"Championship or bust" Mentality

[STL Cardinal Fan 24]

A recent podcast had this discussion amongst different fanbase podcasters:

https://youtu.be/VnIp-yc7d2s?si=YjDy7BkUuiPsbr85

I'm firmly in the "keep me entertained" category. Personally, I want the team to be in the playoff hunt for a long as possible. It keeps me entertained for the summer. A championship is the ultimate fun, of course, but I won't be upset when they don't.

Its about the ride, ya'll.

[mattmitchl44]

I don't think it should be exactly "championship or bust" - but for an organization with as robust a history of winning WS and NL pennants as the Cardinals, it should be about always wanting to be a position where you are one of top 3-4 teams in the NL on an almost-every-year basis.

If you are doing that, maybe you only make it to the WS every 5 years and win one WS title a decade, but that seems like were an organization like the Cardinals should be positioning itself.

When have the Cardinals' history, just limping into the playoffs as a WC, or even winning the NL Central just to get bounced in the first round of the playoffs shouldn't be the bar.

[desertrat23]

A recent podcast had this discussion amongst different fanbase podcasters:

https://youtu.be/VnIp-yc7d2s?si=YjDy7BkUuiPsbr85

I'm firmly in the "keep me entertained" category. Personally, I want the team to be in the playoff hunt for a long as possible. It keeps me entertained for the summer. A championship is the ultimate fun, of course, but I won't be upset when they don't.

Its about the ride, ya'll.

It’s about the ride in Little League. In the big leagues, they get paid to win.

[STL Cardinal Fan 24]

It’s about the ride in Little League. In the big leagues, they get paid to win.

We arent in the big leagues, though. I'm talking about the fans and their perspective on fandom.

Also, I'd say its their job to entertain. I'm suggesting being entertained is about the ride. I'm glad the Cardinals arent tanking to look for championships down the road.

[bretto12]

The Cards should always "want" to win the WS, but that is not realistic. PLayers age or under perform. Late draft picks make it hard to stay a championship caliber team. Free Agency has tilted the game to the big market teams and they will continue to buy talent. If a club can stay in the hunt for 3 to 5 years before needing to reload, I would say that is a solid franchise.

[Ozziesfan41]

I’m in the category of I want to be entertained but I want the feeling that if they do make it to the post season they have a chance to win and it’s been a long time since I have had that feeling. The last few years I’ve had the feeling even if they make it to the post season they will be one and done they don’t have a chance against the good post season teams and

[desertrat23]

It’s about the ride in Little League. In the big leagues, they get paid to win.

We arent in the big leagues, though. I'm talking about the fans and their perspective on fandom.

Also, I'd say its their job to entertain. I'm suggesting being entertained is about the ride. I'm glad the Cardinals arent tanking to look for championships down the road.

No argument that they shouldn't tank -- but they shouldn't need to. They have plenty of resources to build a sustainable model that allows them to be serious pennant contenders annually. No, they're not going to win every year -- and despite what the sycophants around here say, no one really expects that. But there's no excuse for not TRYING to win every year. If the fanbase shows up to the tune of 3.2-3.4 million every year with an "aw shucks, I just like a day at the ol' ballyard" attitude and have no expectations for a quality product, what's the incentive for ownership to invest? If I draw the same amount of fans with a mediocre product, why pay for a winning one?

As has been said elsewhere on this thread, being a top 3-4 team in the NL should be the baseline. No more of this "squeak into the wild card or win a weak division" nonsense. Can you compete with the Dodgers or Mets financially? No. Can you compete with the Atlantas/Arizonas/San Diegos of the world? (bleep) right.

[Cusecards]

Money is always going to be an issue and unfortunately the Cards can’t go head to head with the Dodgers, Mets, etc due to differences in revenue.
That being said I think they are TRYING to win but erred in JUDGMENT on some players/moves.
A little luck can also be involved especially when you factor in health/injuries.

[RamFan08NY]

A recent podcast had this discussion amongst different fanbase podcasters:

https://youtu.be/VnIp-yc7d2s?si=YjDy7BkUuiPsbr85

I'm firmly in the "keep me entertained" category. Personally, I want the team to be in the playoff hunt for a long as possible. It keeps me entertained for the summer. A championship is the ultimate fun, of course, but I won't be upset when they don't.

Its about the ride, ya'll.

It’s about the ride in Little League. In the big leagues, they get paid to win.

I haven't received any of that payment yet, so for me , I just want to see them in the playoffs every year. I know that is not sustainable but they usually give us that. Once in, there is a chance.

With that said, entertainment is important too, and this team with its mix of youth and vets, they haven't disappointed. They ARE entertaining.

[JDW]

A recent podcast had this discussion amongst different fanbase podcasters:

https://youtu.be/VnIp-yc7d2s?si=YjDy7BkUuiPsbr85

I'm firmly in the "keep me entertained" category. Personally, I want the team to be in the playoff hunt for a long as possible. It keeps me entertained for the summer. A championship is the ultimate fun, of course, but I won't be upset when they don't.

Its about the ride, ya'll.

It’s about the ride in Little League. In the big leagues, they get paid to win.

Pretty sure the Rockie players are getting paid.

[mattmitchl44]

I'm glad the Cardinals arent tanking to look for championships down the road.

It depends on where the current health of the organization really is.

If they are not close to being in that top 3-4 in the NL on an almost-every-year basis, then taking a step back from trying to compete (call it "tanking" or "reloading" or whatever) may be the quickest way to get back to being in the top 3-4 in the NL. Sometimes you do have to take a step back to take two or three steps forward.

Being "mediocre" and continuing on a strategy (not "tanking" or "reloading" or whatever) which keeps you just "mediocre" isn't the way forward.

[desertrat23]

A recent podcast had this discussion amongst different fanbase podcasters:

https://youtu.be/VnIp-yc7d2s?si=YjDy7BkUuiPsbr85

I'm firmly in the "keep me entertained" category. Personally, I want the team to be in the playoff hunt for a long as possible. It keeps me entertained for the summer. A championship is the ultimate fun, of course, but I won't be upset when they don't.

Its about the ride, ya'll.

It’s about the ride in Little League. In the big leagues, they get paid to win.

Pretty sure the Rockie players are getting paid.

And if their owner cared, he'd find better players.

[thetank2]

I'm glad the Cardinals arent tanking to look for championships down the road.

It depends on where the current health of the organization really is.

If they are not close to being in that top 3-4 in the NL on an almost-every-year basis, then taking a step back from trying to compete (call it "tanking" or "reloading" or whatever) may be the quickest way to get back to being in the top 3-4 in the NL. Sometimes you do have to take a step back to take two or three steps forward.

Being "mediocre" and continuing on a strategy (not "tanking" or "reloading" or whatever) which keeps you just "mediocre" isn't the way forward.

Well, they didn't tank and now if they trade for a position player or sign one we would have to sit one of our young position player. The infield isn't going away and neither is the OF. We have JJ and Sagesse in the minors.

They could use a future SP for next year who may be in the minors. Tanking doesn't get you the best draft picks anymore. SP is a concern next year unless starters stay healthy.

[thetank2]

Money is always going to be an issue and unfortunately the Cards can’t go head to head with the Dodgers, Mets, etc due to differences in revenue.
That being said I think they are TRYING to win but erred in JUDGMENT on some players/moves.
A little luck can also be involved especially when you factor in health/injuries.

Erred? I don't see replacing any of their position players from outside until 2027. Perhaps catcher. SP next year perhaps.

If Scott, Herrera, Nootbaar and Walker had hit this well last year they probably would have won 90.

[blackinkbiz]

A recent podcast had this discussion amongst different fanbase podcasters:

https://youtu.be/VnIp-yc7d2s?si=YjDy7BkUuiPsbr85

I'm firmly in the "keep me entertained" category. Personally, I want the team to be in the playoff hunt for a long as possible. It keeps me entertained for the summer. A championship is the ultimate fun, of course, but I won't be upset when they don't.

Its about the ride, ya'll.

Could not agree more. If you've already witnessed your team win a championship and you live by this "championship or bust" mentality, you honestly have something mentally or emotionally wrong with you. I've seen STL teams win 4 championships, 1 Rams, 2 Cards, 1 Blues, and all the way up until the last game, the ride, the camaraderie, the intrigue and anxiety are all a fantastic distraction from real life. But the instant the last game's over, the ride comes to an abrupt end. I sure as h*ll didn't feel some lasting sense of accomplishment or fulfillment from witnessing the team that represents my city win a championship.

Actually, it was the opposite the first time it happened. I was stunned by the feeling of emptiness afterward, because there were no more games, no more group events that everyone is excited for one cause, it's just over.

So compete as much as possible, prolong each season as much as possible, keep the product exciting and successful. IMO, going to game 7 of the final round of the playoffs (if you've won it within the last decade) is just as good as winning the whole thing. Because win or lose that last game, the season's over for everyone. No more games to play for. haha

[desertrat23]

A recent podcast had this discussion amongst different fanbase podcasters:

https://youtu.be/VnIp-yc7d2s?si=YjDy7BkUuiPsbr85

I'm firmly in the "keep me entertained" category. Personally, I want the team to be in the playoff hunt for a long as possible. It keeps me entertained for the summer. A championship is the ultimate fun, of course, but I won't be upset when they don't.

Its about the ride, ya'll.

Could not agree more. If you've already witnessed your team win a championship and you live by this "championship or bust" mentality, you honestly have something mentally or emotionally wrong with you. I've seen STL teams win 4 championships, 1 Rams, 2 Cards, 1 Blues, and all the way up until the last game, the ride, the camaraderie, the intrigue and anxiety are all a fantastic distraction from real life. But the instant the last game's over, the ride comes to an abrupt end. I sure as h*ll didn't feel some lasting sense of accomplishment or fulfillment from witnessing the team that represents my city win a championship.

Actually, it was the opposite the first time it happened. I was stunned by the feeling of emptiness afterward, because there were no more games, no more group events that everyone is excited for one cause, it's just over.

So compete as much as possible, prolong each season as much as possible, keep the product exciting and successful. IMO, going to game 7 of the final round of the playoffs (if you've won it within the last decade) is just as good as winning the whole thing. Because win or lose that last game, the season's over for everyone. No more games to play for. haha

What if my kids haven't seen it yet? Not everyone is old.