Ozziesfan41 wrote: ↑27 Sep 2025 19:20 pm
I don’t know why people are in an uproar over either decision . They were both smart baseball moves. The cubs had a four run lead smart to try to tack on more there as evidenced by the tying run coming up in the ninth. Oli was smart for walking him because the game was still within reach as evidenced by the tying run coming up in the ninth. But I guess people need to be outraged about anything even smart baseball
As others have already pointed out, you are correct!
+1000
It was the correct baseball move BY FAR!
Let me get this straight?
Oli should PITCH to the red hot LH hitter(RH pitcher on the mound) so he can get a shot at the Cycle????
Red...if Oli pitches to Busch and he drives in ANOTHER run you wouldn’t be calling Oli “gutless”
but “moronic” instead!
I’m not an Oli fan but this is a ridiculous thread!
Especially if he drives in the run then church pulls off a miracle grand slam in the ninth and they lose by that 1 run then they would be hating on oli because he gave the game away to try to give a cub the chance at a cycle. I hate the cubs but they made a smart move stealing third trying and to tack on a run. I’m not a big oli fan but he made the smart decision walking him because 4 runs is definitely within reach. I also disagree it was the gutless move I think it would have been gutless to pitch to him and say well we aren’t eliminated we might as well pitch to him give him a chance for the cycle. Screw that i want a manager
Managing to win no matter if they are 20 games out 20 games in first or tied.
Exactly!
RH pitcher
LH red hot hitter
Pitches around him to get to a RH hitter and more favorable matchup!
STRIKES THE HITTER OUT!
I hope we find a better Manager than Oli but this thread is ridiculous over the top Oli hating!
2 HR, double, and triple (sort of).
13 total bases.
4 RBI.
And STL should pitch to him with yet another runner in scoring position??
You do understand that Marmol does not manage the Cubs, don't you?
2 HR, double, and triple (sort of).
13 total bases.
4 RBI.
And STL should pitch to him with yet another runner in scoring position??
You do understand that Marmol does not manage the Cubs, don't you?
Gutless decision ? Cmon now ... As a Cardinal fan, how many times was Albert Pujols walked intentionally when the Cardinals had a few run leas and the other team didn't want the Cards to score any more runs. Barry Bonds too.. just because the cycle was in play , so what .. it's trying to win the game for cardinals is the key .. As Melville said , Marmol manages for the Cardinals .. he is not managing to please the Cub fans possibly get more runs.
PS and what if Marmol had pitched to Busch with the pitcher throwing low outside pitches and he would have walked that way. The fans would have still booed . Would the complaint then be .. well he was going for the cycle , the Cards pitcher should have tried to get him out on pitches right down the gut of the strike zone ? What a crazy argument
Last edited by ramfandan on 27 Sep 2025 23:49 pm, edited 2 times in total.
I see I'm in the minority, but the game meant nothing win or lose. If it had meant something to win, I would have to agree.
I have to say, the Cubs have some power hitters on that team.
Example:
1952- Musial Pitches to One Batter; Also Wins 3rd Batting Title in Row
One oddity to the season happens in the finale on Sept. 28 as Stan Musial makes his only major league pitching performance. He faces Frankie Baumholtz of the Cubs and he reaches on an error by third baseman Solly Hemus.
Musial is replaced by the starting pitcher, Harvey Haddix who had moved to the outfield for one batter. Musial gets one hit in three at bats and wins his third consecutive batting title with a .336 average by keeping Baumholtz from getting a hit.
Ted Williams' last game of the 1941 season was on September 28, where he played both games against the Philadelphia Athletics. He finished the season with a .406 batting average, going 6-for-8 in the final day's games. This performance solidified his legacy as the last Major League player to hit .400 for a full season. Williams' dedication to hitting .400 and his remarkable last day at the plate are celebrated as milestones in baseball history.
Worth noting Busch already had 4 PA's before the IBB.
Fact is, he had a chance for the cycle and didn't get it done.
STL did not deny him the opportunity.
He had his own chance - and failed.
That failure is on him, not the Cardinals.
Heck, at that point they had already gifted him with a "triple" when Walker generously added 2 bases to a base hit.
Further, Busch did not need a 2nd HR to complete the cycle - so he could have chosen to hit a single in the 5th inning instead
(Seriously, how difficult would that have been?)
That's on him.
When all factors are considered, it is clear that Busch alone is responsible for not hitting for the cycle.
Easy.
Obvious.
Correct.
I am with OldRed on this one. We are at the end of a meaningless season. The Cardinals should have tried to get him out by pitching to him. They shouldn't have taken the bat out of his hands.
Well, it wasn't a meaningless post, and I wasn't looking for attention. The story made the New York Times and many other Major Newspapers across the country.
Well Red, when the forum poster known as "Northsider 76" (an obvious small bear fan) has no problem with Oli's move, you know it would have been stupid to pitch to Busch.
12xu wrote: ↑28 Sep 2025 09:41 am
Well Red, when the forum poster known as "Northsider 76" (an obvious small bear fan) has no problem with Oli's move, you know it would have been stupid to pitch to Busch.
You pitch to him and get him out. End of logic and story.
