, no pick is guaranteed but all 3 have way more potential than Peru ever had or was expected to have. The pick on Peru was a miss. It happens. It happens a lot actually. To all teams. If what’s expected is for a team to draft the player that ends up being the best player available once all their careers are over at every pick they have then no team has been successful any year ever. It just doesn’t happen. It’s just super hard to predict how a lot of these kids will turn out in 5-6 years when the scouts have to make the call on them in either their age 17 or age 18 year (the draft cutoff is Sept 15 so for about 75% of first time eligible kids, it’s their 17 year old season that’s being evaluated for the draft).

I can’t predict the future but I feel much much more comfortable with the futures of Dvorsky, Stenberg and Lindstein than I ever did Perunovich.

I'm hoping for young prospects that turn heads around the NHL.

The aspect of Perunovich that hangs with me is that it took us a long time (8 years ?) to figure out it was going nowhere. I realize that he was a 2nd etc., but the Blues should have moved on faster.

Two things to learn and embrace: Patience and moving on from the past.

Keep an eye on the Blues prospects and be patient with them. Neighbours was groomed and emerged, Holloway and Broberg emerged with the Blues, Bolduc now as well. In the past the Blues groomed Parayko, Thomas, Kyrou, Barbashev, Walman, Dunn, Mikkola. Before that there was Oshie, Perron, Schwartz, et al. They've been very patient with Snuggerud and now with Dvorsky.

The Blues have turned some heads. I don't believe any insiders have failed to note the contributions Broberg and Holloway made, and how Snuggerud was ready to step in and backfill for Holloway. How Bolduc responded to his handling. There is a lengthy parade of prospects on the horizon, the fruits will be ripenning for some time yet providing strong internal competition.

Perunovich is a sad case. He flashed high-end talent in college and absolutely tore up the AHL before joining the Blues. He was squeezed by the veteran laden Blues defense and beset by one debilitating injury after another. Similar to Fabbri, Army tried to do him a favor moving him out. He is gone, past history. Wish him well but he's no longer on the Blues, no longer in focus as a Blues fan. Same with all the other ex-Blues, I wish them well but they are no longer helping my team, no longer of any relevance.

[STL fan in MN]

And tbh, I didn’t think Tarasenko was worth a 1st at the time and we were lucky to get that. Likely why he had to include Mikkola to get the Rangers’ 1st. To me, it was clear the wheels were about to fall off Tarasenko as he was declining hard. His goals for %, Corsi and Fenwick were all hovering around 45% that year (meaning the Blues were getting outscored and outchaned 45 to 55% whenever Tarasenko was on the ice). I was pretty ecstatic to get a 1st for him tbh.

You know I can nitpick Armstrong but I was impressed that deadline how he jumped the market to lock down that 1st. It was a great draft to stockpile 1sts and for this exact reason you articulate with Tarasenko's play in 22-23 (Tarasenko's 21-22 was impressive and Masterton worthy to me), him jumping the market to lock down the more difficult 1st to get was a low key shrewd move that I personally appreciated then and now.

That’s a good point and a very key detail I omitted. Tarasenko had a full NTC and it was pretty well known he wanted to go to the NYR. Patrick Kane was also rumored to NYR but was recovering from a hip injury. Army traded Tarasenko to the Rangers about a month before the trade deadline, as you said, jumping the market. I think a lot of GMs would’ve waited until the last minute to see if they could get a better deal but Army weighed the risk very well. The Rangers met his price so he made the deal. If he had waited, maybe Kane goes to the Rangers for a 1st and the offer for Tarasenko goes off the table. And then Tarasenko says no to being traded anywhere else and it’s a disaster. Or maybe Tarasenko gets injured in that month and all of a sudden you have no asset to trade anymore. That’s the kind of risk a GM has to weigh and I agree with you that Army read the market perfectly in that situation.

A few weeks later, Kane (a better player than Tarasenko) was also traded to the Rangers but for a lesser package - the main piece bring a conditional 2nd (because a 2024 1st if the Rangers advanced to the 2023 ECF). The condition was not met and the Hawks got a 2nd round pick for Patrick Kane, which they used to select Martin Misiak. Army got a guaranteed 1st for Tarasenko and the Hawks got a maybe 1st (that ultimately became a 2nd) for a better player. Army jumped the market and got a quality asset for a declining Tarasenko that clearly wasn’t returning to the Blues anyway.

I was happy with what we got for ROR and Tarasenko, but I had grand hopes for what they would be parlayed into. Hopefully, the 3 prospects will start taking the stage soon. I'm OK with a slower development, but I'm going to be very disappointed if we come away with 3 more Perunoviches.

If at least 1 hits the big and makes an impact, I would be happy. Armstrong chosing to call the re-whatever "over" threw me over the edge.

I admire your knowledge and intelligence, and you're content, so I'll be more content.

Appreciate that.

You thought the picks would be parlayed into some other assets or something? And not used to draft future players? Not sure I’m understanding what it is you were hoping for.

And you seem oddly fixed on Perunovich. He was a risky pick at 45th overall. The other 3 are 1st round picks. Sure, no pick is guaranteed but all 3 have way more potential than Peru ever had or was expected to have. The pick on Peru was a miss. It happens. It happens a lot actually. To all teams. If what’s expected is for a team to draft the player that ends up being the best player available once all their careers are over at every pick they have then no team has been successful any year ever. It just doesn’t happen. It’s just super hard to predict how a lot of these kids will turn out in 5-6 years when the scouts have to make the call on them in either their age 17 or age 18 year (the draft cutoff is Sept 15 so for about 75% of first time eligible kids, it’s their 17 year old season that’s being evaluated for the draft).

I can’t predict the future but I feel much much more comfortable with the futures of Dvorsky, Stenberg and Lindstein than I ever did Perunovich.

I'm hoping for young prospects that turn heads around the NHL.

The aspect of Perunovich that hangs with me is that it took us a long time (8 years ?) to figure out it was going nowhere. I realize that he was a 2nd etc., but the Blues should have moved on faster.

I get it but in the 6 1/2 years the Blues had Perunovich (not he went through two major surgeries where he missed pretty much a full season each team. A B prospect (which Peru was, he was never an A prospect) has neat no value when they’re injured like that. So you can either give him away or let him read, return and see if he becomes something. He never became something. I’m sure the 2 big injuries didn’t help. Or being 5’9”. I wish we had cut bait sooner as well but given his injuries, I don’t really blame the Blues for doing so as I don’t really recall a point in which he ever would’ve had a high trade value.

I also want top players, especially young ones. I think Dvorsky and Snuggy can be that. Not at the Crosby/McDavid level but definitely be difference makers that move the needle.

[Bubble4427]

Ritchie is a really good player. I’m still shocked the Av’s gave him up but they truly believed they had a shot at the Cup. Pretty good trade for the Islanders

Armstrong wanted to trade Schenn at the trade deadline. Do you think that that Avs tried to get Schenn first, over Nelson?

I see that the Avs are trying to sign Nelson longer-term now.

No…pretty sure Army was discussing Schenn with Toronto.

if I had to guess, it was more TOR asking about Schenn than Army shopping him

again, just a guess

It was more than asking..they had a deal agreed upon.

I hadn't heard that.

I had heard that Army asked Schenn if he'd be willing to waive and he said yes if he would be united with his brother, otherwise he wasn't interested.

Army was on record before the deadline that he wouldn’t ask anybody to waive unless he had a deal that he liked.

If you have multiple teams calling about Schenn…you are doing a disservice to the team (And Schenn himself) if you do not ask if he is open to being moved.

There is no guarantee that a deal was agreed upon before Army went to Schenn. The team was awful and Schenn is getting older. Army might have just asked “would you like to go to a particular contender if I can make a deal work”.
No one knows what happened and I think it’s unfair to the player and the GM to assume they know based on half quotes that are taken out of context.

Just my opinion.

[Pierre McGuire]

Ritchie is a really good player. I’m still shocked the Av’s gave him up but they truly believed they had a shot at the Cup. Pretty good trade for the Islanders

Armstrong wanted to trade Schenn at the trade deadline. Do you think that that Avs tried to get Schenn first, over Nelson?

I see that the Avs are trying to sign Nelson longer-term now.

No…pretty sure Army was discussing Schenn with Toronto.

if I had to guess, it was more TOR asking about Schenn than Army shopping him

again, just a guess

It was more than asking..they had a deal agreed upon.

I hadn't heard that.

I had heard that Army asked Schenn if he'd be willing to waive and he said yes if he would be united with his brother, otherwise he wasn't interested.

Army was on record before the deadline that he wouldn’t ask anybody to waive unless he had a deal that he liked.

If you have multiple teams calling about Schenn…you are doing a disservice to the team (And Schenn himself) if you do not ask if he is open to being moved.

There is no guarantee that a deal was agreed upon before Army went to Schenn. The team was awful and Schenn is getting older. Army might have just asked “would you like to go to a particular contender if I can make a deal work”.
No one knows what happened and I think it’s unfair to the player and the GM to assume they know based on half quotes that are taken out of context.

Just my opinion.

Army had an offer that he perceived as good enough so he approached Schenn about waiving, Schenn said no….end of story and they put an end to even discussing it at that point. Schenn is a professional, he knows it’s a business.
Army wasn’t asking Schenn or anybody to waive a no trade clause unless he had an offer that he thought was worth it.

[Emma bleeds blue]

And tbh, I didn’t think Tarasenko was worth a 1st at the time and we were lucky to get that. Likely why he had to include Mikkola to get the Rangers’ 1st. To me, it was clear the wheels were about to fall off Tarasenko as he was declining hard. His goals for %, Corsi and Fenwick were all hovering around 45% that year (meaning the Blues were getting outscored and outchaned 45 to 55% whenever Tarasenko was on the ice). I was pretty ecstatic to get a 1st for him tbh.

You know I can nitpick Armstrong but I was impressed that deadline how he jumped the market to lock down that 1st. It was a great draft to stockpile 1sts and for this exact reason you articulate with Tarasenko's play in 22-23 (Tarasenko's 21-22 was impressive and Masterton worthy to me), him jumping the market to lock down the more difficult 1st to get was a low key shrewd move that I personally appreciated then and now.

That’s a good point and a very key detail I omitted. Tarasenko had a full NTC and it was pretty well known he wanted to go to the NYR. Patrick Kane was also rumored to NYR but was recovering from a hip injury. Army traded Tarasenko to the Rangers about a month before the trade deadline, as you said, jumping the market. I think a lot of GMs would’ve waited until the last minute to see if they could get a better deal but Army weighed the risk very well. The Rangers met his price so he made the deal. If he had waited, maybe Kane goes to the Rangers for a 1st and the offer for Tarasenko goes off the table. And then Tarasenko says no to being traded anywhere else and it’s a disaster. Or maybe Tarasenko gets injured in that month and all of a sudden you have no asset to trade anymore. That’s the kind of risk a GM has to weigh and I agree with you that Army read the market perfectly in that situation.

A few weeks later, Kane (a better player than Tarasenko) was also traded to the Rangers but for a lesser package - the main piece bring a conditional 2nd (because a 2024 1st if the Rangers advanced to the 2023 ECF). The condition was not met and the Hawks got a 2nd round pick for Patrick Kane, which they used to select Martin Misiak. Army got a guaranteed 1st for Tarasenko and the Hawks got a maybe 1st (that ultimately became a 2nd) for a better player. Army jumped the market and got a quality asset for a declining Tarasenko that clearly wasn’t returning to the Blues anyway.

I was happy with what we got for ROR and Tarasenko, but I had grand hopes for what they would be parlayed into. Hopefully, the 3 prospects will start taking the stage soon. I'm OK with a slower development, but I'm going to be very disappointed if we come away with 3 more Perunoviches.

If at least 1 hits the big and makes an impact, I would be happy. Armstrong chosing to call the re-whatever "over" threw me over the edge.

I admire your knowledge and intelligence, and you're content, so I'll be more content.

Appreciate that.

You thought the picks would be parlayed into some other assets or something? And not used to draft future players? Not sure I’m understanding what it is you were hoping for.

And you seem oddly fixed on Perunovich. He was a risky pick at 45th overall. The other 3 are 1st round picks. Sure, no pick is guaranteed but all 3 have way more potential than Peru ever had or was expected to have. The pick on Peru was a miss. It happens. It happens a lot actually. To all teams. If what’s expected is for a team to draft the player that ends up being the best player available once all their careers are over at every pick they have then no team has been successful any year ever. It just doesn’t happen. It’s just super hard to predict how a lot of these kids will turn out in 5-6 years when the scouts have to make the call on them in either their age 17 or age 18 year (the draft cutoff is Sept 15 so for about 75% of first time eligible kids, it’s their 17 year old season that’s being evaluated for the draft).

I can’t predict the future but I feel much much more comfortable with the futures of Dvorsky, Stenberg and Lindstein than I ever did Perunovich.

I'm hoping for young prospects that turn heads around the NHL.

The aspect of Perunovich that hangs with me is that it took us a long time (8 years ?) to figure out it was going nowhere. I realize that he was a 2nd etc., but the Blues should have moved on faster.

Two things to learn and embrace: Patience and moving on from the past.

Keep an eye on the Blues prospects and be patient with them. Neighbours was groomed and emerged, Holloway and Broberg emerged with the Blues, Bolduc now as well. In the past the Blues groomed Parayko, Thomas, Kyrou, Barbashev, Walman, Dunn, Mikkola. Before that there was Oshie, Perron, Schwartz, et al. They've been very patient with Snuggerud and now with Dvorsky.

The Blues have turned some heads. I don't believe any insiders have failed to note the contributions Broberg and Holloway made, and how Snuggerud was ready to step in and backfill for Holloway. How Bolduc responded to his handling. There is a lengthy parade of prospects on the horizon, the fruits will be ripenning for some time yet providing strong internal competition.

Perunovich is a sad case. He flashed high-end talent in college and absolutely tore up the AHL before joining the Blues. He was squeezed by the veteran laden Blues defense and beset by one debilitating injury after another. Similar to Fabbri, Army tried to do him a favor moving him out. He is gone, past history. Wish him well but he's no longer on the Blues, no longer in focus as a Blues fan. Same with all the other ex-Blues, I wish them well but they are no longer helping my team, no longer of any relevance.

Just a great post DawgDad - I'm with you 100%. I'm new to the board and can understand some temporary pain over losing a player that (as a fan) we watched do so many great things for our team. But I'm just not able to lament for years over players who left. I enjoy reading about the players on the team now and the ones who are coming in the future.

I wandered into the Oilers HF board and there was a post about Broberg and Holloway was something like 80 pages long - and I'm sure there's probably posts from Oilers fans out there now about "Bet Broberg and Holloway wish they never signed those offer sheets now". I'm just kind of like - "dude, let it go."

[Harry S Deals]

Schenn is more likely to retire here than me dealt. He's a very good compliment to the Kyrou line my money says he bests 50 pts next year no problem. Also the Blues already need a 3rd center they haven't signed their 4th center no way the Blues come up with 2 centers in the UFA market

[DawgDad]

And tbh, I didn’t think Tarasenko was worth a 1st at the time and we were lucky to get that. Likely why he had to include Mikkola to get the Rangers’ 1st. To me, it was clear the wheels were about to fall off Tarasenko as he was declining hard. His goals for %, Corsi and Fenwick were all hovering around 45% that year (meaning the Blues were getting outscored and outchaned 45 to 55% whenever Tarasenko was on the ice). I was pretty ecstatic to get a 1st for him tbh.

You know I can nitpick Armstrong but I was impressed that deadline how he jumped the market to lock down that 1st. It was a great draft to stockpile 1sts and for this exact reason you articulate with Tarasenko's play in 22-23 (Tarasenko's 21-22 was impressive and Masterton worthy to me), him jumping the market to lock down the more difficult 1st to get was a low key shrewd move that I personally appreciated then and now.

That’s a good point and a very key detail I omitted. Tarasenko had a full NTC and it was pretty well known he wanted to go to the NYR. Patrick Kane was also rumored to NYR but was recovering from a hip injury. Army traded Tarasenko to the Rangers about a month before the trade deadline, as you said, jumping the market. I think a lot of GMs would’ve waited until the last minute to see if they could get a better deal but Army weighed the risk very well. The Rangers met his price so he made the deal. If he had waited, maybe Kane goes to the Rangers for a 1st and the offer for Tarasenko goes off the table. And then Tarasenko says no to being traded anywhere else and it’s a disaster. Or maybe Tarasenko gets injured in that month and all of a sudden you have no asset to trade anymore. That’s the kind of risk a GM has to weigh and I agree with you that Army read the market perfectly in that situation.

A few weeks later, Kane (a better player than Tarasenko) was also traded to the Rangers but for a lesser package - the main piece bring a conditional 2nd (because a 2024 1st if the Rangers advanced to the 2023 ECF). The condition was not met and the Hawks got a 2nd round pick for Patrick Kane, which they used to select Martin Misiak. Army got a guaranteed 1st for Tarasenko and the Hawks got a maybe 1st (that ultimately became a 2nd) for a better player. Army jumped the market and got a quality asset for a declining Tarasenko that clearly wasn’t returning to the Blues anyway.

I was happy with what we got for ROR and Tarasenko, but I had grand hopes for what they would be parlayed into. Hopefully, the 3 prospects will start taking the stage soon. I'm OK with a slower development, but I'm going to be very disappointed if we come away with 3 more Perunoviches.

If at least 1 hits the big and makes an impact, I would be happy. Armstrong chosing to call the re-whatever "over" threw me over the edge.

I admire your knowledge and intelligence, and you're content, so I'll be more content.

Appreciate that.

You thought the picks would be parlayed into some other assets or something? And not used to draft future players? Not sure I’m understanding what it is you were hoping for.

And you seem oddly fixed on Perunovich. He was a risky pick at 45th overall. The other 3 are 1st round picks. Sure, no pick is guaranteed but all 3 have way more potential than Peru ever had or was expected to have. The pick on Peru was a miss. It happens. It happens a lot actually. To all teams. If what’s expected is for a team to draft the player that ends up being the best player available once all their careers are over at every pick they have then no team has been successful any year ever. It just doesn’t happen. It’s just super hard to predict how a lot of these kids will turn out in 5-6 years when the scouts have to make the call on them in either their age 17 or age 18 year (the draft cutoff is Sept 15 so for about 75% of first time eligible kids, it’s their 17 year old season that’s being evaluated for the draft).

I can’t predict the future but I feel much much more comfortable with the futures of Dvorsky, Stenberg and Lindstein than I ever did Perunovich.

I'm hoping for young prospects that turn heads around the NHL.

The aspect of Perunovich that hangs with me is that it took us a long time (8 years ?) to figure out it was going nowhere. I realize that he was a 2nd etc., but the Blues should have moved on faster.

Two things to learn and embrace: Patience and moving on from the past.

Keep an eye on the Blues prospects and be patient with them. Neighbours was groomed and emerged, Holloway and Broberg emerged with the Blues, Bolduc now as well. In the past the Blues groomed Parayko, Thomas, Kyrou, Barbashev, Walman, Dunn, Mikkola. Before that there was Oshie, Perron, Schwartz, et al. They've been very patient with Snuggerud and now with Dvorsky.

The Blues have turned some heads. I don't believe any insiders have failed to note the contributions Broberg and Holloway made, and how Snuggerud was ready to step in and backfill for Holloway. How Bolduc responded to his handling. There is a lengthy parade of prospects on the horizon, the fruits will be ripenning for some time yet providing strong internal competition.

Perunovich is a sad case. He flashed high-end talent in college and absolutely tore up the AHL before joining the Blues. He was squeezed by the veteran laden Blues defense and beset by one debilitating injury after another. Similar to Fabbri, Army tried to do him a favor moving him out. He is gone, past history. Wish him well but he's no longer on the Blues, no longer in focus as a Blues fan. Same with all the other ex-Blues, I wish them well but they are no longer helping my team, no longer of any relevance.

Just a great post DawgDad - I'm with you 100%. I'm new to the board and can understand some temporary pain over losing a player that (as a fan) we watched do so many great things for our team. But I'm just not able to lament for years over players who left. I enjoy reading about the players on the team now and the ones who are coming in the future.

I wandered into the Oilers HF board and there was a post about Broberg and Holloway was something like 80 pages long - and I'm sure there's probably posts from Oilers fans out there now about "Bet Broberg and Holloway wish they never signed those offer sheets now". I'm just kind of like - "dude, let it go."

Holloway has his recovery challenges, but those two have to believe they are going to make something good happen here and cash in. If Holloway can pick up with his former abandon we are about to witness one heck of a salary drive