Would Marco Rossi Be A Good Fit For The St. Louis Blues?

[seattleblue]

The Blues expected Schwartz to depart in free agency (to Seatle) so they didn't protect him. Seattle didn't need to select him, they selected Dunn when Armstrong protected the guy who hit Thomas that time in the Finals, did you see that big hit? What a physical hitter! and crushed Armstrong's mind and thus our hopes for years.

This is very true. Letting Dunn go was Doug's biggest mistake.

I still think Dunn is not very good defensively and you need to shelter him when it really matters or else you're asking to lose, so I didn't mind losing him as much as I minded keeping Krug. Krug is close to pitiful. Maybe one standard deviation above pitiful.

[Backesdraft]

But there’s a reason why MIN is looking to trade him. Rossi was demoted to 4C in the playoffs because he was super ineffective once the physicality increased. Part of that could simply be that it was his first playoffs and he’ll learn and get better. But he’s always going to be 5’9”. Size matters, especially in the playoffs. And at C.

This is why I am not thrilled about taking a center under 6' asking him to play 2C and defend in the playoffs. Drafting Cootes isn't the same as drafting 5'9" but that's why I wanted to be sold on an extra defensive sense. If Cootes doesn't have an extra defensive sense why are we interested? Aren't we buying a similar situation?

I’m confused how people keep bringing up Dean as if he’s destined for the big club. He’s been lapped by so many other, younger prospects. Dean isn’t happening.

[Old_Goat]

But there’s a reason why MIN is looking to trade him. Rossi was demoted to 4C in the playoffs because he was super ineffective once the physicality increased. Part of that could simply be that it was his first playoffs and he’ll learn and get better. But he’s always going to be 5’9”. Size matters, especially in the playoffs. And at C.

This is why I am not thrilled about taking a center under 6' asking him to play 2C and defend in the playoffs. Drafting Cootes isn't the same as drafting 5'9" but that's why I wanted to be sold on an extra defensive sense. If Cootes doesn't have an extra defensive sense why are we interested? Aren't we buying a similar situation?

I’m confused how people keep bringing up Dean as if he’s destined for the big club. He’s been lapped by so many other, younger prospects. Dean isn’t happening.

I believe I may have been the one to bring up Dean's name on this post?...I don't disagree with you. I don't even know exactly what his injury was and if it's fully recoverable. That's why I say assuming he's still not ready, as well as it's his last chance season. If he does not show something exceptional in pre-season, then he's Springfield-bound for the duration, or a throw-in on something else.
Case closed.

[STL fan in MN]

But there’s a reason why MIN is looking to trade him. Rossi was demoted to 4C in the playoffs because he was super ineffective once the physicality increased. Part of that could simply be that it was his first playoffs and he’ll learn and get better. But he’s always going to be 5’9”. Size matters, especially in the playoffs. And at C.

This is why I am not thrilled about taking a center under 6' asking him to play 2C and defend in the playoffs. Drafting Cootes isn't the same as drafting 5'9" but that's why I wanted to be sold on an extra defensive sense. If Cootes doesn't have an extra defensive sense why are we interested? Aren't we buying a similar situation?

I’m confused how people keep bringing up Dean as if he’s destined for the big club. He’s been lapped by so many other, younger prospects. Dean isn’t happening.

In what way has he been lapped by so many? By whom? He didn’t perform poorly, he was just injured. When he returned late this season, he played well. He still has the same bottom-6 C potential I saw in him when we first acquired him. The injury just delayed his timeline a bit IMO.

That said, this upcoming season will be big for him. He needs to stay healthy. I don’t see him likely winning a spot in camp but if he can stay healthy, I’d hope he’s pushing for some NHL games at some point this upcoming season when there’s the inevitable injuries to others.

[Backesdraft]

But there’s a reason why MIN is looking to trade him. Rossi was demoted to 4C in the playoffs because he was super ineffective once the physicality increased. Part of that could simply be that it was his first playoffs and he’ll learn and get better. But he’s always going to be 5’9”. Size matters, especially in the playoffs. And at C.

This is why I am not thrilled about taking a center under 6' asking him to play 2C and defend in the playoffs. Drafting Cootes isn't the same as drafting 5'9" but that's why I wanted to be sold on an extra defensive sense. If Cootes doesn't have an extra defensive sense why are we interested? Aren't we buying a similar situation?

I’m confused how people keep bringing up Dean as if he’s destined for the big club. He’s been lapped by so many other, younger prospects. Dean isn’t happening.

In what way has he been lapped by so many? By whom? He didn’t perform poorly, he was just injured. When he returned late this season, he played well. He still has the same bottom-6 C potential I saw in him when we first acquired him. The injury just delayed his timeline a bit IMO.

That said, this upcoming season will be big for him. He needs to stay healthy. I don’t see him likely winning a spot in camp but if he can stay healthy, I’d hope he’s pushing for some NHL games at some point this upcoming season when there’s the inevitable injuries to others.

Come on. Would you not say the likes of Snuggy, Dvo, Boldy, and even guys like Stancl and Robertson have passed Dean on the depth chart?

[sdaltons]

But there’s a reason why MIN is looking to trade him. Rossi was demoted to 4C in the playoffs because he was super ineffective once the physicality increased. Part of that could simply be that it was his first playoffs and he’ll learn and get better. But he’s always going to be 5’9”. Size matters, especially in the playoffs. And at C.

This is why I am not thrilled about taking a center under 6' asking him to play 2C and defend in the playoffs. Drafting Cootes isn't the same as drafting 5'9" but that's why I wanted to be sold on an extra defensive sense. If Cootes doesn't have an extra defensive sense why are we interested? Aren't we buying a similar situation?

I’m confused how people keep bringing up Dean as if he’s destined for the big club. He’s been lapped by so many other, younger prospects. Dean isn’t happening.

In what way has he been lapped by so many? By whom? He didn’t perform poorly, he was just injured. When he returned late this season, he played well. He still has the same bottom-6 C potential I saw in him when we first acquired him. The injury just delayed his timeline a bit IMO.

That said, this upcoming season will be big for him. He needs to stay healthy. I don’t see him likely winning a spot in camp but if he can stay healthy, I’d hope he’s pushing for some NHL games at some point this upcoming season when there’s the inevitable injuries to others.

Come on. Would you not say the likes of Snuggy, Dvo, Boldy, and even guys like Stancl and Robertson have passed Dean on the depth chart?

They have different roles. Dvo, for example, is not coming here to be 4C.

[STL fan in MN]

But there’s a reason why MIN is looking to trade him. Rossi was demoted to 4C in the playoffs because he was super ineffective once the physicality increased. Part of that could simply be that it was his first playoffs and he’ll learn and get better. But he’s always going to be 5’9”. Size matters, especially in the playoffs. And at C.

This is why I am not thrilled about taking a center under 6' asking him to play 2C and defend in the playoffs. Drafting Cootes isn't the same as drafting 5'9" but that's why I wanted to be sold on an extra defensive sense. If Cootes doesn't have an extra defensive sense why are we interested? Aren't we buying a similar situation?

I’m confused how people keep bringing up Dean as if he’s destined for the big club. He’s been lapped by so many other, younger prospects. Dean isn’t happening.

In what way has he been lapped by so many? By whom? He didn’t perform poorly, he was just injured. When he returned late this season, he played well. He still has the same bottom-6 C potential I saw in him when we first acquired him. The injury just delayed his timeline a bit IMO.

That said, this upcoming season will be big for him. He needs to stay healthy. I don’t see him likely winning a spot in camp but if he can stay healthy, I’d hope he’s pushing for some NHL games at some point this upcoming season when there’s the inevitable injuries to others.

Come on. Would you not say the likes of Snuggy, Dvo, Boldy, and even guys like Stancl and Robertson have passed Dean on the depth chart?

Well most of those guys aren’t centers, Dvorsky was always ahead of him and no, Stancl and especially Robertsson are still behind him.

As soon as he re-entered the lineup he spent 1 game on the 4th line to get his feet wet/get back up to speed and then he was right back into the T-birds top-6. Was one of their more impactful forwards in the playoff series vs Providence.

[netboy65]

The Blues expected Schwartz to depart in free agency (to Seatle) so they didn't protect him. Seattle didn't need to select him, they selected Dunn when Armstrong protected the guy who hit Thomas that time in the Finals, did you see that big hit? What a physical hitter! and crushed Armstrong's mind and thus our hopes for years.

Krug had just signed here the year before, no way we weren’t protecting him

[sdaltons]

The Blues expected Schwartz to depart in free agency (to Seatle) so they didn't protect him. Seattle didn't need to select him, they selected Dunn when Armstrong protected the guy who hit Thomas that time in the Finals, did you see that big hit? What a physical hitter! and crushed Armstrong's mind and thus our hopes for years.

The Seattle/Schwartz thing was a little shady. They were able to talk with free agents early and if they signed any, that would count as their expansion selection from the player's prior team.

So everyone knew Schwartz was signing there, but by waiting to announce it, they were also able to take Dunn from us.

[Backesdraft]

But there’s a reason why MIN is looking to trade him. Rossi was demoted to 4C in the playoffs because he was super ineffective once the physicality increased. Part of that could simply be that it was his first playoffs and he’ll learn and get better. But he’s always going to be 5’9”. Size matters, especially in the playoffs. And at C.

This is why I am not thrilled about taking a center under 6' asking him to play 2C and defend in the playoffs. Drafting Cootes isn't the same as drafting 5'9" but that's why I wanted to be sold on an extra defensive sense. If Cootes doesn't have an extra defensive sense why are we interested? Aren't we buying a similar situation?

I’m confused how people keep bringing up Dean as if he’s destined for the big club. He’s been lapped by so many other, younger prospects. Dean isn’t happening.

In what way has he been lapped by so many? By whom? He didn’t perform poorly, he was just injured. When he returned late this season, he played well. He still has the same bottom-6 C potential I saw in him when we first acquired him. The injury just delayed his timeline a bit IMO.

That said, this upcoming season will be big for him. He needs to stay healthy. I don’t see him likely winning a spot in camp but if he can stay healthy, I’d hope he’s pushing for some NHL games at some point this upcoming season when there’s the inevitable injuries to others.

Come on. Would you not say the likes of Snuggy, Dvo, Boldy, and even guys like Stancl and Robertson have passed Dean on the depth chart?

They have different roles. Dvo, for example, is not coming here to be 4C.

Is the argument then that Dean is, from a prospect perspective, on the same wavelength as Dvo because of positional expectations? That’s literally WHY Dvo (to just name one) has lapped Dean. Dvo is projected as our future #2 center and we’re debating whether or not Dean could even cut it as our #4.

[BluesDom]

He's not going to be available. He will remain in MN.

[Sophisticated Shoes]

Blues have DD arriving likely later this year and they have Dean, who ideally would fill #3C. Blues either bring in an older C/Wing during the transition or not, but why sign a guy like Rossi when the team is only a year away from Dvorsky?
I'm not saying it couldn't happen, but it seems a guy like Grandlund, if he still plays Center, would be a better way to allocate resources as we await DD/Dean.

I'm not sure what Dean has done to make you think he could fill the #3C any time soon. Dvorsky is also a bit farther away than I think many of us would like him to be. I don't want Rossi, but if they get another center, they are not blocking Dvorsky. Blues will be better off with Schenn moving to wing eventually also.

Which is why you sign a guy like Grandlund, did you miss that part? I think you did. Dean will get a chance early, we'll know if he sticks, or not right away. DD will likely play some wing later in the year, or maybe 3C if he leaps forward in his development.

[noted]

Blues have DD arriving likely later this year and they have Dean, who ideally would fill #3C. Blues either bring in an older C/Wing during the transition or not, but why sign a guy like Rossi when the team is only a year away from Dvorsky?
I'm not saying it couldn't happen, but it seems a guy like Grandlund, if he still plays Center, would be a better way to allocate resources as we await DD/Dean.

I'm not sure what Dean has done to make you think he could fill the #3C any time soon. Dvorsky is also a bit farther away than I think many of us would like him to be. I don't want Rossi, but if they get another center, they are not blocking Dvorsky. Blues will be better off with Schenn moving to wing eventually also.

Which is why you sign a guy like Grandlund, did you miss that part? I think you did. Dean will get a chance early, we'll know if he sticks, or not right away. DD will likely play some wing later in the year, or maybe 3C if he leaps forward in his development.

I’m all for the Granlund signing but he played wing for the Stars and appears to be more effective there. Dean also played wing when he came back at end of year.

[tfriede2]

Who is the last successful NHL center that was 5’9”?

Marco Rossi

[somni]

But there’s a reason why MIN is looking to trade him. Rossi was demoted to 4C in the playoffs because he was super ineffective once the physicality increased. Part of that could simply be that it was his first playoffs and he’ll learn and get better. But he’s always going to be 5’9”. Size matters, especially in the playoffs. And at C.

This is why I am not thrilled about taking a center under 6' asking him to play 2C and defend in the playoffs. Drafting Cootes isn't the same as drafting 5'9" but that's why I wanted to be sold on an extra defensive sense. If Cootes doesn't have an extra defensive sense why are we interested? Aren't we buying a similar situation?

I’m confused how people keep bringing up Dean as if he’s destined for the big club. He’s been lapped by so many other, younger prospects. Dean isn’t happening.

In what way has he been lapped by so many? By whom? He didn’t perform poorly, he was just injured. When he returned late this season, he played well. He still has the same bottom-6 C potential I saw in him when we first acquired him. The injury just delayed his timeline a bit IMO.

That said, this upcoming season will be big for him. He needs to stay healthy. I don’t see him likely winning a spot in camp but if he can stay healthy, I’d hope he’s pushing for some NHL games at some point this upcoming season when there’s the inevitable injuries to others.

Come on. Would you not say the likes of Snuggy, Dvo, Boldy, and even guys like Stancl and Robertson have passed Dean on the depth chart?

They have different roles. Dvo, for example, is not coming here to be 4C.

Is the argument then that Dean is, from a prospect perspective, on the same wavelength as Dvo because of positional expectations? That’s literally WHY Dvo (to just name one) has lapped Dean. Dvo is projected as our future #2 center and we’re debating whether or not Dean could even cut it as our #4.

Dean will be fine. His injury delayed him a year, otherwise he may very well be competing for a spot this year. As MN said, he needs a healthy season this year and will hopefully be a call up later in the year.

He has one more year on his current contract and then he's an RFA. So the Blues will still have his rights.

[Lone_Ranger]

Who is the last successful NHL center that was 5’9”?

yanni gourde?

Ok last successful center 5’9” that played top 6 role?

Bedard's 5'10", like 1 inch is a big deal? Today's game accommodates the smaller player now anyway.

In what ways has the game accommodated to smaller players? Especially in the playoffs?

And Bedard is a generational talent. So Rossi is both shorter and less skilled. And Bedard is going to have to improve at being a C if he wants to stick at C. His faceoff % this season was 38%. That’s simply unsustainable. And he’s destroyed on the defensive metrics too. Part of that is he’s simply 19 and he’ll get better but the size disadvantage sure doesn’t help and will be a detriment his entire career.

If Rossi had Bedard level skill then this would be a different conversation. But he doesn’t.

Nathan Walker is 5'9" and he plays big. You can't say the game today doesn't accommodate smaller players as compared to yesteryear cause it does. You see smaller D men now. It's all about speed and pushing the pace up ice. Having a couple small players in the lineup is different than fielding a small team. I don't want a small team but at the same time there's a place in the lineup for a smaller guy if he's a gamer. Like when Fabbri came up his first year and gave the team a boost in the playoffs in 16. The Blues were a heavy team that year, but Fabbri fit in well and helped us out that post season quite a bit.

Walker is a 4th line winger we’re paying league minimum to. That is not remotely comparable to having that sized of a player as your 2C and paying him ~ $7M/year.

Fabbri was also a winger. And I’d bet his size sure didn’t help his injury risk. That’s also a risk with smaller players. Jaden Schwartz has always been one of my favorite players but there’s no denying he gets a lot of injuries. And there’s a reason why the Blues moved on from him when he reached UFA and could command quite a bit more money.

Can you articulate any of the ways in which the game accommodates small players now? Particularly in the playoffs? How are those small d-men doing in the playoffs?

I'm not saying I advocate small D men, I'm just saying there's more of them. Tkachuk's recommendation to draft Perunovich was horrible.