This team makes the playoffs with a decent CF and RF

[CrownRoyalCaramel]

I honestly believe VS2 and Walker drug this team down so bad, they have to be worth 4-5 more wins without those two and their ridiculous lack of hitting ability. I mean, how can you have 2 guys in your lineup all the time with a less than .600 OBPS? Don’t care what WAR says, it just doesn’t make sense. You replace those 2 with some league average bats with a tad bit of pop and this team makes it into the playoffs.

[Talkin' Baseball]

I honestly believe VS2 and Walker drug this team down so bad, they have to be worth 4-5 more wins without those two and their ridiculous lack of hitting ability. I mean, how can you have 2 guys in your lineup all the time with a less than .600 OBPS? Don’t care what WAR says, it just doesn’t make sense. You replace those 2 with some league average bats with a tad bit of pop and this team makes it into the playoffs.

The problem includes them, but is broader than them. You can't have a lineup with them that also includes Pages, Gorman, and in most cases Nootbaar. That is over half the lineup where very little is happening. Or, 60% of a starting rotation made up of Fedde, Mikolas, and Pallante. And yet in spite of all of this, they are only eliminated from the playoffs with 3 games left in the season. Improvement at the margins from any or all of these guys would be big.

[The Nard]

Pitching - or the lack thereof - was much more of a factor. And even if they squeezed into a WC spot, they would not have gone far.

[stormtime]

I honestly believe VS2 and Walker drug this team down so bad, they have to be worth 4-5 more wins without those two and their ridiculous lack of hitting ability. I mean, how can you have 2 guys in your lineup all the time with a less than .600 OBPS? Don’t care what WAR says, it just doesn’t make sense. You replace those 2 with some league average bats with a tad bit of pop and this team makes it into the playoffs.

Personally, I have little interest in a "playoff" team that gets swept out of the first round yet again. I'd rather have better draft picks for 20 rounds. I realize anything can happen in the post season but I really don't care about David vs Goliath anymore.....only the original story is still good.

[MrPostman01]

Gallen and maybe Flaherty.

[Ronnie Dobbs]

Okay....and then what? You have a barely over .500 team with barely any pitching that is fighting for the last wildcard spot and likely gets booted out right of the playoffs. That's what people have been giving Mo (bleep) about for the last 5+ years.

This team is at a point where they need to do something different. They were at that point in 2023, but they convinced themselves that they could do exactly what you are suggesting they do in 2024 and look where it got them.

The good news is that they do have a pretty decent core of young players, with some more coming up in the next few years. 2026 probably looks a lot like 2023, but 2027 could get interesting. And we should pressure the front office to open up the purse if there is an opportunity that makes sense for this team, because a lot of money is coming off the books.

But no more of this hang around and see what happens (bleep).

[Banner29]

This team was like 3-283738291929233829 in games started by Mikolas Fedde and Pallante

Walker and Winn sucked but were far from the main problem and even if they were some sort of help to get us to the playoffs we would have gotten b**ch slapped right out of it with such a pathetic excuse for a rotation.

[blackinkbiz]

This team was like 3-283738291929233829 in games started by Mikolas Fedde and Pallante

Walker and Winn sucked but were far from the main problem and even if they were some sort of help to get us to the playoffs we would have gotten b**ch slapped right out of it with such a pathetic excuse for a rotation.

Yep, all you had to do was DFA Fedde a month sooner and bring up McG. Then, send Pallante to the pen and allow spot starts by Leahy, not trading Matz, and perhaps Pallante, hoping that with more rest he'd return closer to his ~4era form. All you'd need is replacement-level performance and you're looking at a MINIMUM 5 game swing. But there's no way Walker should have been given enough rope to hang himself with. Again, all you need is replacement level from his position and you're looking at a minimum 7-game swing with those 3 moves.

Baffling, though not surprising considering tooslowMO was still in charge.

[Carp4Cy]

I honestly believe VS2 and Walker drug this team down so bad, they have to be worth 4-5 more wins without those two and their ridiculous lack of hitting ability. I mean, how can you have 2 guys in your lineup all the time with a less than .600 OBPS? Don’t care what WAR says, it just doesn’t make sense. You replace those 2 with some league average bats with a tad bit of pop and this team makes it into the playoffs.

The problem includes them, but is broader than them. You can't have a lineup with them that also includes Pages, Gorman, and in most cases Nootbaar. That is over half the lineup where very little is happening. Or, 60% of a starting rotation made up of Fedde, Mikolas, and Pallante. And yet in spite of all of this, they are only eliminated from the playoffs with 3 games left in the season. Improvement at the margins from any or all of these guys would be big.

He's talking about the currently constructed team where Fedde is already gone and McGreevy is throwing darts. Or at least getting by and winning.
So yeah we already have that improvement at one margin. And Mikolas has been a lot better this month fwiw. Replace 2/3 of the outfield with offensive competency and I think we rather easily make up those 3 games. Replace Pallante with a true solid pitcher and we get closer to 90 wins.

[Carp4Cy]

This team was like 3-283738291929233829 in games started by Mikolas Fedde and Pallante

Walker and Winn sucked but were far from the main problem and even if they were some sort of help to get us to the playoffs we would have gotten b**ch slapped right out of it with such a pathetic excuse for a rotation.

Mikolas is actually close to .500. Positive WAR. OK for a #5 on a 80 something win team. But not good enough for our #3, and those other 2 were worse than zeroes.

[alw80]

I honestly believe VS2 and Walker drug this team down so bad, they have to be worth 4-5 more wins without those two and their ridiculous lack of hitting ability. I mean, how can you have 2 guys in your lineup all the time with a less than .600 OBPS? Don’t care what WAR says, it just doesn’t make sense. You replace those 2 with some league average bats with a tad bit of pop and this team makes it into the playoffs.

This guy is pumped for the 2025-26 Chicago Bulls.

[bccardsfan]

This team was like 3-283738291929233829 in games started by Mikolas Fedde and Pallante

Walker and Winn sucked but were far from the main problem and even if they were some sort of help to get us to the playoffs we would have gotten b**ch slapped right out of it with such a pathetic excuse for a rotation.

Yep, all you had to do was DFA Fedde a month sooner and bring up McG. Then, send Pallante to the pen and allow spot starts by Leahy, not trading Matz, and perhaps Pallante, hoping that with more rest he'd return closer to his ~4era form. All you'd need is replacement-level performance and you're looking at a MINIMUM 5 game swing. But there's no way Walker should have been given enough rope to hang himself with. Again, all you need is replacement level from his position and you're looking at a minimum 7-game swing with those 3 moves.

Baffling, though not surprising considering tooslowMO was still in charge.

Agreed, but everything would have to work, and be managed properly by the alleged manager and pitching coaches we refuse to replace. The problem is we have NO corner OFer who is a consistent bat, and most importantly, NO starting pitching depth at all. We better hope Doyle is on the fast track and he at least has the ability to become a #2 SP. The winter meetings will be interesting. If Bloom gets Nado and Gray to waive their NTCs there may be some dumping. Of course ownership would have either eat some salary or take on bad contracts in return (which obviously you don't want to do). If this team digs up one good corner OFer AND 2 or 3 SPs they can compete. The minor league system may produce some pitching, but not for next season without some trades. I will be very interested to see what happens in Dec-Jan. Either ownership gives Bloom the resources to do something or we are living with Gray and Nado and little pitching. JW and probably Gorman need to go to AAA and figure it out, or be dealt. If they knock the cover off the ball in ST they can break camp with the team. No more of the same old same old. Time for some moves. Maybe we will actually see some....

[Carp4Cy]

This team was like 3-283738291929233829 in games started by Mikolas Fedde and Pallante

Walker and Winn sucked but were far from the main problem and even if they were some sort of help to get us to the playoffs we would have gotten b**ch slapped right out of it with such a pathetic excuse for a rotation.

Yep, all you had to do was DFA Fedde a month sooner and bring up McG. Then, send Pallante to the pen and allow spot starts by Leahy, not trading Matz, and perhaps Pallante, hoping that with more rest he'd return closer to his ~4era form. All you'd need is replacement-level performance and you're looking at a MINIMUM 5 game swing. But there's no way Walker should have been given enough rope to hang himself with. Again, all you need is replacement level from his position and you're looking at a minimum 7-game swing with those 3 moves.

Baffling, though not surprising considering tooslowMO was still in charge.

Agreed, but everything would have to work, and be managed properly by the alleged manager and pitching coaches we refuse to replace. The problem is we have NO corner OFer who is a consistent bat, and most importantly, NO starting pitching depth at all. We better hope Doyle is on the fast track and he at least has the ability to become a #2 SP. The winter meetings will be interesting. If Bloom gets Nado and Gray to waive their NTCs there may be some dumping. Of course ownership would have either eat some salary or take on bad contracts in return (which obviously you don't want to do). If this team digs up one good corner OFer AND 2 or 3 SPs they can compete. The minor league system may produce some pitching, but not for next season without some trades. I will be very interested to see what happens in Dec-Jan. Either ownership gives Bloom the resources to do something or we are living with Gray and Nado and little pitching. JW and probably Gorman need to go to AAA and figure it out, or be dealt. If they knock the cover off the ball in ST they can break camp with the team. No more of the same old same old. Time for some moves. Maybe we will actually see some....

$75M payroll commited if we DON"T trade them. There's plenty of room to add regardless.

[bccardsfan]

This team was like 3-283738291929233829 in games started by Mikolas Fedde and Pallante

Walker and Winn sucked but were far from the main problem and even if they were some sort of help to get us to the playoffs we would have gotten b**ch slapped right out of it with such a pathetic excuse for a rotation.

Yep, all you had to do was DFA Fedde a month sooner and bring up McG. Then, send Pallante to the pen and allow spot starts by Leahy, not trading Matz, and perhaps Pallante, hoping that with more rest he'd return closer to his ~4era form. All you'd need is replacement-level performance and you're looking at a MINIMUM 5 game swing. But there's no way Walker should have been given enough rope to hang himself with. Again, all you need is replacement level from his position and you're looking at a minimum 7-game swing with those 3 moves.

Baffling, though not surprising considering tooslowMO was still in charge.

Agreed, but everything would have to work, and be managed properly by the alleged manager and pitching coaches we refuse to replace. The problem is we have NO corner OFer who is a consistent bat, and most importantly, NO starting pitching depth at all. We better hope Doyle is on the fast track and he at least has the ability to become a #2 SP. The winter meetings will be interesting. If Bloom gets Nado and Gray to waive their NTCs there may be some dumping. Of course ownership would have either eat some salary or take on bad contracts in return (which obviously you don't want to do). If this team digs up one good corner OFer AND 2 or 3 SPs they can compete. The minor league system may produce some pitching, but not for next season without some trades. I will be very interested to see what happens in Dec-Jan. Either ownership gives Bloom the resources to do something or we are living with Gray and Nado and little pitching. JW and probably Gorman need to go to AAA and figure it out, or be dealt. If they knock the cover off the ball in ST they can break camp with the team. No more of the same old same old. Time for some moves. Maybe we will actually see some....

$75M payroll commited if we DON"T trade them. There's plenty of room to add regardless.

Hey Carp, I agree, and will be very interesting to see what actually happens. Still, Gray is not a #1 SP. He is a #2 or 3 on a good team. He rarely goes more than 6 innings and he is getting older, but he is a sunk cost on a team that desperately needs SPs. Nado ... his D is still well above average, and gold glove now and then. His offense .... well he is getting older too. It is probably time to move on from Nado. I am little tired of WC's antics as well, but he should be above .800 OPS and can play a pretty good 1B. But we have a ton of 1B/DH types. The roster construction needs a shakeup. It would be nice to field a very good defensive team that had 3 or 4 .800 OPS guys and some table setters, and no defensive liabilities at any position. To have at least three really good SPs. I know, I dream. The problem is you want Burley's bat in there, but he is not a great OFer. His D is most adequate at 1B, but you have WC. Hererra is the same. Where do you play him? DH of course, but wait, you have lots of DH guys you don't want to hide in the field. I know, this has been discussed ad nauseum on here. The construction of this roster needs to improved.

[Punkk6]

Personally, I have little interest in a "playoff" team that gets swept out of the first round yet again

[Carp4Cy]

Personally, I have little interest in a "playoff" team that gets swept out of the first round yet again

Just because it happened last time doesn't mean it will again. AZ was supposed to be that team that got swept in 2023. They won a pennant.

Get there and there's a chance. More chance that most posters will allow for. Miss the playoffs and there's zero chance.

This isn't the NBA where the last place team in the playoffs has never advanced.