How does Joel Reuter grade out the Doyle pick as a B?

[Bully4you]

This seems weird to me.
Shouldn't this pick be given the best grade.
I mean Doyle was consistently mocked to
go in the top 2 and the Cards ended up getting
the possible best SLH pitcher at pick 5.
Instead, he says the following:

First Round (No. 5 Overall): Liam Doyle, LHP, Tennessee," Reuter said. "MLB Comp: Robbie Ray. After flashing swing-and-miss stuff at Coastal Carolina (56.1 IP, 4.15 ERA, 69 K) and Ole Miss (55.0 IP, 5.73 ERA, 84 K), Doyle joined his third team when he transferred to Tennessee where he was college baseball's biggest breakout star. Leaning heavily on a high-octane fastball that touches 100 mph and blows hitters away up the zone, he posted a 3.20 ERA, 0.99 WHIP and 164 strikeouts in 95.2 innings.

"A max-effort delivery and his lagging secondary stuff raises some legitimate reliever questions, but a fastball like his from the left side does not come along often. Grade: B. The predraft expectation was that Doyle would be gone and the Cardinals would be picking between Jamie Arnold or someone from the prep shortstop class. Instead they get the most overpowering pitcher in college baseball this year, though there is some risk here."

Isn't there risk with every pick.
The #1 pick went to a kid that's
17 years old.
I just don't understand that assessment.
I'd call it a A grade all day.

[craviduce]

This seems weird to me.
Shouldn't this pick be given the best grade.
I mean Doyle was consistently mocked to
go in the top 2 and the Cards ended up getting
the possible best SLH pitcher at pick 5.
Instead, he says the following:

First Round (No. 5 Overall): Liam Doyle, LHP, Tennessee," Reuter said. "MLB Comp: Robbie Ray. After flashing swing-and-miss stuff at Coastal Carolina (56.1 IP, 4.15 ERA, 69 K) and Ole Miss (55.0 IP, 5.73 ERA, 84 K), Doyle joined his third team when he transferred to Tennessee where he was college baseball's biggest breakout star. Leaning heavily on a high-octane fastball that touches 100 mph and blows hitters away up the zone, he posted a 3.20 ERA, 0.99 WHIP and 164 strikeouts in 95.2 innings.

"A max-effort delivery and his lagging secondary stuff raises some legitimate reliever questions, but a fastball like his from the left side does not come along often. Grade: B. The predraft expectation was that Doyle would be gone and the Cardinals would be picking between Jamie Arnold or someone from the prep shortstop class. Instead they get the most overpowering pitcher in college baseball this year, though there is some risk here."

Isn't there risk with every pick.
The #1 pick went to a kid that's
17 years old.
I just don't understand that assessment.
I'd call it a A grade all day.

he was mocked to go #2 to b/c the Angels were picking #2, not b/c he was the #2 amateur prospect. On most draft boards he had fallen anywhere from 7-10. The Angels are notorious for the Underslot deal, which means they draft players willing to take around 75-80% of slot value. Doyle was expected to be this pick, they chose differently with Bremner.

Risk : His risk is his Floor. His Floor is Back End Reliever. The Cards are "risking" paying a potential future setup man $8million. The Cards are hoping he gives a Reward by being a Starter, and praying he's a Front of the Rotation starter.

The "B" grade is fitting, and it's not an insult.

[ClassicO]

This dude is from Bleacher Report. Say no more. They dot have hiring standards.
His job prior to that was a sales associate at Ace Hardware per LinkedIn. (“Not that there’s anything wrong with that.”)
Don’t worry; be happy, with Doyle.

[craviduce]

This dude is from Bleacher Report. Say no more. They dot have hiring standards.
His job prior to that was a sales associate at Ace Hardware per LinkedIn. (“Not that there’s anything wrong with that.”)
Don’t worry; be happy, with Doyle.

I think B is fitting, there's not many "A" in this draft. You can argue 4, but it's more like 3 with a boat load of "B's"

I think Bleacher Report is a joke, as well, and they're full of extreme bias....but the "B" grade is proper. And I'm not offended by it.

[ClassicO]

This dude is from Bleacher Report. Say no more. They dot have hiring standards.
His job prior to that was a sales associate at Ace Hardware per LinkedIn. (“Not that there’s anything wrong with that.”)
Don’t worry; be happy, with Doyle.

I think B is fitting, there's not many "A" in this draft. You can argue 4, but it's more like 3 with a boat load of "B's"

I think Bleacher Report is a joke, as well, and they're full of extreme bias....but the "B" grade is proper. And I'm not offended by it.

I certainly don't know. I haven't seen him pitch much, and most of the discussion has been around staying healthy with his atypical delivery and his other pitches beyond the fastball. I don't give a crab's rear end what they grade him -- only how he performs.

[ScotchMIrish]

The good news about sports is they play the games and we find out. Normally a starting pitcher needs a secondary pitch or two. Maybe he will develop that in the minors.

[HorseTrader]

I'd take the Robbie Ray comp and be happy

[craviduce]

This dude is from Bleacher Report. Say no more. They dot have hiring standards.
His job prior to that was a sales associate at Ace Hardware per LinkedIn. (“Not that there’s anything wrong with that.”)
Don’t worry; be happy, with Doyle.

I think B is fitting, there's not many "A" in this draft. You can argue 4, but it's more like 3 with a boat load of "B's"

I think Bleacher Report is a joke, as well, and they're full of extreme bias....but the "B" grade is proper. And I'm not offended by it.

I certainly don't know. I haven't seen him pitch much, and most of the discussion has been around staying healthy with his atypical delivery and his other pitches beyond the fastball. I don't give a crab's rear end what they grade him -- only how he performs.

absolutely!

[scoutyjones2]

This seems weird to me.
Shouldn't this pick be given the best grade.
I mean Doyle was consistently mocked to
go in the top 2 and the Cards ended up getting
the possible best SLH pitcher at pick 5.
Instead, he says the following:

First Round (No. 5 Overall): Liam Doyle, LHP, Tennessee," Reuter said. "MLB Comp: Robbie Ray. After flashing swing-and-miss stuff at Coastal Carolina (56.1 IP, 4.15 ERA, 69 K) and Ole Miss (55.0 IP, 5.73 ERA, 84 K), Doyle joined his third team when he transferred to Tennessee where he was college baseball's biggest breakout star. Leaning heavily on a high-octane fastball that touches 100 mph and blows hitters away up the zone, he posted a 3.20 ERA, 0.99 WHIP and 164 strikeouts in 95.2 innings.

"A max-effort delivery and his lagging secondary stuff raises some legitimate reliever questions, but a fastball like his from the left side does not come along often. Grade: B. The predraft expectation was that Doyle would be gone and the Cardinals would be picking between Jamie Arnold or someone from the prep shortstop class. Instead they get the most overpowering pitcher in college baseball this year, though there is some risk here."

Isn't there risk with every pick.
The #1 pick went to a kid that's
17 years old.
I just don't understand that assessment.
I'd call it a A grade all day.

No secondary pitch...red flag. Reading is hard. Was predicted to go 8th and Cards picked him 5th

[HOUCARD]

This dude is from Bleacher Report. Say no more. They dot have hiring standards.
His job prior to that was a sales associate at Ace Hardware per LinkedIn. (“Not that there’s anything wrong with that.”)
Don’t worry; be happy, with Doyle.

I think B is fitting, there's not many "A" in this draft. You can argue 4, but it's more like 3 with a boat load of "B's"

I think Bleacher Report is a joke, as well, and they're full of extreme bias....but the "B" grade is proper. And I'm not offended by it.

I certainly don't know. I haven't seen him pitch much, and most of the discussion has been around staying healthy with his atypical delivery and his other pitches beyond the fastball. I don't give a crab's rear end what they grade him -- only how he performs.

When no one can catch up to your FB, who needs secondary pitches (college kids). Can't teach velocity. One can teach offspeed offerings. JMHO.

[Red7]

This seems weird to me.
Shouldn't this pick be given the best grade.
I mean Doyle was consistently mocked to
go in the top 2 and the Cards ended up getting
the possible best SLH pitcher at pick 5.
Instead, he says the following:

First Round (No. 5 Overall): Liam Doyle, LHP, Tennessee," Reuter said. "MLB Comp: Robbie Ray. After flashing swing-and-miss stuff at Coastal Carolina (56.1 IP, 4.15 ERA, 69 K) and Ole Miss (55.0 IP, 5.73 ERA, 84 K), Doyle joined his third team when he transferred to Tennessee where he was college baseball's biggest breakout star. Leaning heavily on a high-octane fastball that touches 100 mph and blows hitters away up the zone, he posted a 3.20 ERA, 0.99 WHIP and 164 strikeouts in 95.2 innings.

"A max-effort delivery and his lagging secondary stuff raises some legitimate reliever questions, but a fastball like his from the left side does not come along often. Grade: B. The predraft expectation was that Doyle would be gone and the Cardinals would be picking between Jamie Arnold or someone from the prep shortstop class. Instead they get the most overpowering pitcher in college baseball this year, though there is some risk here."

Isn't there risk with every pick.
The #1 pick went to a kid that's
17 years old.
I just don't understand that assessment.
I'd call it a A grade all day.

No secondary pitch...red flag. Reading is hard. Was predicted to go 8th and Cards picked him 5th

He has a pretty good secondary pitch: his splitter. What he lacks right now is a breaking ball that he throws consistently. It came down, I think, to Doyle and Arnold. I believe the thinking is Doyle has the higher upside while Arnold is more polished now. The Cardinals have gone the more polished route in the past and it really hasn’t worked out. The one thing the Tampa and Cleveland organizations know how to do and that is to develop pitching. That’s the background of Bloom and Cerfelio (sp).

[ClassicO]

This dude is from Bleacher Report. Say no more. They dot have hiring standards.
His job prior to that was a sales associate at Ace Hardware per LinkedIn. (“Not that there’s anything wrong with that.”)
Don’t worry; be happy, with Doyle.

I think B is fitting, there's not many "A" in this draft. You can argue 4, but it's more like 3 with a boat load of "B's"

I think Bleacher Report is a joke, as well, and they're full of extreme bias....but the "B" grade is proper. And I'm not offended by it.

I certainly don't know. I haven't seen him pitch much, and most of the discussion has been around staying healthy with his atypical delivery and his other pitches beyond the fastball. I don't give a crab's rear end what they grade him -- only how he performs.

When no one can catch up to your FB, who needs secondary pitches (college kids). Can't teach velocity. One can teach offspeed offerings. JMHO.

Agree. It was too hard to pass up an arm like this when the good majority of the greatest pitchers have come from the top 10 or so picks.

[scoutyjones2]

This seems weird to me.
Shouldn't this pick be given the best grade.
I mean Doyle was consistently mocked to
go in the top 2 and the Cards ended up getting
the possible best SLH pitcher at pick 5.
Instead, he says the following:

First Round (No. 5 Overall): Liam Doyle, LHP, Tennessee," Reuter said. "MLB Comp: Robbie Ray. After flashing swing-and-miss stuff at Coastal Carolina (56.1 IP, 4.15 ERA, 69 K) and Ole Miss (55.0 IP, 5.73 ERA, 84 K), Doyle joined his third team when he transferred to Tennessee where he was college baseball's biggest breakout star. Leaning heavily on a high-octane fastball that touches 100 mph and blows hitters away up the zone, he posted a 3.20 ERA, 0.99 WHIP and 164 strikeouts in 95.2 innings.

"A max-effort delivery and his lagging secondary stuff raises some legitimate reliever questions, but a fastball like his from the left side does not come along often. Grade: B. The predraft expectation was that Doyle would be gone and the Cardinals would be picking between Jamie Arnold or someone from the prep shortstop class. Instead they get the most overpowering pitcher in college baseball this year, though there is some risk here."

Isn't there risk with every pick.
The #1 pick went to a kid that's
17 years old.
I just don't understand that assessment.
I'd call it a A grade all day.

No secondary pitch...red flag. Reading is hard. Was predicted to go 8th and Cards picked him 5th

He has a pretty good secondary pitch: his splitter. What he lacks right now is a breaking ball that he throws consistently. It came down, I think, to Doyle and Arnold. I believe the thinking is Doyle has the higher upside while Arnold is more polished now. The Cardinals have gone the more polished route in the past and it really hasn’t worked out. The one thing the Tampa and Cleveland organizations know how to do and that is to develop pitching. That’s the background of Bloom and Cerfelio (sp).

No, he really doesn't. His fast all plays, but MLB will eat his [shirt] up overtime

[hugeCardfan]

This seems weird to me.
Shouldn't this pick be given the best grade.
I mean Doyle was consistently mocked to
go in the top 2 and the Cards ended up getting
the possible best SLH pitcher at pick 5.
Instead, he says the following:

First Round (No. 5 Overall): Liam Doyle, LHP, Tennessee," Reuter said. "MLB Comp: Robbie Ray. After flashing swing-and-miss stuff at Coastal Carolina (56.1 IP, 4.15 ERA, 69 K) and Ole Miss (55.0 IP, 5.73 ERA, 84 K), Doyle joined his third team when he transferred to Tennessee where he was college baseball's biggest breakout star. Leaning heavily on a high-octane fastball that touches 100 mph and blows hitters away up the zone, he posted a 3.20 ERA, 0.99 WHIP and 164 strikeouts in 95.2 innings.

"A max-effort delivery and his lagging secondary stuff raises some legitimate reliever questions, but a fastball like his from the left side does not come along often. Grade: B. The predraft expectation was that Doyle would be gone and the Cardinals would be picking between Jamie Arnold or someone from the prep shortstop class. Instead they get the most overpowering pitcher in college baseball this year, though there is some risk here."

Isn't there risk with every pick.
The #1 pick went to a kid that's
17 years old.
I just don't understand that assessment.
I'd call it a A grade all day.

No secondary pitch...red flag. Reading is hard. Was predicted to go 8th and Cards picked him 5th

Wrong. He has a great splitter.

[RipRipulski]

Doyle’s secondaries are splitter, cutter and slider and the have graded out as a 55, which is in fact above average. They do need improvement but he simply has not needed to use them in college

[Wattage]

This seems weird to me.
Shouldn't this pick be given the best grade.
I mean Doyle was consistently mocked to
go in the top 2 and the Cards ended up getting
the possible best SLH pitcher at pick 5.
Instead, he says the following:

First Round (No. 5 Overall): Liam Doyle, LHP, Tennessee," Reuter said. "MLB Comp: Robbie Ray. After flashing swing-and-miss stuff at Coastal Carolina (56.1 IP, 4.15 ERA, 69 K) and Ole Miss (55.0 IP, 5.73 ERA, 84 K), Doyle joined his third team when he transferred to Tennessee where he was college baseball's biggest breakout star. Leaning heavily on a high-octane fastball that touches 100 mph and blows hitters away up the zone, he posted a 3.20 ERA, 0.99 WHIP and 164 strikeouts in 95.2 innings.

"A max-effort delivery and his lagging secondary stuff raises some legitimate reliever questions, but a fastball like his from the left side does not come along often. Grade: B. The predraft expectation was that Doyle would be gone and the Cardinals would be picking between Jamie Arnold or someone from the prep shortstop class. Instead they get the most overpowering pitcher in college baseball this year, though there is some risk here."

Isn't there risk with every pick.
The #1 pick went to a kid that's
17 years old.
I just don't understand that assessment.
I'd call it a A grade all day.

His ranking was all over the place from 2.to 10. As i posted the top 4 picks from 2018-2021 in another thread and how underwhelming they were, the draft is a bitnof a crapshoot with the bust rate very high. The rankings vary. Its not til after players react to minor leagues that you can get true projection