Is Gorman right sized in his current role?

[Alex Reyes Cy Young]

Defensively in 2024, his batting run value was 22nd (percentile), baserunning 29th, and fielding 19th. His Range OAA 9th percentile, Arm Strength 14th and Sprint Speed 21st. These are all bottom quartile or close to it....

2025 Range shot up SSS, arm strength about the same 19th and sprint speed 18th.

He isn't much on defense or on the bases. He has power and this season seems to have developed the ability to draw some walks. But is he really some poorly developed prospect or is he, what he is as we see him now. Part-time player who has an explosive bat with a lot of miss. I realize his PA's are ~100 this season.

I don't see all the hype, I don't see a missed opportunity like you all. His xwOBA is league average over his last 100 PA's and with a sharp dip over his last 250.

Last year 616 pitches he posted a -4 run value against the fastball and has the same run value this season at 139 pitches vs the fastball

A just a side note. How in the hell did anyone expect him to play 3rd base all season with below average arm strength? Let's all rejoice that Nado wasn't traded

*** I like him in his current role, I like having that power and ability to walk late in games if an injury occurs or there is a favorable match up. Essentially a pitcher who doesn't have an elite fastball.

[Ozziesfan41]

Defensively in 2024, his batting run value was 22nd (percentile), baserunning 29th, and fielding 19th. His Range OAA 9th percentile, Arm Strength 14th and Sprint Speed 21st. These are all bottom quartile or close to it....

2025 Range shot up SSS, arm strength about the same 19th and sprint speed 18th.

He isn't much on defense or on the bases. He has power and this season seems to have developed the ability to draw some walks. But is he really some poorly developed prospect or is he, what he is as we see him now. Part-time player who has an explosive bat with a lot of miss. I realize his PA's are ~100 this season.

I don't see all the hype, I don't see a missed opportunity like you all. His xwOBA is league average over his last 100 PA's and with a sharp dip over his last 250.

Last year 616 pitches he posted a -4 run value against the fastball and has the same run value this season at 139 pitches vs the fastball

A just a side note. How in the hell did anyone expect him to play 3rd base all season with below average arm strength? Let's all rejoice that Nado wasn't traded

*** I like him in his current role, I like having that power and ability to walk late in games if an injury occurs or there is a favorable match up. Essentially a pitcher who doesn't have an elite fastball.

I agree it’s a good thing mo didn’t succeed in his 1,2,3 goal of trading arenado because Gorman every day at third would have been a disaster but I don’t like him in his current role. There may some way something clicks and he starts hitting and he needs to play every day to do that. I don’t think he should do that in the majors because cardinals are winning but he should be doing it in minors

[Eyelids64]

Sounds like he needs to be a house painter

[3dender]

If they only play him 300-400 PAs per season he'll only ever be a backup guy. Funny how that works.

Misuse of assets not to have given him the "runway" they claimed they would last winter.

And it's funny saying you like his power off the bench. His SLG has completely evaporated this year. Funny how not having consistent PT may affect that.

[hugeCardfan]

Gorman might just be AAAA.... I still think he could benefit from hitting every day in Memphis. With a lot of attention from a good hitting scout. He should spend a winter with Holliday....

[blackinkbiz]

Defensively in 2024, his batting run value was 22nd (percentile), baserunning 29th, and fielding 19th. His Range OAA 9th percentile, Arm Strength 14th and Sprint Speed 21st. These are all bottom quartile or close to it....

2025 Range shot up SSS, arm strength about the same 19th and sprint speed 18th.

He isn't much on defense or on the bases. He has power and this season seems to have developed the ability to draw some walks. But is he really some poorly developed prospect or is he, what he is as we see him now. Part-time player who has an explosive bat with a lot of miss. I realize his PA's are ~100 this season.

I don't see all the hype, I don't see a missed opportunity like you all. His xwOBA is league average over his last 100 PA's and with a sharp dip over his last 250.

Last year 616 pitches he posted a -4 run value against the fastball and has the same run value this season at 139 pitches vs the fastball

A just a side note. How in the hell did anyone expect him to play 3rd base all season with below average arm strength? Let's all rejoice that Nado wasn't traded

*** I like him in his current role, I like having that power and ability to walk late in games if an injury occurs or there is a favorable match up. Essentially a pitcher who doesn't have an elite fastball.

Do you sabermetric statisticians just completely overlook the most obvious stats to be deliberately obtuse, or do you truly believe you can find everything in underlying stats?

In his first 689 abs, before the age of 24, Gorman hit 41 HR's, 30 2bs, and drove in 111 RBIs.

Sabremetrics can go F themselves. How many guys in MLB history have put up that much power and production in their first 700 abs before the age of 24?

My guess is less than 100--in the history of MLB. Again that's a guess but very few players do that right out of the gun. Whatever they're doing with him right now, it's not working, and they need to change course, because that kind of power should not be given up on until it's definitely gone.

My concern is the kid has a bad back and if that's the case, well, I hope he earned his college degree.

[RunSup]

If they only play him 300-400 PAs per season he'll only ever be a backup guy. Funny how that works.

Misuse of assets not to have given him the "runway" they claimed they would last winter.

And it's funny saying you like his power off the bench. His SLG has completely evaporated this year. Funny how not having consistent PT may affect that.

+1

[bfib]

Defensively in 2024, his batting run value was 22nd (percentile), baserunning 29th, and fielding 19th. His Range OAA 9th percentile, Arm Strength 14th and Sprint Speed 21st. These are all bottom quartile or close to it....

2025 Range shot up SSS, arm strength about the same 19th and sprint speed 18th.

He isn't much on defense or on the bases. He has power and this season seems to have developed the ability to draw some walks. But is he really some poorly developed prospect or is he, what he is as we see him now. Part-time player who has an explosive bat with a lot of miss. I realize his PA's are ~100 this season.

I don't see all the hype, I don't see a missed opportunity like you all. His xwOBA is league average over his last 100 PA's and with a sharp dip over his last 250.

Last year 616 pitches he posted a -4 run value against the fastball and has the same run value this season at 139 pitches vs the fastball

A just a side note. How in the hell did anyone expect him to play 3rd base all season with below average arm strength? Let's all rejoice that Nado wasn't traded

*** I like him in his current role, I like having that power and ability to walk late in games if an injury occurs or there is a favorable match up. Essentially a pitcher who doesn't have an elite fastball.

I agree it’s a good thing mo didn’t succeed in his 1,2,3 goal of trading arenado because Gorman every day at third would have been a disaster but I don’t like him in his current role. There may some way something clicks and he starts hitting and he needs to play every day to do that. I don’t think he should do that in the majors because cardinals are winning but he should be doing it in minors

He probably wouldn’t be playing much 3B at this point either. Donovan Or Saggese would be there.

[woofy25]

Is there anything easier than saying one doesn’t see the hype with a once highly regarded prospect hitting under .200 and is barely playing?
He was untouchable in 2021 and 2022 for a reason and had a very good 2023/age 23 season that should have made you excited for his future. He clearly has fallen off the wagon since then.

Gorman is Exhibit A showing the cardinals have not stuck to their stated 2025 plan

[3dender]

Is there anything easier than saying one doesn’t see the hype with a once highly regarded prospect hitting under .200 and is barely playing?
He was untouchable in 2021 and 2022 for a reason and had a very good 2023/age 23 season that should have made you excited for his future. He clearly has fallen off the wagon since then.

Gorman is Exhibit A showing the cardinals have not stuck to their stated 2025 plan

+1

I'm not saying Gorman will definitely put it together. But it's ironic that this thread is right next to a Liberatore thread, which is filled with evidence of the difference it can make to simply show confidence and consistency to a young, high potential player who has struggled for years.

How did the people writing off Gorman feel about Liberatore last year? Do those people still wish the Cards would have just made him a reliever?

[Adam2]

I almost forgot he was even on the team. Did him and Phil maton just go on vacation? Feel like I haven't seen them in weeks

[Vinegar Ben]

My guess is he will be trade bait. He really hasn't got a lot to offer except potential, maybe if he?? He is not a good defensive player. Do you think he would have made those 2 excellent plays at 3rd yesterday when the game is on the line. Hell no. People continue to trash Nolan Arenado, but he is still the best 3rd baseman in baseball. Gorman reminds me of Paul DeJong, never got it together!

[rockondlouie]

Gorman needs to be at Memphis getting AB's, not rotting on the bench

Good job Mo

[Melville]

Is there anything easier than saying one doesn’t see the hype with a once highly regarded prospect hitting under .200 and is barely playing?
He was untouchable in 2021 and 2022 for a reason and had a very good 2023/age 23 season that should have made you excited for his future. He clearly has fallen off the wagon since then.

Gorman is Exhibit A showing the cardinals have not stuck to their stated 2025 plan

They have done the opposite of sticking to the plan.
And Gorman - among others - are exhibits of that.

[redbirdfan51]

Gorman needs to be at Memphis getting AB's, not rotting on the bench

Good job Mo

Agree, Gorman is seeing way too much bench time. He needs to be playing 3B and 2B at Memphis. As of now, I am not seeing him as an heir apparent at 3B for Nado. Glad the Cards have decided so far to keep Nado. I could see Wetherholt or Saggese or both playing 3B or 2B within this season or next.

[sikeston bulldog2]

This is a side effect of succcess. How do you insert him without messing up the karma, the groove, the team work.

In other words he is a victim of- if it ain’t broke don’t fix it or let sleeping dogs lie.