Team leadership/team identity

[sneptsmoustache]

Seems like there's a bit of an evolution going on right now on which younger players are growing into secondary leadership role on the team, and that's part of the reason why the team is "still trying to find its identity".

And when I say "leadership" in this sense, I think of "primary leadership" as the guys who:
A) command a ton of respect in the room, via their NHL resume and/or they way they carry themselves;
B) command respect by their play on the ice;
C) are mature enough to go talk to the coaches, talk to Steen, even go talk to Army, have a couple beers and talk about what needs to be done; and then
D) carry all of that back to locker room and say "listen up fellas here's what's going on".

It feels to me like the "Primary leadership" is led by Schenn and Fowler (based on listening to them talk); then the secondary leadership would be 55, Faulk, Thomas, Sunny, and Binner.

I have no idea what goes on in the locker room, but it seems to me that Thomas and Parayko are not true "leaders" like Schenn and Fowler--too quiet. Faulk and Sunny are probably totally fine in that role and I suspect Binner leads by example and by the respect that he's gained, but he's not the super vocal guy in the locker room. And I don't think Kyrou is ever going to be that guy either--I don't think he wants to be, and I don't think he's capable of it. My guess is Faksa was an important part of that last year, maybe Leddy too, so there's a huge hole there.

So you have Sunny and Faulk, but they're in the late innings of their career with declining play. And then you have guys like Neighbors, Broberg, Holloway, now Snuggerud, maybe Dvorsky...guys that are going to be around for a while, and are capable of commanding respect with their play. Among them, it seems like Neighbors is closest, then Holloway and Snuggy, not sure if Broberg or Dvo will ever get there (seem quiet, but what do I know).

At any rate it feels like we're in this transitional phase...that secondary group (Faulk, 55, 18, and 70) are all "old guard" and could use an infusion of young leadership. And that's still in the process of sorting itself out, I suspect those younger guys are still finding their voice and/or are being deferential to the current leadership group that's been around for years.

So it feels like we're kind of an air pocket right now as the team identity establishes itself and the broader leadership team coalesces. Hopefully what I'm saying makes sense (it makes sense in my head haha), I think it will sort itself out over the course of the season but my concern is it doesn't happen in time for us to make the playoffs.

[theograce]

Neighbours basically has the keys to the arena. He’s in with the big boys and cool guys. They love him to bits.

[Mr.Snuggleupagus]

Too many airheads on this team; Parayko, Buchnevich, Thomas, Kyrou, Mailloux

Those are the main culprits, and 4 of them are supposed to be "leaders" and 3 are paid 8 or more million a season.

[DawgDad]

Too many airheads on this team; Parayko, Buchnevich, Thomas, Kyrou, Mailloux

Those are the main culprits, and 4 of them are supposed to be "leaders" and 3 are paid 8 or more million a season.

Tell me, Great Swami, what is Thomas doing to extend this losing streak? The Blues DESPERATELY need him back in the lineup.

[Mr.Snuggleupagus]

Too many airheads on this team; Parayko, Buchnevich, Thomas, Kyrou, Mailloux

Those are the main culprits, and 4 of them are supposed to be "leaders" and 3 are paid 8 or more million a season.

Tell me, Great Swami, what is Thomas doing to extend this losing streak? The Blues DESPERATELY need him back in the lineup.

He wouldn't have helped anyway, he's a nonchalant Spicoli airhead.

[a smell of green grass]

Too many airheads on this team; Parayko, Buchnevich, Thomas, Kyrou, Mailloux

Those are the main culprits, and 4 of them are supposed to be "leaders" and 3 are paid 8 or more million a season.

When the Blues saw that they could win without Parayko, Thomas, Buchnevich and Kyrou late last year and in the playoffs, they should have traded all of them away.

This is especially true because Armstrong noticed on Feb 1 that our best players who have been here the longest are not making a difference.

Thomas, Buchnevich, and Kyrou being duds is old news at this point.

[Mr.Snuggleupagus]

Too many airheads on this team; Parayko, Buchnevich, Thomas, Kyrou, Mailloux

Those are the main culprits, and 4 of them are supposed to be "leaders" and 3 are paid 8 or more million a season.

When the Blues saw that they could win without Parayko, Thomas, Buchnevich and Kyrou late last year and in the playoffs, they should have traded all of them away.

This is especially true because Armstrong noticed on Feb 1 that our best players who have been here the longest are not making a difference.

Thomas, Buchnevich, and Kyrou being duds is old news at this point.

Parayko is an airhead I can live with (Thomas most of the time too), the others not so much.

[DawgDad]

Too many airheads on this team; Parayko, Buchnevich, Thomas, Kyrou, Mailloux

Those are the main culprits, and 4 of them are supposed to be "leaders" and 3 are paid 8 or more million a season.

When the Blues saw that they could win without Parayko, Thomas, Buchnevich and Kyrou late last year and in the playoffs, they should have traded all of them away.

This is especially true because Armstrong noticed on Feb 1 that our best players who have been here the longest are not making a difference.

Thomas, Buchnevich, and Kyrou being duds is old news at this point.

The Blues last season had enough talent and depth performing well enough to cover for Parayko and the others, EXCEPT Thomas. The roster as constructed had no "next man up" capable of compensating for the loss of Thomas. He is the most irreplaceable player on the team right now, though there is an argument for Binner too.

What you failed to post is all those best players pulled together and performed very well, leading the team to a record winning streak and a playoff appearance.

Now, they've reverted. The frustration is we AND they know it's in them to play better individually and collectively. What I will add is until Thomas returns healthy (or is replaced) this team is unlikely to win with any consistency. The hole at 1C is too big to scheme around.

For all the Thomas detractors he played at a 90-point pace last season. Count the 90-point players in the league. Take him away, that playmaking and his plus defense can't be coveted for with the players on-hand.

[Harry York 37]

Too many airheads on this team; Parayko, Buchnevich, Thomas, Kyrou, Mailloux

Those are the main culprits, and 4 of them are supposed to be "leaders" and 3 are paid 8 or more million a season.

When the Blues saw that they could win without Parayko, Thomas, Buchnevich and Kyrou late last year and in the playoffs, they should have traded all of them away.

This is especially true because Armstrong noticed on Feb 1 that our best players who have been here the longest are not making a difference.

Thomas, Buchnevich, and Kyrou being duds is old news at this point.

The Blues last season had enough talent and depth performing well enough to cover for Parayko and the others, EXCEPT Thomas. The roster as constructed had no "next man up" capable of compensating for the loss of Thomas. He is the most irreplaceable player on the team right now, though there is an argument for Binner too.

What you failed to post is all those best players pulled together and performed very well, leading the team to a record winning streak and a playoff appearance.

Now, they've reverted. The frustration is we AND they know it's in them to play better individually and collectively. What I will add is until Thomas returns healthy (or is replaced) this team is unlikely to win with any consistency. The hole at 1C is too big to scheme around.

For all the Thomas detractors he played at a 90-point pace last season. Count the 90-point players in the league. Take him away, that playmaking and his plus defense can't be coveted for with the players on-hand.

Parayko, Thomas, Buchnevich, and even young Mailloux play with heart.
Kyrou does not.
No one will give Doug what he wants for him.
To take less might be admitting that Berube was right to dress his indolent and careless (donkey) down in public.
Almost two years ago.

[HighStick]

This team is full of beta b*tches. They need a couple Alphas. It's been like this for years. ROR and Maroon were our last Alphas. If we trade away Parayko, Thomas, Buch and Kyrou they lose in every one of those trades. It'll be the Bolduc/Mailloux situation 4 times over.
And how long does the next team get to win the Cup before they have to trade them too?

[Younghopp1991]

This team is full of beta b*tches. They need a couple Alphas. It's been like this for years. ROR and Maroon were our last Alphas. If we trade away Parayko, Thomas, Buch and Kyrou they lose in every one of those trades. It'll be the Bolduc/Mailloux situation 4 times over.
And how long does the next team get to win the Cup before they have to trade them too?

I get what you are saying, but at least our latest prospect crop seem to be in the gamer mold. Dvo, snugg, carbs and more.

[Blues Dave]

Seems like there's a bit of an evolution going on right now on which younger players are growing into secondary leadership role on the team, and that's part of the reason why the team is "still trying to find its identity".

And when I say "leadership" in this sense, I think of "primary leadership" as the guys who:
A) command a ton of respect in the room, via their NHL resume and/or they way they carry themselves;
B) command respect by their play on the ice;
C) are mature enough to go talk to the coaches, talk to Steen, even go talk to Army, have a couple beers and talk about what needs to be done; and then
D) carry all of that back to locker room and say "listen up fellas here's what's going on".

It feels to me like the "Primary leadership" is led by Schenn and Fowler (based on listening to them talk); then the secondary leadership would be 55, Faulk, Thomas, Sunny, and Binner.

I have no idea what goes on in the locker room, but it seems to me that Thomas and Parayko are not true "leaders" like Schenn and Fowler--too quiet. Faulk and Sunny are probably totally fine in that role and I suspect Binner leads by example and by the respect that he's gained, but he's not the super vocal guy in the locker room. And I don't think Kyrou is ever going to be that guy either--I don't think he wants to be, and I don't think he's capable of it. My guess is Faksa was an important part of that last year, maybe Leddy too, so there's a huge hole there.

So you have Sunny and Faulk, but they're in the late innings of their career with declining play. And then you have guys like Neighbors, Broberg, Holloway, now Snuggerud, maybe Dvorsky...guys that are going to be around for a while, and are capable of commanding respect with their play. Among them, it seems like Neighbors is closest, then Holloway and Snuggy, not sure if Broberg or Dvo will ever get there (seem quiet, but what do I know).

At any rate it feels like we're in this transitional phase...that secondary group (Faulk, 55, 18, and 70) are all "old guard" and could use an infusion of young leadership. And that's still in the process of sorting itself out, I suspect those younger guys are still finding their voice and/or are being deferential to the current leadership group that's been around for years.

So it feels like we're kind of an air pocket right now as the team identity establishes itself and the broader leadership team coalesces. Hopefully what I'm saying makes sense (it makes sense in my head haha), I think it will sort itself out over the course of the season but my concern is it doesn't happen in time for us to make the playoffs.

Well said, but I don't know if it will be carried further along in this thread.

[Old_Goat]

Seems like there's a bit of an evolution going on right now on which younger players are growing into secondary leadership role on the team, and that's part of the reason why the team is "still trying to find its identity".

And when I say "leadership" in this sense, I think of "primary leadership" as the guys who:
A) command a ton of respect in the room, via their NHL resume and/or they way they carry themselves;
B) command respect by their play on the ice;
C) are mature enough to go talk to the coaches, talk to Steen, even go talk to Army, have a couple beers and talk about what needs to be done; and then
D) carry all of that back to locker room and say "listen up fellas here's what's going on".

It feels to me like the "Primary leadership" is led by Schenn and Fowler (based on listening to them talk); then the secondary leadership would be 55, Faulk, Thomas, Sunny, and Binner.

I have no idea what goes on in the locker room, but it seems to me that Thomas and Parayko are not true "leaders" like Schenn and Fowler--too quiet. Faulk and Sunny are probably totally fine in that role and I suspect Binner leads by example and by the respect that he's gained, but he's not the super vocal guy in the locker room. And I don't think Kyrou is ever going to be that guy either--I don't think he wants to be, and I don't think he's capable of it. My guess is Faksa was an important part of that last year, maybe Leddy too, so there's a huge hole there.

So you have Sunny and Faulk, but they're in the late innings of their career with declining play. And then you have guys like Neighbors, Broberg, Holloway, now Snuggerud, maybe Dvorsky...guys that are going to be around for a while, and are capable of commanding respect with their play. Among them, it seems like Neighbors is closest, then Holloway and Snuggy, not sure if Broberg or Dvo will ever get there (seem quiet, but what do I know).

At any rate it feels like we're in this transitional phase...that secondary group (Faulk, 55, 18, and 70) are all "old guard" and could use an infusion of young leadership. And that's still in the process of sorting itself out, I suspect those younger guys are still finding their voice and/or are being deferential to the current leadership group that's been around for years.

So it feels like we're kind of an air pocket right now as the team identity establishes itself and the broader leadership team coalesces. Hopefully what I'm saying makes sense (it makes sense in my head haha), I think it will sort itself out over the course of the season but my concern is it doesn't happen in time for us to make the playoffs.

Well said, but I don't know if it will be carried further along in this thread.

What and how would you describe a great leader?

[Blues Dave]

Seems like there's a bit of an evolution going on right now on which younger players are growing into secondary leadership role on the team, and that's part of the reason why the team is "still trying to find its identity".

And when I say "leadership" in this sense, I think of "primary leadership" as the guys who:
A) command a ton of respect in the room, via their NHL resume and/or they way they carry themselves;
B) command respect by their play on the ice;
C) are mature enough to go talk to the coaches, talk to Steen, even go talk to Army, have a couple beers and talk about what needs to be done; and then
D) carry all of that back to locker room and say "listen up fellas here's what's going on".

It feels to me like the "Primary leadership" is led by Schenn and Fowler (based on listening to them talk); then the secondary leadership would be 55, Faulk, Thomas, Sunny, and Binner.

I have no idea what goes on in the locker room, but it seems to me that Thomas and Parayko are not true "leaders" like Schenn and Fowler--too quiet. Faulk and Sunny are probably totally fine in that role and I suspect Binner leads by example and by the respect that he's gained, but he's not the super vocal guy in the locker room. And I don't think Kyrou is ever going to be that guy either--I don't think he wants to be, and I don't think he's capable of it. My guess is Faksa was an important part of that last year, maybe Leddy too, so there's a huge hole there.

So you have Sunny and Faulk, but they're in the late innings of their career with declining play. And then you have guys like Neighbors, Broberg, Holloway, now Snuggerud, maybe Dvorsky...guys that are going to be around for a while, and are capable of commanding respect with their play. Among them, it seems like Neighbors is closest, then Holloway and Snuggy, not sure if Broberg or Dvo will ever get there (seem quiet, but what do I know).

At any rate it feels like we're in this transitional phase...that secondary group (Faulk, 55, 18, and 70) are all "old guard" and could use an infusion of young leadership. And that's still in the process of sorting itself out, I suspect those younger guys are still finding their voice and/or are being deferential to the current leadership group that's been around for years.

So it feels like we're kind of an air pocket right now as the team identity establishes itself and the broader leadership team coalesces. Hopefully what I'm saying makes sense (it makes sense in my head haha), I think it will sort itself out over the course of the season but my concern is it doesn't happen in time for us to make the playoffs.

Well said, but I don't know if it will be carried further along in this thread.

What and how would you describe a great leader?

Seems like there's a bit of an evolution going on right now on which younger players are growing into secondary leadership role on the team, and that's part of the reason why the team is "still trying to find its identity".

And when I say "leadership" in this sense, I think of "primary leadership" as the guys who:
A) command a ton of respect in the room, via their NHL resume and/or they way they carry themselves;
B) command respect by their play on the ice;
C) are mature enough to go talk to the coaches, talk to Steen, even go talk to Army, have a couple beers and talk about what needs to be done; and then
D) carry all of that back to locker room and say "listen up fellas here's what's going on".

It feels to me like the "Primary leadership" is led by Schenn and Fowler (based on listening to them talk); then the secondary leadership would be 55, Faulk, Thomas, Sunny, and Binner.

I have no idea what goes on in the locker room, but it seems to me that Thomas and Parayko are not true "leaders" like Schenn and Fowler--too quiet. Faulk and Sunny are probably totally fine in that role and I suspect Binner leads by example and by the respect that he's gained, but he's not the super vocal guy in the locker room. And I don't think Kyrou is ever going to be that guy either--I don't think he wants to be, and I don't think he's capable of it. My guess is Faksa was an important part of that last year, maybe Leddy too, so there's a huge hole there.

So you have Sunny and Faulk, but they're in the late innings of their career with declining play. And then you have guys like Neighbors, Broberg, Holloway, now Snuggerud, maybe Dvorsky...guys that are going to be around for a while, and are capable of commanding respect with their play. Among them, it seems like Neighbors is closest, then Holloway and Snuggy, not sure if Broberg or Dvo will ever get there (seem quiet, but what do I know).

At any rate it feels like we're in this transitional phase...that secondary group (Faulk, 55, 18, and 70) are all "old guard" and could use an infusion of young leadership. And that's still in the process of sorting itself out, I suspect those younger guys are still finding their voice and/or are being deferential to the current leadership group that's been around for years.

So it feels like we're kind of an air pocket right now as the team identity establishes itself and the broader leadership team coalesces. Hopefully what I'm saying makes sense (it makes sense in my head haha), I think it will sort itself out over the course of the season but my concern is it doesn't happen in time for us to make the playoffs.

Well said, but I don't know if it will be carried further along in this thread.

What and how would you describe a great leader?

I hope you're not mad at me. I'm just an old gummer who liked the post. But in general that's a tough question to answer. There were a lot of folks mentioned even in the post I liked.

[Harry S Deals]

Too many airheads on this team; Parayko, Buchnevich, Thomas, Kyrou, Mailloux

Those are the main culprits, and 4 of them are supposed to be "leaders" and 3 are paid 8 or more million a season.

Tell me, Great Swami, what is Thomas doing to extend this losing streak? The Blues DESPERATELY need him back in the lineup.

Forget Mailloux/Bolduc that trade was meant for the future, Bolduc 100% does not change the narrative or trajectory in STL right now. Im taking Dvorsky, Snuggerud and Neighbours every single day over Bolduc and those guy made Bolduc expendable. Its been said 1000x lets check back on the Mailloux trade after hes played a 100 games or so. To do so now is dumb