Bloom says "* Must be elite in drafting & acquiring talent"

[Melville]

Doesn't matter who was in charge. Judging an entire draft as good or bad after a little more than 2 months is kind of silly.

Indeed.

Judging the actual drafting process is sort of silly. All teams rank the same draftees for the most part. Reality is it is sort of a mechanical process especially in the early rounds.

The real rub comes from how players are developed after they are drafted. Too early still to judge in many cases but you have to have doubts on how this organization develops players.

Correct.
Development matters more than draft position and selections.
A little luck with pitchers' health doesn't hurt.

[Cranny]

Doesn't matter who was in charge. Judging an entire draft as good or bad after a little more than 2 months is kind of silly.

Indeed.

There will be posters judging Bloom after 1 offseason as POBO before spring training starts. I'm sure of it.

Exactly.

[Melville]

Doesn't matter who was in charge. Judging an entire draft as good or bad after a little more than 2 months is kind of silly.

Indeed.

Judging the actual drafting process is sort of silly. All teams rank the same draftees for the most part. Reality is it is sort of a mechanical process especially in the early rounds.

The real rub comes from how players are developed after they are drafted. Too early still to judge in many cases but you have to have doubts on how this organization develops players.

That's what the conversation needs to be. For instance, I'm positive they completely failed Walker. Is it too late to send him back to AAA and spend a year in a program designed for him to succeed instead of one that's designed for his launch angle to be what they think it should be?

Walker is but one of many.
Reality is, in the modern game, a lot of players are rushed to maximize years of control and minimize payroll cost.
MLB staffs are expected to put the finishing touches on development - and the Cardinal MLB staff is about the worst I have ever seen.

[Cranny]

Doesn't matter who was in charge. Judging an entire draft as good or bad after a little more than 2 months is kind of silly.

Indeed.

Judging the actual drafting process is sort of silly. All teams rank the same draftees for the most part. Reality is it is sort of a mechanical process especially in the early rounds.

The real rub comes from how players are developed after they are drafted. Too early still to judge in many cases but you have to have doubts on how this organization develops players.

That's what the conversation needs to be. For instance, I'm positive they completely failed Walker. Is it too late to send him back to AAA and spend a year in a program designed for him to succeed instead of one that's designed for his launch angle to be what they think it should be?

Walker is but one of many.
Reality is, in the modern game, a lot of players are rushed to maximize years of control and minimize payroll cost.
MLB staffs are expected to put the finishing touches on development - and the Cardinal MLB staff is about the worst I have ever seen.

Reasonable opinion, Melville.

[rockondlouie]

Doesn't matter who was in charge. Judging an entire draft as good or bad after a little more than 2 months is kind of silly.

Indeed.

There will be posters judging Bloom after 1 offseason as POBO before spring training starts. I'm sure of it.

Exactly.

And they'd be showing what idiots they are since the man isn't a miracle worker.

The minor system was a total mess, he's been working for two years to upgrade it.

Mo left him a major league roster that's unbalanced and lacking in talent, it will take a couple years to fix that mess too.

It will be multiple years before the fruits of his labors begin to "bloom".

[craviduce]

How should rounds 2-5 in 2024 and 2025 looked differently if he had been in charge?

Brian Holiday (80) RHP R-R 5-11 203 Oklahoma State University Tampa, Fla. - no minor league stats on BBR ( is he permanently injured?)
Ryan Campos (109) C L-R 5-9 190 Arizona State University Mesa, Ariz. - 22 yo - .696 OPS at A+. Pretty far behind JJW progress wise.
Braden Davis (142) LHP L-L 5-11 175 University of Oklahoma Keller, Texas - 22 yo - 2.85 ERA and 150Ks, good for a pitcher at A/A+ but I wonder how he projects at MLB level at only 5-11?

Ryan Mitchell, OF no stats?
Tanner Franklin, RHP, career reliever 1.50 WHIP in SSS
Jack Gurevitch,1B 21yo 1 HR, .556 OPS at A
Cade Crossland, LHP no stats
Ethan Young, RHP - 21 yo, no stats, reliever in college

Is this what Elite should look like, or might Bloom have changed some of these picks if it were up to him? If so, who might he have taken instead?

And did he run the 2025 draft as "GM" or will next year be his first time to own the eliteness of the draft?

75 walks to go with those 150 K's....control problems hampered his possible innings total.

He's a reliever at best right now.

---------

and the 2024 draft...there wasn't any particular skill with drafting Wetherholt...its him, Cags, or Kurtz....Wetherholt fell to us. After Montgomery's season ending injury, and Flores' not wanting to draft HS prospects Griffin or Rainer (which in hindsight was DUMB, b/c Griffin is #1 overall prospect now), the pick was just 1 player...whichever player was left at #7: Kurtz, Cags or Wetherholt.

And the rest of the draft was nearly an abomination...extremely short, control type pitchers, and even shorter batters who can take a walk. The one player who bucked the "short trend" was Deniel Ortiz...good find in the 16th round. JonJon Gazdar is probably the best hitter of the draft...we'll see how AA and AA treat him.

Campos was probably the worst pick of the draft...only drafted b/c he could get his 5'8" frame low to the ground behind the plate and get the low strike. He championed Peoria to one of the worst Team ERA's in Advanced A ball.

Yes, it's too early to judge a draft like 2024 and 2025...but there's a real trend that formed after 2018..."Flores and scouting crew are pretty bad at this"

And don't get me started on 2023...thankfully, Mathews and Henderson might help bail out that disaster of draft.... Chase Davis is endanger of falling out of our Top 30 prospect list...Top 25 is a no go for him for sure.

[Ronnie Dobbs]

Yes, it's too early to judge a draft like 2024 and 2025...but there's a real trend that formed after 2018..."Flores and scouting crew are pretty bad at this"

Man, I’ve been wondering about this myself. Maybe a bit less harsh, but I’m much less up on the draft and minors stuff than you are. But I’ve wondered for awhile how it is that Flores gets this reputation for being so good at the draft and it’s the developmental system that is ruining these great picks. I mean, I guess that could be the case, but it’s just strange how a lot of people, including media, kind of treat it as gospel that he’s great at this.

What great success has he had? Okay, sure, if Wetherholt is called up and breaks out next year, great pick, but only a complete buffoon would have not taken him there. And maybe Mo put a lot of control over the draft and his guys overruled a lot of the Flores guys when it came to making the actual picks, or set parameters on the types of players for the, to scout? I don’t know. I’ll say that 2025 looked awfully different than many of his other drafts and the only difference was Bloom was in charge rather than Mo.

But yea. Flores has been around a long time now, but what has been his big success?

[renostl]

Yes, it's too early to judge a draft like 2024 and 2025...but there's a real trend that formed after 2018..."Flores and scouting crew are pretty bad at this"

Man, I’ve been wondering about this myself. Maybe a bit less harsh, but I’m much less up on the draft and minors stuff than you are. But I’ve wondered for awhile how it is that Flores gets this reputation for being so good at the draft and it’s the developmental system that is ruining these great picks. I mean, I guess that could be the case, but it’s just strange how a lot of people, including media, kind of treat it as gospel that he’s great at this.

What great success has he had? Okay, sure, if Wetherholt is called up and breaks out next year, great pick, but only a complete buffoon would have not taken him there. And maybe Mo put a lot of control over the draft and his guys overruled a lot of the Flores guys when it came to making the actual picks, or set parameters on the types of players for the, to scout? I don’t know. I’ll say that 2025 looked awfully different than many of his other drafts and the only difference was Bloom was in charge rather than Mo.

But yea. Flores has been around a long time now, but what has been his big success?

Just info, not at all an excuse either way.
Baseball fails are common, which is probably why Bloom said that they need to be elite.

https://sabr.org/journal/article/the-ch ... ive-study/

[Ronnie Dobbs]

Just info, not at all an excuse either way.
Baseball fails are common, which is probably why Bloom said that they need to be elite.

https://sabr.org/journal/article/the-ch ... ive-study/

Yea, absolutely, but I guess that's been part of the frustration with Flores or Mo or whoever had been driving the draft picks in the Flores era up to 2024, with basically 2020 being the exception.

You aim for a bunch of low ceiling, high floor guys, but even the high floor guys bust out. So you bust out on a few high floor early draft picks and maybe a few of the low ceiling guys work out and you end up with Michael McGreevy being the best starter you've developed in years. They've taken guys like Gorman, but when those guys are few and far between, I guess the point still remains.

[Hoosier59]

Unless Bloom can be a real MOB and lead the rotation I don't see him making a difference with this ownership group still here.

Just some food for thought…..

It could be that DeWitt, who didn’t really want to fire his friend Mo, decided he wasn’t going to allow him to waste anymore of his money either! The timing of it with MO’s contract ending, the collective bargaining agreement coming up, and with several players not playing up to their supposed abilities, DeWitt just decided to hold off on spending for a couple seasons, let the young guys sink or swim and then give Bloom the reins to spend on shoring up the holes. I tend to think this could be the case, instead of Bill just all the sudden going cheap, and caring anymore! I’m saying this is the case, but it could be!

[Cranny]

Just info, not at all an excuse either way.
Baseball fails are common, which is probably why Bloom said that they need to be elite.

https://sabr.org/journal/article/the-ch ... ive-study/

Yea, absolutely, but I guess that's been part of the frustration with Flores or Mo or whoever had been driving the draft picks in the Flores era up to 2024, with basically 2020 being the exception.

You aim for a bunch of low ceiling, high floor guys, but even the high floor guys bust out. So you bust out on a few high floor early draft picks and maybe a few of the low ceiling guys work out and you end up with Michael McGreevy being the best starter you've developed in years. They've taken guys like Gorman, but when those guys are few and far between, I guess the point still remains.

RD - I believe that the first 5 draft picks each year were drafted about where they were predicted to be drafted. Sometimes you just get unlucky.

[craviduce]

I'm intrigued a lot by Tanner Franklin. He has really good stuff. And if he becomes an elite closer, I can live with that. I think that was the thought with his selection. Push him as a starter, see if all his pitches play as a starter, if they don't you know he will/can as a reliever.

[Cranny]

Unless Bloom can be a real MOB and lead the rotation I don't see him making a difference with this ownership group still here.

That’s a real downer.

[craviduce]

Just info, not at all an excuse either way.
Baseball fails are common, which is probably why Bloom said that they need to be elite.

https://sabr.org/journal/article/the-ch ... ive-study/

Yea, absolutely, but I guess that's been part of the frustration with Flores or Mo or whoever had been driving the draft picks in the Flores era up to 2024, with basically 2020 being the exception.

You aim for a bunch of low ceiling, high floor guys, but even the high floor guys bust out. So you bust out on a few high floor early draft picks and maybe a few of the low ceiling guys work out and you end up with Michael McGreevy being the best starter you've developed in years. They've taken guys like Gorman, but when those guys are few and far between, I guess the point still remains.

RD - I believe that the first 5 draft picks each year were drafted about where they were predicted to be drafted. Sometimes you just get unlucky.

no they weren't...2024 was a perfect example. Campos and Holiday specifically. Horrible reaches. The org could've/should've done a lot better. 2023, selecting an oft hurt Honeyman on a prayer? Another poor selection outside of where he would've/should've gone. The org could've/should've done better.

Blanket statements without proper research, Cranny.

[craviduce]

And let's not forget the 35th ranked Hjerpe was selected by the Cards at 22nd...Flores listened to NW Scouting director....Flores has ALWAYS been easily swayed....huge mistake

Bottom line, the Cards MUST deploy a better game plan and scouting plan going forward...wasting picks are bad talent is an oft occurrence and we're currently paying for it.

saving grace is possibly the 2022 draft...VS2 and Crooks have made the show, that's a plus...they need to start hitting. Hansen and Mautz need to shine in AAA now.

[WLTFE]

Unless Bloom can be a real MOB and lead the rotation I don't see him making a difference with this ownership group still here.

The only thing that really matters...Does he have a beautiful family!