What if Liberatore hadn't excelled

[Melville]

Liberatore isnt an ace by any means, but one can argue that he's a low 2 or high 3, depending on the quality of the rotation, but I digress.

As the season has gone on, Mikolas has only 5 QS out of 17 and more often than not being hit hard. Arguably, his contract is why he is even in the rotation. Fedde and Pallente are not far behind. At best none of them are better than BOTR pitchers. Can you imagine if Liberatore hadn't established himself in the rotation the way he did? We wouldn't be talking about if we have a shot at the WC, we'd be talking almost without exception about who will be moved by the trade deadline.

Again, the Cardinals do not make BASEBALL DECISIONS and have not for the past decade.
Mikolas is on the roster because of his contract.
Pallente is a failed reliever whom they hoped could be repurposed as a cheap starter.
Meanwhile, two pitchers who would almost certainly perform better than those 2, are banned from the rotation.
And none of these decisions were made with any consideration of winning games.

Of course not. It is a marketing organization. BP village, Cards hall of fame red jackets, endless promotions. The baseball brain trust side completely fell apart about the time Taveras died. They have been in panic mode ever since. The Walt method of bringing in Vets like Nado and Goldy, but not surrounding them with much. They even tried getting back to fundamentals and "the Cardinal Way" by hiring Shildt. He tightened up the fundamentals, and then was promptly fired to install Oli. They are a rudderless ship on the baseball side of things. They have no plan and direction. Lots of cheap moves, and when they do spend money, rarely do they spend it well. SG has been pretty good value, I will give them that, but then they never got another reliable veteran starter and of course wasted tons of resources on the likes of MM, Fowler, etc....

Hopefully ownership will give Bloom a decent budget and let him do what he wants. Then we will know if it was all on MO....

Excellent post!
As I was first and best to understand and explain to all several years ago (and continuously since), the Cardinals are not a baseball organization with a marketing department.
It is a marketing company with a baseball department.
That is essential to understanding all things related to the Cardinals.

This was all obvious to anyone with half a brain. You give yourself credit where it isn’t due as usual, but it’s not about you, never about you, even though you use the word “I” in every single one of your posts…

Gosh - so many references to me in your post.
Disappointing.
I regret it whenever anyone attempts to make it about me.
In this instance, it is about the transition the organization made during and immediately after the MV3 years and the toxic consequences over the past 20 years as a result.
That I was the very first to truly understand the genesis, and the very first to identify the pattern repeated ever since, and the very first to predict the inevitable consequence which all have experienced over the past 3 seasons, is not the key point.
The Cardinals are not a baseball organization with a marketing department.
It is a marketing company with a baseball department.
I originated - and have been using that perfectly turned phrase for the past decade here.
At the beginning, all objected.
Now - all understand.
Happy to provide that service.
It is all about the game.

[An Old Friend]

Want a comparison for Libby but a right handed one? Take a look at 2024, guy named Pallante. All I'm saying is don't get too high on Libby. Next year he could be the 2025 version of Pallante.

Just a note... Pallante was below 15th percentile in walk rate and Liberatore is near 90th percentile.

Liberatore is 86th percentile in chase rate and 97th percentile in offspeed run value.
Pallante was 11th percentile in chase rate and 28th percentile in breaking ball run value in 2024.

They have very different profiles and I would be hesitant to comp them.

[Horseradish]

Liberatore isnt an ace by any means, but one can argue that he's a low 2 or high 3, depending on the quality of the rotation, but I digress.

As the season has gone on, Mikolas has only 5 QS out of 17 and more often than not being hit hard. Arguably, his contract is why he is even in the rotation. Fedde and Pallente are not far behind. At best none of them are better than BOTR pitchers. Can you imagine if Liberatore hadn't established himself in the rotation the way he did? We wouldn't be talking about if we have a shot at the WC, we'd be talking almost without exception about who will be moved by the trade deadline.

Again, the Cardinals do not make BASEBALL DECISIONS and have not for the past decade.
Mikolas is on the roster because of his contract.
Pallente is a failed reliever whom they hoped could be repurposed as a cheap starter.
Meanwhile, two pitchers who would almost certainly perform better than those 2, are banned from the rotation.
And none of these decisions were made with any consideration of winning games.

Of course not. It is a marketing organization. BP village, Cards hall of fame red jackets, endless promotions. The baseball brain trust side completely fell apart about the time Taveras died. They have been in panic mode ever since. The Walt method of bringing in Vets like Nado and Goldy, but not surrounding them with much. They even tried getting back to fundamentals and "the Cardinal Way" by hiring Shildt. He tightened up the fundamentals, and then was promptly fired to install Oli. They are a rudderless ship on the baseball side of things. They have no plan and direction. Lots of cheap moves, and when they do spend money, rarely do they spend it well. SG has been pretty good value, I will give them that, but then they never got another reliable veteran starter and of course wasted tons of resources on the likes of MM, Fowler, etc....

Hopefully ownership will give Bloom a decent budget and let him do what he wants. Then we will know if it was all on MO....

Excellent post!
As I was first and best to understand and explain to all several years ago (and continuously since), the Cardinals are not a baseball organization with a marketing department.
It is a marketing company with a baseball department.
That is essential to understanding all things related to the Cardinals.

This was all obvious to anyone with half a brain. You give yourself credit where it isn’t due as usual, but it’s not about you, never about you, even though you use the word “I” in every single one of your posts…

Gosh - so many references to me in your post.
Disappointing.
I regret it whenever anyone attempts to make it about me.
In this instance, it is about the transition the organization made during and immediately after the MV3 years and the toxic consequences over the past 20 years as a result.
That I was the very first to truly understand the genesis, and the very first to identify the pattern repeated ever since, and the very first to predict the inevitable consequence which all have experienced over the past 3 seasons, is not the key point.
The Cardinals are not a baseball organization with a marketing department.
It is a marketing company with a baseball department.
I originated - and have been using that perfectly turned phrase for the past decade here.
At the beginning, all objected.
Now - all understand.
Happy to provide that service.
It is all about the game.

Two “me”s and three “I”s.

Come on you can do better. Really lay it on thick next time and don’t be afraid to also refer to yourself in third person for extra narcissism points.

[2ninr]

Liberatore isnt an ace by any means, but one can argue that he's a low 2 or high 3, depending on the quality of the rotation, but I digress.

As the season has gone on, Mikolas has only 5 QS out of 17 and more often than not being hit hard. Arguably, his contract is why he is even in the rotation. Fedde and Pallente are not far behind. At best none of them are better than BOTR pitchers. Can you imagine if Liberatore hadn't established himself in the rotation the way he did? We wouldn't be talking about if we have a shot at the WC, we'd be talking almost without exception about who will be moved by the trade deadline.

You make a super point- depending on quality of rotation. In a stud rotation he is a fine three and flourish’s there. Bad rotation he is a two and may struggle.

Whether he is considered a "2" or a "3" has no bearing on his performance. Maybe on his W L record. But his peripheral metrics should remain the same. Any reason why not?