BREAKING: HELSLEY TO METS!!!

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Goldfan
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Re: BREAKING: HELSLEY TO METS!!!

Post by Goldfan »

Bomber1 wrote: 31 Jul 2025 08:22 am
Quincy Varnish wrote: 30 Jul 2025 21:18 pm
Goldfan wrote: 30 Jul 2025 21:12 pmI ask both you and Quinc
If Cards had extended a QO to Helsley would they receive a draft pick if he signed elsewhere?
The QO will be $20M+ and the Cards would have been idiots to offer it. Helsley would have accepted, and the Cardinals would again look like idiots having an $20M+ closer on a rebuilding team.
This.
The general point is
Losing ML talent and then NOT replacing ML isn’t rebuilding. What’s the plan here?? Tanking?? Then do it…..should‘ve done it last offseason
Why have a WC, Gray, NA??? Sure NTC…..I’m certain with the correct persuasive conversation those fella’s would move along
So we don’t need a closer because rebuilding so won’t be winning games for a closer to save…..assume don’t really need high$ SP if goal is losing
Or high $$ 3b, or high $$ 1b.
There’s no plan….
Ronnie Dobbs
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Re: BREAKING: HELSLEY TO METS!!!

Post by Ronnie Dobbs »

Goldfan wrote: 31 Jul 2025 08:29 amThe general point is
Losing ML talent and then NOT replacing ML isn’t rebuilding. What’s the plan here?? Tanking?? Then do it…..should‘ve done it last offseason
Why have a WC, Gray, NA??? Sure NTC…..I’m certain with the correct persuasive conversation those fella’s would move along
So we don’t need a closer because rebuilding so won’t be winning games for a closer to save…..assume don’t really need high$ SP if goal is losing
Or high $$ 3b, or high $$ 1b.
There’s no plan….
Between your misunderstanding of how rebuilding works, not understanding what a salary dump is, and not understanding why they didn't get some sure thing, top prospect for Ryan Helsley, you are really proving that you have no idea how any of this works.

And yea, sure, I guess you could make life hell on those three and get them to waive their NTC, but I don't think that's going to do much for your organizational reputation when you're trying to sign a free agent or extend a guy.
OldRed
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Re: BREAKING: HELSLEY TO METS!!!

Post by OldRed »

Ronnie Dobbs wrote: 31 Jul 2025 08:49 am
Goldfan wrote: 31 Jul 2025 08:29 amThe general point is
Losing ML talent and then NOT replacing ML isn’t rebuilding. What’s the plan here?? Tanking?? Then do it…..should‘ve done it last offseason
Why have a WC, Gray, NA??? Sure NTC…..I’m certain with the correct persuasive conversation those fella’s would move along
So we don’t need a closer because rebuilding so won’t be winning games for a closer to save…..assume don’t really need high$ SP if goal is losing
Or high $$ 3b, or high $$ 1b.
There’s no plan….

Between your misunderstanding of how rebuilding works, not understanding what a salary dump is, and not understanding why they didn't get some sure thing, top prospect for Ryan Helsley, you are really proving that you have no idea how any of this works.

And yea, sure, I guess you could make life hell on those three and get them to waive their NTC, but I don't think that's going to do much for your organizational reputation when you're trying to sign a free agent or extend a guy.
You really believe this is rebuilding?
Ronnie Dobbs
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Re: BREAKING: HELSLEY TO METS!!!

Post by Ronnie Dobbs »

OldRed wrote: 31 Jul 2025 08:52 amYou really believe this is rebuilding?
Before I answer that question, what do you believe rebuilding is? We've been over this before, but I don't think you understand.
Goldfan
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Re: BREAKING: HELSLEY TO METS!!!

Post by Goldfan »

Ronnie Dobbs wrote: 31 Jul 2025 08:49 am
Goldfan wrote: 31 Jul 2025 08:29 amThe general point is
Losing ML talent and then NOT replacing ML isn’t rebuilding. What’s the plan here?? Tanking?? Then do it…..should‘ve done it last offseason
Why have a WC, Gray, NA??? Sure NTC…..I’m certain with the correct persuasive conversation those fella’s would move along
So we don’t need a closer because rebuilding so won’t be winning games for a closer to save…..assume don’t really need high$ SP if goal is losing
Or high $$ 3b, or high $$ 1b.
There’s no plan….
Between your misunderstanding of how rebuilding works, not understanding what a salary dump is, and not understanding why they didn't get some sure thing, top prospect for Ryan Helsley, you are really proving that you have no idea how any of this works.

And yea, sure, I guess you could make life hell on those three and get them to waive their NTC, but I don't think that's going to do much for your organizational reputation when you're trying to sign a free agent or extend a guy.
Ronnie whats the rationale yall are going with? Well we didn’t trade Helsley or Fedde last offseason…..because “we’re rebuilding”??? But now we must trade Helsley to get “something” for him. Well if you get “nothing” for him…..at this point all you’re doing is dumping his remaining salary. See how we get there?? And please, quickly detail this “rebuilding”plan?? Apparently, they received a better return for MATZ :lol: than an Allstar Closer??
Steven Matz is a FA just like RH…….who has a value better than an ALL-star closer??
Anyway, please detail this rebuilding?
They sold have half the SP a couple years ago and had to go sign FA because they had TWO SP…..for that they received bodies that have been in minors and probably will never leave the minors. So is that rebuilding?? If the return for ML Talent is NEVER at least as good or better ML talent down the road you are not rebuilding.
An Old Friend
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Re: BREAKING: HELSLEY TO METS!!!

Post by An Old Friend »

Goldfan wrote: 31 Jul 2025 08:00 am
An Old Friend wrote: 30 Jul 2025 22:32 pm
Goldfan wrote: 30 Jul 2025 22:21 pm https://www.nytimes.com/athletic/652635 ... ed_article
As I said…..salary dump
Repeating it doesn’t make you less wrong.

It’s not a salary dump. You don’t know what that means. You should stop and just accept that.

Helsley was the exact opposite of a salary dump.
So you agree they receive very little in return for an all-star closer who was contracted at 8.2mil with 2.706 roughly outstanding…….
So what would you call this…..charity for the Mets??….letting RH have some time in the Big Apple?? Tired of seeing Helsley face in BP???
“It’s not a salary dump”…..they say so rigid in their little definition :lol: :lol:
If you’re not paying a salary any longer and really received very little in return for that value what is it then???
I don't really know how to answer this without sounding like an arsehole.

You don't understand what a salary dump transaction is, but this wasn't it. Packaging someone like Arenado with him would be a salary dump.

They got prospects back that they valued, regardless of your personal perception of the prospects. Baez has been a highly thought of international signee. Dohm had first round grades on his pure stuff / ability but fell to the 3rd round of last year's draft with an 800K bonus primarily due to availability concerns.

They wouldn't have gotten those two players in the deal if it was purely a salary dump... i.e. take this player and pay him, we don't need / get anything of value back.
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Re: BREAKING: HELSLEY TO METS!!!

Post by Ronnie Dobbs »

Goldfan wrote: 31 Jul 2025 09:05 am Ronnie whats the rationale yall are going with? Well we didn’t trade Helsley or Fedde last offseason…..because “we’re rebuilding”??? But now we must trade Helsley to get “something” for him. Well if you get “nothing” for him…..at this point all you’re doing is dumping his remaining salary. See how we get there?? And please, quickly detail this “rebuilding”plan?? Apparently, they received a better return for MATZ :lol: than an Allstar Closer??
Steven Matz is a FA just like RH…….who has a value better than an ALL-star closer??
Anyway, please detail this rebuilding?
They sold have half the SP a couple years ago and had to go sign FA because they had TWO SP…..for that they received bodies that have been in minors and probably will never leave the minors. So is that rebuilding?? If the return for ML Talent is NEVER at least as good or better ML talent down the road you are not rebuilding.
Again, it's clear you don't know what the definition of rebuilding or salary dump is.
Goldfan
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Re: BREAKING: HELSLEY TO METS!!!

Post by Goldfan »

An Old Friend wrote: 31 Jul 2025 09:11 am
Goldfan wrote: 31 Jul 2025 08:00 am
An Old Friend wrote: 30 Jul 2025 22:32 pm
Goldfan wrote: 30 Jul 2025 22:21 pm https://www.nytimes.com/athletic/652635 ... ed_article
As I said…..salary dump
Repeating it doesn’t make you less wrong.

It’s not a salary dump. You don’t know what that means. You should stop and just accept that.

Helsley was the exact opposite of a salary dump.
So you agree they receive very little in return for an all-star closer who was contracted at 8.2mil with 2.706 roughly outstanding…….
So what would you call this…..charity for the Mets??….letting RH have some time in the Big Apple?? Tired of seeing Helsley face in BP???
“It’s not a salary dump”…..they say so rigid in their little definition :lol: :lol:
If you’re not paying a salary any longer and really received very little in return for that value what is it then???
I don't really know how to answer this without sounding like an arsehole.

You don't understand what a salary dump transaction is, but this wasn't it. Packaging someone like Arenado with him would be a salary dump.

They got prospects back that they valued, regardless of your personal perception of the prospects. Baez has been a highly thought of international signee. Dohm had first round grades on his pure stuff / ability but fell to the 3rd round of last year's draft with an 800K bonus primarily due to availability concerns.

They wouldn't have gotten those two players in the deal if it was purely a salary dump... i.e. take this player and pay him, we don't need / get anything of value back.
AOF, I get the salary dump….
IF nothing was returned for RH then all it accomplished was NOT paying 2.706mil…..which is dumping salary. Add Matz’s prorated to that and perhaps we see a real Salary Dump with NA, Gray,…..today and it adds up…..which I believe is the main goal for BDW.
Goldfan
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Re: BREAKING: HELSLEY TO METS!!!

Post by Goldfan »

Ronnie Dobbs wrote: 31 Jul 2025 09:12 am
Goldfan wrote: 31 Jul 2025 09:05 am Ronnie whats the rationale yall are going with? Well we didn’t trade Helsley or Fedde last offseason…..because “we’re rebuilding”??? But now we must trade Helsley to get “something” for him. Well if you get “nothing” for him…..at this point all you’re doing is dumping his remaining salary. See how we get there?? And please, quickly detail this “rebuilding”plan?? Apparently, they received a better return for MATZ :lol: than an Allstar Closer??
Steven Matz is a FA just like RH…….who has a value better than an ALL-star closer??
Anyway, please detail this rebuilding?
They sold have half the SP a couple years ago and had to go sign FA because they had TWO SP…..for that they received bodies that have been in minors and probably will never leave the minors. So is that rebuilding?? If the return for ML Talent is NEVER at least as good or better ML talent down the road you are not rebuilding.
Again, it's clear you don't know what the definition of rebuilding or salary dump is.
Again, outline this rebuilding plan. Is this ongoing this season?? By what metrics?? Watching Yutes flounder as they have in the past? That’s rebuilding?? Returning middling minor league talent for ML talent….that’s rebuilding???
If from 2 yrs ago and today…..if that return never makes it to MLB for Cards…..all you’ve done is let ML talent go>>>>jettisoned that salary>>>>and are standing still. If that’s rebuilding then I guess we’re right on track.
An Old Friend
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Re: BREAKING: HELSLEY TO METS!!!

Post by An Old Friend »

Goldfan wrote: 31 Jul 2025 09:17 am
An Old Friend wrote: 31 Jul 2025 09:11 am
Goldfan wrote: 31 Jul 2025 08:00 am
An Old Friend wrote: 30 Jul 2025 22:32 pm
Goldfan wrote: 30 Jul 2025 22:21 pm https://www.nytimes.com/athletic/652635 ... ed_article
As I said…..salary dump
Repeating it doesn’t make you less wrong.

It’s not a salary dump. You don’t know what that means. You should stop and just accept that.

Helsley was the exact opposite of a salary dump.
So you agree they receive very little in return for an all-star closer who was contracted at 8.2mil with 2.706 roughly outstanding…….
So what would you call this…..charity for the Mets??….letting RH have some time in the Big Apple?? Tired of seeing Helsley face in BP???
“It’s not a salary dump”…..they say so rigid in their little definition :lol: :lol:
If you’re not paying a salary any longer and really received very little in return for that value what is it then???
I don't really know how to answer this without sounding like an arsehole.

You don't understand what a salary dump transaction is, but this wasn't it. Packaging someone like Arenado with him would be a salary dump.

They got prospects back that they valued, regardless of your personal perception of the prospects. Baez has been a highly thought of international signee. Dohm had first round grades on his pure stuff / ability but fell to the 3rd round of last year's draft with an 800K bonus primarily due to availability concerns.

They wouldn't have gotten those two players in the deal if it was purely a salary dump... i.e. take this player and pay him, we don't need / get anything of value back.
AOF, I get the salary dump….
You can say that... but you're clearly demonstrating that you don't.

I can't help you with that.
IF nothing was returned for RH then all it accomplished was NOT paying 2.706mil…..which is dumping salary.
Right. But they DID get a return. So it's NOT dumping salary.
Add Matz’s prorated to that and perhaps we see a real Salary Dump with NA, Gray,…..today and it adds up…..which I believe is the main goal for BDW.
They didn't salary dump Matz, either.

The goal with Arenado has ALWAYS been to salary dump. Mozeliak just hasn't been able to get that done, not partially due to Arenado's reluctance to leave.

And you don't need to "believe" DeWitt's goal to lower payroll. They've told you a hundred times that this is a 'reset'... and that 'reset' includes lowering their payroll. If you still find yourself pondering whether that is in question, you don't listen to or read anything.
Ronnie Dobbs
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Re: BREAKING: HELSLEY TO METS!!!

Post by Ronnie Dobbs »

Goldfan wrote: 31 Jul 2025 09:21 amAgain, outline this rebuilding plan. Is this ongoing this season?? By what metrics?? Watching Yutes flounder as they have in the past? That’s rebuilding?? Returning middling minor league talent for ML talent….that’s rebuilding???
If from 2 yrs ago and today…..if that return never makes it to MLB for Cards…..all you’ve done is let ML talent go>>>>jettisoned that salary>>>>and are standing still. If that’s rebuilding then I guess we’re right on track.
I don't think it's worth explaining to you. I used to think you just were purposefully obtuse just to troll people here. Maybe you are and I'm just not picking up on it, but it does seem like you truly just don't understand this.

But I will briefly try. I don't think they ever truly commited to a rebuild. They started to in 2023, but didn't go all the way because the organization wants to be competitive every year. Also, I believe that the organization doesn't believe (rightly, judging from this forum)that the fans understand, and could sit through, a real rebuild, like other organizations, that are successful today, have done in the past.

You seem to believe that trading rentals like Jack Flaherty, Jordan Montgomery, Ryan Helsley, and Steven Matz are going to get you big name, MLB talent. There's really not much point in arguing with you anymore if that's the case.
Goldfan
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Re: BREAKING: HELSLEY TO METS!!!

Post by Goldfan »

An Old Friend wrote: 31 Jul 2025 09:32 am
Goldfan wrote: 31 Jul 2025 09:17 am
An Old Friend wrote: 31 Jul 2025 09:11 am
Goldfan wrote: 31 Jul 2025 08:00 am
An Old Friend wrote: 30 Jul 2025 22:32 pm
Goldfan wrote: 30 Jul 2025 22:21 pm https://www.nytimes.com/athletic/652635 ... ed_article
As I said…..salary dump
Repeating it doesn’t make you less wrong.

It’s not a salary dump. You don’t know what that means. You should stop and just accept that.

Helsley was the exact opposite of a salary dump.
So you agree they receive very little in return for an all-star closer who was contracted at 8.2mil with 2.706 roughly outstanding…….
So what would you call this…..charity for the Mets??….letting RH have some time in the Big Apple?? Tired of seeing Helsley face in BP???
“It’s not a salary dump”…..they say so rigid in their little definition :lol: :lol:
If you’re not paying a salary any longer and really received very little in return for that value what is it then???
I don't really know how to answer this without sounding like an arsehole.

You don't understand what a salary dump transaction is, but this wasn't it. Packaging someone like Arenado with him would be a salary dump.

They got prospects back that they valued, regardless of your personal perception of the prospects. Baez has been a highly thought of international signee. Dohm had first round grades on his pure stuff / ability but fell to the 3rd round of last year's draft with an 800K bonus primarily due to availability concerns.

They wouldn't have gotten those two players in the deal if it was purely a salary dump... i.e. take this player and pay him, we don't need / get anything of value back.
AOF, I get the salary dump….
You can say that... but you're clearly demonstrating that you don't.

I can't help you with that.
IF nothing was returned for RH then all it accomplished was NOT paying 2.706mil…..which is dumping salary.
Right. But they DID get a return. So it's NOT dumping salary.
Add Matz’s prorated to that and perhaps we see a real Salary Dump with NA, Gray,…..today and it adds up…..which I believe is the main goal for BDW.
They didn't salary dump Matz, either.

The goal with Arenado has ALWAYS been to salary dump. Mozeliak just hasn't been able to get that done, not partially due to Arenado's reluctance to leave.

And you don't need to "believe" DeWitt's goal to lower payroll. They've told you a hundred times that this is a 'reset'... and that 'reset' includes lowering their payroll. If you still find yourself pondering whether that is in question, you don't listen to or read anything.
Did they get a return……YOU were panning this….now it was good talent? :lol: :lol:
An Old Friend
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Re: BREAKING: HELSLEY TO METS!!!

Post by An Old Friend »

Goldfan wrote: 31 Jul 2025 09:36 am
An Old Friend wrote: 31 Jul 2025 09:32 am
Goldfan wrote: 31 Jul 2025 09:17 am
An Old Friend wrote: 31 Jul 2025 09:11 am
Goldfan wrote: 31 Jul 2025 08:00 am
An Old Friend wrote: 30 Jul 2025 22:32 pm
Goldfan wrote: 30 Jul 2025 22:21 pm https://www.nytimes.com/athletic/652635 ... ed_article
As I said…..salary dump
Repeating it doesn’t make you less wrong.

It’s not a salary dump. You don’t know what that means. You should stop and just accept that.

Helsley was the exact opposite of a salary dump.
So you agree they receive very little in return for an all-star closer who was contracted at 8.2mil with 2.706 roughly outstanding…….
So what would you call this…..charity for the Mets??….letting RH have some time in the Big Apple?? Tired of seeing Helsley face in BP???
“It’s not a salary dump”…..they say so rigid in their little definition :lol: :lol:
If you’re not paying a salary any longer and really received very little in return for that value what is it then???
I don't really know how to answer this without sounding like an arsehole.

You don't understand what a salary dump transaction is, but this wasn't it. Packaging someone like Arenado with him would be a salary dump.

They got prospects back that they valued, regardless of your personal perception of the prospects. Baez has been a highly thought of international signee. Dohm had first round grades on his pure stuff / ability but fell to the 3rd round of last year's draft with an 800K bonus primarily due to availability concerns.

They wouldn't have gotten those two players in the deal if it was purely a salary dump... i.e. take this player and pay him, we don't need / get anything of value back.
AOF, I get the salary dump….
You can say that... but you're clearly demonstrating that you don't.

I can't help you with that.
IF nothing was returned for RH then all it accomplished was NOT paying 2.706mil…..which is dumping salary.
Right. But they DID get a return. So it's NOT dumping salary.
Add Matz’s prorated to that and perhaps we see a real Salary Dump with NA, Gray,…..today and it adds up…..which I believe is the main goal for BDW.
They didn't salary dump Matz, either.

The goal with Arenado has ALWAYS been to salary dump. Mozeliak just hasn't been able to get that done, not partially due to Arenado's reluctance to leave.

And you don't need to "believe" DeWitt's goal to lower payroll. They've told you a hundred times that this is a 'reset'... and that 'reset' includes lowering their payroll. If you still find yourself pondering whether that is in question, you don't listen to or read anything.
Did they get a return……YOU were panning this….now it was good talent? :lol: :lol:
You are insufferable right now. I'm in line with Ronnie... if I didn't know any better, I'd say that you were trolling.

It's not anyone's fault but yours that you don't know what a 'salary dump' conceptually means.
Goldfan
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Re: BREAKING: HELSLEY TO METS!!!

Post by Goldfan »

Ronnie Dobbs wrote: 31 Jul 2025 09:33 am
Goldfan wrote: 31 Jul 2025 09:21 amAgain, outline this rebuilding plan. Is this ongoing this season?? By what metrics?? Watching Yutes flounder as they have in the past? That’s rebuilding?? Returning middling minor league talent for ML talent….that’s rebuilding???
If from 2 yrs ago and today…..if that return never makes it to MLB for Cards…..all you’ve done is let ML talent go>>>>jettisoned that salary>>>>and are standing still. If that’s rebuilding then I guess we’re right on track.
I don't think it's worth explaining to you. I used to think you just were purposefully obtuse just to troll people here. Maybe you are and I'm just not picking up on it, but it does seem like you truly just don't understand this.

But I will briefly try. I don't think they ever truly commited to a rebuild. They started to in 2023, but didn't go all the way because the organization wants to be competitive every year. Also, I believe that the organization doesn't believe (rightly, judging from this forum)that the fans understand, and could sit through, a real rebuild, like other organizations, that are successful today, have done in the past.

You seem to believe that trading rentals like Jack Flaherty, Jordan Montgomery, Ryan Helsley, and Steven Matz are going to get you big name, MLB talent. There's really not much point in arguing with you anymore if that's the case.
So if they don’t return real talent…..and they are never really replaced….then at some point you pay The money to KEEP ML talent and start winning
This is point yall don’t seem to get…..this “rebuilding” is going nowhere if real ML talent isn’t returned….and you acknowledge they’re not getting it in return….
Short of tanking how are they going to rebuild without getting real talent back in trades or spending $$??
An Old Friend
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Re: BREAKING: HELSLEY TO METS!!!

Post by An Old Friend »

Goldfan wrote: 31 Jul 2025 09:43 am
Ronnie Dobbs wrote: 31 Jul 2025 09:33 am
Goldfan wrote: 31 Jul 2025 09:21 amAgain, outline this rebuilding plan. Is this ongoing this season?? By what metrics?? Watching Yutes flounder as they have in the past? That’s rebuilding?? Returning middling minor league talent for ML talent….that’s rebuilding???
If from 2 yrs ago and today…..if that return never makes it to MLB for Cards…..all you’ve done is let ML talent go>>>>jettisoned that salary>>>>and are standing still. If that’s rebuilding then I guess we’re right on track.
I don't think it's worth explaining to you. I used to think you just were purposefully obtuse just to troll people here. Maybe you are and I'm just not picking up on it, but it does seem like you truly just don't understand this.

But I will briefly try. I don't think they ever truly commited to a rebuild. They started to in 2023, but didn't go all the way because the organization wants to be competitive every year. Also, I believe that the organization doesn't believe (rightly, judging from this forum)that the fans understand, and could sit through, a real rebuild, like other organizations, that are successful today, have done in the past.

You seem to believe that trading rentals like Jack Flaherty, Jordan Montgomery, Ryan Helsley, and Steven Matz are going to get you big name, MLB talent. There's really not much point in arguing with you anymore if that's the case.
So if they don’t return real talent…..and they are never really replaced….then at some point you pay The money to KEEP ML talent and start winning
This is point yall don’t seem to get…..this “rebuilding” is going nowhere if real ML talent isn’t returned….and you acknowledge they’re not getting it in return….
Short of tanking how are they going to rebuild without getting real talent back in trades or spending $$??
How is it that you seriously don't understand that the Cardinals are trying to add more talent to their development pipeline with the end goal of providing better and more sustainable talent to the major league roster? And that they need to do that if they want to be competitive since their economics have changed and they are moving to a lower payroll model?

F dude. Give it a rest.
Ozziesfan41
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Re: BREAKING: HELSLEY TO METS!!!

Post by Ozziesfan41 »

An Old Friend wrote: 31 Jul 2025 09:32 am
Goldfan wrote: 31 Jul 2025 09:17 am
An Old Friend wrote: 31 Jul 2025 09:11 am
Goldfan wrote: 31 Jul 2025 08:00 am
An Old Friend wrote: 30 Jul 2025 22:32 pm
Goldfan wrote: 30 Jul 2025 22:21 pm https://www.nytimes.com/athletic/652635 ... ed_article
As I said…..salary dump
Repeating it doesn’t make you less wrong.

It’s not a salary dump. You don’t know what that means. You should stop and just accept that.

Helsley was the exact opposite of a salary dump.
So you agree they receive very little in return for an all-star closer who was contracted at 8.2mil with 2.706 roughly outstanding…….
So what would you call this…..charity for the Mets??….letting RH have some time in the Big Apple?? Tired of seeing Helsley face in BP???
“It’s not a salary dump”…..they say so rigid in their little definition :lol: :lol:
If you’re not paying a salary any longer and really received very little in return for that value what is it then???
I don't really know how to answer this without sounding like an arsehole.

You don't understand what a salary dump transaction is, but this wasn't it. Packaging someone like Arenado with him would be a salary dump.

They got prospects back that they valued, regardless of your personal perception of the prospects. Baez has been a highly thought of international signee. Dohm had first round grades on his pure stuff / ability but fell to the 3rd round of last year's draft with an 800K bonus primarily due to availability concerns.

They wouldn't have gotten those two players in the deal if it was purely a salary dump... i.e. take this player and pay him, we don't need / get anything of value back.
AOF, I get the salary dump….
You can say that... but you're clearly demonstrating that you don't.

I can't help you with that.
IF nothing was returned for RH then all it accomplished was NOT paying 2.706mil…..which is dumping salary.
Right. But they DID get a return. So it's NOT dumping salary.
Add Matz’s prorated to that and perhaps we see a real Salary Dump with NA, Gray,…..today and it adds up…..which I believe is the main goal for BDW.
They didn't salary dump Matz, either.

The goal with Arenado has ALWAYS been to salary dump. Mozeliak just hasn't been able to get that done, not partially due to Arenado's reluctance to leave.

And you don't need to "believe" DeWitt's goal to lower payroll. They've told you a hundred times that this is a 'reset'... and that 'reset' includes lowering their payroll. If you still find yourself pondering whether that is in question, you don't listen to or read anything.
If it was salary dumps they were interested in they would have dumped them in the offseason when they could have saved even more money. The fact is they wanted to hope and prayer their way into a wild card spot they kept them and would have kept them until the end of the season if they thought they had a chance at the wild card when it was obvious that wasn’t going to happen then it becomes stupid to keep them and them leave for nothing when you could trade them and get something in return. Arenado is part salary dump part wanting to dump a declining player part wanting to make room for other players to play
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