Good bye Peyton Marshall

[winonsports]

Must be brutal being paid over 4M a year which is among the highest paid coaches in the country with a great arena.

Oh woe is Gates.

It must be brutal being so insecure that you have to attack a man, because he is making 100 times more than you.

Oh woe is WS11

[Sweet Jones]

well this sucks. marshall is a high IQ guy with a lot of upside. I really liked him, and though he did have some struggles, I was really excited about his development and hopeful he could take a step ahead next year. allen was a lockdown defender, also with a lot of upside, and his departure may be more impactful.

the most positive take would be: marshall was not that good anyway, this is happening to every team, the portal is leading to instability that Gates cannot control, Gates has recruited well before, there's one extra spot and Gates can get someone who fits his style to take the team to a better place.

the most negative take would be: marshall was mishandled like other freshman, Gates can't develop or effectively utilize big men, does not prioritize rebounding or post play, and doesn't generally know what to do with the talent he has, and this another indication of a coach struggling at this level.

Similar to your Marcus Allen take, I agree with you here too.

I always looked at Marshall as a Yr 2/Yr 3 type of contributor who would be much better as a Jnr/Snr. He needs those 2 plus years in the strength and conditioning program to help make up for the lack of athleticism/speed. But he did have natural size, decent IQ (still needed polish on aspects of post play) and seemed to have some moxie to his game. Wouldn't surprise me to see him blossom into a very solid and useful big in the next few years. Best of luck to the kid.

Again, folks in this forum need to judge these freshman and Mizzou players in the context of how they competed in literally the STRONGEST single season conference (SEC) in the history of college basketball.

Also, as far as Gates goes, I tend to lean towards your positive take over the negative one.

[hdhntr148]

Was a Gates honk with the job he did this season with a supposedly great recruiting class and hyped transfers buy with the late collapse which was all about lack of fundamental coaching and especially losing to a bunch of tier 2 players because of a better coach. Then the vaunted recruiting class did literally NOTHING and added zip to the team.

Now his only big man coach and best supposedly offensive one left and the rest are a bunch of Juco slugs. Gates himself doesn't coach defense or rebounding and seems to have peter principled past his level which would be much lower power 5 or d2 guy.

HOPE I AM WRONG as you have to like how well he loves his kids and wants them to succeed but so far his coaching seems to be second level.

Love the ones you got Gates and COACH THEM UP. None seem power 5 worth at this point from the little we have seen.

Now he is recruiting nothing but second tier talent who are NOT difference makers at all. Bunch of slugs. Gates we hardly knew ya. but if he finishes in lower tier of SEC wouldn't blame AD and big donors to cut him.

[Caregiver1]

I am glad that Marshall moved on. Has good hands and may develop. But until he gets down to 270 and builds some Muscle he is a backup at best. Now with Burns. We have been told alot on how good he is. What I don't want to hear is a kid that is 7'5" and shoots from 23 feet for a living. He better put on 25lb's of muscle or he will get his behind kicked. ON the Transfer portal moves so far I love what Gates has done. Porter is an upgrade over Shaw and will be a great rotational piece. The 2 centers with burns will be a committee of who has the hot Hand. Again an overall upgrade. Mack is Perkins with Eligibility, and every bit the player Perkins was from time to time. With a much higher Ceiling than Perkins. Now for 2 wing/shooting Guards we are set to be every bit as good as last season or better.

[11WSChamps]

Must be brutal being paid over 4M a year which is among the highest paid coaches in the country with a great arena.

Oh woe is Gates.

It must be brutal being so insecure that you have to attack a man, because he is making 100 times more than you.

Oh woe is WS11

You must have the IQ of a shoe size.

My post had everything to do with responding to another poster who for some reason believes Gates has it so bad at MU and I was saying how good he has it here.

And here you are with your woe is me playing the indoctrinated victim card because you haven't got a freakin' clue as to what you're talking about.

What a heaping pile of [shirt] you are.

[woofy25]

Gates I dare you win 20 plus games and 10 conference games and be predicted to finish at the bottom of the conference this year and make the dance. You have to budget basement shop in the portal and high school recruiting, because we have one of the lowest NIL budgets in the country. There's a reason that Laurence Bowers resigned as director of the NIL for basketball. The football team continues to get money for the football team and the basketball team.......Oh well!!!

Gates please get the hell out of Boone Co.

Really curious about this. Can you detail what Mizzou's basketball NIL budget is compared to other Power 4 schools? Or maybe the just the SEC would do. If it is materially less than other schools, then that certainly changes my opinion of the incredibly underwhelming portal class and incoming Freshman class.

[woofy25]

well this sucks. marshall is a high IQ guy with a lot of upside. I really liked him, and though he did have some struggles, I was really excited about his development and hopeful he could take a step ahead next year. allen was a lockdown defender, also with a lot of upside, and his departure may be more impactful.

the most positive take would be: marshall was not that good anyway, this is happening to every team, the portal is leading to instability that Gates cannot control, Gates has recruited well before, there's one extra spot and Gates can get someone who fits his style to take the team to a better place.

the most negative take would be: marshall was mishandled like other freshman, Gates can't develop or effectively utilize big men, does not prioritize rebounding or post play, and doesn't generally know what to do with the talent he has, and this another indication of a coach struggling at this level.

Maybe Marshall turns into that big dude from NC St. last year that helped them go on the Final Four run. But, he is the epitome of a project. He's just far too slow, both foot speed and quickness, to provide quality minutes in the SEC. Of course, he could lose 50lbs and become somebody. But, he didn't do much to inspire high future expectations, at least not for me.

[Lightning Rod]

I am glad that Marshall moved on. Has good hands and may develop. But until he gets down to 270 and builds some Muscle he is a backup at best. Now with Burns. We have been told alot on how good he is. What I don't want to hear is a kid that is 7'5" and shoots from 23 feet for a living. He better put on 25lb's of muscle or he will get his behind kicked. ON the Transfer portal moves so far I love what Gates has done. Porter is an upgrade over Shaw and will be a great rotational piece. The 2 centers with burns will be a committee of who has the hot Hand. Again an overall upgrade. Mack is Perkins with Eligibility, and every bit the player Perkins was from time to time. With a much higher Ceiling than Perkins. Now for 2 wing/shooting Guards we are set to be every bit as good as last season or better.

Phillips for Gray=wash. Perkins for Mack=wash. Porter for Shaw? Shaw was a bench player, so maybe our bench is stronger? Meh. Gates still hasn't landed a difference maker and that's what we're waiting for. Until he does we haven't really improved, and that's the objective.

[straight out of st louis robert ave]

well this sucks. marshall is a high IQ guy with a lot of upside. I really liked him, and though he did have some struggles, I was really excited about his development and hopeful he could take a step ahead next year. allen was a lockdown defender, also with a lot of upside, and his departure may be more impactful.

the most positive take would be: marshall was not that good anyway, this is happening to every team, the portal is leading to instability that Gates cannot control, Gates has recruited well before, there's one extra spot and Gates can get someone who fits his style to take the team to a better place.

the most negative take would be: marshall was mishandled like other freshman, Gates can't develop or effectively utilize big men, does not prioritize rebounding or post play, and doesn't generally know what to do with the talent he has, and this another indication of a coach struggling at this level.

Maybe Marshall turns into that big dude from NC St. last year that helped them go on the Final Four run. But, he is the epitome of a project. He's just far too slow, both foot speed and quickness, to provide quality minutes in the SEC. Of course, he could lose 50lbs and become somebody. But, he didn't do much to inspire high future expectations, at least not for me.

I agree with your reasoning.

Marshall was actually embarrassing when he was on the floor.
I saw him at point blank range rebounding the ball and then start dribbling before he shot the ball. Every time he got the ball, he turned it over.
He looked pathetic huffing and puffing going from one end of the floor to the other.
In my opinion, he reminded me of Jordan Wilmore.
Does Marshall have the intestinal fortitude to get better? He has a lot of things to work on before he is even average.
It will take him two years to be decent. Is he worth the wait? I don't think so!
Wish him well but Gates can't wait two years before Marshall is a decent player.
I am hoping Burns surprises people. Burns has more potential than Marshall.
Of course, I hope Burns doesn't transfer!

[Rvrartst]

Was a Gates honk with the job he did this season with a supposedly great recruiting class and hyped transfers buy with the late collapse which was all about lack of fundamental coaching and especially losing to a bunch of tier 2 players because of a better coach. Then the vaunted recruiting class did literally NOTHING and added zip to the team.

Now his only big man coach and best supposedly offensive one left and the rest are a bunch of Juco slugs. Gates himself doesn't coach defense or rebounding and seems to have peter principled past his level which would be much lower power 5 or d2 guy.

HOPE I AM WRONG as you have to like how well he loves his kids and wants them to succeed but so far his coaching seems to be second level.

Love the ones you got Gates and COACH THEM UP. None seem power 5 worth at this point from the little we have seen.

Now he is recruiting nothing but second tier talent who are NOT difference makers at all. Bunch of slugs. Gates we hardly knew ya. but if he finishes in lower tier of SEC wouldn't blame AD and big donors to cut him.

Wow. I don't think I agree with a single thing you said. The late collapse wasn't about lack of fundamental coaching. It was simply a combination of the player you were depending upon to make timely threes going into a horrific shooting slump (probably because of playing 35 minutes a game (sixth man...hilarious) and being beaten half to death by defenders off the ball, and opposing coaches figuring out that Mizzou's guys couldn't stay in front of their man on defense, allowing constant penetration and dishing to the open man. Mizzou's players had weaknesses, and by the end of the season those weaknesses were being exploited.

The freshmen were always considered works in progress, with high ceilings but needing development. They were playing behind a bunch of experienced players, and Gates values experience. Sure, he could have played the freshmen a lot more, but chances are they would have won considerably fewer games doing so. The goal is to win now; developing players is a luxury in this college basketball climate, as every other team in the SEC also found out.

I've said this over and over, but Gates isn't setting out to recruit second tier talent. This is a weird portal season. There simply hasn't been much top tier talent entering the portal, and those who have are quickly going to a different school, so quickly that it's obvious they had the deal cut before they even entered the portal...or else they are asking for far more money than Mizzou is willing or able to spend. Prices for quality guys are through the roof. Seems you are expecting Gates to pull a couple rabbits out of the hat when there ain't any rabbits around.

[knttiger]

Gates I dare you win 20 plus games and 10 conference games and be predicted to finish at the bottom of the conference this year and make the dance. You have to budget basement shop in the portal and high school recruiting, because we have one of the lowest NIL budgets in the country. There's a reason that Laurence Bowers resigned as director of the NIL for basketball. The football team continues to get money for the football team and the basketball team.......Oh well!!!

Gates please get the hell out of Boone Co.

Really curious about this. Can you detail what Mizzou's basketball NIL budget is compared to other Power 4 schools? Or maybe the just the SEC would do. If it is materially less than other schools, then that certainly changes my opinion of the incredibly underwhelming portal class and incoming Freshman class.

He has no idea what the NIL budget is for the hoops program… he’s banged this drum until there’s a hole in it. We signed a top 10 freshmen class last year, in addition to starters from Duke and Iowa. We didn’t do that with “one of the lowest NIL budgets in the country” We don’t have Arkansas, Kty, or NC money to throw around, but it isn’t chicken feed either - per people who are knowledgeable on the subject, we are middle of the pack in the sec

[11WSChamps]

The "difference makers" folks are looking for should already be on the roster and their names are Robinson and Pierce.

Both have plenty of talent. Both have plenty of experience in their two years here. Both have plenty of room to grow and next season is the time.

A lot of folks here have been singing their praises about what kind of talent they have and now its time to deliver if this team is going to take the next step next season.

With the promise of Barrett the insertion of the veteran Mack and the leadership of Mitchell that should be a foundation for Gates to work with next season with hopefully Burns, Boateng and others maturing quickly.

[icon]

The "difference makers" folks are looking for should already be on the roster and their names are Robinson and Pierce.

Both have plenty of talent. Both have plenty of experience in their two years here. Both have plenty of room to grow and next season is the time.

A lot of folks here have been singing their praises about what kind of talent they have and now its time to deliver if this team is going to take the next step next season.

With the promise of Barrett the insertion of the veteran Mack and the leadership of Mitchell that should be a foundation for Gates to work with next season with hopefully Burns, Boateng and others maturing quickly.

True, and to those who say how will Gates ever replace the scoring of Grill, Bates and Perkins -- Grill's shooting was horrific down the stretch, and Bates and Perkins were wildly inconsistent. The Tigers can lose to the likes of Drake without those 3.

It's time for others to step up.

[woofy25]

Gates I dare you win 20 plus games and 10 conference games and be predicted to finish at the bottom of the conference this year and make the dance. You have to budget basement shop in the portal and high school recruiting, because we have one of the lowest NIL budgets in the country. There's a reason that Laurence Bowers resigned as director of the NIL for basketball. The football team continues to get money for the football team and the basketball team.......Oh well!!!

Gates please get the hell out of Boone Co.

Really curious about this. Can you detail what Mizzou's basketball NIL budget is compared to other Power 4 schools? Or maybe the just the SEC would do. If it is materially less than other schools, then that certainly changes my opinion of the incredibly underwhelming portal class and incoming Freshman class.

He has no idea what the NIL budget is for the hoops program… he’s banged this drum until there’s a hole in it. We signed a top 10 freshmen class last year, in addition to starters from Duke and Iowa. We didn’t do that with “one of the lowest NIL budgets in the country” We don’t have Arkansas, Kty, or NC money to throw around, but it isn’t chicken feed either - per people who are knowledgeable on the subject, we are middle of the pack in the sec

Can you provide a source?

[Rantz]

I have different feelings about good prized recruits coaches recruit, and portal players. First, Shaun Phillips wasn't setting the world on fire at Arizona St. He's more like Grey more than anything. Think of him as Gray 2.0. Philips gets everything at the rim only a bit better than Gray....no jumper and a little bit better in FT shooing. I think Gray was .569 in FT's and Philips was .600. Marshall wanted more playing time. Marshall felt threaten by the fact that Burns is doing well in open gym and practices and the fact he has to be challenged by Phillips as well as Burns for playing time. Its been proven in the last few years, that continuity on a basketball team goes further in the dance than trying to put together a basketball team from the portal. Gates has even said as much, so I don't know why he's messing around with the portal when he needs to get those freshmen developed and more playing time. Marshall would have been better to stay...he was being trained to play in Gates system.

There was rumors flying around Friday that Phillips was coming and Marshall was going into the portal. It was true.

There is also rumors Boateng and Burns is thinking about jumping ship. This will be a disaster if they do. The minute Boateng hits portal, the Hogs will snatch him up with the deep pockets they have....and Burns...well....He can easily get payed and play in his home town of Houston.

I don't know...you watch Phillips's highlights, and it really looks like he's better than Gray; he moves better and plays a lot higher above the rim. Maybe there are trade-offs in defense and rebounding?
All we really know about Burns is what we hear in the rumor mill as to how good he is now and how good he can be. If he's as good as the rumors suggest, then I can't imagine Mizzou not doing everything they can to keep him ($$$). Boateng is still a work in progress, heck of an athlete but in a way he reminds me of Aiden Shaw; great athlete, offense really needs work.
What the portal is telling us this year is that it's becoming more and more difficult to pick up the exact type of players you need, unless you have VERY deep pockets. I agree with you that for a school like Mizzou, continuity is going to be more and more important, so I hope they do all they can to keep Burns and Boateng.

No one knows what Burns brings to the table, but we have heard he is their best player in practice, just like Kaleb Brown was. :lol Hopefully he turns out to be someone who can actually play and contribute, at 7'5" we all have high hopes. The portal additions to this point have been less than great, so having two more open spots means nothing unless he can get's more than warm bodies. Still waiting for that home run portal get or our vaunted high school recruits, other than Barrett, to be more than bench guys.

Id say the Mack was a great get!.....I think Gates would have been good to pass on Phillips and gog with Marshall and Burns....but need the playing time. facts show teams with the most continuity go further in the dance....I feel if he got these guys out of high school, might as well get them developed with playing time. The reason Boateng ddidnt playin the second half of the season as much as was expected was because of injury.

[Lightning Rod]

I have different feelings about good prized recruits coaches recruit, and portal players. First, Shaun Phillips wasn't setting the world on fire at Arizona St. He's more like Grey more than anything. Think of him as Gray 2.0. Philips gets everything at the rim only a bit better than Gray....no jumper and a little bit better in FT shooing. I think Gray was .569 in FT's and Philips was .600. Marshall wanted more playing time. Marshall felt threaten by the fact that Burns is doing well in open gym and practices and the fact he has to be challenged by Phillips as well as Burns for playing time. Its been proven in the last few years, that continuity on a basketball team goes further in the dance than trying to put together a basketball team from the portal. Gates has even said as much, so I don't know why he's messing around with the portal when he needs to get those freshmen developed and more playing time. Marshall would have been better to stay...he was being trained to play in Gates system.

There was rumors flying around Friday that Phillips was coming and Marshall was going into the portal. It was true.

There is also rumors Boateng and Burns is thinking about jumping ship. This will be a disaster if they do. The minute Boateng hits portal, the Hogs will snatch him up with the deep pockets they have....and Burns...well....He can easily get payed and play in his home town of Houston.

I don't know...you watch Phillips's highlights, and it really looks like he's better than Gray; he moves better and plays a lot higher above the rim. Maybe there are trade-offs in defense and rebounding?
All we really know about Burns is what we hear in the rumor mill as to how good he is now and how good he can be. If he's as good as the rumors suggest, then I can't imagine Mizzou not doing everything they can to keep him ($$$). Boateng is still a work in progress, heck of an athlete but in a way he reminds me of Aiden Shaw; great athlete, offense really needs work.
What the portal is telling us this year is that it's becoming more and more difficult to pick up the exact type of players you need, unless you have VERY deep pockets. I agree with you that for a school like Mizzou, continuity is going to be more and more important, so I hope they do all they can to keep Burns and Boateng.

No one knows what Burns brings to the table, but we have heard he is their best player in practice, just like Kaleb Brown was. :lol Hopefully he turns out to be someone who can actually play and contribute, at 7'5" we all have high hopes. The portal additions to this point have been less than great, so having two more open spots means nothing unless he can get's more than warm bodies. Still waiting for that home run portal get or our vaunted high school recruits, other than Barrett, to be more than bench guys.

Id say the Mack was a great get!.....I think Gates would have been good to pass on Phillips and gog with Marshall and Burns....but need the playing time. facts show teams with the most continuity go further in the dance....I feel if he got these guys out of high school, might as well get them developed with playing time. The reason Boateng ddidnt playin the second half of the season as much as was expected was because of injury.

Admittedly I haven't seen Mack p!ay, so maybe you're right about him, but a "great" get seems a stretch based on his stats. I also thought Marshall and Burns, with some work, might turn into a nice duo. Boateng hurt? I missed that. He sure didn't show much early when he had the chance. Instead of a 5 star (4 star), he looked like a raw 3 star. Hopefully he works on his game and that potential turns into the performance his high ranking indicated.