CT Fantasy Baseball - Interested?

[Quincy Varnish]

For the past 10 years or so we’ve always had Saves + Holds as a category, especially since there’s been so many great late inning RP’s…but I’m totally fine with just saves

Yes, that was AOF’s suggestion. I don’t like “Saves + Holds” b/c it values a hold equally to a save. I also didn’t want holds to have their own category, because they suck. You’ll have 5 spots for relievers… not everyone’s getting 5 bonafide closers, so quality middle relievers will still have value.

If we get a good group together, and it appears we may, I’m completely open to doing a ‘rebuild’ of the format in future years. This season is almost upon us. We’ll have a lot of time next offseason to debate what’s in, and what’s out.

[Brock #20]

Just my opinion, because I have played this game for over 40 years using various formats. When you add OBP it just takes away from Batting average, and batting average just takes away from OBP, all you are doing is nullifying one for the other. OPS is already baked in with the other offensive categories!

Nothing is really ‘nullified’, though I do understand your perspective. I wanted to keep the traditional 5x5 cats. IMO the addition of OPS effectively lightens the importance of SB, and gives more credit to players who might hit for a low average but consistently get on base. SLG gives credit to players who compile doubles, but may not crush a bunch of HR.

Your input is appreciated.

You just said it, by adding OPS you are taking away the importance of steals and giving double credit for HR, and that is not good. However, I would rather see a category for QS than for W's because there is some major luck involved in getting W's. Many times a SP will give some one a great QS but not get the win. Getting the W, is relying on a SP offence and not his sole performance.

I believe it to be good. SB is a PITA category, and adding OPS does not give “double credit” for HRs. It’s gives credit for OPS, OBP & SLG combined… you could also say it gives credit for walks, doubles and well… almost everything.

I originally wanted to make this a standard 5x5, to keep it simple and avoid conversations like this. If all those who choose to participate and register their team collectively decide to revert back to 5x5 standard, before draft day - I will abide.

For now it’s 6x6, and the categories are chosen.

Do as you wish, but OPS does NOT include anything about SB, so you have now added to the importance of HR, thus making HR more valuble that SB. Have fun but count me out. There is a reason why standard leagues are 5X5, because each of the 5 offensive categories are EQUALLY important as the others.

Thank you for your input. I’ll take that into consideration.

I’ve been doing this as long as you have. A HR should be valued more than a SB, because it’s more valuable.

Everyone has their opinion of what the ‘perfect’ fantasy league might be, and yours is just one of them.

This is simply a minor tweak, and IMO an improvement over the standard. Though I do like the simplicity of a traditional 5x5, it is not an infallible divine conscript.

It's not a matter that a HR has more value to a team than a SB, it's about making ALL categories equal. If you want to make that arguement, then K's should not even be a category because a K is not as important than a W, WHIP, ERA, it is no different than a flyout. Again, the whole idea of fantasy baseball was to make all categories EQUALLY as important as all the others. If you want to play fantasy baseball where one category is more important than the other, have at it, after all people have tried to reinvent the wheel for 100's of years!

[Brock #20]

Case in point, there is a very good reason as to why you should not play in a league that does both Saves and Holds. It is because it ruins the strategy of having to get Saves from limited resources, while filling in the other categories. When you add HOLDS, it removes all of the strategy because if you can not get SAVES, you can then get HOLDS, because there are now a abundance of players to chose from. The whole idea of making Saves a category is because there are not many to chose from, so it requires strategic thinking because of supply and demand. By adding Holds, you completely erase that strategy, because now the supply is limitless! It's like adding 30 or more closers to the supply line! Like I said, there is a real good reason as to why the 5X5 is the standard after all of these years!

[Quincy Varnish]

Case in point, there is a very good reason as to why you should not play in a league that does both Saves and Holds. It is because it ruins the strategy of having to get Saves from limited resources, while filling in the other categories. When you add HOLDS, it removes all of the strategy because if you can not get SAVES, you can then get HOLDS, because there are now a abundance of players to chose from. The whole idea of making Saves a category is because there are not many to chose from, so it requires strategic thinking because of supply and demand. By adding Holds, you completely erase that strategy, because now the supply is limitless! It's like adding 30 or more closers to the supply line! Like I said, there is a real good reason as to why the 5X5 is the standard after all of these years!

Again, thank you for your input. This is all insightful wisdom you may apply to a league in which you plan to participate, or serve as commissioner.

We won’t have Saves + Holds, so you need to find a league that does, and tell them why they’re doing it wrong.

[Quincy Varnish]

For the past 10 years or so we’ve always had Saves + Holds as a category, especially since there’s been so many great late inning RP’s…but I’m totally fine with just saves

Yes, that was AOF’s suggestion. I don’t like “Saves + Holds” b/c it values a hold equally to a save. I also didn’t want holds to have their own category, because they suck. You’ll have 5 spots for relievers… not everyone’s getting 5 bonafide closers, so quality middle relievers will still have value.

If we get a good group together, and it appears we may, I’m completely open to doing a ‘rebuild’ of the format in future years. This season is almost upon us. We’ll have a lot of time next offseason to debate what’s in, and what’s out.

I get it…it also keeps you on your toes for a closer in waiting.

Yes, and that’s one of the aspects of fantasy I enjoy… the ‘closer watch’. When you have H+S you can have a bunch of setup men and be effective as a team w/ several true closers, which doesn’t seem fair. I like getting a jump on who might inherit the role, who is losing it, etc… that aspect is lost when saves & holds are combined.

[Cardinals4Life]

I don't gather many folks that post here play fantasy baseball but wanted to get a feeler out for a league... Quincy and I have been talking about putting one together.

I know it's not for everyone. I've played for about 25 years and have two long-standing leagues running. We'd be looking probably for a 10-12 teamer pretty standard roto format through Yahoo.

If you're not interested in the league but want to chat fantasy strategy / keepers / draft prep, have at it.

I would be interested.

[An Old Friend]

Do as you wish, but OPS does NOT include anything about SB, so you have now added to the importance of HR, thus making HR more valuble that SB. Have fun but count me out. There is a reason why standard leagues are 5X5, because each of the 5 offensive categories are EQUALLY important as the others.

Appreciate your input.

There is no right or wrong, just preferences.

The H2H league with categories I'm in now has more than this... so you effectively have counting categories but also the slash line categories. It adds some balance and makes it so gimmicky guys don't make or break a team.

If you're not interested because it's expanded over the traditional 5x5, that's fine... just don't be overly critical of it.

[An Old Friend]

It's not a matter that a HR has more value to a team than a SB, it's about making ALL categories equal. If you want to make that arguement, then K's should not even be a category because a K is not as important than a W, WHIP, ERA, it is no different than a flyout. Again, the whole idea of fantasy baseball was to make all categories EQUALLY as important as all the others. If you want to play fantasy baseball where one category is more important than the other, have at it, after all people have tried to reinvent the wheel for 100's of years!

I gather you're fundamentally against points leagues, then?

[Brock #20]

It's not a matter that a HR has more value to a team than a SB, it's about making ALL categories equal. If you want to make that arguement, then K's should not even be a category because a K is not as important than a W, WHIP, ERA, it is no different than a flyout. Again, the whole idea of fantasy baseball was to make all categories EQUALLY as important as all the others. If you want to play fantasy baseball where one category is more important than the other, have at it, after all people have tried to reinvent the wheel for 100's of years!

I gather you're fundamentally against points leagues, then?

My feeling are, why change or add to a game that is perfect for finding out who knows their baseball and who does not. By making all categories equal, one must use very strategic thinking in order to cover all 5 offensive categories, even tho all categories are limited in supply. I started out years ago playing 5X5 auction and NL only, which require one to know every single player in the NL including all bench players. I have played it many types of leagues throughout the years and came to the conclusion that 5x5 is the best format. The only change that I would be open to is doing away with W's and adding QS, because there is to much luck involved in W's. A SP can pitch 8 scoreless inning's or even 9 and not get the W because his offense did not score any runs for him. Or he can lose a great start because the closer blew the game. One year I had the most K's and the best ERA and WHIP yet finished next to last in W's, even tho I pitched max innings. Moreover, by subtracting W's and adding QS it would eliminate closers and RP from getting W's, because only God is going to be able to predict how many W's a RP is going to get because its all 100% luck. Hell you can have a closer who comes in and blows a 3 run lead and end up getting the W. I would also be open to doing a 5x5 league with 16 managers instead of 12, because the more managers in a league the more one needs to know their baseball. Everyone knows who the star players are, so I perfer playing in deeper leagues. If I actually told you how many teams I play per year and how much money I bet you would not believe me. I play both money and free leagues on Yahoo and Yahoo only. Anyone who plays Yahoo every year has most likely played against me because of the number of teams that I play under various yahoo accounts. Anyone who claims to know and really love baseball, has to be playing fantasy baseball, or they just think that they know and love the game of baseball. It would be complete torture if I could not play fantasy baseball every year. One can not [nonsense] their way through fantasy baseball, because it is the perfect measuring rod to see who really knows their baseball and who don't. If one can not evaluate baseball talent, they would have a ZERO chance of winning in a WINNERS league or a money league! Yahoo now has a 1,000.00 entry fee league starting this year. I read a lot a [nonsense] on this forum from people who claim to really know their baseball, but if they really knew their baseball they would be putting up the CA$H like I do.

[Quincy Varnish]

I don't gather many folks that post here play fantasy baseball but wanted to get a feeler out for a league... Quincy and I have been talking about putting one together.

I know it's not for everyone. I've played for about 25 years and have two long-standing leagues running. We'd be looking probably for a 10-12 teamer pretty standard roto format through Yahoo.

If you're not interested in the league but want to chat fantasy strategy / keepers / draft prep, have at it.

Too late to join?

Definitely not.

[HorseTrader]

Interested enough that, if the draft were convenient and you needed one more to make it go, I could be talked into it.

Noted - would be good to have you.

Goal would be a live draft so we'd try to figure out how to have as many attend as possible.

I haven't played since 1999 might be nice to try again. However put me low on your list, doubt I could make a live draft since I live in Ohio

[Quincy Varnish]

And, FWIW, that's what differentiates "knowing baseball" from "knowing fantasy baseball." That is, of course, demonstrating success at fantasy baseball should never be confused with understanding what it takes for a team to be successful in actual baseball.

Plenty of people “know baseball” but may not know precisely how to build a successful MLB team. Jim Edmonds knows baseball, but do you want him as your POBO? It takes a comprehensive knowledge of all aspects of the game to effectively do that job.

I agree that knowing fantasy baseball does not translate to an overarching knowledge of what it takes to build a “real” team. It does require a wide understanding of current players in the league, and what they do well.

There’s an abundance of ways to “know baseball” and they do not necessarily inform each other. Point being… a grasp of advanced statistics (like xwOBA, wRC+ and fWAR) does not qualify one to build a “real” team any more than kicking (donkey) at fantasy baseball.

[An Old Friend]

Interested enough that, if the draft were convenient and you needed one more to make it go, I could be talked into it.

Noted - would be good to have you.

Goal would be a live draft so we'd try to figure out how to have as many attend as possible.

I haven't played since 1999 might be nice to try again. However put me low on your list, doubt I could make a live draft since I live in Ohio

Live = online

It matters not where one lives.

[An Old Friend]

Interested enough that, if the draft were convenient and you needed one more to make it go, I could be talked into it.

Noted - would be good to have you.

Goal would be a live draft so we'd try to figure out how to have as many attend as possible.

I haven't played since 1999 might be nice to try again. However put me low on your list, doubt I could make a live draft since I live in Ohio

Live = online

It matters not where one lives.

Unless you are old and can't stay awake past 9 PM.

Ha! I’m a night owl and don’t sleep enough.

I did a league one year where the draft was entirely by message board. There were guys in Alaska and Hawaii so it took forever… like 2+ weeks to get through it because there was no way to find a good time to do it live.

Never again.

[Boooyah]

Will there be as much [shirt] talking there as there is here?? If so, I’m in!

I’d be all in a few years ago. Seems like a chore to keep checking multiple times a day to make sure your players are in the lineup that day. Not sure if there’s a way around that??? Been a while since I’ve played but could get into it. If you need someone to fill out the league i can give it a try again.

[Quincy Varnish]

Will there be as much [shirt] talking there as there is here?? If so, I’m in!

I’d be all in a few years ago. Seems like a chore to keep checking multiple times a day to make sure your players are in the lineup that day. Not sure if there’s a way around that??? Been a while since I’ve played but could get into it. If you need someone to fill out the league i can give it a try again.

I’m making the roster slots for pitching a bit more “set it and forget it” than the default settings. There will be 5 spots for SP and 5 for general P (starters or relievers).

As for the offense, there will be three UT spots. At the moment, bench will be 4 spots total for pitching/hitting so there just won’t be many moves to make. There’s a 162 game limit for position players, so let’s say you have Goldschmidt at 1B and another ”every day” 1B on your bench. If you’re making sure you have someone starting EVERY day at 1B, you’ll probably run out of games before the season is over.

Bottom line - you definitely won’t need to check in multiple times every day or even once a day. If you have platoon players, it might be a good idea, but I don’t think it will be necessary to stay competitive in this league.