Buying The Cardinals Way Back To The WS

[Othawhitemeat]

Many posters have suggested that the Cards should get back to the $175-180 million spending level. Let’s see what that would do.

Dodgers - $337.8 million
Mets - $331.3 million
Yanks - $290.3 million
Phillies - $279.4 million
Jays - $245.9 million
Astros - $221.3 million
Rangers - $218.7 million
Braves - $211.7 million
Padres - $209.0 million
Cubs - $195.4 million
Giants - $195.3 million
Angels - $193.9 million
Red Sox - $190.8 million
Diamondbacks - $188.9 million
Cardinals - 175-180 million

Maybe just throwing money at it won’t do the trick.
The strength will have to come mainly through the system. Draft well. Develop well. Trade as necessary to fill holes.

Keep it up Toady Front Office Footstool.

cranny = king of all sycophants

C. Bloom/R.Cerfolio can only do so much via the draft & development route.

If they find one FOTR #1 starter and one all-star position player in the next five years via the draft & development route, then they've done more than Mo and his gang have for years.

But that won't be even close to enough to make them WS contenders.

Unless BDWJr takes the payroll back to $180+M, this team is destined for years of mediocre baseball.

Poor take cranny.........as usual

So what’s your solution, Rock?

BDWjr has done a good thing removing Mo and replacing him w/two smart young baseball execs.

Next would be removing Oli at seasons end and replacing him w/an experience major league Manager.

Finally, he has to give Bloom "some" money (+$35-40M above this season payroll would be a good start) to fill in the holes on this roster (starting pitcher, MOTO hitter).

Nothing crazy (re: NOT K. Tucker) but definitely an upgrade.

That’s reasonable and makes sense.

Crav - to be honest, with spending 35-40 mill more than this year, we could even afford a Kyle Tucker if wanted (wont be worth it compared what other team will give him). However, we will have Matz, Mikolas, Fedde, Helsley's contracts coming off books. Thats like 46 mill there and then if say trade Arenado, we are only paying for a year of Sonny Gray and then 2 years of Contreras. We are literally bare in contracts to do some spending until our youngsters are ready to get a couple impact players.

[sikeston bulldog2]

Many posters have suggested that the Cards should get back to the $175-180 million spending level. Let’s see what that would do.

Dodgers - $337.8 million
Mets - $331.3 million
Yanks - $290.3 million
Phillies - $279.4 million
Jays - $245.9 million
Astros - $221.3 million
Rangers - $218.7 million
Braves - $211.7 million
Padres - $209.0 million
Cubs - $195.4 million
Giants - $195.3 million
Angels - $193.9 million
Red Sox - $190.8 million
Diamondbacks - $188.9 million
Cardinals - 175-180 million

Maybe just throwing money at it won’t do the trick.
The strength will have to come mainly through the system. Draft well. Develop well. Trade as necessary to fill holes.

I don’t get your point. You make the point that money can buy you love, or WS. Correct.

Of all the teams listed, all but one are recently successful.
Yes money works.

[Cranny]

Many posters have suggested that the Cards should get back to the $175-180 million spending level. Let’s see what that would do.

Dodgers - $337.8 million
Mets - $331.3 million
Yanks - $290.3 million
Phillies - $279.4 million
Jays - $245.9 million
Astros - $221.3 million
Rangers - $218.7 million
Braves - $211.7 million
Padres - $209.0 million
Cubs - $195.4 million
Giants - $195.3 million
Angels - $193.9 million
Red Sox - $190.8 million
Diamondbacks - $188.9 million
Cardinals - 175-180 million

Maybe just throwing money at it won’t do the trick.
The strength will have to come mainly through the system. Draft well. Develop well. Trade as necessary to fill holes.

I don’t get your point. You make the point that money can buy you love, or WS. Correct.

Of all the teams listed, all but one are recently successful.
Yes money works.

The point is simple. You can’t spend on free agents like big market teams can, but you can strengthen
the farm system and use some well developed minor leaguers as trade chips. It’s the way Cardinals have become successful in the past. It didn’t work with Ozuna, Goldy, and Arenado, but trying that model again is simply the only way forward.

[sikeston bulldog2]

Many posters have suggested that the Cards should get back to the $175-180 million spending level. Let’s see what that would do.

Dodgers - $337.8 million
Mets - $331.3 million
Yanks - $290.3 million
Phillies - $279.4 million
Jays - $245.9 million
Astros - $221.3 million
Rangers - $218.7 million
Braves - $211.7 million
Padres - $209.0 million
Cubs - $195.4 million
Giants - $195.3 million
Angels - $193.9 million
Red Sox - $190.8 million
Diamondbacks - $188.9 million
Cardinals - 175-180 million

Maybe just throwing money at it won’t do the trick.
The strength will have to come mainly through the system. Draft well. Develop well. Trade as necessary to fill holes.

I don’t get your point. You make the point that money can buy you love, or WS. Correct.

Of all the teams listed, all but one are recently successful.
Yes money works.

The point is simple. You can’t spend on free agents like big market teams can, but you can strengthen
the farm system and use some well developed minor leaguers as trade chips. It’s the way Cardinals have become successful in the past. It didn’t work with Ozuna, Goldy, and Arenado, but trying that model again is simply the only way forward.

Well developed minor leaguer- why would I trade that young and cost controlled up and coming performance. It’s exactly what I crave.


Next if I do trade the young studs, the player I get back, the vet stud, carries a salary. A big salary.

Tor simply robbing Peter to pay Paul.

[JDW]

Many posters have suggested that the Cards should get back to the $175-180 million spending level. Let’s see what that would do.

Dodgers - $337.8 million
Mets - $331.3 million
Yanks - $290.3 million
Phillies - $279.4 million
Jays - $245.9 million
Astros - $221.3 million
Rangers - $218.7 million
Braves - $211.7 million
Padres - $209.0 million
Cubs - $195.4 million
Giants - $195.3 million
Angels - $193.9 million
Red Sox - $190.8 million
Diamondbacks - $188.9 million
Cardinals - 175-180 million

Maybe just throwing money at it won’t do the trick.
The strength will have to come mainly through the system. Draft well. Develop well. Trade as necessary to fill holes.

$200M, or top 10. Stop rooting for Bill DeWitt and start rooting for the Cardinals.

I doubt if $200M buys you deep into October vs.
the big spenders.

The Cards like you said need to develop. But, when they have a chance to win, they need to selectively go for it by actively adding. Lets say 2027 is the next window. Baez, Wetherholdt, Bernal, Herrera, Roby and Mathews all look like the real deal. It means adding a TOR arm to that team, adding a couple bullpen pieces, adding an experienced bat to the team. They can probably do that within $200M if they have that young of a team.

The old model of adding mid range free agents to fill in gaps didn't work. The new model should be develop almost everything, fill in the remaining gap or 2 with the best guy available and make sure there is sufficient pitching depth. Finally, never ever give out another legacy contract....

This is a pretty good blueprint of what in reality could be done.
When there's a decent chance before the deadline, try to strengthen, but always knowing the farm will need to remain strong.
Don't waste money on middling FA's, those positions need to be filled internally.
Sign only top FA's, knowing you're limited on how many you can afford.
Keep the fans encouraged and engaged by always trying to build a winner.

[rockondlouie]

Many posters have suggested that the Cards should get back to the $175-180 million spending level. Let’s see what that would do.

Dodgers - $337.8 million
Mets - $331.3 million
Yanks - $290.3 million
Phillies - $279.4 million
Jays - $245.9 million
Astros - $221.3 million
Rangers - $218.7 million
Braves - $211.7 million
Padres - $209.0 million
Cubs - $195.4 million
Giants - $195.3 million
Angels - $193.9 million
Red Sox - $190.8 million
Diamondbacks - $188.9 million
Cardinals - 175-180 million

Maybe just throwing money at it won’t do the trick.
The strength will have to come mainly through the system. Draft well. Develop well. Trade as necessary to fill holes.

Keep it up Toady Front Office Footstool.

cranny = king of all sycophants

C. Bloom/R.Cerfolio can only do so much via the draft & development route.

If they find one FOTR #1 starter and one all-star position player in the next five years via the draft & development route, then they've done more than Mo and his gang have for years.

But that won't be even close to enough to make them WS contenders.

Unless BDWJr takes the payroll back to $180+M, this team is destined for years of mediocre baseball.

Poor take cranny.........as usual

So what’s your solution, Rock?

BDWjr has done a good thing removing Mo and replacing him w/two smart young baseball execs.

Next would be removing Oli at seasons end and replacing him w/an experience major league Manager.

Finally, he has to give Bloom "some" money (+$35-40M above this season payroll would be a good start) to fill in the holes on this roster (starting pitcher, MOTO hitter).

Nothing crazy (re: NOT K. Tucker) but definitely an upgrade.

That’s reasonable and makes sense.

Thx

[Othawhitemeat]

Many posters have suggested that the Cards should get back to the $175-180 million spending level. Let’s see what that would do.

Dodgers - $337.8 million
Mets - $331.3 million
Yanks - $290.3 million
Phillies - $279.4 million
Jays - $245.9 million
Astros - $221.3 million
Rangers - $218.7 million
Braves - $211.7 million
Padres - $209.0 million
Cubs - $195.4 million
Giants - $195.3 million
Angels - $193.9 million
Red Sox - $190.8 million
Diamondbacks - $188.9 million
Cardinals - 175-180 million

Maybe just throwing money at it won’t do the trick.
The strength will have to come mainly through the system. Draft well. Develop well. Trade as necessary to fill holes.

Keep it up Toady Front Office Footstool.

cranny = king of all sycophants

C. Bloom/R.Cerfolio can only do so much via the draft & development route.

If they find one FOTR #1 starter and one all-star position player in the next five years via the draft & development route, then they've done more than Mo and his gang have for years.

But that won't be even close to enough to make them WS contenders.

Unless BDWJr takes the payroll back to $180+M, this team is destined for years of mediocre baseball.

Poor take cranny.........as usual

So what’s your solution, Rock?

BDWjr has done a good thing removing Mo and replacing him w/two smart young baseball execs.

Next would be removing Oli at seasons end and replacing him w/an experience major league Manager.

Finally, he has to give Bloom "some" money (+$35-40M above this season payroll would be a good start) to fill in the holes on this roster (starting pitcher, MOTO hitter).

Nothing crazy (re: NOT K. Tucker) but definitely an upgrade.

That’s reasonable and makes sense.

Thx

with all the expirings we have coming off, that would be $45 mill and Arenado's salary seems to be going down (assuming we don't trade him). Factor in if we got $35-$40 mill (won't happen) but that would be $80 million to get some players. Could make a real dent if we go after a superstar type with our other talent we are developing. It is fine to build if build smart, but still got to do both. Totally agree with you Rock! Have a golden opportunity if JJ pans out and hit on our #5 pick. To me, below is the core based on age (Love Donny - my fav current Cardinal, but do you build around him or trade him if can get a haul due to age and contract?).

Burly
Herrera
Winn
JJ
Libby
McGreevy

Matthews
Roby/Hence (one hopefully will pan out)
Bernal


Fringe:
Pages
Donovan or get a haul
Victor Scott


Trade pieces IMO if can restore:
Noot
Gorman
Donny if we don't keep him
Crooks

Possible down the line?
Baez
Raniel
Padilla


Current trade pieces:
Matz
Helsley
Maton
Romero

maybe could get something if can restore (Fedde) and if willing to waive no-trade, Arenado


We have some wiggle room to do some things to rebuild this if done right, rather quickly.

[rockondlouie]

Many posters have suggested that the Cards should get back to the $175-180 million spending level. Let’s see what that would do.

Dodgers - $337.8 million
Mets - $331.3 million
Yanks - $290.3 million
Phillies - $279.4 million
Jays - $245.9 million
Astros - $221.3 million
Rangers - $218.7 million
Braves - $211.7 million
Padres - $209.0 million
Cubs - $195.4 million
Giants - $195.3 million
Angels - $193.9 million
Red Sox - $190.8 million
Diamondbacks - $188.9 million
Cardinals - 175-180 million

Maybe just throwing money at it won’t do the trick.
The strength will have to come mainly through the system. Draft well. Develop well. Trade as necessary to fill holes.

Keep it up Toady Front Office Footstool.

cranny = king of all sycophants

C. Bloom/R.Cerfolio can only do so much via the draft & development route.

If they find one FOTR #1 starter and one all-star position player in the next five years via the draft & development route, then they've done more than Mo and his gang have for years.

But that won't be even close to enough to make them WS contenders.

Unless BDWJr takes the payroll back to $180+M, this team is destined for years of mediocre baseball.

Poor take cranny.........as usual

So what’s your solution, Rock?

BDWjr has done a good thing removing Mo and replacing him w/two smart young baseball execs.

Next would be removing Oli at seasons end and replacing him w/an experience major league Manager.

Finally, he has to give Bloom "some" money (+$35-40M above this season payroll would be a good start) to fill in the holes on this roster (starting pitcher, MOTO hitter).

Nothing crazy (re: NOT K. Tucker) but definitely an upgrade.

That’s reasonable and makes sense.

Thx

with all the expirings we have coming off, that would be $45 mill and Arenado's salary seems to be going down (assuming we don't trade him). Factor in if we got $35-$40 mill (won't happen) but that would be $80 million to get some players. Could make a real dent if we go after a superstar type with our other talent we are developing. It is fine to build if build smart, but still got to do both. Totally agree with you Rock! Have a golden opportunity if JJ pans out and hit on our #5 pick. To me, below is the core based on age (Love Donny - my fav current Cardinal, but do you build around him or trade him if can get a haul due to age and contract?).

Burly
Herrera
Winn
JJ
Libby
McGreevy

Matthews
Roby/Hence (one hopefully will pan out)
Bernal


Fringe:
Pages
Donovan or get a haul
Victor Scott


Trade pieces IMO if can restore:
Noot
Gorman
Donny if we don't keep him
Crooks

Possible down the line?
Baez
Raniel
Padilla


Current trade pieces:
Matz
Helsley
Maton
Romero

maybe could get something if can restore (Fedde) and if willing to waive no-trade, Arenado


We have some wiggle room to do some things to rebuild this if done right, rather quickly.

Thx meat

I'd a huge Donny fan too, I extend him and build around him and his leadership but agree w/all your other trade chips.

There's roughly $42.6M falling off the books from expired deals.

NADO reduces to $27M -$5M from Rockies -$3M deferred to $19M

Gray jumps +$10M.

ARB raises ($15M est.)

Total:
$90M 2026 payroll (est)

So if BDWJr takes the payroll to $150M (nothing crazy so relax cranny, but well below the $175-180M he gave Mo) then C. Bloom could have as much as $60M to spend on trade targets and Free agents!

[ICCFIM2]

Many posters have suggested that the Cards should get back to the $175-180 million spending level. Let’s see what that would do.

Dodgers - $337.8 million
Mets - $331.3 million
Yanks - $290.3 million
Phillies - $279.4 million
Jays - $245.9 million
Astros - $221.3 million
Rangers - $218.7 million
Braves - $211.7 million
Padres - $209.0 million
Cubs - $195.4 million
Giants - $195.3 million
Angels - $193.9 million
Red Sox - $190.8 million
Diamondbacks - $188.9 million
Cardinals - 175-180 million

Maybe just throwing money at it won’t do the trick.
The strength will have to come mainly through the system. Draft well. Develop well. Trade as necessary to fill holes.

Keep it up Toady Front Office Footstool.

cranny = king of all sycophants

C. Bloom/R.Cerfolio can only do so much via the draft & development route.

If they find one FOTR #1 starter and one all-star position player in the next five years via the draft & development route, then they've done more than Mo and his gang have for years.

But that won't be even close to enough to make them WS contenders.

Unless BDWJr takes the payroll back to $180+M, this team is destined for years of mediocre baseball.

Poor take cranny.........as usual

So what’s your solution, Rock?

BDWjr has done a good thing removing Mo and replacing him w/two smart young baseball execs.

Next would be removing Oli at seasons end and replacing him w/an experience major league Manager.

Finally, he has to give Bloom "some" money (+$35-40M above this season payroll would be a good start) to fill in the holes on this roster (starting pitcher, MOTO hitter).

Nothing crazy (re: NOT K. Tucker) but definitely an upgrade.

That’s reasonable and makes sense.

Thx

with all the expirings we have coming off, that would be $45 mill and Arenado's salary seems to be going down (assuming we don't trade him). Factor in if we got $35-$40 mill (won't happen) but that would be $80 million to get some players. Could make a real dent if we go after a superstar type with our other talent we are developing. It is fine to build if build smart, but still got to do both. Totally agree with you Rock! Have a golden opportunity if JJ pans out and hit on our #5 pick. To me, below is the core based on age (Love Donny - my fav current Cardinal, but do you build around him or trade him if can get a haul due to age and contract?).

Burly
Herrera
Winn
JJ
Libby
McGreevy

Matthews
Roby/Hence (one hopefully will pan out)
Bernal


Fringe:
Pages
Donovan or get a haul
Victor Scott


Trade pieces IMO if can restore:
Noot
Gorman
Donny if we don't keep him
Crooks

Possible down the line?
Baez
Raniel
Padilla


Current trade pieces:
Matz
Helsley
Maton
Romero

maybe could get something if can restore (Fedde) and if willing to waive no-trade, Arenado


We have some wiggle room to do some things to rebuild this if done right, rather quickly.

Thx meat

I'd a huge Donny fan too, I extend him and build around him and his leadership but agree w/all your other trade chips.

There's roughly $42.6M falling off the books from expired deals.

NADO reduces to $27M -$5M from Rockies -$3M deferred to $19M

Gray jumps +$10M.

ARB raises ($15M est.)

Total:
$90M 2026 payroll (est)

So if BDWJr takes the payroll to $150M (nothing crazy so relax cranny, but well below the $175-180M he gave Mo) then C. Bloom could have as much as $60M to spend on trade targets and Free agents!

With our attendance figures this year, I think $150M is wildly optimistic. BDW killed the goose that layed the golden eggs...

[rockondlouie]

Many posters have suggested that the Cards should get back to the $175-180 million spending level. Let’s see what that would do.

Dodgers - $337.8 million
Mets - $331.3 million
Yanks - $290.3 million
Phillies - $279.4 million
Jays - $245.9 million
Astros - $221.3 million
Rangers - $218.7 million
Braves - $211.7 million
Padres - $209.0 million
Cubs - $195.4 million
Giants - $195.3 million
Angels - $193.9 million
Red Sox - $190.8 million
Diamondbacks - $188.9 million
Cardinals - 175-180 million

Maybe just throwing money at it won’t do the trick.
The strength will have to come mainly through the system. Draft well. Develop well. Trade as necessary to fill holes.

Keep it up Toady Front Office Footstool.

cranny = king of all sycophants

C. Bloom/R.Cerfolio can only do so much via the draft & development route.

If they find one FOTR #1 starter and one all-star position player in the next five years via the draft & development route, then they've done more than Mo and his gang have for years.

But that won't be even close to enough to make them WS contenders.

Unless BDWJr takes the payroll back to $180+M, this team is destined for years of mediocre baseball.

Poor take cranny.........as usual

So what’s your solution, Rock?

BDWjr has done a good thing removing Mo and replacing him w/two smart young baseball execs.

Next would be removing Oli at seasons end and replacing him w/an experience major league Manager.

Finally, he has to give Bloom "some" money (+$35-40M above this season payroll would be a good start) to fill in the holes on this roster (starting pitcher, MOTO hitter).

Nothing crazy (re: NOT K. Tucker) but definitely an upgrade.

That’s reasonable and makes sense.

Thx

with all the expirings we have coming off, that would be $45 mill and Arenado's salary seems to be going down (assuming we don't trade him). Factor in if we got $35-$40 mill (won't happen) but that would be $80 million to get some players. Could make a real dent if we go after a superstar type with our other talent we are developing. It is fine to build if build smart, but still got to do both. Totally agree with you Rock! Have a golden opportunity if JJ pans out and hit on our #5 pick. To me, below is the core based on age (Love Donny - my fav current Cardinal, but do you build around him or trade him if can get a haul due to age and contract?).

Burly
Herrera
Winn
JJ
Libby
McGreevy

Matthews
Roby/Hence (one hopefully will pan out)
Bernal


Fringe:
Pages
Donovan or get a haul
Victor Scott


Trade pieces IMO if can restore:
Noot
Gorman
Donny if we don't keep him
Crooks

Possible down the line?
Baez
Raniel
Padilla


Current trade pieces:
Matz
Helsley
Maton
Romero

maybe could get something if can restore (Fedde) and if willing to waive no-trade, Arenado


We have some wiggle room to do some things to rebuild this if done right, rather quickly.

Thx meat

I'd a huge Donny fan too, I extend him and build around him and his leadership but agree w/all your other trade chips.

There's roughly $42.6M falling off the books from expired deals.

NADO reduces to $27M -$5M from Rockies -$3M deferred to $19M

Gray jumps +$10M.

ARB raises ($15M est.)

Total:
$90M 2026 payroll (est)

So if BDWJr takes the payroll to $150M (nothing crazy so relax cranny, but well below the $175-180M he gave Mo) then C. Bloom could have as much as $60M to spend on trade targets and Free agents!

With our attendance figures this year, I think $150M is wildly optimistic. BDW killed the goose that layed the golden eggs...

I think Bill knows he's got to "spend money to make money" and for him to make (a lot of) money he needs that 3+M back.

A $150M payroll for this market is still low, he can easily afford that.

And if Bloom makes wise use of it and the team rebounds to a 90+ win team, then he'll draw 3+M again.

BUT

Dewitt also has to get rid of Oli who has too much "Mo stank" on him to stay around in 2026.

A very, very large portion of the (potential) paying fan base dislikes Oli and see's him as part of the problem and NOT part of the solution to turning this around.

And they're right, he's NOT a good Manager.

[Cranny]

Many posters have suggested that the Cards should get back to the $175-180 million spending level. Let’s see what that would do.

Dodgers - $337.8 million
Mets - $331.3 million
Yanks - $290.3 million
Phillies - $279.4 million
Jays - $245.9 million
Astros - $221.3 million
Rangers - $218.7 million
Braves - $211.7 million
Padres - $209.0 million
Cubs - $195.4 million
Giants - $195.3 million
Angels - $193.9 million
Red Sox - $190.8 million
Diamondbacks - $188.9 million
Cardinals - 175-180 million

Maybe just throwing money at it won’t do the trick.
The strength will have to come mainly through the system. Draft well. Develop well. Trade as necessary to fill holes.

Keep it up Toady Front Office Footstool.

cranny = king of all sycophants

C. Bloom/R.Cerfolio can only do so much via the draft & development route.

If they find one FOTR #1 starter and one all-star position player in the next five years via the draft & development route, then they've done more than Mo and his gang have for years.

But that won't be even close to enough to make them WS contenders.

Unless BDWJr takes the payroll back to $180+M, this team is destined for years of mediocre baseball.

Poor take cranny.........as usual

So what’s your solution, Rock?

BDWjr has done a good thing removing Mo and replacing him w/two smart young baseball execs.

Next would be removing Oli at seasons end and replacing him w/an experience major league Manager.

Finally, he has to give Bloom "some" money (+$35-40M above this season payroll would be a good start) to fill in the holes on this roster (starting pitcher, MOTO hitter).

Nothing crazy (re: NOT K. Tucker) but definitely an upgrade.

That’s reasonable and makes sense.

Thx

with all the expirings we have coming off, that would be $45 mill and Arenado's salary seems to be going down (assuming we don't trade him). Factor in if we got $35-$40 mill (won't happen) but that would be $80 million to get some players. Could make a real dent if we go after a superstar type with our other talent we are developing. It is fine to build if build smart, but still got to do both. Totally agree with you Rock! Have a golden opportunity if JJ pans out and hit on our #5 pick. To me, below is the core based on age (Love Donny - my fav current Cardinal, but do you build around him or trade him if can get a haul due to age and contract?).

Burly
Herrera
Winn
JJ
Libby
McGreevy

Matthews
Roby/Hence (one hopefully will pan out)
Bernal


Fringe:
Pages
Donovan or get a haul
Victor Scott


Trade pieces IMO if can restore:
Noot
Gorman
Donny if we don't keep him
Crooks

Possible down the line?
Baez
Raniel
Padilla


Current trade pieces:
Matz
Helsley
Maton
Romero

maybe could get something if can restore (Fedde) and if willing to waive no-trade, Arenado


We have some wiggle room to do some things to rebuild this if done right, rather quickly.

Thx meat

I'd a huge Donny fan too, I extend him and build around him and his leadership but agree w/all your other trade chips.

There's roughly $42.6M falling off the books from expired deals.

NADO reduces to $27M -$5M from Rockies -$3M deferred to $19M

Gray jumps +$10M.

ARB raises ($15M est.)

Total:
$90M 2026 payroll (est)

So if BDWJr takes the payroll to $150M (nothing crazy so relax cranny, but well below the $175-180M he gave Mo) then C. Bloom could have as much as $60M to spend on trade targets and Free agents!

With our attendance figures this year, I think $150M is wildly optimistic. BDW killed the goose that layed the golden eggs...

I think Bill knows he's got to "spend money to make money" and for him to make (a lot of) money he needs that 3+M back.

A $150M payroll for this market is still low, he can easily afford that.

And if Bloom makes wise use of it and the team rebounds to a 90+ win team, then he'll draw 3+M again.

BUT

Dewitt also has to get rid of Oli who has too much "Mo stank" on him to stay around in 2026.

A very, very large portion of the (potential) paying fan base dislikes Oli and see's him as part of the problem and NOT part of the solution to turning this around.

And they're right, he's NOT a good Manager.

I don't get why the players like and respect him.

[rockondlouie]

Many posters have suggested that the Cards should get back to the $175-180 million spending level. Let’s see what that would do.

Dodgers - $337.8 million
Mets - $331.3 million
Yanks - $290.3 million
Phillies - $279.4 million
Jays - $245.9 million
Astros - $221.3 million
Rangers - $218.7 million
Braves - $211.7 million
Padres - $209.0 million
Cubs - $195.4 million
Giants - $195.3 million
Angels - $193.9 million
Red Sox - $190.8 million
Diamondbacks - $188.9 million
Cardinals - 175-180 million

Maybe just throwing money at it won’t do the trick.
The strength will have to come mainly through the system. Draft well. Develop well. Trade as necessary to fill holes.

Keep it up Toady Front Office Footstool.

cranny = king of all sycophants

C. Bloom/R.Cerfolio can only do so much via the draft & development route.

If they find one FOTR #1 starter and one all-star position player in the next five years via the draft & development route, then they've done more than Mo and his gang have for years.

But that won't be even close to enough to make them WS contenders.

Unless BDWJr takes the payroll back to $180+M, this team is destined for years of mediocre baseball.

Poor take cranny.........as usual

So what’s your solution, Rock?

BDWjr has done a good thing removing Mo and replacing him w/two smart young baseball execs.

Next would be removing Oli at seasons end and replacing him w/an experience major league Manager.

Finally, he has to give Bloom "some" money (+$35-40M above this season payroll would be a good start) to fill in the holes on this roster (starting pitcher, MOTO hitter).

Nothing crazy (re: NOT K. Tucker) but definitely an upgrade.

That’s reasonable and makes sense.

Thx

with all the expirings we have coming off, that would be $45 mill and Arenado's salary seems to be going down (assuming we don't trade him). Factor in if we got $35-$40 mill (won't happen) but that would be $80 million to get some players. Could make a real dent if we go after a superstar type with our other talent we are developing. It is fine to build if build smart, but still got to do both. Totally agree with you Rock! Have a golden opportunity if JJ pans out and hit on our #5 pick. To me, below is the core based on age (Love Donny - my fav current Cardinal, but do you build around him or trade him if can get a haul due to age and contract?).

Burly
Herrera
Winn
JJ
Libby
McGreevy

Matthews
Roby/Hence (one hopefully will pan out)
Bernal


Fringe:
Pages
Donovan or get a haul
Victor Scott


Trade pieces IMO if can restore:
Noot
Gorman
Donny if we don't keep him
Crooks

Possible down the line?
Baez
Raniel
Padilla


Current trade pieces:
Matz
Helsley
Maton
Romero

maybe could get something if can restore (Fedde) and if willing to waive no-trade, Arenado


We have some wiggle room to do some things to rebuild this if done right, rather quickly.

Thx meat

I'd a huge Donny fan too, I extend him and build around him and his leadership but agree w/all your other trade chips.

There's roughly $42.6M falling off the books from expired deals.

NADO reduces to $27M -$5M from Rockies -$3M deferred to $19M

Gray jumps +$10M.

ARB raises ($15M est.)

Total:
$90M 2026 payroll (est)

So if BDWJr takes the payroll to $150M (nothing crazy so relax cranny, but well below the $175-180M he gave Mo) then C. Bloom could have as much as $60M to spend on trade targets and Free agents!

With our attendance figures this year, I think $150M is wildly optimistic. BDW killed the goose that layed the golden eggs...

I think Bill knows he's got to "spend money to make money" and for him to make (a lot of) money he needs that 3+M back.

A $150M payroll for this market is still low, he can easily afford that.

And if Bloom makes wise use of it and the team rebounds to a 90+ win team, then he'll draw 3+M again.

BUT

Dewitt also has to get rid of Oli who has too much "Mo stank" on him to stay around in 2026.

A very, very large portion of the (potential) paying fan base dislikes Oli and see's him as part of the problem and NOT part of the solution to turning this around.

And they're right, he's NOT a good Manager.

I don't get why the players like and respect him.

Liking does not = Good manager

Not a good in game strategist, get's out managed by opposing managers all the time.

Sets a very poor lineup that doesn't put hitters in the right lineup slot, doesn't show any creativity creating scoring chances and is very predictable.

He belongs back in minor league baseball, he has a player development mindset that's suited for AA/AAA.

[Cranny]

Many posters have suggested that the Cards should get back to the $175-180 million spending level. Let’s see what that would do.

Dodgers - $337.8 million
Mets - $331.3 million
Yanks - $290.3 million
Phillies - $279.4 million
Jays - $245.9 million
Astros - $221.3 million
Rangers - $218.7 million
Braves - $211.7 million
Padres - $209.0 million
Cubs - $195.4 million
Giants - $195.3 million
Angels - $193.9 million
Red Sox - $190.8 million
Diamondbacks - $188.9 million
Cardinals - 175-180 million

Maybe just throwing money at it won’t do the trick.
The strength will have to come mainly through the system. Draft well. Develop well. Trade as necessary to fill holes.

Keep it up Toady Front Office Footstool.

cranny = king of all sycophants

C. Bloom/R.Cerfolio can only do so much via the draft & development route.

If they find one FOTR #1 starter and one all-star position player in the next five years via the draft & development route, then they've done more than Mo and his gang have for years.

But that won't be even close to enough to make them WS contenders.

Unless BDWJr takes the payroll back to $180+M, this team is destined for years of mediocre baseball.

Poor take cranny.........as usual

So what’s your solution, Rock?

BDWjr has done a good thing removing Mo and replacing him w/two smart young baseball execs.

Next would be removing Oli at seasons end and replacing him w/an experience major league Manager.

Finally, he has to give Bloom "some" money (+$35-40M above this season payroll would be a good start) to fill in the holes on this roster (starting pitcher, MOTO hitter).

Nothing crazy (re: NOT K. Tucker) but definitely an upgrade.

That’s reasonable and makes sense.

Thx

with all the expirings we have coming off, that would be $45 mill and Arenado's salary seems to be going down (assuming we don't trade him). Factor in if we got $35-$40 mill (won't happen) but that would be $80 million to get some players. Could make a real dent if we go after a superstar type with our other talent we are developing. It is fine to build if build smart, but still got to do both. Totally agree with you Rock! Have a golden opportunity if JJ pans out and hit on our #5 pick. To me, below is the core based on age (Love Donny - my fav current Cardinal, but do you build around him or trade him if can get a haul due to age and contract?).

Burly
Herrera
Winn
JJ
Libby
McGreevy

Matthews
Roby/Hence (one hopefully will pan out)
Bernal


Fringe:
Pages
Donovan or get a haul
Victor Scott


Trade pieces IMO if can restore:
Noot
Gorman
Donny if we don't keep him
Crooks

Possible down the line?
Baez
Raniel
Padilla


Current trade pieces:
Matz
Helsley
Maton
Romero

maybe could get something if can restore (Fedde) and if willing to waive no-trade, Arenado


We have some wiggle room to do some things to rebuild this if done right, rather quickly.

Thx meat

I'd a huge Donny fan too, I extend him and build around him and his leadership but agree w/all your other trade chips.

There's roughly $42.6M falling off the books from expired deals.

NADO reduces to $27M -$5M from Rockies -$3M deferred to $19M

Gray jumps +$10M.

ARB raises ($15M est.)

Total:
$90M 2026 payroll (est)

So if BDWJr takes the payroll to $150M (nothing crazy so relax cranny, but well below the $175-180M he gave Mo) then C. Bloom could have as much as $60M to spend on trade targets and Free agents!

With our attendance figures this year, I think $150M is wildly optimistic. BDW killed the goose that layed the golden eggs...

I think Bill knows he's got to "spend money to make money" and for him to make (a lot of) money he needs that 3+M back.

A $150M payroll for this market is still low, he can easily afford that.

And if Bloom makes wise use of it and the team rebounds to a 90+ win team, then he'll draw 3+M again.

BUT

Dewitt also has to get rid of Oli who has too much "Mo stank" on him to stay around in 2026.

A very, very large portion of the (potential) paying fan base dislikes Oli and see's him as part of the problem and NOT part of the solution to turning this around.

And they're right, he's NOT a good Manager.

I don't get why the players like and respect him.

Liking does not = Good manager

Not a good in game strategist, get's out managed by opposing managers all the time.

Sets a very poor lineup that doesn't put hitters in the right lineup slot, doesn't show any creativity creating scoring chances and is very predictable.

He belongs back in minor league baseball, he has a player development mindset that's suited for AA/AAA.

Thank you for your opinion.

[An Old Friend]

Should've gone all in on Bryce Harper when they had the chance.
Should've gone all in on Juan Soto when they had the chance.

I have no faith that current ownership has what it takes to get this franchise back to where it belongs. They lost their will to win and massively took the fan base for granted. It's tough to recover a brand when the leadership in place for the fall stays in place.

[Cranny]

Should've gone all in on Bryce Harper when they had the chance.
Should've gone all in on Juan Soto when they had the chance.

I have no faith that current ownership has what it takes to get this franchise back to where it belongs. They lost their will to win and massively took the fan base for granted. It's tough to recover a brand when the leadership in place for the fall stays in place.

Thanks - very original post.

[desertrat23]

Should've gone all in on Bryce Harper when they had the chance.
Should've gone all in on Juan Soto when they had the chance.

I have no faith that current ownership has what it takes to get this franchise back to where it belongs. They lost their will to win and massively took the fan base for granted. It's tough to recover a brand when the leadership in place for the fall stays in place.

Thanks - very original post.

They’ve done nothing to rebuild the faith of the fanbase, so it bears repeating. Why does that bother you so much? Truth hurts?