rockondlouie wrote: ↑25 Nov 2025 13:46 pm
Say's Clark has as much talent as any pitcher in the minor leagues, just has to be developed.
Knows he's far away from his ceiling but he could be elite if we can get him there
That is 100% what they need. They desperately need to have and develop guys who can be All-Star level impact players.
He also said all the guys were in the room when the trade was made, both off field (Strength & Conditioning, diet, ect...) and on field coaches.
TTE
(Total Team Effort)
I think that's huge Rock. Team effort. People do a better job when they feel they are part of and can make a difference. Mo had become a dictator. I can't imagine what it was like being one of his subjects. Heck, I bet Bloom even admits when a move or signing doesn't pan out. I believe poor public relations has played a big role in the overall decline of the organization. That's on DeWitt as well. Make Bloom your front man and keep the Bills away from the microphone.
Me too 2n
Already shows, unlike Mo who I agree seemed to operate like a dictator, that Bloom values input from all his people.
Differing views usually lead to a better decision, I love he's doing this.
rockondlouie wrote: ↑25 Nov 2025 13:46 pm
Say's Clark has as much talent as any pitcher in the minor leagues, just has to be developed.
Knows he's far away from his ceiling but he could be elite if we can get him there
As Bloom stated, he has that grade 70 slider (Grade 70 is a plus plus rating on the scouts scale ) .
He has ability that cannot be taught is correct. His issues thus far has been health and command. He had those blisters so pitching guys need to work with him on ways to eliminate that . Command is also something that coaches can hope to deveiop. What you cannot teach is to throw that wipeout slide the way he does.
Will he become top shelf remains to be seen but the type talent you take a shot on for if he develops , you have a true gem.
Classis big payroll vs medium/low payroll trade. We are hoping the player will develop. They add to a contending team. I suspect the key is the money saved which will be spent on a starting pitcher.
Gray didn’t fit the 3-5 year rebuild plan but neither does Contreras or Arenado. Once one is gone I expect all 3 moves and things to be really hard to watch this year. Isn’t this want last year was supposed to be? Still going backwards.
That would be the best scenario assuming we can find trade partners. I wouldn't expect much for Arenado. Contreras a little more but remember even as a catcher on the Cardinals were willing to pay that much. He has value but not as much at 1B.
The problem with them is they are B grade players. Nice to have if you have 3 superstars. The cardinals have been trying to promote them as elite. Same problem the rest of roster. Missing the 3 superstars. To develop them it will take 5 plus seasons.
We don't have a future HOF player but Donovan is top 5 at second base. If they move him Bloom had better get a lot more than he got for Gray.
He’s a solid player without much speed and without much power he’s not going to score a lot of runs or drive in a lot of runs and he isn’t worth signing for 70+million for the cardinals. They should absolutely trade him but I don’t overvalue him enough to think they are going to get a massive haul for him
The difference with a potential Donovan deal than with recent deals the Cardinals have had to make is that it appears, via multiple sources, that Donovan has a good deal of teams including contenders and\or big markets interested. If Bloom is a shrewd negotiator he should be able to get multiple teams bidding against each other and get a return which should exceed Donovan's actual value.
What does exceeding his actual value means?
SG had actual value as a #2 ish SP. That has a very high demand. The Cardinals had to erase the highly backed loaded contract then received a return related to a SP.
What is Donovan? There is a limit to that value wise.
It gets increase some by his lower pay and some by having multiple teams but still there is limit due to an option B existing. We don't usually over pay for a Subaru. No insult intended.
You guys might not be that far apart in your expectations. After all a haul is subjective. I see no harm in upgrading Donovan if needed to upgrade his return by adding a piece. IMO, you may want to enhance the best trade chip in attempt for impact player potential.
I think these Trade Values are a close cousin to MR. WAR……..the 2 we received COULD never help a ML team going forward(injury history, unproven) and Gray could be a very productive 1.5-2 ML SP and help the Sox win a WS….what’s the value then?? What the $$$ value on that?? Doubt that real world on the field performance factors in to these “Trade Value” formulas….
- and the 'tank crowd' will make up for us right?