Pirates ahead of us

[Goldfan]

The hell you mean "no proof"?

You're really gonna dispute that the Cardinals became a NET RECEIVER for revenue sharing for the first time EVER?
You're really gonna dispute the fact that their media / cable deal went up in smoke with the Bally's bankruptcy?
https://www.sportsbusinessjournal.com/A ... irst-time/

The St. Louis Cardinals will “be a receiver” this winter within the current MLB revenue-sharing system for the first time following a full season in at least 25 years and since the advent of the current program, which began in 1996. The team is eligible for a top-six pick in the upcoming MLB Draft Lottery because they “will be classified as a ‘payee.’

Their ticket sales have dropped 30.6% since the 3.2 million sold in 2023.

The Cardinals had to “rework their broadcast-rights deal” a year ago with partner FanDuel Sports Network at a rate reduced by 23%

The Cardinals have a bottom-five market score

Their rights fees were cut, contract shortened, and NOW the new rightsholder is missing payments.

FOH with no proof. Don't be obtuse. That's a choice you're making. I do low-key love the idea that you'd try to position Chicago as a small market for your argument

Yes, the Great Great Great Bankruptcy which reduced BDW annual haul by 17mil to a paltry 58mil……a MIles Mikolas or WC is THE reason payroll must be reduced from 180mil to possibly less than 100mil. Never mind the National Contract that Tripled in 20yrs…..or the cost to go the game that has more than doubled……please focus on the 17mil which has turned The Cardinals into the Pirates…..

If you think it’s only $17MM, I can’t help you. That’s willful ignorance on your part.

“The prior deal, signed in 2015 and running through 2032, was reportedly valued at over $1 billion in total and would have paid the team around $75 million for the 2025 season. The new annual revenue is estimated to be in the $57-58 million range.”
You were speaking of “willful ignorance”…..AI is your friend. This topic was robustly discussed a couple months ago

They don’t HAVE a deal that runs through 2032. They DID.

And this new deal, that is for a shorter duration and less money, is already going sideways.

Neither of those things account for the equity lost, and you’re wanting to pretend it’s zero.

Why do you think it’s zero?

The $17MM decline was the FIRST YEAR alone. But you must get that. Why act like that’s all it is?

Then show the numbers. I posted the latest up to date research. If you have the details for the decline out to ‘32 by all means show it. The storyline the past few years has been exclusively that the local TV contract reduction won’t let poor BDW spend at the 180mil clip. When UP TO NOW, this last season it’s only been a 17mil haircut……which is a Miles. Not a difference from 180>>>>100. As far as ticket sales the loyal and heavy pocketed Cards fans were going through turnstiles at a 3.2-3.5 mil clip UNTIL they FINALLY got tired of the [nonsense] and decided not to support this chitshow. If the strategy is to put a (bleep) product on the field and then claim “no one is buying tickets” well ……good luck with that. A couple stars and winning puts tics back where there were. So again show your math not just YOUR beliefs about the local contract.

[An Old Friend]

The hell you mean "no proof"?

You're really gonna dispute that the Cardinals became a NET RECEIVER for revenue sharing for the first time EVER?
You're really gonna dispute the fact that their media / cable deal went up in smoke with the Bally's bankruptcy?
https://www.sportsbusinessjournal.com/A ... irst-time/

The St. Louis Cardinals will “be a receiver” this winter within the current MLB revenue-sharing system for the first time following a full season in at least 25 years and since the advent of the current program, which began in 1996. The team is eligible for a top-six pick in the upcoming MLB Draft Lottery because they “will be classified as a ‘payee.’

Their ticket sales have dropped 30.6% since the 3.2 million sold in 2023.

The Cardinals had to “rework their broadcast-rights deal” a year ago with partner FanDuel Sports Network at a rate reduced by 23%

The Cardinals have a bottom-five market score

Their rights fees were cut, contract shortened, and NOW the new rightsholder is missing payments.

FOH with no proof. Don't be obtuse. That's a choice you're making. I do low-key love the idea that you'd try to position Chicago as a small market for your argument

Yes, the Great Great Great Bankruptcy which reduced BDW annual haul by 17mil to a paltry 58mil……a MIles Mikolas or WC is THE reason payroll must be reduced from 180mil to possibly less than 100mil. Never mind the National Contract that Tripled in 20yrs…..or the cost to go the game that has more than doubled……please focus on the 17mil which has turned The Cardinals into the Pirates…..

If you think it’s only $17MM, I can’t help you. That’s willful ignorance on your part.

“The prior deal, signed in 2015 and running through 2032, was reportedly valued at over $1 billion in total and would have paid the team around $75 million for the 2025 season. The new annual revenue is estimated to be in the $57-58 million range.”
You were speaking of “willful ignorance”…..AI is your friend. This topic was robustly discussed a couple months ago

They don’t HAVE a deal that runs through 2032. They DID.

And this new deal, that is for a shorter duration and less money, is already going sideways.

Neither of those things account for the equity lost, and you’re wanting to pretend it’s zero.

Why do you think it’s zero?

The $17MM decline was the FIRST YEAR alone. But you must get that. Why act like that’s all it is?

Then show the numbers. I posted the latest up to date research. If you have the details for the decline out to ‘32 by all means show it. The storyline the past few years has been exclusively that the local TV contract reduction won’t let poor BDW spend at the 180mil clip. When UP TO NOW, this last season it’s only been a 17mil haircut……which is a Miles. Not a difference from 180>>>>100. As far as ticket sales the loyal and heavy pocketed Cards fans were going through turnstiles at a 3.2-3.5 mil clip UNTIL they FINALLY got tired of the [nonsense] and decided not to support this chitshow. If the strategy is to put a (bleep) product on the field and then claim “no one is buying tickets” well ……good luck with that. A couple stars and winning puts tics back where there were. So again show your math not just YOUR beliefs about the local contract.

They signed a 15 year $1 billion contract covering 2018-2032 and the Cardinals gained a 30% equity stake in Fox Sports Midwest.

Their first year payment was $50MM in 2018 scaling up year over year to a final year payment of $86MM in 2032.

So we know 2025 was scheduled in that $75MM range. That means 2026-2032 was worth approx $475MM in total revenue that they now have zero certainty over. With them currently sitting as a bottom 5 media market, their rights aren’t worth close to that.

Secondly, Diamond Sports Group filed chapter 11 bankruptcy which effectively wipes out shareholder value. Considering the Cardinals deal alone was more than a billion, it’s safe to assume the worth of the regional sports network to have been higher than that. Even if we conservatively assume the worth at $1.5B, that would mean an equity stake of $450MM for the team that was also wiped out.

These numbers are magnitudes higher than the $17MM you’ve lazily represented.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/christinas ... n-tv-deal/

Let me know how your math differs and what you come up with.

[Goldfan]

The hell you mean "no proof"?

You're really gonna dispute that the Cardinals became a NET RECEIVER for revenue sharing for the first time EVER?
You're really gonna dispute the fact that their media / cable deal went up in smoke with the Bally's bankruptcy?
https://www.sportsbusinessjournal.com/A ... irst-time/

The St. Louis Cardinals will “be a receiver” this winter within the current MLB revenue-sharing system for the first time following a full season in at least 25 years and since the advent of the current program, which began in 1996. The team is eligible for a top-six pick in the upcoming MLB Draft Lottery because they “will be classified as a ‘payee.’

Their ticket sales have dropped 30.6% since the 3.2 million sold in 2023.

The Cardinals had to “rework their broadcast-rights deal” a year ago with partner FanDuel Sports Network at a rate reduced by 23%

The Cardinals have a bottom-five market score

Their rights fees were cut, contract shortened, and NOW the new rightsholder is missing payments.

FOH with no proof. Don't be obtuse. That's a choice you're making. I do low-key love the idea that you'd try to position Chicago as a small market for your argument

Yes, the Great Great Great Bankruptcy which reduced BDW annual haul by 17mil to a paltry 58mil……a MIles Mikolas or WC is THE reason payroll must be reduced from 180mil to possibly less than 100mil. Never mind the National Contract that Tripled in 20yrs…..or the cost to go the game that has more than doubled……please focus on the 17mil which has turned The Cardinals into the Pirates…..

If you think it’s only $17MM, I can’t help you. That’s willful ignorance on your part.

“The prior deal, signed in 2015 and running through 2032, was reportedly valued at over $1 billion in total and would have paid the team around $75 million for the 2025 season. The new annual revenue is estimated to be in the $57-58 million range.”
You were speaking of “willful ignorance”…..AI is your friend. This topic was robustly discussed a couple months ago

They don’t HAVE a deal that runs through 2032. They DID.

And this new deal, that is for a shorter duration and less money, is already going sideways.

Neither of those things account for the equity lost, and you’re wanting to pretend it’s zero.

Why do you think it’s zero?

The $17MM decline was the FIRST YEAR alone. But you must get that. Why act like that’s all it is?

Then show the numbers. I posted the latest up to date research. If you have the details for the decline out to ‘32 by all means show it. The storyline the past few years has been exclusively that the local TV contract reduction won’t let poor BDW spend at the 180mil clip. When UP TO NOW, this last season it’s only been a 17mil haircut……which is a Miles. Not a difference from 180>>>>100. As far as ticket sales the loyal and heavy pocketed Cards fans were going through turnstiles at a 3.2-3.5 mil clip UNTIL they FINALLY got tired of the [nonsense] and decided not to support this chitshow. If the strategy is to put a (bleep) product on the field and then claim “no one is buying tickets” well ……good luck with that. A couple stars and winning puts tics back where there were. So again show your math not just YOUR beliefs about the local contract.

They signed a 15 year $1 billion contract covering 2018-2032 and the Cardinals gained a 30% equity stake in Fox Sports Midwest.

Their first year payment was $50MM in 2018 scaling up year over year to a final year payment of $86MM in 2032.

So we know 2025 was scheduled in that $75MM range. That means 2026-2032 was worth approx $475MM in total revenue that they now have zero certainty over. With them currently sitting as a bottom 5 media market, their rights aren’t worth close to that.

Secondly, Diamond Sports Group filed chapter 11 bankruptcy which effectively wipes out shareholder value. Considering the Cardinals deal alone was more than a billion, it’s safe to assume the worth of the regional sports network to have been higher than that. Even if we conservatively assume the worth at $1.5B, that would mean an equity stake of $450MM for the team that was also wiped out.

These numbers are magnitudes higher than the $17MM you’ve lazily represented.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/christinas ... n-tv-deal/

Let me know how your math differs and what you come up with.

The deal paid out until the bankruptcy and the 17mil is an annual amount to date. So again, to date, this isn’t a significant anticipated shortfall. The CNBC Revenue data through ‘25 was around 390mil if I recall correctly which placed them 12th, which is where they’ve been for MANY years. If you know for certain that BDW equity stake was marked to ZERO and you know for sure what their revenue stream will be thru ‘32 you must really be connected…….

[Goldfan]

The hell you mean "no proof"?

You're really gonna dispute that the Cardinals became a NET RECEIVER for revenue sharing for the first time EVER?
You're really gonna dispute the fact that their media / cable deal went up in smoke with the Bally's bankruptcy?
https://www.sportsbusinessjournal.com/A ... irst-time/

The St. Louis Cardinals will “be a receiver” this winter within the current MLB revenue-sharing system for the first time following a full season in at least 25 years and since the advent of the current program, which began in 1996. The team is eligible for a top-six pick in the upcoming MLB Draft Lottery because they “will be classified as a ‘payee.’

Their ticket sales have dropped 30.6% since the 3.2 million sold in 2023.

The Cardinals had to “rework their broadcast-rights deal” a year ago with partner FanDuel Sports Network at a rate reduced by 23%

The Cardinals have a bottom-five market score

Their rights fees were cut, contract shortened, and NOW the new rightsholder is missing payments.

FOH with no proof. Don't be obtuse. That's a choice you're making. I do low-key love the idea that you'd try to position Chicago as a small market for your argument

Yes, the Great Great Great Bankruptcy which reduced BDW annual haul by 17mil to a paltry 58mil……a MIles Mikolas or WC is THE reason payroll must be reduced from 180mil to possibly less than 100mil. Never mind the National Contract that Tripled in 20yrs…..or the cost to go the game that has more than doubled……please focus on the 17mil which has turned The Cardinals into the Pirates…..

If you think it’s only $17MM, I can’t help you. That’s willful ignorance on your part.

“The prior deal, signed in 2015 and running through 2032, was reportedly valued at over $1 billion in total and would have paid the team around $75 million for the 2025 season. The new annual revenue is estimated to be in the $57-58 million range.”
You were speaking of “willful ignorance”…..AI is your friend. This topic was robustly discussed a couple months ago

They don’t HAVE a deal that runs through 2032. They DID.

And this new deal, that is for a shorter duration and less money, is already going sideways.

Neither of those things account for the equity lost, and you’re wanting to pretend it’s zero.

Why do you think it’s zero?

The $17MM decline was the FIRST YEAR alone. But you must get that. Why act like that’s all it is?

Then show the numbers. I posted the latest up to date research. If you have the details for the decline out to ‘32 by all means show it. The storyline the past few years has been exclusively that the local TV contract reduction won’t let poor BDW spend at the 180mil clip. When UP TO NOW, this last season it’s only been a 17mil haircut……which is a Miles. Not a difference from 180>>>>100. As far as ticket sales the loyal and heavy pocketed Cards fans were going through turnstiles at a 3.2-3.5 mil clip UNTIL they FINALLY got tired of the [nonsense] and decided not to support this chitshow. If the strategy is to put a (bleep) product on the field and then claim “no one is buying tickets” well ……good luck with that. A couple stars and winning puts tics back where there were. So again show your math not just YOUR beliefs about the local contract.

They signed a 15 year $1 billion contract covering 2018-2032 and the Cardinals gained a 30% equity stake in Fox Sports Midwest.

Their first year payment was $50MM in 2018 scaling up year over year to a final year payment of $86MM in 2032.

So we know 2025 was scheduled in that $75MM range. That means 2026-2032 was worth approx $475MM in total revenue that they now have zero certainty over. With them currently sitting as a bottom 5 media market, their rights aren’t worth close to that.

Secondly, Diamond Sports Group filed chapter 11 bankruptcy which effectively wipes out shareholder value. Considering the Cardinals deal alone was more than a billion, it’s safe to assume the worth of the regional sports network to have been higher than that. Even if we conservatively assume the worth at $1.5B, that would mean an equity stake of $450MM for the team that was also wiped out.

These numbers are magnitudes higher than the $17MM you’ve lazily represented.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/christinas ... n-tv-deal/

Let me know how your math differs and what you come up with.

The deal paid out until the bankruptcy and the 17mil is an annual amount to date. So again, to date, this isn’t a significant anticipated shortfall. The CNBC Revenue data through ‘25 was around 390mil if I recall correctly which placed them 12th, which is where they’ve been for MANY years. If you know for certain that BDW equity stake was marked to ZERO and you know for sure what their revenue stream will be thru ‘32 you must really be connected…….

“Joint-Venture Status: The Cardinals' regional sports network (RSN), now known as FanDuel Sports Network Midwest, is a joint venture in which the team holds an approximate 30% ownership stake. Because it is a joint venture, the RSN was not a formal part of the main DSG bankruptcy process, which allowed the Cardinals to maintain more control over their broadcast rights and equity than teams that had a standard broadcast contract.
Renegotiated Deal: While the Cardinals retained their stake, the financial instability forced them to renegotiate their media rights agreement. The new multi-year deal with the post-bankruptcy entity (now called Main Street Sports Group) includes a significant reduction in annual rights fees—reportedly a "haircut" of more than 20% compared to their previous deal.”

So the Cards still control and didn’t lose their equity and have more control over that than before bankruptcy. As indicated they took a hit on the annual local TV payout. As stated ‘25 payout 58mil as opposed to 75mil. The real $$$ crunch is destroying the fanbase that translates to butts in seats. And we know how to fix that……

[Goldfan]

The hell you mean "no proof"?

You're really gonna dispute that the Cardinals became a NET RECEIVER for revenue sharing for the first time EVER?
You're really gonna dispute the fact that their media / cable deal went up in smoke with the Bally's bankruptcy?
https://www.sportsbusinessjournal.com/A ... irst-time/

The St. Louis Cardinals will “be a receiver” this winter within the current MLB revenue-sharing system for the first time following a full season in at least 25 years and since the advent of the current program, which began in 1996. The team is eligible for a top-six pick in the upcoming MLB Draft Lottery because they “will be classified as a ‘payee.’

Their ticket sales have dropped 30.6% since the 3.2 million sold in 2023.

The Cardinals had to “rework their broadcast-rights deal” a year ago with partner FanDuel Sports Network at a rate reduced by 23%

The Cardinals have a bottom-five market score

Their rights fees were cut, contract shortened, and NOW the new rightsholder is missing payments.

FOH with no proof. Don't be obtuse. That's a choice you're making. I do low-key love the idea that you'd try to position Chicago as a small market for your argument

Yes, the Great Great Great Bankruptcy which reduced BDW annual haul by 17mil to a paltry 58mil……a MIles Mikolas or WC is THE reason payroll must be reduced from 180mil to possibly less than 100mil. Never mind the National Contract that Tripled in 20yrs…..or the cost to go the game that has more than doubled……please focus on the 17mil which has turned The Cardinals into the Pirates…..

If you think it’s only $17MM, I can’t help you. That’s willful ignorance on your part.

“The prior deal, signed in 2015 and running through 2032, was reportedly valued at over $1 billion in total and would have paid the team around $75 million for the 2025 season. The new annual revenue is estimated to be in the $57-58 million range.”
You were speaking of “willful ignorance”…..AI is your friend. This topic was robustly discussed a couple months ago

They don’t HAVE a deal that runs through 2032. They DID.

And this new deal, that is for a shorter duration and less money, is already going sideways.

Neither of those things account for the equity lost, and you’re wanting to pretend it’s zero.

Why do you think it’s zero?

The $17MM decline was the FIRST YEAR alone. But you must get that. Why act like that’s all it is?

Then show the numbers. I posted the latest up to date research. If you have the details for the decline out to ‘32 by all means show it. The storyline the past few years has been exclusively that the local TV contract reduction won’t let poor BDW spend at the 180mil clip. When UP TO NOW, this last season it’s only been a 17mil haircut……which is a Miles. Not a difference from 180>>>>100. As far as ticket sales the loyal and heavy pocketed Cards fans were going through turnstiles at a 3.2-3.5 mil clip UNTIL they FINALLY got tired of the [nonsense] and decided not to support this chitshow. If the strategy is to put a (bleep) product on the field and then claim “no one is buying tickets” well ……good luck with that. A couple stars and winning puts tics back where there were. So again show your math not just YOUR beliefs about the local contract.

They signed a 15 year $1 billion contract covering 2018-2032 and the Cardinals gained a 30% equity stake in Fox Sports Midwest.

Their first year payment was $50MM in 2018 scaling up year over year to a final year payment of $86MM in 2032.

So we know 2025 was scheduled in that $75MM range. That means 2026-2032 was worth approx $475MM in total revenue that they now have zero certainty over. With them currently sitting as a bottom 5 media market, their rights aren’t worth close to that.

Secondly, Diamond Sports Group filed chapter 11 bankruptcy which effectively wipes out shareholder value. Considering the Cardinals deal alone was more than a billion, it’s safe to assume the worth of the regional sports network to have been higher than that. Even if we conservatively assume the worth at $1.5B, that would mean an equity stake of $450MM for the team that was also wiped out.

These numbers are magnitudes higher than the $17MM you’ve lazily represented.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/christinas ... n-tv-deal/

Let me know how your math differs and what you come up with.

The deal paid out until the bankruptcy and the 17mil is an annual amount to date. So again, to date, this isn’t a significant anticipated shortfall. The CNBC Revenue data through ‘25 was around 390mil if I recall correctly which placed them 12th, which is where they’ve been for MANY years. If you know for certain that BDW equity stake was marked to ZERO and you know for sure what their revenue stream will be thru ‘32 you must really be connected…….

“Joint-Venture Status: The Cardinals' regional sports network (RSN), now known as FanDuel Sports Network Midwest, is a joint venture in which the team holds an approximate 30% ownership stake. Because it is a joint venture, the RSN was not a formal part of the main DSG bankruptcy process, which allowed the Cardinals to maintain more control over their broadcast rights and equity than teams that had a standard broadcast contract.
Renegotiated Deal: While the Cardinals retained their stake, the financial instability forced them to renegotiate their media rights agreement. The new multi-year deal with the post-bankruptcy entity (now called Main Street Sports Group) includes a significant reduction in annual rights fees—reportedly a "haircut" of more than 20% compared to their previous deal.”

So the Cards still control and didn’t lose their equity and have more control over that than before bankruptcy. As indicated they took a hit on the annual local TV payout. As stated ‘25 payout 58mil as opposed to 75mil. The real $$$ crunch is destroying the fanbase that translates to butts in seats. And we know how to fix that……

In ‘25 the National TV contract paid each team 90-100mil
In ‘25 the Braves local TV contract paid 71mil
In ‘25 the Cards local TV contract paid 58mil

So this great story ONLY the Cardinals have been gravely defeated and mortally wounded to where they can’t pay for a worthy MLB team is 3 kinds of horsechit. Stl has been and will Be in the same ballpark as its Total Revenue Peers. If anyone thinks a MLB payroll that increases every season goes from 180mil to 100mil because its local contract is 13mil below what the Braves bring in and 17mil under the anticipated amount before the Bankruptcy then you gotta be the most naive baseball soul logging in here.

[An Old Friend]

Goldfan creating new math, learning it on the fly, all while pretending the Cardinals didn’t lose any value on their equity in the bankruptcy… is amazing mental gymnastics to watch.

By the way, Main Street Sports Group also looks insolvent (hence the missed rights holder payment) and they are desperately trying to sell a majority stake to London based sports streaming company, DAZN… and if they don’t, they’re likely shutting down. Either way, it puts the 2026 Cards rights in flux, again, and at a more distressed revenue number.

But sure, pretend none of that is happening and that the team magically emerged from that bankruptcy unscathed with their equity position intact… whatever floats your boat.

[Goldfan]

Goldfan creating new math, learning it on the fly, all while pretending the Cardinals didn’t lose any value on their equity in the bankruptcy… is amazing mental gymnastics to watch.

By the way, Main Street Sports Group also looks insolvent (hence the missed rights holder payment) and they are desperately trying to sell a majority stake to London based sports streaming company, DAZN… and if they don’t, they’re likely shutting down. Either way, it puts the 2026 Cards rights in flux, again, and at a more distressed revenue number.

But sure, pretend none of that is happening and that the team magically emerged from that bankruptcy unscathed with their equity position intact… whatever floats your boat.

I simply posted the latest publicly available info and you’re attributing it to me??
I’m also making up that MLB national TV contract pays out 90=100mil to each team and that in ‘25 the Cardinals made a huge 13mil less than the Braves from local TV contract? So what new math am I creating??
I will do a little daydreaming along with you…..I don’t think MLB will let one their Crown Jewels lose their rights contract. Do you think MLB teams are out on their own little financial island? Or are they part of an integrated system reliant on each other

[An Old Friend]

Goldfan creating new math, learning it on the fly, all while pretending the Cardinals didn’t lose any value on their equity in the bankruptcy… is amazing mental gymnastics to watch.

By the way, Main Street Sports Group also looks insolvent (hence the missed rights holder payment) and they are desperately trying to sell a majority stake to London based sports streaming company, DAZN… and if they don’t, they’re likely shutting down. Either way, it puts the 2026 Cards rights in flux, again, and at a more distressed revenue number.

But sure, pretend none of that is happening and that the team magically emerged from that bankruptcy unscathed with their equity position intact… whatever floats your boat.

I simply posted the latest publicly available info and you’re attributing it to me??
I’m also making up that MLB national TV contract pays out 90=100mil to each team and that in ‘25 the Cardinals made a huge 13mil less than the Braves from local TV contract? So what new math am I creating??
I will do a little daydreaming along with you…..I don’t think MLB will let one their Crown Jewels lose their rights contract. Do you think MLB teams are out on their own little financial island? Or are they part of an integrated system reliant on each other

2025 is meaningless considering we’re talking about revenue streams going forward. I don’t know why you’re hyper focused on a year in the past.

[Goldfan]

Goldfan creating new math, learning it on the fly, all while pretending the Cardinals didn’t lose any value on their equity in the bankruptcy… is amazing mental gymnastics to watch.

By the way, Main Street Sports Group also looks insolvent (hence the missed rights holder payment) and they are desperately trying to sell a majority stake to London based sports streaming company, DAZN… and if they don’t, they’re likely shutting down. Either way, it puts the 2026 Cards rights in flux, again, and at a more distressed revenue number.

But sure, pretend none of that is happening and that the team magically emerged from that bankruptcy unscathed with their equity position intact… whatever floats your boat.

I simply posted the latest publicly available info and you’re attributing it to me??
I’m also making up that MLB national TV contract pays out 90=100mil to each team and that in ‘25 the Cardinals made a huge 13mil less than the Braves from local TV contract? So what new math am I creating??
I will do a little daydreaming along with you…..I don’t think MLB will let one their Crown Jewels lose their rights contract. Do you think MLB teams are out on their own little financial island? Or are they part of an integrated system reliant on each other

2025 is meaningless considering we’re talking about revenue streams going forward. I don’t know why you’re hyper focused on a year in the past.

We’ve been hearing for years now that the Cards won’t be receiving their local payouts……and they have…..and you have no idea that they won’t

[Goldfan]

Goldfan creating new math, learning it on the fly, all while pretending the Cardinals didn’t lose any value on their equity in the bankruptcy… is amazing mental gymnastics to watch.

By the way, Main Street Sports Group also looks insolvent (hence the missed rights holder payment) and they are desperately trying to sell a majority stake to London based sports streaming company, DAZN… and if they don’t, they’re likely shutting down. Either way, it puts the 2026 Cards rights in flux, again, and at a more distressed revenue number.

But sure, pretend none of that is happening and that the team magically emerged from that bankruptcy unscathed with their equity position intact… whatever floats your boat.

I simply posted the latest publicly available info and you’re attributing it to me??
I’m also making up that MLB national TV contract pays out 90=100mil to each team and that in ‘25 the Cardinals made a huge 13mil less than the Braves from local TV contract? So what new math am I creating??
I will do a little daydreaming along with you…..I don’t think MLB will let one their Crown Jewels lose their rights contract. Do you think MLB teams are out on their own little financial island? Or are they part of an integrated system reliant on each other

2025 is meaningless considering we’re talking about revenue streams going forward. I don’t know why you’re hyper focused on a year in the past.

Cards local TV Rev
‘23
71mil
‘24
73mil
‘25
58mil

Paid……if you know they won’t be paid going forward please post those details

[ecleme22]

You said there was NO WAY Scott should be on the mlb roster to begin the season no matter how well he did in ST.

Scott did well, and you retreated to the shadows.

Scott did WELL?!?

Low bar, I suppose, to avoid saying you were wrong, and that your made up narrative about Siani was tasteless, petty, and juvenile.

Scott hit .216 with a 72 OPS+ and only 34 SB. It was a bad year for him. You don’t need to pretend it wasn’t. What are you protecting? Your dignity?

Scott did well in ST, Siani did poorly. Scott made the team, and you retreated to the shadows… lol

Another weird saying.

I didn’t go anywhere and posted pretty frequently the first half of the season. I just didn’t engage with your pettiness. You can make up stories, but it doesn’t make them true. It’s been a bad habit of yours for many years.

You stopped posting about Siani as soon as he struggled in ST.

You act like I was some huge Siani advocate and then was ashamed and went into hiding.

It’s some of the dumbest shart you’ve ever made up on this forum.

I get why you’re trying to deflect, though.

Deflect what?

I have no problem continuing our convo how you think the word ‘reset’ means we are turning into The Rays…

Oh so you didn’t bring up some nonsense about Michael Siani to deflect away from your other defenseless position that there’s no proof that Bally’s went bankrupt and the media value of the Cardinals has declined?

Tell me more

Bloom came up through Tampa
Cerfolio came up through Cleveland

What playbook do you think they’re running?

I brought up Siani as an example of how you will defend something for months then, when it looks like you’re wrong, you quietly retreat.

You brought up a story that YOU MADE UP, attributed it to me, then started a thread whining that I wouldn’t engage with your made up story. Everyone ripped you for it, and the mods took it down because it was a debacle.

Now you want to pretend that didn’t happen, and you’re gonna start up again with this juvenile lie?

Just stop, dude.

You’ll do the same with this.

The Cards are going through a much needed rebuild/overhaul/reset.

As a Cards fan, I know this is new to you. But that’s what it is…

They needed an overhaul of their player development system. They needed to get rid of all of Mozeliak’s stink. And they need to reset to a small market model, because that’s what St Louis now is.

None of this is anything like the tanking rebuilds that the Cubs and Astros took on. And no, Chicago isn’t a small market

Goldfan… I get it, I don’t think he has a fundamental understanding of the economics, here.

But you… you’re relentlessly disingenuous and dishonest. I don’t know why you’re that way.

Just because they are overhauling PD doesn’t mean their payroll will never return.

I agree, the Mo stink was bad. Even the Dodgers know to win, you have to make smart decisions in your minors system. PD, evaluation, etc.

So you have smart small markets like Tampa and smart big markets like LAD valuing the same thing.

Bloom knows no matter what, he has to get his house n order. That’s what he’s doing. Something SMART orgs do big and small…

Funny how OldFriend went to sleep on this.

Tampa Bay is doing what Bloom is doing.
The Dodgers are doing what Bloom is doing.

What is he doing? Building a solid minor league system with talent and great player development and player evaluation.

No matter what the Cardinals organization wants to be, there's one thing that they MUST be. And that is an organization that does all the above. It doesn't matter if you are in Tampa, LAD, or anything in between; you have to have a sound minor league system to start.

That's what Bloom is building.

Reading into it as if the Cardinals are going to be a small-market team and will never raise their payroll is just conjecture based on nothing.

Bloom is trying to build what ALL successful orgs, big and small, use.

[An Old Friend]

Goldfan creating new math, learning it on the fly, all while pretending the Cardinals didn’t lose any value on their equity in the bankruptcy… is amazing mental gymnastics to watch.

By the way, Main Street Sports Group also looks insolvent (hence the missed rights holder payment) and they are desperately trying to sell a majority stake to London based sports streaming company, DAZN… and if they don’t, they’re likely shutting down. Either way, it puts the 2026 Cards rights in flux, again, and at a more distressed revenue number.

But sure, pretend none of that is happening and that the team magically emerged from that bankruptcy unscathed with their equity position intact… whatever floats your boat.

I simply posted the latest publicly available info and you’re attributing it to me??
I’m also making up that MLB national TV contract pays out 90=100mil to each team and that in ‘25 the Cardinals made a huge 13mil less than the Braves from local TV contract? So what new math am I creating??
I will do a little daydreaming along with you…..I don’t think MLB will let one their Crown Jewels lose their rights contract. Do you think MLB teams are out on their own little financial island? Or are they part of an integrated system reliant on each other

2025 is meaningless considering we’re talking about revenue streams going forward. I don’t know why you’re hyper focused on a year in the past.

We’ve been hearing for years now that the Cards won’t be receiving their local payouts……and they have…..and you have no idea that they won’t

Last year was the first impacted year and it was short, and now they’re short for 2026 already. The contract was torched.

You’re arguing as if it wasn’t. I think we can stop cause denial isn’t debate. You’re debating and disputing known facts. It’s silliness.

We have all this at our fingertips to verify, and the team’s actions & behaviors are in line with this economic shift. Denying that any of that is actually taking place is pure silliness.

I’m moving on - next topic.

[An Old Friend]

Goldfan creating new math, learning it on the fly, all while pretending the Cardinals didn’t lose any value on their equity in the bankruptcy… is amazing mental gymnastics to watch.

By the way, Main Street Sports Group also looks insolvent (hence the missed rights holder payment) and they are desperately trying to sell a majority stake to London based sports streaming company, DAZN… and if they don’t, they’re likely shutting down. Either way, it puts the 2026 Cards rights in flux, again, and at a more distressed revenue number.

But sure, pretend none of that is happening and that the team magically emerged from that bankruptcy unscathed with their equity position intact… whatever floats your boat.

I simply posted the latest publicly available info and you’re attributing it to me??
I’m also making up that MLB national TV contract pays out 90=100mil to each team and that in ‘25 the Cardinals made a huge 13mil less than the Braves from local TV contract? So what new math am I creating??
I will do a little daydreaming along with you…..I don’t think MLB will let one their Crown Jewels lose their rights contract. Do you think MLB teams are out on their own little financial island? Or are they part of an integrated system reliant on each other

2025 is meaningless considering we’re talking about revenue streams going forward. I don’t know why you’re hyper focused on a year in the past.

Cards local TV Rev
‘23
71mil
‘24
73mil
‘25
58mil

Paid……if you know they won’t be paid going forward please post those details

Like… dude… that’s THE WHOLE F’N POINT! They have no idea what they’re getting going forward. THAT is the uncertainty. Their certain revenue stream that was contracted through 2032 is gone.

How do you not understand this?! Good lord, man.

This is why I made the comment to ecleme earlier that you just lack any semblance of an understanding of the economics. He’s intentionally dishonest. I think you just have no idea what you’re talking about.

[An Old Friend]

Funny how OldFriend went to sleep on this.

Tampa Bay is doing what Bloom is doing.
The Dodgers are doing what Bloom is doing.

What is he doing? Building a solid minor league system with talent and great player development and player evaluation.

No matter what the Cardinals organization wants to be, there's one thing that they MUST be. And that is an organization that does all the above. It doesn't matter if you are in Tampa, LAD, or anything in between; you have to have a sound minor league system to start.

That's what Bloom is building.

Reading into it as if the Cardinals are going to be a small-market team and will never raise their payroll is just conjecture based on nothing.

Bloom is trying to build what ALL successful orgs, big and small, use.

the only funny thing here is that you think that any of the above is up for dispute.

I told you for years they had a player development problem and you disputed it. Now you want to present this as if that’s something I’m missing?

Good stuff.

Next topic. This is stupid.

FWIW, I do find it awfully odd that you disputed the pure existence of the DSG bankruptcy and still never came around to acknowledging it… your whole “no proof” charade

Do you not believe in dinosaurs, either? Haha

[Goldfan]

Goldfan creating new math, learning it on the fly, all while pretending the Cardinals didn’t lose any value on their equity in the bankruptcy… is amazing mental gymnastics to watch.

By the way, Main Street Sports Group also looks insolvent (hence the missed rights holder payment) and they are desperately trying to sell a majority stake to London based sports streaming company, DAZN… and if they don’t, they’re likely shutting down. Either way, it puts the 2026 Cards rights in flux, again, and at a more distressed revenue number.

But sure, pretend none of that is happening and that the team magically emerged from that bankruptcy unscathed with their equity position intact… whatever floats your boat.

I simply posted the latest publicly available info and you’re attributing it to me??
I’m also making up that MLB national TV contract pays out 90=100mil to each team and that in ‘25 the Cardinals made a huge 13mil less than the Braves from local TV contract? So what new math am I creating??
I will do a little daydreaming along with you…..I don’t think MLB will let one their Crown Jewels lose their rights contract. Do you think MLB teams are out on their own little financial island? Or are they part of an integrated system reliant on each other

2025 is meaningless considering we’re talking about revenue streams going forward. I don’t know why you’re hyper focused on a year in the past.

Cards local TV Rev
‘23
71mil
‘24
73mil
‘25
58mil

Paid……if you know they won’t be paid going forward please post those details

Like… dude… that’s THE WHOLE F’N POINT! They have no idea what they’re getting going forward. THAT is the uncertainty. Their certain revenue stream that was contracted through 2032 is gone.

How do you not understand this?! Good lord, man.

This is why I made the comment to ecleme earlier that you just lack any semblance of an understanding of the economics. He’s intentionally dishonest. I think you just have no idea what you’re talking about.

So you’re moving forward like the number will be 0…..does that seem remotely realistic? If you have the ‘26,’27,’28 local TV revenue number please post.

[Goldfan]

Goldfan creating new math, learning it on the fly, all while pretending the Cardinals didn’t lose any value on their equity in the bankruptcy… is amazing mental gymnastics to watch.

By the way, Main Street Sports Group also looks insolvent (hence the missed rights holder payment) and they are desperately trying to sell a majority stake to London based sports streaming company, DAZN… and if they don’t, they’re likely shutting down. Either way, it puts the 2026 Cards rights in flux, again, and at a more distressed revenue number.

But sure, pretend none of that is happening and that the team magically emerged from that bankruptcy unscathed with their equity position intact… whatever floats your boat.

I simply posted the latest publicly available info and you’re attributing it to me??
I’m also making up that MLB national TV contract pays out 90=100mil to each team and that in ‘25 the Cardinals made a huge 13mil less than the Braves from local TV contract? So what new math am I creating??
I will do a little daydreaming along with you…..I don’t think MLB will let one their Crown Jewels lose their rights contract. Do you think MLB teams are out on their own little financial island? Or are they part of an integrated system reliant on each other

2025 is meaningless considering we’re talking about revenue streams going forward. I don’t know why you’re hyper focused on a year in the past.

Cards local TV Rev
‘23
71mil
‘24
73mil
‘25
58mil

Paid……if you know they won’t be paid going forward please post those details

Like… dude… that’s THE WHOLE F’N POINT! They have no idea what they’re getting going forward. THAT is the uncertainty. Their certain revenue stream that was contracted through 2032 is gone.

How do you not understand this?! Good lord, man.

This is why I made the comment to ecleme earlier that you just lack any semblance of an understanding of the economics. He’s intentionally dishonest. I think you just have no idea what you’re talking about.

So you’re moving forward like the number will be 0…..does that seem remotely realistic? If you have the ‘26,’27,’28 local TV revenue number please post.

“The Cardinals may have to take the route that clubs like the Mariners, Padres, Rockies, Twins, Guardians, and Diamondbacks have and fold into the MLB's media group, or perhaps another bidder will see an opportunity here and swoop in to acquire the Cardinals' television and streaming rights for the near future. The future of MLB's regional sports network strategy and overall media packages will be a major topic in the upcoming collective bargaining agreement.”
The last sentence sure is interesting…….