The athletic and 2027 expansion draft

[The Average Gatsby]

Going to end up watering down the league big time.

Already can't find enough quality centers or defenders.

There’s plenty of talent out there. Some guys will get a chance to be full time NHL players..that’s a good thing.
I’m looking forward to the expansion

The talent in the league is going to get diluted. That's what is the inevitable result of team expansion

That statement is said every time they do expansion, yet the league is better is doing better than ever.

It's said because it's true. More AHL level players and SHL, KHL etc...will be in the NHL. That's just reality.

There are plenty of guys that are capable of playing in the NHL that aren’t there yet. These expansion teams will be be filled with mostly current NHL players. Every team in the league has multiple prospects that are NHL caliber to replace players. The “watered down” statement just really isn’t true.

Operative word here is prospects.

Are you really trying to tell me the NHL is a better league if the Blues lost Buchnevich to an expansion draft and had to play Carbonneau in his place next season?

That's basically what you just argued for above.

I'll go ahead and disagree.

You can disagree, but you would be wrong. You should look into this if you don’t believe us.

[UMR-alum-05]

Going to end up watering down the league big time.

Already can't find enough quality centers or defenders.

There’s plenty of talent out there. Some guys will get a chance to be full time NHL players..that’s a good thing.
I’m looking forward to the expansion

The talent in the league is going to get diluted. That's what is the inevitable result of team expansion

That statement is said every time they do expansion, yet the league is better is doing better than ever.

It's said because it's true. More AHL level players and SHL, KHL etc...will be in the NHL. That's just reality.

There are plenty of guys that are capable of playing in the NHL that aren’t there yet. These expansion teams will be be filled with mostly current NHL players. Every team in the league has multiple prospects that are NHL caliber to replace players. The “watered down” statement just really isn’t true.

Operative word here is prospects.

Are you really trying to tell me the NHL is a better league if the Blues lost Buchnevich to an expansion draft and had to play Carbonneau in his place next season?

That's basically what you just argued for above.

I'll go ahead and disagree.

You can disagree, but you would be wrong. You should look into this if you don’t believe us.

The Blues are not better without Buchnevich and with Carbonneau at this juncture. I don't need to look into it. The league isn't better either if you repeat this scenario 30+ times.

Carry on believing that. To just assume the NHL is a better league if teams lose their veterans and call up their prospects is not realistic as a blanket assumption

[StlFanInVA]

Going to end up watering down the league big time.

Already can't find enough quality centers or defenders.

There’s plenty of talent out there. Some guys will get a chance to be full time NHL players..that’s a good thing.
I’m looking forward to the expansion

The talent in the league is going to get diluted. That's what is the inevitable result of team expansion

That statement is said every time they do expansion, yet the league is better is doing better than ever.

It's said because it's true. More AHL level players and SHL, KHL etc...will be in the NHL. That's just reality.

There are plenty of guys that are capable of playing in the NHL that aren’t there yet. These expansion teams will be be filled with mostly current NHL players. Every team in the league has multiple prospects that are NHL caliber to replace players. The “watered down” statement just really isn’t true.

Operative word here is prospects.

Are you really trying to tell me the NHL is a better league if the Blues lost Buchnevich to an expansion draft and had to play Carbonneau in his place next season?

That's basically what you just argued for above.

I'll go ahead and disagree.

You can disagree, but you would be wrong. You should look into this if you don’t believe us.

The Blues are not better without Buchnevich and with Carbonneau at this juncture. I don't need to look into it. The league isn't better either if you repeat this scenario 30+ times.

Carry on believing that. To just assume the NHL is a better league if teams lose their veterans and call up their prospects is not realistic as a blanket assumption

looking at the micro, its hard to disagree with you. looking at the macro, its quite possible that expansion helps grow the game... and talent. it may take a while to catch up, but in the past it seems to have.

[Pierre McGuire]

Going to end up watering down the league big time.

Already can't find enough quality centers or defenders.

There’s plenty of talent out there. Some guys will get a chance to be full time NHL players..that’s a good thing.
I’m looking forward to the expansion

The talent in the league is going to get diluted. That's what is the inevitable result of team expansion

That statement is said every time they do expansion, yet the league is better is doing better than ever.

It's said because it's true. More AHL level players and SHL, KHL etc...will be in the NHL. That's just reality.

There are plenty of guys that are capable of playing in the NHL that aren’t there yet. These expansion teams will be be filled with mostly current NHL players. Every team in the league has multiple prospects that are NHL caliber to replace players. The “watered down” statement just really isn’t true.

Operative word here is prospects.

Are you really trying to tell me the NHL is a better league if the Blues lost Buchnevich to an expansion draft and had to play Carbonneau in his place next season?

That's basically what you just argued for above.

I'll go ahead and disagree.

You can disagree all you want. I’d much rather have Carbonneau in a few years over Buch. Why on earth would you not think Carbonneau would be here by then anyway?

[UMR-alum-05]

Going to end up watering down the league big time.

Already can't find enough quality centers or defenders.

There’s plenty of talent out there. Some guys will get a chance to be full time NHL players..that’s a good thing.
I’m looking forward to the expansion

The talent in the league is going to get diluted. That's what is the inevitable result of team expansion

That statement is said every time they do expansion, yet the league is better is doing better than ever.

It's said because it's true. More AHL level players and SHL, KHL etc...will be in the NHL. That's just reality.

There are plenty of guys that are capable of playing in the NHL that aren’t there yet. These expansion teams will be be filled with mostly current NHL players. Every team in the league has multiple prospects that are NHL caliber to replace players. The “watered down” statement just really isn’t true.

Operative word here is prospects.

Are you really trying to tell me the NHL is a better league if the Blues lost Buchnevich to an expansion draft and had to play Carbonneau in his place next season?

That's basically what you just argued for above.

I'll go ahead and disagree.

You can disagree all you want. I’d much rather have Carbonneau in a few years over Buch. Why on earth would you not think Carbonneau would be here by then anyway?

This comment is missing the overall point. Say the expansion happened right now. Buch for Carbo. That's what I'm saying.

In "a few years" it's different players, same scenario. Give up McTavish or Thomas and have to promote Lawrence early. Or some other scenario just like that.

[Frank Barone]

I'm not a subscriber so I can't read the article, but, what the actual [fork]? How bored is The Athletic staff? There is no 2027 expansion draft. The only group close enough is choosing between Houston or Austin and neither of those cities has an NHL building. Atlanta is still in the planning stages. By the time expansion is announced we may have a roster full of studs, and Buch could be retired.

Houston has a building that could support an NHL team, the Toyota Center where the Rockets play. A team in Austin could play in the arena where the Texas Stars play while an NHL size arena is built. A team in Atlanta could play where the Thrashers used to play while a new arena is built.

Expansion is coming in the next few years, although next year might be pushing it. I'm looking forward to it.

[Old_Goat]

I believe the discussion is not complete without including the reality that hockey is a difficult sport to watch on TV, thus it's revenues come more-so from in-person ticket sales as a percentage than other major sports. Additionally, it is much more costly for youths to play mainly because of required rink infrastructure and for player equipment. So, without actually experiencing the feel of playing, at least the energy of being in the crowd actually present near the action helps draw people in. Add to this the rising salary costs especially at the NHL level, and it is becoming cost prohibitive for a lot of fans.
I have said this before: NHL Teams should invest more into their top minor league teams (AHL) and expand investment at the next tier down and possibly even a tier below that. Look at pro baseball for example. I have friends whom live all over the country in minor league baseball and hockey towns whom are so happy to be able to take their families to see darn good play at an affordable price. And they brag about the value experience.
Baseball and football can get by with TV. I do not believe the NHL (pro hockey) can.
Some folks go on and on about how players need more time at the AHL league to develop, but now suggest that those players will be the reason that there is no dilution in quality/level of play, and expect that people will be satisfied to see that.
And then we have spirited discussions about right or wrong moves to build a Championship team yet so many having never achieved it, or at least not for 3 generations, or only once in 80+ years. In the meantime, it's exciting for those following their local minor league team to win the Calder Cup, or even the Kelly Cup.
I am opposed to expansion. I've made my case. Thanks for reading. But I realize I have no vote.
So, what I am really focused on is: Will I be able to watch the Blues via my local Streaming Service? I realize I have to pay some way, but hope it is simple without having to jump through hoops to get the right app, set up other accounts.

[DawgDad]

I believe a rink development at or near the Northpoint Mall property could work [Atlanta]. Parking another expansion team downtown is a non-starter on enough levels to top the Burj Khalifa.

This isn't really my fight anymore, I'm getting too old. Tried to be a a Thrashers fan throughout the life of that franchise but the NHL just wanted money, ownership flat out didn't care about the team [or each other, suing each other into oblivion], the business leaders, old money, and politicians ultimately snubbed their noses [don't ask me why, responding truthfully would get me banned].

[dhsux]

I would selfishly prefer they not expand.

If they do....life goes on and I can live with the results.

The sport is growing, the youth coming up today is far advanced of the youth of yesteryear....certainly enough to accommodate another group of some 250 plus hockey players to support the new franchises.

IMO

[The Average Gatsby]

Going to end up watering down the league big time.

Already can't find enough quality centers or defenders.

There’s plenty of talent out there. Some guys will get a chance to be full time NHL players..that’s a good thing.
I’m looking forward to the expansion

The talent in the league is going to get diluted. That's what is the inevitable result of team expansion

That statement is said every time they do expansion, yet the league is better is doing better than ever.

It's said because it's true. More AHL level players and SHL, KHL etc...will be in the NHL. That's just reality.

There are plenty of guys that are capable of playing in the NHL that aren’t there yet. These expansion teams will be be filled with mostly current NHL players. Every team in the league has multiple prospects that are NHL caliber to replace players. The “watered down” statement just really isn’t true.

Operative word here is prospects.

Are you really trying to tell me the NHL is a better league if the Blues lost Buchnevich to an expansion draft and had to play Carbonneau in his place next season?

That's basically what you just argued for above.

I'll go ahead and disagree.

You can disagree, but you would be wrong. You should look into this if you don’t believe us.

The Blues are not better without Buchnevich and with Carbonneau at this juncture. I don't need to look into it. The league isn't better either if you repeat this scenario 30+ times.

Carry on believing that. To just assume the NHL is a better league if teams lose their veterans and call up their prospects is not realistic as a blanket assumption

I’m not giving you my opinion. I’m telling you that this is a known thing that gets debated every time the league expands. The general consensus is that there are so many more people that play high level hockey and the skill level is so much higher than it used to be that the league can expand without a noticeable drop off in talent. That probably wouldn’t be the case if the league were double in size overnight but that’s not the scale we are talking about.

[UMR-alum-05]

Going to end up watering down the league big time.

Already can't find enough quality centers or defenders.

There’s plenty of talent out there. Some guys will get a chance to be full time NHL players..that’s a good thing.
I’m looking forward to the expansion

The talent in the league is going to get diluted. That's what is the inevitable result of team expansion

That statement is said every time they do expansion, yet the league is better is doing better than ever.

It's said because it's true. More AHL level players and SHL, KHL etc...will be in the NHL. That's just reality.

There are plenty of guys that are capable of playing in the NHL that aren’t there yet. These expansion teams will be be filled with mostly current NHL players. Every team in the league has multiple prospects that are NHL caliber to replace players. The “watered down” statement just really isn’t true.

Operative word here is prospects.

Are you really trying to tell me the NHL is a better league if the Blues lost Buchnevich to an expansion draft and had to play Carbonneau in his place next season?

That's basically what you just argued for above.

I'll go ahead and disagree.

You can disagree, but you would be wrong. You should look into this if you don’t believe us.

The Blues are not better without Buchnevich and with Carbonneau at this juncture. I don't need to look into it. The league isn't better either if you repeat this scenario 30+ times.

Carry on believing that. To just assume the NHL is a better league if teams lose their veterans and call up their prospects is not realistic as a blanket assumption

I’m not giving you my opinion. I’m telling you that this is a known thing that gets debated every time the league expands. The general consensus is that there are so many more people that play high level hockey and the skill level is so much higher than it used to be that the league can expand without a noticeable drop off in talent. That probably wouldn’t be the case if the league were double in size overnight but that’s not the scale we are talking about.

What general consensus. Get on man. I don't mind engaging with you but this is ridiculous.

[clemonsonroots]

Going to end up watering down the league big time.

Already can't find enough quality centers or defenders.

There’s plenty of talent out there. Some guys will get a chance to be full time NHL players..that’s a good thing.
I’m looking forward to the expansion

The talent in the league is going to get diluted. That's what is the inevitable result of team expansion

That statement is said every time they do expansion, yet the league is better is doing better than ever.

It's said because it's true. More AHL level players and SHL, KHL etc...will be in the NHL. That's just reality.

There are plenty of guys that are capable of playing in the NHL that aren’t there yet. These expansion teams will be be filled with mostly current NHL players. Every team in the league has multiple prospects that are NHL caliber to replace players. The “watered down” statement just really isn’t true.

Operative word here is prospects.

Are you really trying to tell me the NHL is a better league if the Blues lost Buchnevich to an expansion draft and had to play Carbonneau in his place next season?

That's basically what you just argued for above.

I'll go ahead and disagree.

You can disagree, but you would be wrong. You should look into this if you don’t believe us.

The Blues are not better without Buchnevich and with Carbonneau at this juncture. I don't need to look into it. The league isn't better either if you repeat this scenario 30+ times.

Carry on believing that. To just assume the NHL is a better league if teams lose their veterans and call up their prospects is not realistic as a blanket assumption

Right now, no...but in a season or two, who knows...Buch is going to be getting into his mid 30s with term.

[TAFKAP]

I'm not a subscriber so I can't read the article, but, what the actual [fork]? How bored is The Athletic staff? There is no 2027 expansion draft. The only group close enough is choosing between Houston or Austin and neither of those cities has an NHL building. Atlanta is still in the planning stages. By the time expansion is announced we may have a roster full of studs, and Buch could be retired.

Houston has a building that could support an NHL team, the Toyota Center where the Rockets play. A team in Austin could play in the arena where the Texas Stars play while an NHL size arena is built. A team in Atlanta could play where the Thrashers used to play while a new arena is built.

Expansion is coming in the next few years, although next year might be pushing it. I'm looking forward to it.

People aren't really getting what I'm saying. I'm not saying I'm for or against it, what I'm saying is that there is no 2027 expansion draft. A 2029 expansion draft would be MONUMENTALLY different looking than a 2027 draft. Under the last expansion rules Mailloux and Snuggerud would not need protection, a 2029 draft they would. That's just off the top of my head.

https://thehockeywriters.com/nhl-expansion-draft-rules/

[BalotelliMassive]

There should be a minor league or college team with incredible support wherever they plan to expand - I just don’t think Atlanta is going to work out.

[clemonsonroots]

There should be a minor league or college team with incredible support wherever they plan to expand - I just don’t think Atlanta is going to work out.

it is insanity that they are considering it. Phoenix also on the list...I mean come on. How many times does it have to fail?

[The Average Gatsby]

Going to end up watering down the league big time.

Already can't find enough quality centers or defenders.

There’s plenty of talent out there. Some guys will get a chance to be full time NHL players..that’s a good thing.
I’m looking forward to the expansion

The talent in the league is going to get diluted. That's what is the inevitable result of team expansion

That statement is said every time they do expansion, yet the league is better is doing better than ever.

It's said because it's true. More AHL level players and SHL, KHL etc...will be in the NHL. That's just reality.

There are plenty of guys that are capable of playing in the NHL that aren’t there yet. These expansion teams will be be filled with mostly current NHL players. Every team in the league has multiple prospects that are NHL caliber to replace players. The “watered down” statement just really isn’t true.

Operative word here is prospects.

Are you really trying to tell me the NHL is a better league if the Blues lost Buchnevich to an expansion draft and had to play Carbonneau in his place next season?

That's basically what you just argued for above.

I'll go ahead and disagree.

You can disagree, but you would be wrong. You should look into this if you don’t believe us.

The Blues are not better without Buchnevich and with Carbonneau at this juncture. I don't need to look into it. The league isn't better either if you repeat this scenario 30+ times.

Carry on believing that. To just assume the NHL is a better league if teams lose their veterans and call up their prospects is not realistic as a blanket assumption

I’m not giving you my opinion. I’m telling you that this is a known thing that gets debated every time the league expands. The general consensus is that there are so many more people that play high level hockey and the skill level is so much higher than it used to be that the league can expand without a noticeable drop off in talent. That probably wouldn’t be the case if the league were double in size overnight but that’s not the scale we are talking about.

What general consensus. Get on man. I don't mind engaging with you but this is ridiculous.

Bud, you’re the only person on this board kvetching about a diluted talent pool. I can’t find any articles from major hockey publications that agree with you. Hell, just go watch a game from 1988 (22 team league) and watch a game now and tell me which game features more talented players.

Here’s Chris Johnston in the athletic from October. It’s just a Q & A but it’s the first question that’s asked.

https://www.nytimes.com/athletic/674395 ... -ios-share