Leahy/Dobbins piggyback.

[ecleme22]

I think they may have promised Leahy a starters roll this season

I’m not opposed to that. But Leahy Can probably start and go a good five, and Dobbins can only go three ish. Reduces the pen by at least two relievers. Every five days.

I use Leahy as most others Libby mcg and May are going six or close to it.

In that scenario, why not just make dobbins a reliever?

He is the reliever by role. He’s an ever five day reliever. Under this scenario, every five days, we could get 7-8 innings pitched, with minimal use of the pen.

Then with Libby and McG and May, you use the pen heavier. Pallante is the five guy/ he gives you what you got.

Get it’s just an idea to use Dobbins effectively and maybe cut down on pen stress in a predictable environment.

What you’re doing though is making the pen less deep the other four days.

Also, who’s to say that Dobbins is the best pitcher when Leahy is lifted? Maybe there are two lefties leading off who crush righties like dobbins?

Well any scenerio could and will happen.

As for the pen, how do you figure? On a normal six man rotation using these six pitchers, we will use 3-5 pitchers per night. 7-9 innings nightly.

The piggy back Hopes to give you eight, with one reliever maybe. This would be an expectation every fifth game.

They will never try this, but it doesn't mean it isn't a good idea. You can continue to develop/stretch both and on days when they are good, the BP gets a day off. A lot of MILB pitchers have pitched in tandem and are used to being the "2nd starter". There have been other times that the Cardinals should have done this, but it is rare that it has lined up so well.

Good write. Yes MiLB is classic for this scenerio. The line up so well notation would be solved if the piggyback was a planned event every fifth game.

Question: who will be the first reliever to come in for Leahy tonight?

Fact is, we don’t know.

Why don’t we know? Because we have no idea what he scenario will be.

So assigning a long reliever for ONE starter removes any in-the-moment strategy.

[sikeston bulldog2]

I think they may have promised Leahy a starters roll this season

I’m not opposed to that. But Leahy Can probably start and go a good five, and Dobbins can only go three ish. Reduces the pen by at least two relievers. Every five days.

I use Leahy as most others Libby mcg and May are going six or close to it.

In that scenario, why not just make dobbins a reliever?

He is the reliever by role. He’s an ever five day reliever. Under this scenario, every five days, we could get 7-8 innings pitched, with minimal use of the pen.

Then with Libby and McG and May, you use the pen heavier. Pallante is the five guy/ he gives you what you got.

Get it’s just an idea to use Dobbins effectively and maybe cut down on pen stress in a predictable environment.

What you’re doing though is making the pen less deep the other four days.

Also, who’s to say that Dobbins is the best pitcher when Leahy is lifted? Maybe there are two lefties leading off who crush righties like dobbins?

Well any scenerio could and will happen.

As for the pen, how do you figure? On a normal six man rotation using these six pitchers, we will use 3-5 pitchers per night. 7-9 innings nightly.

The piggy back Hopes to give you eight, with one reliever maybe. This would be an expectation every fifth game.

They will never try this, but it doesn't mean it isn't a good idea. You can continue to develop/stretch both and on days when they are good, the BP gets a day off. A lot of MILB pitchers have pitched in tandem and are used to being the "2nd starter". There have been other times that the Cardinals should have done this, but it is rare that it has lined up so well.

Good write. Yes MiLB is classic for this scenerio. The line up so well notation would be solved if the piggyback was a planned event every fifth game.

Question: who will be the first reliever to come in for Leahy tonight?

Fact is, we don’t know.

Why don’t we know? Because we have no idea what he scenario will be.

So assigning a long reliever for ONE starter removes any in-the-moment strategy.

I don’t know who will be first reliever. But we know there will be several. Maybe four.

If he knew he was pitching just 4-5 innings, he could tailor his strategy towards those 15 outs. Then Dobbins for three.
Your right. No in the moment decision, unless it’s an absolute blood bath.

[hugeCardfan]

I think they may have promised Leahy a starters roll this season

I’m not opposed to that. But Leahy Can probably start and go a good five, and Dobbins can only go three ish. Reduces the pen by at least two relievers. Every five days.

I use Leahy as most others Libby mcg and May are going six or close to it.

In that scenario, why not just make dobbins a reliever?

He is the reliever by role. He’s an ever five day reliever. Under this scenario, every five days, we could get 7-8 innings pitched, with minimal use of the pen.

Then with Libby and McG and May, you use the pen heavier. Pallante is the five guy/ he gives you what you got.

Get it’s just an idea to use Dobbins effectively and maybe cut down on pen stress in a predictable environment.

What you’re doing though is making the pen less deep the other four days.

Also, who’s to say that Dobbins is the best pitcher when Leahy is lifted? Maybe there are two lefties leading off who crush righties like dobbins?

Well any scenerio could and will happen.

As for the pen, how do you figure? On a normal six man rotation using these six pitchers, we will use 3-5 pitchers per night. 7-9 innings nightly.

The piggy back Hopes to give you eight, with one reliever maybe. This would be an expectation every fifth game.

They will never try this, but it doesn't mean it isn't a good idea. You can continue to develop/stretch both and on days when they are good, the BP gets a day off. A lot of MILB pitchers have pitched in tandem and are used to being the "2nd starter". There have been other times that the Cardinals should have done this, but it is rare that it has lined up so well.

Good write. Yes MiLB is classic for this scenerio. The line up so well notation would be solved if the piggyback was a planned event every fifth game.

Question: who will be the first reliever to come in for Leahy tonight?

Fact is, we don’t know.

Why don’t we know? Because we have no idea what he scenario will be.

So assigning a long reliever for ONE starter removes any in-the-moment strategy.

But, that is the beauty of inserting a starter who is used to applying his entire repetoir of pitches. He will normally face all comers and not need to be brought in conditionally. If there is a big lead or a big deficit, when inserted, then he is mop up; no need for any bullpen usage. If the game is tight, advantage might be, if anyone, only the closer is necessary. Still, he could simply finish the game all things being equal. That is huge for the pen to have a set night off every five days.

If we want to go to a sixth starter, perhaps Matthews could be called into action.

[sikeston bulldog2]

I think they may have promised Leahy a starters roll this season

I’m not opposed to that. But Leahy Can probably start and go a good five, and Dobbins can only go three ish. Reduces the pen by at least two relievers. Every five days.

I use Leahy as most others Libby mcg and May are going six or close to it.

In that scenario, why not just make dobbins a reliever?

He is the reliever by role. He’s an ever five day reliever. Under this scenario, every five days, we could get 7-8 innings pitched, with minimal use of the pen.

Then with Libby and McG and May, you use the pen heavier. Pallante is the five guy/ he gives you what you got.

Get it’s just an idea to use Dobbins effectively and maybe cut down on pen stress in a predictable environment.

What you’re doing though is making the pen less deep the other four days.

Also, who’s to say that Dobbins is the best pitcher when Leahy is lifted? Maybe there are two lefties leading off who crush righties like dobbins?

Well any scenerio could and will happen.

As for the pen, how do you figure? On a normal six man rotation using these six pitchers, we will use 3-5 pitchers per night. 7-9 innings nightly.

The piggy back Hopes to give you eight, with one reliever maybe. This would be an expectation every fifth game.

They will never try this, but it doesn't mean it isn't a good idea. You can continue to develop/stretch both and on days when they are good, the BP gets a day off. A lot of MILB pitchers have pitched in tandem and are used to being the "2nd starter". There have been other times that the Cardinals should have done this, but it is rare that it has lined up so well.

Good write. Yes MiLB is classic for this scenerio. The line up so well notation would be solved if the piggyback was a planned event every fifth game.

Question: who will be the first reliever to come in for Leahy tonight?

Fact is, we don’t know.

Why don’t we know? Because we have no idea what he scenario will be.

So assigning a long reliever for ONE starter removes any in-the-moment strategy.

But, that is the beauty of inserting a starter who is used to applying his entire repetoir of pitches. He will normally face all comers and not need to be brought in conditionally. If there is a big lead or a big deficit, when inserted, then he is mop up; no need for any bullpen usage. If the game is tight, advantage might be, if anyone, only the closer is necessary. Still, he could simply finish the game all things being equal. That is huge for the pen to have a set night off every five days.

If we want to go to a sixth starter, perhaps Matthews could be called into action.

What if it were Pallante /Dobbins. Does that change the narrative.

[ecleme22]

I think they may have promised Leahy a starters roll this season

I’m not opposed to that. But Leahy Can probably start and go a good five, and Dobbins can only go three ish. Reduces the pen by at least two relievers. Every five days.

I use Leahy as most others Libby mcg and May are going six or close to it.

In that scenario, why not just make dobbins a reliever?

He is the reliever by role. He’s an ever five day reliever. Under this scenario, every five days, we could get 7-8 innings pitched, with minimal use of the pen.

Then with Libby and McG and May, you use the pen heavier. Pallante is the five guy/ he gives you what you got.

Get it’s just an idea to use Dobbins effectively and maybe cut down on pen stress in a predictable environment.

What you’re doing though is making the pen less deep the other four days.

Also, who’s to say that Dobbins is the best pitcher when Leahy is lifted? Maybe there are two lefties leading off who crush righties like dobbins?

Well any scenerio could and will happen.

As for the pen, how do you figure? On a normal six man rotation using these six pitchers, we will use 3-5 pitchers per night. 7-9 innings nightly.

The piggy back Hopes to give you eight, with one reliever maybe. This would be an expectation every fifth game.

They will never try this, but it doesn't mean it isn't a good idea. You can continue to develop/stretch both and on days when they are good, the BP gets a day off. A lot of MILB pitchers have pitched in tandem and are used to being the "2nd starter". There have been other times that the Cardinals should have done this, but it is rare that it has lined up so well.

Good write. Yes MiLB is classic for this scenerio. The line up so well notation would be solved if the piggyback was a planned event every fifth game.

Question: who will be the first reliever to come in for Leahy tonight?

Fact is, we don’t know.

Why don’t we know? Because we have no idea what he scenario will be.

So assigning a long reliever for ONE starter removes any in-the-moment strategy.

But, that is the beauty of inserting a starter who is used to applying his entire repetoir of pitches. He will normally face all comers and not need to be brought in conditionally. If there is a big lead or a big deficit, when inserted, then he is mop up; no need for any bullpen usage. If the game is tight, advantage might be, if anyone, only the closer is necessary. Still, he could simply finish the game all things being equal. That is huge for the pen to have a set night off every five days.

If we want to go to a sixth starter, perhaps Matthews could be called into action.

The great thing about a great bullpen is you can put guys in at the right time when the game needs it.

Bulldog's idea is more about this obssession with needing to cover innings for starters who don't throw many quality starts.

If Dobbins, for example, becomes a long reliever, why does he HAVE TO relieve Leahy? As long as he's put into games regularly, the covered innings will take care of themselves. Maybe Libby can't get out of the third, and Dobbins pitches three in relief. FOR LIBBY.

Lastly having a set day off for the bullpen is silly. Once again, it takes strategy out of the game and is just about 'covering innings.' Not winning.

[sikeston bulldog2]

I think they may have promised Leahy a starters roll this season

I’m not opposed to that. But Leahy Can probably start and go a good five, and Dobbins can only go three ish. Reduces the pen by at least two relievers. Every five days.

I use Leahy as most others Libby mcg and May are going six or close to it.

In that scenario, why not just make dobbins a reliever?

He is the reliever by role. He’s an ever five day reliever. Under this scenario, every five days, we could get 7-8 innings pitched, with minimal use of the pen.

Then with Libby and McG and May, you use the pen heavier. Pallante is the five guy/ he gives you what you got.

Get it’s just an idea to use Dobbins effectively and maybe cut down on pen stress in a predictable environment.

What you’re doing though is making the pen less deep the other four days.

Also, who’s to say that Dobbins is the best pitcher when Leahy is lifted? Maybe there are two lefties leading off who crush righties like dobbins?

Well any scenerio could and will happen.

As for the pen, how do you figure? On a normal six man rotation using these six pitchers, we will use 3-5 pitchers per night. 7-9 innings nightly.

The piggy back Hopes to give you eight, with one reliever maybe. This would be an expectation every fifth game.

They will never try this, but it doesn't mean it isn't a good idea. You can continue to develop/stretch both and on days when they are good, the BP gets a day off. A lot of MILB pitchers have pitched in tandem and are used to being the "2nd starter". There have been other times that the Cardinals should have done this, but it is rare that it has lined up so well.

Good write. Yes MiLB is classic for this scenerio. The line up so well notation would be solved if the piggyback was a planned event every fifth game.

Question: who will be the first reliever to come in for Leahy tonight?

Fact is, we don’t know.

Why don’t we know? Because we have no idea what he scenario will be.

So assigning a long reliever for ONE starter removes any in-the-moment strategy.

But, that is the beauty of inserting a starter who is used to applying his entire repetoir of pitches. He will normally face all comers and not need to be brought in conditionally. If there is a big lead or a big deficit, when inserted, then he is mop up; no need for any bullpen usage. If the game is tight, advantage might be, if anyone, only the closer is necessary. Still, he could simply finish the game all things being equal. That is huge for the pen to have a set night off every five days.

If we want to go to a sixth starter, perhaps Matthews could be called into action.

The great thing about a great bullpen is you can put guys in at the right time when the game needs it.

Bulldog's idea is more about this obssession with needing to cover innings for starters who don't throw many quality starts.

If Dobbins, for example, becomes a long reliever, why does he HAVE TO relieve Leahy? As long as he's put into games regularly, the covered innings will take care of themselves. Maybe Libby can't get out of the third, and Dobbins pitches three in relief. FOR LIBBY.

Lastly having a set day off for the bullpen is silly. Once again, it takes strategy out of the game and is just about 'covering innings.' Not winning.

Nice write. The set day off is a result of two pitchers going four innings each. The other four days, the pen is used heavily, from mid sixth thru the ninth.

We are a team heavy in one run games.

[ecleme22]

I think they may have promised Leahy a starters roll this season

I’m not opposed to that. But Leahy Can probably start and go a good five, and Dobbins can only go three ish. Reduces the pen by at least two relievers. Every five days.

I use Leahy as most others Libby mcg and May are going six or close to it.

In that scenario, why not just make dobbins a reliever?

He is the reliever by role. He’s an ever five day reliever. Under this scenario, every five days, we could get 7-8 innings pitched, with minimal use of the pen.

Then with Libby and McG and May, you use the pen heavier. Pallante is the five guy/ he gives you what you got.

Get it’s just an idea to use Dobbins effectively and maybe cut down on pen stress in a predictable environment.

What you’re doing though is making the pen less deep the other four days.

Also, who’s to say that Dobbins is the best pitcher when Leahy is lifted? Maybe there are two lefties leading off who crush righties like dobbins?

Well any scenerio could and will happen.

As for the pen, how do you figure? On a normal six man rotation using these six pitchers, we will use 3-5 pitchers per night. 7-9 innings nightly.

The piggy back Hopes to give you eight, with one reliever maybe. This would be an expectation every fifth game.

They will never try this, but it doesn't mean it isn't a good idea. You can continue to develop/stretch both and on days when they are good, the BP gets a day off. A lot of MILB pitchers have pitched in tandem and are used to being the "2nd starter". There have been other times that the Cardinals should have done this, but it is rare that it has lined up so well.

Good write. Yes MiLB is classic for this scenerio. The line up so well notation would be solved if the piggyback was a planned event every fifth game.

Question: who will be the first reliever to come in for Leahy tonight?

Fact is, we don’t know.

Why don’t we know? Because we have no idea what he scenario will be.

So assigning a long reliever for ONE starter removes any in-the-moment strategy.

But, that is the beauty of inserting a starter who is used to applying his entire repetoir of pitches. He will normally face all comers and not need to be brought in conditionally. If there is a big lead or a big deficit, when inserted, then he is mop up; no need for any bullpen usage. If the game is tight, advantage might be, if anyone, only the closer is necessary. Still, he could simply finish the game all things being equal. That is huge for the pen to have a set night off every five days.

If we want to go to a sixth starter, perhaps Matthews could be called into action.

The great thing about a great bullpen is you can put guys in at the right time when the game needs it.

Bulldog's idea is more about this obssession with needing to cover innings for starters who don't throw many quality starts.

If Dobbins, for example, becomes a long reliever, why does he HAVE TO relieve Leahy? As long as he's put into games regularly, the covered innings will take care of themselves. Maybe Libby can't get out of the third, and Dobbins pitches three in relief. FOR LIBBY.

Lastly having a set day off for the bullpen is silly. Once again, it takes strategy out of the game and is just about 'covering innings.' Not winning.

Nice write. The set day off is a result of two pitchers going four innings each. The other four days, the pen is used heavily, from mid sixth thru the ninth.

We are a team heavy in one run games.

Sometimes, things line up perfectly where a pitcher throws a complete game or a bullpen only needs one arm.

But this is baseball. An entire bullpen (minus one) should never assume the day off.

And as I said, rationale of this weekly day off has nothing to do with winning the game.

[sikeston bulldog2]

I’m not opposed to that. But Leahy Can probably start and go a good five, and Dobbins can only go three ish. Reduces the pen by at least two relievers. Every five days.

I use Leahy as most others Libby mcg and May are going six or close to it.

In that scenario, why not just make dobbins a reliever?

He is the reliever by role. He’s an ever five day reliever. Under this scenario, every five days, we could get 7-8 innings pitched, with minimal use of the pen.

Then with Libby and McG and May, you use the pen heavier. Pallante is the five guy/ he gives you what you got.

Get it’s just an idea to use Dobbins effectively and maybe cut down on pen stress in a predictable environment.

What you’re doing though is making the pen less deep the other four days.

Also, who’s to say that Dobbins is the best pitcher when Leahy is lifted? Maybe there are two lefties leading off who crush righties like dobbins?

Well any scenerio could and will happen.

As for the pen, how do you figure? On a normal six man rotation using these six pitchers, we will use 3-5 pitchers per night. 7-9 innings nightly.

The piggy back Hopes to give you eight, with one reliever maybe. This would be an expectation every fifth game.

They will never try this, but it doesn't mean it isn't a good idea. You can continue to develop/stretch both and on days when they are good, the BP gets a day off. A lot of MILB pitchers have pitched in tandem and are used to being the "2nd starter". There have been other times that the Cardinals should have done this, but it is rare that it has lined up so well.

Good write. Yes MiLB is classic for this scenerio. The line up so well notation would be solved if the piggyback was a planned event every fifth game.

Question: who will be the first reliever to come in for Leahy tonight?

Fact is, we don’t know.

Why don’t we know? Because we have no idea what he scenario will be.

So assigning a long reliever for ONE starter removes any in-the-moment strategy.

But, that is the beauty of inserting a starter who is used to applying his entire repetoir of pitches. He will normally face all comers and not need to be brought in conditionally. If there is a big lead or a big deficit, when inserted, then he is mop up; no need for any bullpen usage. If the game is tight, advantage might be, if anyone, only the closer is necessary. Still, he could simply finish the game all things being equal. That is huge for the pen to have a set night off every five days.

If we want to go to a sixth starter, perhaps Matthews could be called into action.

The great thing about a great bullpen is you can put guys in at the right time when the game needs it.

Bulldog's idea is more about this obssession with needing to cover innings for starters who don't throw many quality starts.

If Dobbins, for example, becomes a long reliever, why does he HAVE TO relieve Leahy? As long as he's put into games regularly, the covered innings will take care of themselves. Maybe Libby can't get out of the third, and Dobbins pitches three in relief. FOR LIBBY.

Lastly having a set day off for the bullpen is silly. Once again, it takes strategy out of the game and is just about 'covering innings.' Not winning.

Nice write. The set day off is a result of two pitchers going four innings each. The other four days, the pen is used heavily, from mid sixth thru the ninth.

We are a team heavy in one run games.

Sometimes, things line up perfectly where a pitcher throws a complete game or a bullpen only needs one arm.

But this is baseball. An entire bullpen (minus one) should never assume the day off.

And as I said, rationale of this weekly day off has nothing to do with winning the game.

And a long starter stint is the every game goal. The longer the better. The relievers are probably set for a normal start games x 3 relievers.

In a piggy back you attempt to regulate the pen more so than a normal game, and that would be great during losing time or dog day games.

[ecleme22]

In that scenario, why not just make dobbins a reliever?

He is the reliever by role. He’s an ever five day reliever. Under this scenario, every five days, we could get 7-8 innings pitched, with minimal use of the pen.

Then with Libby and McG and May, you use the pen heavier. Pallante is the five guy/ he gives you what you got.

Get it’s just an idea to use Dobbins effectively and maybe cut down on pen stress in a predictable environment.

What you’re doing though is making the pen less deep the other four days.

Also, who’s to say that Dobbins is the best pitcher when Leahy is lifted? Maybe there are two lefties leading off who crush righties like dobbins?

Well any scenerio could and will happen.

As for the pen, how do you figure? On a normal six man rotation using these six pitchers, we will use 3-5 pitchers per night. 7-9 innings nightly.

The piggy back Hopes to give you eight, with one reliever maybe. This would be an expectation every fifth game.

They will never try this, but it doesn't mean it isn't a good idea. You can continue to develop/stretch both and on days when they are good, the BP gets a day off. A lot of MILB pitchers have pitched in tandem and are used to being the "2nd starter". There have been other times that the Cardinals should have done this, but it is rare that it has lined up so well.

Good write. Yes MiLB is classic for this scenerio. The line up so well notation would be solved if the piggyback was a planned event every fifth game.

Question: who will be the first reliever to come in for Leahy tonight?

Fact is, we don’t know.

Why don’t we know? Because we have no idea what he scenario will be.

So assigning a long reliever for ONE starter removes any in-the-moment strategy.

But, that is the beauty of inserting a starter who is used to applying his entire repetoir of pitches. He will normally face all comers and not need to be brought in conditionally. If there is a big lead or a big deficit, when inserted, then he is mop up; no need for any bullpen usage. If the game is tight, advantage might be, if anyone, only the closer is necessary. Still, he could simply finish the game all things being equal. That is huge for the pen to have a set night off every five days.

If we want to go to a sixth starter, perhaps Matthews could be called into action.

The great thing about a great bullpen is you can put guys in at the right time when the game needs it.

Bulldog's idea is more about this obssession with needing to cover innings for starters who don't throw many quality starts.

If Dobbins, for example, becomes a long reliever, why does he HAVE TO relieve Leahy? As long as he's put into games regularly, the covered innings will take care of themselves. Maybe Libby can't get out of the third, and Dobbins pitches three in relief. FOR LIBBY.

Lastly having a set day off for the bullpen is silly. Once again, it takes strategy out of the game and is just about 'covering innings.' Not winning.

Nice write. The set day off is a result of two pitchers going four innings each. The other four days, the pen is used heavily, from mid sixth thru the ninth.

We are a team heavy in one run games.

Sometimes, things line up perfectly where a pitcher throws a complete game or a bullpen only needs one arm.

But this is baseball. An entire bullpen (minus one) should never assume the day off.

And as I said, rationale of this weekly day off has nothing to do with winning the game.

And a long starter stint is the every game goal. The longer the better. The relievers are probably set for a normal start games x 3 relievers.

In a piggy back you attempt to regulate the pen more so than a normal game, and that would be great during losing time or dog day games.

The problem is the ‘planning.’

Now if you want to put a long reliever in the pen and look for multi-inning opportunities to deploy him, that’s cool. But to say “well, Leahy can give me about 4 2/3 and then Dobbins for about 4 1/3” every start is not only not reliable, but the goal is no longer winning.

[sikeston bulldog2]

He is the reliever by role. He’s an ever five day reliever. Under this scenario, every five days, we could get 7-8 innings pitched, with minimal use of the pen.

Then with Libby and McG and May, you use the pen heavier. Pallante is the five guy/ he gives you what you got.

Get it’s just an idea to use Dobbins effectively and maybe cut down on pen stress in a predictable environment.

What you’re doing though is making the pen less deep the other four days.

Also, who’s to say that Dobbins is the best pitcher when Leahy is lifted? Maybe there are two lefties leading off who crush righties like dobbins?

Well any scenerio could and will happen.

As for the pen, how do you figure? On a normal six man rotation using these six pitchers, we will use 3-5 pitchers per night. 7-9 innings nightly.

The piggy back Hopes to give you eight, with one reliever maybe. This would be an expectation every fifth game.

They will never try this, but it doesn't mean it isn't a good idea. You can continue to develop/stretch both and on days when they are good, the BP gets a day off. A lot of MILB pitchers have pitched in tandem and are used to being the "2nd starter". There have been other times that the Cardinals should have done this, but it is rare that it has lined up so well.

Good write. Yes MiLB is classic for this scenerio. The line up so well notation would be solved if the piggyback was a planned event every fifth game.

Question: who will be the first reliever to come in for Leahy tonight?

Fact is, we don’t know.

Why don’t we know? Because we have no idea what he scenario will be.

So assigning a long reliever for ONE starter removes any in-the-moment strategy.

But, that is the beauty of inserting a starter who is used to applying his entire repetoir of pitches. He will normally face all comers and not need to be brought in conditionally. If there is a big lead or a big deficit, when inserted, then he is mop up; no need for any bullpen usage. If the game is tight, advantage might be, if anyone, only the closer is necessary. Still, he could simply finish the game all things being equal. That is huge for the pen to have a set night off every five days.

If we want to go to a sixth starter, perhaps Matthews could be called into action.

The great thing about a great bullpen is you can put guys in at the right time when the game needs it.

Bulldog's idea is more about this obssession with needing to cover innings for starters who don't throw many quality starts.

If Dobbins, for example, becomes a long reliever, why does he HAVE TO relieve Leahy? As long as he's put into games regularly, the covered innings will take care of themselves. Maybe Libby can't get out of the third, and Dobbins pitches three in relief. FOR LIBBY.

Lastly having a set day off for the bullpen is silly. Once again, it takes strategy out of the game and is just about 'covering innings.' Not winning.

Nice write. The set day off is a result of two pitchers going four innings each. The other four days, the pen is used heavily, from mid sixth thru the ninth.

We are a team heavy in one run games.

Sometimes, things line up perfectly where a pitcher throws a complete game or a bullpen only needs one arm.

But this is baseball. An entire bullpen (minus one) should never assume the day off.

And as I said, rationale of this weekly day off has nothing to do with winning the game.

And a long starter stint is the every game goal. The longer the better. The relievers are probably set for a normal start games x 3 relievers.

In a piggy back you attempt to regulate the pen more so than a normal game, and that would be great during losing time or dog day games.

The problem is the ‘planning.’

Now if you want to put a long reliever in the pen and look for multi-inning opportunities to deploy him, that’s cool. But to say “well, Leahy can give me about 4 2/3 and then Dobbins for about 4 1/3” every start is not only not reliable, but the goal is no longer winning.

Using Dobbins as a long reliever is exactly that. Just once per five days. That’s the planning.

And Dobbins starts his inning clean. That’s important.

And that’s where my thought gets muddy. If Leahy/Pallante have a bad first four, Dobbins becomes mop up.

As for not trying to win, I’m not following. Of course I’m trying to win.

[ecleme22]

What you’re doing though is making the pen less deep the other four days.

Also, who’s to say that Dobbins is the best pitcher when Leahy is lifted? Maybe there are two lefties leading off who crush righties like dobbins?

Well any scenerio could and will happen.

As for the pen, how do you figure? On a normal six man rotation using these six pitchers, we will use 3-5 pitchers per night. 7-9 innings nightly.

The piggy back Hopes to give you eight, with one reliever maybe. This would be an expectation every fifth game.

They will never try this, but it doesn't mean it isn't a good idea. You can continue to develop/stretch both and on days when they are good, the BP gets a day off. A lot of MILB pitchers have pitched in tandem and are used to being the "2nd starter". There have been other times that the Cardinals should have done this, but it is rare that it has lined up so well.

Good write. Yes MiLB is classic for this scenerio. The line up so well notation would be solved if the piggyback was a planned event every fifth game.

Question: who will be the first reliever to come in for Leahy tonight?

Fact is, we don’t know.

Why don’t we know? Because we have no idea what he scenario will be.

So assigning a long reliever for ONE starter removes any in-the-moment strategy.

But, that is the beauty of inserting a starter who is used to applying his entire repetoir of pitches. He will normally face all comers and not need to be brought in conditionally. If there is a big lead or a big deficit, when inserted, then he is mop up; no need for any bullpen usage. If the game is tight, advantage might be, if anyone, only the closer is necessary. Still, he could simply finish the game all things being equal. That is huge for the pen to have a set night off every five days.

If we want to go to a sixth starter, perhaps Matthews could be called into action.

The great thing about a great bullpen is you can put guys in at the right time when the game needs it.

Bulldog's idea is more about this obssession with needing to cover innings for starters who don't throw many quality starts.

If Dobbins, for example, becomes a long reliever, why does he HAVE TO relieve Leahy? As long as he's put into games regularly, the covered innings will take care of themselves. Maybe Libby can't get out of the third, and Dobbins pitches three in relief. FOR LIBBY.

Lastly having a set day off for the bullpen is silly. Once again, it takes strategy out of the game and is just about 'covering innings.' Not winning.

Nice write. The set day off is a result of two pitchers going four innings each. The other four days, the pen is used heavily, from mid sixth thru the ninth.

We are a team heavy in one run games.

Sometimes, things line up perfectly where a pitcher throws a complete game or a bullpen only needs one arm.

But this is baseball. An entire bullpen (minus one) should never assume the day off.

And as I said, rationale of this weekly day off has nothing to do with winning the game.

And a long starter stint is the every game goal. The longer the better. The relievers are probably set for a normal start games x 3 relievers.

In a piggy back you attempt to regulate the pen more so than a normal game, and that would be great during losing time or dog day games.

The problem is the ‘planning.’

Now if you want to put a long reliever in the pen and look for multi-inning opportunities to deploy him, that’s cool. But to say “well, Leahy can give me about 4 2/3 and then Dobbins for about 4 1/3” every start is not only not reliable, but the goal is no longer winning.

Using Dobbins as a long reliever is exactly that. Just once per five days. That’s the planning.

And Dobbins starts his inning clean. That’s important.

And that’s where my thought gets muddy. If Leahy/Pallante have a bad first four, Dobbins becomes mop up.

As for not trying to win, I’m not following. Of course I’m trying to win.

“Dobbins will only be used to relieve X pitcher, and he will complete the game.”

Is the focus winning the game? Nope.

[sikeston bulldog2]

Well any scenerio could and will happen.

As for the pen, how do you figure? On a normal six man rotation using these six pitchers, we will use 3-5 pitchers per night. 7-9 innings nightly.

The piggy back Hopes to give you eight, with one reliever maybe. This would be an expectation every fifth game.

They will never try this, but it doesn't mean it isn't a good idea. You can continue to develop/stretch both and on days when they are good, the BP gets a day off. A lot of MILB pitchers have pitched in tandem and are used to being the "2nd starter". There have been other times that the Cardinals should have done this, but it is rare that it has lined up so well.

Good write. Yes MiLB is classic for this scenerio. The line up so well notation would be solved if the piggyback was a planned event every fifth game.

Question: who will be the first reliever to come in for Leahy tonight?

Fact is, we don’t know.

Why don’t we know? Because we have no idea what he scenario will be.

So assigning a long reliever for ONE starter removes any in-the-moment strategy.

But, that is the beauty of inserting a starter who is used to applying his entire repetoir of pitches. He will normally face all comers and not need to be brought in conditionally. If there is a big lead or a big deficit, when inserted, then he is mop up; no need for any bullpen usage. If the game is tight, advantage might be, if anyone, only the closer is necessary. Still, he could simply finish the game all things being equal. That is huge for the pen to have a set night off every five days.

If we want to go to a sixth starter, perhaps Matthews could be called into action.

The great thing about a great bullpen is you can put guys in at the right time when the game needs it.

Bulldog's idea is more about this obssession with needing to cover innings for starters who don't throw many quality starts.

If Dobbins, for example, becomes a long reliever, why does he HAVE TO relieve Leahy? As long as he's put into games regularly, the covered innings will take care of themselves. Maybe Libby can't get out of the third, and Dobbins pitches three in relief. FOR LIBBY.

Lastly having a set day off for the bullpen is silly. Once again, it takes strategy out of the game and is just about 'covering innings.' Not winning.

Nice write. The set day off is a result of two pitchers going four innings each. The other four days, the pen is used heavily, from mid sixth thru the ninth.

We are a team heavy in one run games.

Sometimes, things line up perfectly where a pitcher throws a complete game or a bullpen only needs one arm.

But this is baseball. An entire bullpen (minus one) should never assume the day off.

And as I said, rationale of this weekly day off has nothing to do with winning the game.

And a long starter stint is the every game goal. The longer the better. The relievers are probably set for a normal start games x 3 relievers.

In a piggy back you attempt to regulate the pen more so than a normal game, and that would be great during losing time or dog day games.

The problem is the ‘planning.’

Now if you want to put a long reliever in the pen and look for multi-inning opportunities to deploy him, that’s cool. But to say “well, Leahy can give me about 4 2/3 and then Dobbins for about 4 1/3” every start is not only not reliable, but the goal is no longer winning.

Using Dobbins as a long reliever is exactly that. Just once per five days. That’s the planning.

And Dobbins starts his inning clean. That’s important.

And that’s where my thought gets muddy. If Leahy/Pallante have a bad first four, Dobbins becomes mop up.

As for not trying to win, I’m not following. Of course I’m trying to win.

“Dobbins will only be used to relieve X pitcher, and he will complete the game.”

Is the focus winning the game? Nope.

Yes. That’s the plan. Finish the game. Score depending.
On the other hand, and you use several pitchers per game times 5/6 starters. I don’t see that as better.

I think a set in stone PB game would work 2/3 to 3/4 of time.

And we are talking about the 4 or 5 slot in the staff.

[11WSChamps]

With organizations literally obsessed with analytics this would never be sustainable.

The second pitcher in the later innings wouldn't survive the constant mixing and matching.

You'd wind up most games using the same number of pitchers.

[sikeston bulldog2]

With organizations literally obsessed with analytics this would never be sustainable.

The second pitcher in the later innings wouldn't survive the constant mixing and matching.

You'd wind up most games using the same number of pitchers.

Having them work thru innings would be the trick. Giving up a three spot each reliever is six runs, hard to over come. I expect that occasionally.

Otherwise I see a couple runs per pitcher on full throttle for four.

You mention - most games using more pitchers. That’s the point. Not this game if it works.

[ecleme22]

They will never try this, but it doesn't mean it isn't a good idea. You can continue to develop/stretch both and on days when they are good, the BP gets a day off. A lot of MILB pitchers have pitched in tandem and are used to being the "2nd starter". There have been other times that the Cardinals should have done this, but it is rare that it has lined up so well.

Good write. Yes MiLB is classic for this scenerio. The line up so well notation would be solved if the piggyback was a planned event every fifth game.

Question: who will be the first reliever to come in for Leahy tonight?

Fact is, we don’t know.

Why don’t we know? Because we have no idea what he scenario will be.

So assigning a long reliever for ONE starter removes any in-the-moment strategy.

But, that is the beauty of inserting a starter who is used to applying his entire repetoir of pitches. He will normally face all comers and not need to be brought in conditionally. If there is a big lead or a big deficit, when inserted, then he is mop up; no need for any bullpen usage. If the game is tight, advantage might be, if anyone, only the closer is necessary. Still, he could simply finish the game all things being equal. That is huge for the pen to have a set night off every five days.

If we want to go to a sixth starter, perhaps Matthews could be called into action.

The great thing about a great bullpen is you can put guys in at the right time when the game needs it.

Bulldog's idea is more about this obssession with needing to cover innings for starters who don't throw many quality starts.

If Dobbins, for example, becomes a long reliever, why does he HAVE TO relieve Leahy? As long as he's put into games regularly, the covered innings will take care of themselves. Maybe Libby can't get out of the third, and Dobbins pitches three in relief. FOR LIBBY.

Lastly having a set day off for the bullpen is silly. Once again, it takes strategy out of the game and is just about 'covering innings.' Not winning.

Nice write. The set day off is a result of two pitchers going four innings each. The other four days, the pen is used heavily, from mid sixth thru the ninth.

We are a team heavy in one run games.

Sometimes, things line up perfectly where a pitcher throws a complete game or a bullpen only needs one arm.

But this is baseball. An entire bullpen (minus one) should never assume the day off.

And as I said, rationale of this weekly day off has nothing to do with winning the game.

And a long starter stint is the every game goal. The longer the better. The relievers are probably set for a normal start games x 3 relievers.

In a piggy back you attempt to regulate the pen more so than a normal game, and that would be great during losing time or dog day games.

The problem is the ‘planning.’

Now if you want to put a long reliever in the pen and look for multi-inning opportunities to deploy him, that’s cool. But to say “well, Leahy can give me about 4 2/3 and then Dobbins for about 4 1/3” every start is not only not reliable, but the goal is no longer winning.

Using Dobbins as a long reliever is exactly that. Just once per five days. That’s the planning.

And Dobbins starts his inning clean. That’s important.

And that’s where my thought gets muddy. If Leahy/Pallante have a bad first four, Dobbins becomes mop up.

As for not trying to win, I’m not following. Of course I’m trying to win.

“Dobbins will only be used to relieve X pitcher, and he will complete the game.”

Is the focus winning the game? Nope.

Yes. That’s the plan. Finish the game. Score depending.
On the other hand, and you use several pitchers per game times 5/6 starters. I don’t see that as better.

I think a set in stone PB game would work 2/3 to 3/4 of time.

And we are talking about the 4 or 5 slot in the staff.

Cards vs Cubs

Cards leading 3-2, but bases loaded in the 8th for the Cubs.

Tough left handed hitter at the plate who destroys RHP but struggles like crazy vs LHP.

Dobbins is pitching has thrown around 45 pitches.


Your solution is to go ahead a let the bullpen arms shower and go home while dobbins “finishes” the game.


Every other person in the world is bringing in the LH reliever. Because they are trying to win the game.

[sikeston bulldog2]

Good write. Yes MiLB is classic for this scenerio. The line up so well notation would be solved if the piggyback was a planned event every fifth game.

Question: who will be the first reliever to come in for Leahy tonight?

Fact is, we don’t know.

Why don’t we know? Because we have no idea what he scenario will be.

So assigning a long reliever for ONE starter removes any in-the-moment strategy.

But, that is the beauty of inserting a starter who is used to applying his entire repetoir of pitches. He will normally face all comers and not need to be brought in conditionally. If there is a big lead or a big deficit, when inserted, then he is mop up; no need for any bullpen usage. If the game is tight, advantage might be, if anyone, only the closer is necessary. Still, he could simply finish the game all things being equal. That is huge for the pen to have a set night off every five days.

If we want to go to a sixth starter, perhaps Matthews could be called into action.

The great thing about a great bullpen is you can put guys in at the right time when the game needs it.

Bulldog's idea is more about this obssession with needing to cover innings for starters who don't throw many quality starts.

If Dobbins, for example, becomes a long reliever, why does he HAVE TO relieve Leahy? As long as he's put into games regularly, the covered innings will take care of themselves. Maybe Libby can't get out of the third, and Dobbins pitches three in relief. FOR LIBBY.

Lastly having a set day off for the bullpen is silly. Once again, it takes strategy out of the game and is just about 'covering innings.' Not winning.

Nice write. The set day off is a result of two pitchers going four innings each. The other four days, the pen is used heavily, from mid sixth thru the ninth.

We are a team heavy in one run games.

Sometimes, things line up perfectly where a pitcher throws a complete game or a bullpen only needs one arm.

But this is baseball. An entire bullpen (minus one) should never assume the day off.

And as I said, rationale of this weekly day off has nothing to do with winning the game.

And a long starter stint is the every game goal. The longer the better. The relievers are probably set for a normal start games x 3 relievers.

In a piggy back you attempt to regulate the pen more so than a normal game, and that would be great during losing time or dog day games.

The problem is the ‘planning.’

Now if you want to put a long reliever in the pen and look for multi-inning opportunities to deploy him, that’s cool. But to say “well, Leahy can give me about 4 2/3 and then Dobbins for about 4 1/3” every start is not only not reliable, but the goal is no longer winning.

Using Dobbins as a long reliever is exactly that. Just once per five days. That’s the planning.

And Dobbins starts his inning clean. That’s important.

And that’s where my thought gets muddy. If Leahy/Pallante have a bad first four, Dobbins becomes mop up.

As for not trying to win, I’m not following. Of course I’m trying to win.

“Dobbins will only be used to relieve X pitcher, and he will complete the game.”

Is the focus winning the game? Nope.

Yes. That’s the plan. Finish the game. Score depending.
On the other hand, and you use several pitchers per game times 5/6 starters. I don’t see that as better.

I think a set in stone PB game would work 2/3 to 3/4 of time.

And we are talking about the 4 or 5 slot in the staff.

Cards vs Cubs

Cards leading 3-2, but bases loaded in the 8th for the Cubs.

Tough left handed hitter at the plate who destroys RHP but struggles like crazy vs LHP.

Dobbins is pitching has thrown around 45 pitches.


Your solution is to go ahead a let the bullpen arms shower and go home while dobbins “finishes” the game.


Every other person in the world is bringing in the LH reliever. Because they are trying to win the game.

On this occasion i bring in the closer. Four out close.