A strange thought on this current Cardinal team

[spfldan]

Mo ran out for luck with his trades and free agent signings for sure, maybe because he didn't have Tony around for consulations? In any event, the biggest over change I see is that the "toxic culture " is eroding, and being replaced by a positive one. ( Quoted Mel )

[TopofthePerch]

If we decide to operate with facts rather than fiction Mo was an assistant for Walt starting in 95 and had a lot to do with Pujols and Yadi being drafted. So yes this is a business and his time did run out but it is very moronic to insinuate it was purely off of Walt and Tony. The truth doesn't operate on parameters of leaving out context that makes it false. I do however understand this is how fans operate when things aren't going well for a period of time. Definitely the last thing I have to say on the subject.

[TopofthePerch]

It was pointed out on a radio program yesterday that basically this is Mo's team developed from the minors. I thought it was an interesting thought.

The drafting/signing of most players was under MO's watch, no doubt. The 'development' has Bloom's fingerprints all over it.

Dont forget that Bloom was an advisor to Mo for two years and was very influential.

As was Mo to Walt and had a lot to do with Pujols and Yadi being here. Mo had a very good run and then fell very flat. Kind of nothing more to it. He had a smig personality that wasn't very fan friendly also. That factors into a lot of it.

[She didn't know I was a midget]

It was pointed out on a radio program yesterday that basically this is Mo's team developed from the minors. I thought it was an interesting thought.

Why is this team suddenly playing smarter? In almost all aspects of the game. Who did that and what exactly was done?

[Ronnie Dobbs]

It was pointed out on a radio program yesterday that basically this is Mo's team developed from the minors. I thought it was an interesting thought.

I agree with this. I know people want to (bleep) all over Mo, but I believe he was good for this franchise overall. Unfortunately, the last few years left a big stain that is going to be hard for some people to get over. But yea, a lot of these guys are guys that were acquired under his tenure. I think that should count for something.

The problem is, if this was still his team, I'm guessing Arenado would still be here. He might have extended Helsley. We don't trade any of the guys that we did last year. We probably get locked into a medium sized, multi-year contract for a mediocre pitcher. We're probably a team with a good bullpen, bad starting pitching, and hoping to get by offensively.

Not too different from this year, but instead of being a rebuild year, it would be more status quo and not much to look for prospect-wise for the future. I think that's the main difference. We seem to have a plan in mind and are sticking to it, rather than get by with what we have, sneak into the playoffs, and hopefully win a few games.

[Melville]

Mo ran out for luck with his trades and free agent signings for sure, maybe because he didn't have Tony around for consulations? In any event, the biggest over change I see is that the "toxic culture " is eroding, and being replaced by a positive one. ( Quoted Mel )

Correct about the culture change!
(And it is never about me.)

[Melville]

If we decide to operate with facts rather than fiction Mo was an assistant for Walt starting in 95 and had a lot to do with Pujols and Yadi being drafted. So yes this is a business and his time did run out but it is very moronic to insinuate it was purely off of Walt and Tony. The truth doesn't operate on parameters of leaving out context that makes it false. I do however understand this is how fans operate when things aren't going well for a period of time. Definitely the last thing I have to say on the subject.

Let's deal with actual facts.
Pujols was drafted in the 13th round.
Every MLB team - including the Cardinals - passed on him a dozen times.
Super Slo Mo gave zero thought and had zero influence over drafting Pujols.
Happily, he accidentally fell into the Cardinal nest.

[OldRed]

It was pointed out on a radio program yesterday that basically this is Mo's team developed from the minors. I thought it was an interesting thought.

I agree with this. I know people want to (bleep) all over Mo, but I believe he was good for this franchise overall. Unfortunately, the last few years left a big stain that is going to be hard for some people to get over. But yea, a lot of these guys are guys that were acquired under his tenure. I think that should count for something.

The problem is, if this was still his team, I'm guessing Arenado would still be here. He might have extended Helsley. We don't trade any of the guys that we did last year. We probably get locked into a medium sized, multi-year contract for a mediocre pitcher. We're probably a team with a good bullpen, bad starting pitching, and hoping to get by offensively.

Not too different from this year, but instead of being a rebuild year, it would be more status quo and not much to look for prospect-wise for the future. I think that's the main difference. We seem to have a plan in mind and are sticking to it, rather than get by with what we have, sneak into the playoffs, and hopefully win a few games.

He had Arenado traded to Houston and Arenado refused the trade. After last season, Arenado knew he needed a new location. He then accepted a trade. He did let Goldschmidt go the year before and basically that was when the "rebuild" started. The player Mo might have kept was Contreras and it has worked out well that he accepted a trade.

[Ronnie Dobbs]

He had Arenado traded to Houston and Arenado refused the trade. After last season, Arenado knew he needed a new location. He then accepted a trade. He did let Goldschmidt go the year before and basically that was when the "rebuild" started. The player Mo might have kept was Contreras and it has worked out well that he accepted a trade.

You might be right. However, I would note that Arenado and Goldschmidt were both let go AFTER Bloom was brought in as a special advisor. The Arenado trade with Houston was made once plans for a rebuild were set in motion. Who knows what happens if Bloom never gets brought in?

If Mo stays on as POBO I think he keeps all of Arenado, Gray, Contreras, and Donovan. They were all good last year.

[Cranny]

He had Arenado traded to Houston and Arenado refused the trade. After last season, Arenado knew he needed a new location. He then accepted a trade. He did let Goldschmidt go the year before and basically that was when the "rebuild" started. The player Mo might have kept was Contreras and it has worked out well that he accepted a trade.

You might be right. However, I would note that Arenado and Goldschmidt were both let go AFTER Bloom was brought in as a special advisor. The Arenado trade with Houston was made once plans for a rebuild were set in motion. Who knows what happens if Bloom never gets brought in?

If Mo stays on as POBO I think he keeps all of Arenado, Gray, Contreras, and Donovan. They were all good last year.

Mo bashers are dime a dozen guys who put their emotions above the facts.

[OldRed]

He had Arenado traded to Houston and Arenado refused the trade. After last season, Arenado knew he needed a new location. He then accepted a trade. He did let Goldschmidt go the year before and basically that was when the "rebuild" started. The player Mo might have kept was Contreras and it has worked out well that he accepted a trade.

You might be right. However, I would note that Arenado and Goldschmidt were both let go AFTER Bloom was brought in as a special advisor. The Arenado trade with Houston was made once plans for a rebuild were set in motion. Who knows what happens if Bloom never gets brought in?

If Mo stays on as POBO I think he keeps all of Arenado, Gray, Contreras, and Donovan. They were all good last year.

That is all speculation and we don't really know, do we? And back to the original thought on ESPN 101 radio, all the current players were drafted and signed under Mo's tenure. That can't be denied. Also, is there another team in the Majors that can field an entire team of home-grown players?

[OldRed]

He had Arenado traded to Houston and Arenado refused the trade. After last season, Arenado knew he needed a new location. He then accepted a trade. He did let Goldschmidt go the year before and basically that was when the "rebuild" started. The player Mo might have kept was Contreras and it has worked out well that he accepted a trade.

You might be right. However, I would note that Arenado and Goldschmidt were both let go AFTER Bloom was brought in as a special advisor. The Arenado trade with Houston was made once plans for a rebuild were set in motion. Who knows what happens if Bloom never gets brought in?

If Mo stays on as POBO I think he keeps all of Arenado, Gray, Contreras, and Donovan. They were all good last year.

Mo bashers are dime a dozen guys who put their emotions above the facts.

This one is not one I can be included in as a basher of Mo.

[Cranny]

He had Arenado traded to Houston and Arenado refused the trade. After last season, Arenado knew he needed a new location. He then accepted a trade. He did let Goldschmidt go the year before and basically that was when the "rebuild" started. The player Mo might have kept was Contreras and it has worked out well that he accepted a trade.

You might be right. However, I would note that Arenado and Goldschmidt were both let go AFTER Bloom was brought in as a special advisor. The Arenado trade with Houston was made once plans for a rebuild were set in motion. Who knows what happens if Bloom never gets brought in?

If Mo stays on as POBO I think he keeps all of Arenado, Gray, Contreras, and Donovan. They were all good last year.

Facts -

1.) Goldy and Arenado went backward faster than anyone anticipated.
2.) Walker and Gorman went backward instead of forward.
3.) Arms picked up at the deadline all had injuries.

[imetsatchelpaige]

If we decide to operate with facts rather than fiction Mo was an assistant for Walt starting in 95 and had a lot to do with Pujols and Yadi being drafted. So yes this is a business and his time did run out but it is very moronic to insinuate it was purely off of Walt and Tony. The truth doesn't operate on parameters of leaving out context that makes it false. I do however understand this is how fans operate when things aren't going well for a period of time. Definitely the last thing I have to say on the subject.

Uh, no. It was total luck.
You don’t think it was?
Two words: 13th round.

[OldRed]

Again, Mo gets some credit:


https://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/mlb/jo ... 32e8&ei=16

[TopofthePerch]

If we decide to operate with facts rather than fiction Mo was an assistant for Walt starting in 95 and had a lot to do with Pujols and Yadi being drafted. So yes this is a business and his time did run out but it is very moronic to insinuate it was purely off of Walt and Tony. The truth doesn't operate on parameters of leaving out context that makes it false. I do however understand this is how fans operate when things aren't going well for a period of time. Definitely the last thing I have to say on the subject.

Uh, no. It was total luck.
You don’t think it was?
Two words: 13th round.

Yes but anyone else could have picked him in that 13th round before you but they didn't. You still identified the talent and said don't pass on this guy here. So yes every prospect can bust or book but you still made that pick so you some get some credit luck or not. Also Molina in the 8th round. So you identified and picked that player also. Yes you should receive some credit for two iconic players in the same draft that were two of the faces of the franchise.