ERA

[Goldfan]

Pitchers and hitters both evolved and adapted.

Pitchers sell out for spin and velo which causes hitters to swing and miss more than ever. Hitters decide they better do damage when they do actually connect and sell out for power. End result is the same amount of scoring but less baserunners.

Runs/Game
2000….10.28
2026….9

[JohnnyMO]

Pitchers and hitters both evolved and adapted.

Pitchers sell out for spin and velo which causes hitters to swing and miss more than ever. Hitters decide they better do damage when they do actually connect and sell out for power. End result is the same amount of scoring but less baserunners.

Runs/Game
2000….10.28
2026….9

Why just two seasons? Look at the last 26 years. 22 of them round to 9 runs per game.

2026 - 9.01
2025 - 8.90
2024 - 8.78
2023 - 9.24
2022 - 8.56
2021 - 9.06
2020 - 9.30
2019 - 9.66
2018 - 8.90
2017 - 9.30
2016 - 8.96
2015 - 8.50
2014 - 8.14
2013 - 8.34
2012 - 8.64
2011 - 8.56
2010 - 8.76
2009 - 9.22
2008 - 9.30
2007 - 9.60
2006 - 9.72
2005 - 9.18
2004 - 9.62
2003 - 9.46
2002 - 9.24
2001 - 9.56
2000 - 10.28

[NYCardsFan]

Pitchers and hitters both evolved and adapted.

Pitchers sell out for spin and velo which causes hitters to swing and miss more than ever. Hitters decide they better do damage when they do actually connect and sell out for power. End result is the same amount of scoring but less baserunners.

Runs/Game
2000….10.28
2026….9

Why would you pick a single year (2000) for comparison knowing that such an approach exposes your entire presentation to extreme endpoint sensitivity? Not very rigorous. For example, look at the average R/G over that entire 2000-2026 period compared to this year:

Average R/G
2000-2026: 4.55
2026: 4.51

[Adam2]

What does it say that the best ERA in Cards rotation…..has the least speed and spin

obviously that he has the best location

[JohnnyMO]

Where is the stat boost for PITCHING appearing?
Hitting is terrible…..low BA high K’s
SP only need to go 5 with the lead…..hand over to the speed/spin BP masters and wins should be logged quite frequently>>>>that’s not happening.
Outside the few Elite SP most teams rotations look like the Cardinals which are putting up ERA’s no better than 20-25yrs ago
So where is this unhittable MLB pitching hiding its historic stats?

The stat boost for pitching is exactly what you said…more k’s and lower batting average against.

[jcgmoi]

more k’s and lower batting average against.

A favorite factoid is that hitters are slugging 233 against Miz. Slugging 233.

[Goldfan]

Where is the stat boost for PITCHING appearing?
Hitting is terrible…..low BA high K’s
SP only need to go 5 with the lead…..hand over to the speed/spin BP masters and wins should be logged quite frequently>>>>that’s not happening.
Outside the few Elite SP most teams rotations look like the Cardinals which are putting up ERA’s no better than 20-25yrs ago
So where is this unhittable MLB pitching hiding its historic stats?

The stat boost for pitching is exactly what you said…more k’s and lower batting average against.

Runs=Wins
So the MLB product has devolved into a less entertaining more boring K/HR exhibition over 9innings. This is the outcome they hoped for?
Less offense
Less single pitching success
Same runs
And I’d argue that the K’s are higher and BA is lower primarily because of the hitter not the pitcher.
And even with K’s higher……it’s very doubtful we see another 3000K pitcher. Max will be the last.

[JohnnyMO]

Where is the stat boost for PITCHING appearing?
Hitting is terrible…..low BA high K’s
SP only need to go 5 with the lead…..hand over to the speed/spin BP masters and wins should be logged quite frequently>>>>that’s not happening.
Outside the few Elite SP most teams rotations look like the Cardinals which are putting up ERA’s no better than 20-25yrs ago
So where is this unhittable MLB pitching hiding its historic stats?

The stat boost for pitching is exactly what you said…more k’s and lower batting average against.

Runs=Wins
So the MLB product has devolved into a less entertaining more boring K/HR exhibition over 9innings. This is the outcome they hoped for?
Less offense
Less single pitching success
Same runs
And I’d argue that the K’s are higher and BA is lower primarily because of the hitter not the pitcher.
And even with K’s higher……it’s very doubtful we see another 3000K pitcher. Max will be the last.

I’m not saying it’s good for the game, but it’s what happened. Pitchers got more difficult to hit, hitters figured out how to score runs despite all the k’s and lower batting averages.

As a fan I prefer seeing some small ball mixed in. I also preferred the NBA before players figured out shooting 35% from three was better than 50% from two and that mid range shots were a bad bet. Or the NFL when running backs dominated the league. But all games evolve over time and you can’t put the genie back in the bottle.

[mattmitchl44]

Where is the stat boost for PITCHING appearing?
Hitting is terrible…..low BA high K’s
SP only need to go 5 with the lead…..hand over to the speed/spin BP masters and wins should be logged quite frequently>>>>that’s not happening.
Outside the few Elite SP most teams rotations look like the Cardinals which are putting up ERA’s no better than 20-25yrs ago
So where is this unhittable MLB pitching hiding its historic stats?

The stat boost for pitching is exactly what you said…more k’s and lower batting average against.

Runs=Wins
So the MLB product has devolved into a less entertaining more boring K/HR exhibition over 9innings. This is the outcome they hoped for?
Less offense
Less single pitching success
Same runs
And I’d argue that the K’s are higher and BA is lower primarily because of the hitter not the pitcher.
And even with K’s higher……it’s very doubtful we see another 3000K pitcher. Max will be the last.

I’m not saying it’s good for the game, but it’s what happened. Pitchers got more difficult to hit, hitters figured out how to score runs despite all the k’s and lower batting averages.

Yes - as pitchers as a group have become progressively more difficult for batters to hit no matter their approach, most hitters have steered toward an approach where they are trying to do as much "damage" as possible when they do catch up with one and hit it hard - an approach to try and generate XBHs, not singles.

[Goldfan]

Where is the stat boost for PITCHING appearing?
Hitting is terrible…..low BA high K’s
SP only need to go 5 with the lead…..hand over to the speed/spin BP masters and wins should be logged quite frequently>>>>that’s not happening.
Outside the few Elite SP most teams rotations look like the Cardinals which are putting up ERA’s no better than 20-25yrs ago
So where is this unhittable MLB pitching hiding its historic stats?

The stat boost for pitching is exactly what you said…more k’s and lower batting average against.

Runs=Wins
So the MLB product has devolved into a less entertaining more boring K/HR exhibition over 9innings. This is the outcome they hoped for?
Less offense
Less single pitching success
Same runs
And I’d argue that the K’s are higher and BA is lower primarily because of the hitter not the pitcher.
And even with K’s higher……it’s very doubtful we see another 3000K pitcher. Max will be the last.

I’m not saying it’s good for the game, but it’s what happened. Pitchers got more difficult to hit, hitters figured out how to score runs despite all the k’s and lower batting averages.

Yes - as pitchers as a group have become progressively more difficult for batters to hit no matter their approach, most hitters have steered toward an approach where they are trying to do as much "damage" as possible when they do catch up with one and hit it hard - an approach to try and generate XBHs, not singles.

I really don’t think it’s the pitcher being better…..if so they would have more wins…..better ERA…..
Somewhere at sometime the analytics honks convinced organizations that launch was the way. This is what induces all the K’s. If contact were taught and practiced I’m almost certain the K’s would go down and the .300 hitter would be plenty. Very few players have the talent for power and high avg. a few more can have power and respectable avg….then there are the majority that if only attempting to swing for power will be your .200 hitter>>>these batters were singles hitters in the past….. And in 2026 every player is swinging for the fence.

[JohnnyMO]

Where is the stat boost for PITCHING appearing?
Hitting is terrible…..low BA high K’s
SP only need to go 5 with the lead…..hand over to the speed/spin BP masters and wins should be logged quite frequently>>>>that’s not happening.
Outside the few Elite SP most teams rotations look like the Cardinals which are putting up ERA’s no better than 20-25yrs ago
So where is this unhittable MLB pitching hiding its historic stats?

The stat boost for pitching is exactly what you said…more k’s and lower batting average against.

Runs=Wins
So the MLB product has devolved into a less entertaining more boring K/HR exhibition over 9innings. This is the outcome they hoped for?
Less offense
Less single pitching success
Same runs
And I’d argue that the K’s are higher and BA is lower primarily because of the hitter not the pitcher.
And even with K’s higher……it’s very doubtful we see another 3000K pitcher. Max will be the last.

I’m not saying it’s good for the game, but it’s what happened. Pitchers got more difficult to hit, hitters figured out how to score runs despite all the k’s and lower batting averages.

Yes - as pitchers as a group have become progressively more difficult for batters to hit no matter their approach, most hitters have steered toward an approach where they are trying to do as much "damage" as possible when they do catch up with one and hit it hard - an approach to try and generate XBHs, not singles.

I really don’t think it’s the pitcher being better…..if so they would have more wins…..better ERA…..
Somewhere at sometime the analytics honks convinced organizations that launch was the way. This is what induces all the K’s. If contact were taught and practiced I’m almost certain the K’s would go down and the .300 hitter would be plenty. Very few players have the talent for power and high avg. a few more can have power and respectable avg….then there are the majority that if only attempting to swing for power will be your .200 hitter>>>these batters were singles hitters in the past….. And in 2026 every player is swinging for the fence.

You’re saying hitters are worse and pitchers are worse. Which is a pretty “get off my lawn” thought process. Yes hitters swing for the fences more than ever. Yes pitchers go for velo and spin more than ever. The question is why. And there is a much more nuanced answer than “analytics are dumb and no one knows what they are doing anymore” if you’re actually willing to think about it.

[mattmitchl44]

Where is the stat boost for PITCHING appearing?
Hitting is terrible…..low BA high K’s
SP only need to go 5 with the lead…..hand over to the speed/spin BP masters and wins should be logged quite frequently>>>>that’s not happening.
Outside the few Elite SP most teams rotations look like the Cardinals which are putting up ERA’s no better than 20-25yrs ago
So where is this unhittable MLB pitching hiding its historic stats?

The stat boost for pitching is exactly what you said…more k’s and lower batting average against.

Runs=Wins
So the MLB product has devolved into a less entertaining more boring K/HR exhibition over 9innings. This is the outcome they hoped for?
Less offense
Less single pitching success
Same runs
And I’d argue that the K’s are higher and BA is lower primarily because of the hitter not the pitcher.
And even with K’s higher……it’s very doubtful we see another 3000K pitcher. Max will be the last.

I’m not saying it’s good for the game, but it’s what happened. Pitchers got more difficult to hit, hitters figured out how to score runs despite all the k’s and lower batting averages.

Yes - as pitchers as a group have become progressively more difficult for batters to hit no matter their approach, most hitters have steered toward an approach where they are trying to do as much "damage" as possible when they do catch up with one and hit it hard - an approach to try and generate XBHs, not singles.

I really don’t think it’s the pitcher being better…..if so they would have more wins…..better ERA…..
Somewhere at sometime the analytics honks convinced organizations that launch was the way. This is what induces all the K’s. If contact were taught and practiced I’m almost certain the K’s would go down and the .300 hitter would be plenty. Very few players have the talent for power and high avg. a few more can have power and respectable avg….then there are the majority that if only attempting to swing for power will be your .200 hitter>>>these batters were singles hitters in the past….. And in 2026 every player is swinging for the fence.

I don't even know what your "would have more wins" argument is. There is exactly one win assigned to a pitcher per game. Who gets the win is an artifact of the rules about assigning wins.

If slap hitting, contact oriented singles hitters were a viable tactical option today, teams would teach to that.

But with today's pitchers, defensive positioning, no astroturf fields, etc., having guys go out to make weak contact isn't guaranteed to produce "plenty" of .300 hitters.

[JohnnyMO]

Where is the stat boost for PITCHING appearing?
Hitting is terrible…..low BA high K’s
SP only need to go 5 with the lead…..hand over to the speed/spin BP masters and wins should be logged quite frequently>>>>that’s not happening.
Outside the few Elite SP most teams rotations look like the Cardinals which are putting up ERA’s no better than 20-25yrs ago
So where is this unhittable MLB pitching hiding its historic stats?

The stat boost for pitching is exactly what you said…more k’s and lower batting average against.

Runs=Wins
So the MLB product has devolved into a less entertaining more boring K/HR exhibition over 9innings. This is the outcome they hoped for?
Less offense
Less single pitching success
Same runs
And I’d argue that the K’s are higher and BA is lower primarily because of the hitter not the pitcher.
And even with K’s higher……it’s very doubtful we see another 3000K pitcher. Max will be the last.

I’m not saying it’s good for the game, but it’s what happened. Pitchers got more difficult to hit, hitters figured out how to score runs despite all the k’s and lower batting averages.

Yes - as pitchers as a group have become progressively more difficult for batters to hit no matter their approach, most hitters have steered toward an approach where they are trying to do as much "damage" as possible when they do catch up with one and hit it hard - an approach to try and generate XBHs, not singles.

I really don’t think it’s the pitcher being better…..if so they would have more wins…..better ERA…..
Somewhere at sometime the analytics honks convinced organizations that launch was the way. This is what induces all the K’s. If contact were taught and practiced I’m almost certain the K’s would go down and the .300 hitter would be plenty. Very few players have the talent for power and high avg. a few more can have power and respectable avg….then there are the majority that if only attempting to swing for power will be your .200 hitter>>>these batters were singles hitters in the past….. And in 2026 every player is swinging for the fence.

I don't even know what your "would have more wins" argument is. There is exactly one win assigned to a pitcher per game. Who gets the win is an artifact of the rules about assigning wins.

If slap hitting, contact oriented singles hitters were a viable tactical option today, teams would teach to that.

But with today's pitchers, defensive positioning, no astroturf fields, etc., having guys go out to make weak contact isn't guaranteed to produce "plenty" of .300 hitters.

Are you sure it isn't because almost everyone is stupid besides Goldfan and Will Clark?

[renostl]

Maybe try other examples than a team that is below league average in ERA sending out their worst starters and a team that is slightly better than league average in ERA sending out their best pitcher, worst pitcher, and meh pitcher?

If MLB pitching is sooo much better than 20yrs ago….why would we need to cherry pick? Shouldn’t the entire league SP be at historical levels considering hitters can’t hit .250?

All I hear is that speed and spin have made hitting impossible. Move back mound….lower mound…..
But you can’t swing a dead cat without finding SP’s with 4 and 5 ERA’s

You have positioned your question with enough bias that you are not
allowing yourself to acknowledge reasons for why or how this can happen.

Batting averages being down for you equals poor hitting and not that the pitching is
doing anything at all. There is bias in that.

ERA being up and Wins being down for you means bad pitching. That doesn't allow you
to acknowledge why this might happen.

Going all the way back to 1970 which should capture seasons in most people memories.
R/G during most of those 55 seasons has been in the 4.40 range +/- 0.35. That's a low
deviation. There were 3 seasons between 5.0- 5.14 late 90's and 2000. There were
3 seasons between 3.69-3.99 R/G in the 1970's.

Stable R/G with decreased BA goes beyond poor hitting. It is different hitting for more than
any single reason.

Pitchers get pulled so early now. In general, 100 pitches is a hard line. The SP
has to go 5 in that game. Then the game cannot be tied or have any lead changes in
that time until the end. The more innings left the more difficult that status quo remains.
Less IP's, Guys get pulled with no hitters going for gosh. They also get pulled early. In doing
so they can give up 4 R's in 3 innings and not get the opportunity of settling down
and going 2-3 innings without runs. Those 4 R's gave him a 12.0 era. It can have the effect we used to
give RP's. Remember the cliche " Don't judge a RP by ERA.

You're actually too smart for all this and not being able to seek out reasons that this could
all occur at the same time if you are open to it.
That has zero to do with how the game is today comparatively just how it is.
Also remember there are teams not deploying that strategy and they are successful
in not doing so. So being a copycat world maybe it changes.
Brewers, Rays, Pitt and even the Cubs are above league average in R/G while
not being HR reliant. You'll see some team BA's >.250 in that group.

[mattmitchl44]

Where is the stat boost for PITCHING appearing?
Hitting is terrible…..low BA high K’s
SP only need to go 5 with the lead…..hand over to the speed/spin BP masters and wins should be logged quite frequently>>>>that’s not happening.
Outside the few Elite SP most teams rotations look like the Cardinals which are putting up ERA’s no better than 20-25yrs ago
So where is this unhittable MLB pitching hiding its historic stats?

The stat boost for pitching is exactly what you said…more k’s and lower batting average against.

Runs=Wins
So the MLB product has devolved into a less entertaining more boring K/HR exhibition over 9innings. This is the outcome they hoped for?
Less offense
Less single pitching success
Same runs
And I’d argue that the K’s are higher and BA is lower primarily because of the hitter not the pitcher.
And even with K’s higher……it’s very doubtful we see another 3000K pitcher. Max will be the last.

I’m not saying it’s good for the game, but it’s what happened. Pitchers got more difficult to hit, hitters figured out how to score runs despite all the k’s and lower batting averages.

Yes - as pitchers as a group have become progressively more difficult for batters to hit no matter their approach, most hitters have steered toward an approach where they are trying to do as much "damage" as possible when they do catch up with one and hit it hard - an approach to try and generate XBHs, not singles.

I really don’t think it’s the pitcher being better…..if so they would have more wins…..better ERA…..
Somewhere at sometime the analytics honks convinced organizations that launch was the way. This is what induces all the K’s. If contact were taught and practiced I’m almost certain the K’s would go down and the .300 hitter would be plenty. Very few players have the talent for power and high avg. a few more can have power and respectable avg….then there are the majority that if only attempting to swing for power will be your .200 hitter>>>these batters were singles hitters in the past….. And in 2026 every player is swinging for the fence.

I don't even know what your "would have more wins" argument is. There is exactly one win assigned to a pitcher per game. Who gets the win is an artifact of the rules about assigning wins.

If slap hitting, contact oriented singles hitters were a viable tactical option today, teams would teach to that.

But with today's pitchers, defensive positioning, no astroturf fields, etc., having guys go out to make weak contact isn't guaranteed to produce "plenty" of .300 hitters.

Are you sure it isn't because almost everyone is stupid besides Goldfan and Will Clark?

LOL

The industry of baseball has always seemingly been very conservative and traditional. Getting teams to change how they approach the game is hard, they very much tend to stick with what they think has "always worked."

The fact that advanced analytics approaches - including pitching labs, hitting labs, etc. to optimize each player's approach to being productive - have gotten a seemingly universal adoption throughout baseball should tell you how much information had to be brought to these teams' front offices to convince them that these modern approaches are the best path for winning in MLB in 2026.

The "analytics honks" didn't hire a witch doctor to cast a voodoo spell in all MLB FOs to get them to adopt these modern approaches. They had to prove, with data, information, and results, that these modern approaches work.

[BrummerStealsHome]

Can someone explain how pitching is so considered so dominant in this new era of baseball with these ERA’s

Monday: Peterson (5-7, 5.97 ERA) vs. Liberatore (5-7, 5.18 ERA)

Tuesday: Rea (7-7, 4.85 ERA) vs. McGreevy (4-8, 3.07 ERA)

Wednesday: Boyd (6-1, 3.81 ERA) vs. May (5-7, 4.59 ERA)

Claims that pitching is dominant is a simplistic response to the offensive dullness of the contemporary game. Runs per game are around historical average. But what seems lifeless about the game and adds boredom is that MLB is near an all-time low on singles per game, near all-time lows in league batting average, while maintaining roughly historical average (a little above average) in walks. Baseball is scoring a {historically} disproportionate number of its runs from the home run. It is also making more of hits outs from a historically high number of strikeouts. Through the flow of a baseball games, it's baserunners that help keep things interesting, plus good defensive play to keep those runners from scoring of off base to begin with.. Waiting for the exuberance of the homerun among a series of strikeouts is dull, and it can seem like too much dominance by pitchers.