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After looking back through the last 2 decades it's apparent that the Cards have spent money. They're pretty consistently between about 9th to 14th or so. I was a bit surprised at this. Still, payroll is way down right now for no real reason, but they aren't the cheapskates that I thought they were, at least in past years. So this is a mea culpa for not researching sooner and pushing an untruth however unintentional. This probably helps explain why they contended for 2 decades too. So, pile on if you will but the numbers don't lie. They have spent solidly in the upper middle of payroll. The demographics of payroll are changing though. It will require more payroll to stay relevant and I hope after this aberration they'll at least revert back to their norm.

CCard wrote: ↑27 Dec 2025 13:04 pm After looking back through the last 2 decades it's apparent that the Cards have spent money. They're pretty consistently between about 9th to 14th or so. I was a bit surprised at this. Still, payroll is way down right now for no real reason, but they aren't the cheapskates that I thought they were, at least in past years. So this is a mea culpa for not researching sooner and pushing an untruth however unintentional. This probably helps explain why they contended for 2 decades too. So, pile on if you will but the numbers don't lie. They have spent solidly in the upper middle of payroll. The demographics of payroll are changing though. It will require more payroll to stay relevant and I hope after this aberration they'll at least revert back to their norm.

To a degree....my problem was when they quit spending to go for it...bringing a player or two in to put themselves over the top...to show that they think they can win it all....started the wild card is good enough and get in and get lucky with what we have....some of that started when mo started handing out terrible contracts... which hurt the ability to add more...and then it became to where adding a couple big players wouldn't matter...like the situation Bloom took over...hopefully Bloom builds a nice young core that looks promising ...then they do what the cubs did in 2015 2016...where they spent on some quality veterans to go with that young core

Yes, it’s been talked about on here a lot. The DeWitts have spent money in the past, however, Mo wasted that money on middle of the road players, who he hoped would fill the voids needed. But, it’s also true that Mo, would stop short of what the team really needed.
I hope Bloom does a better job of distributing the money that he is allowed to spend. In his last interview he stated that he was looking for a right handed power bat. He was looking at possible free agents or trades to accomplish this. When you look at the free agent list, no one really jumps out at you. Andujar, Bader, and McCormick are probably the best, but they don’t really move the needle that much for me. Andujar and Bader both hit decently last year, but neither player is much of a run producer, although both would be an improvement over what we had last year. McCormick could be a change of scenery type guy, but that’s about it.
What they really need probably needs to come via trade.

CCard wrote: ↑27 Dec 2025 13:04 pm After looking back through the last 2 decades it's apparent that the Cards have spent money. They're pretty consistently between about 9th to 14th or so. I was a bit surprised at this. Still, payroll is way down right now for no real reason, but they aren't the cheapskates that I thought they were, at least in past years. So this is a mea culpa for not researching sooner and pushing an untruth however unintentional. This probably helps explain why they contended for 2 decades too. So, pile on if you will but the numbers don't lie. They have spent solidly in the upper middle of payroll. The demographics of payroll are changing though. It will require more payroll to stay relevant and I hope after this aberration they'll at least revert back to their norm.

I don't think many are debating their past spending. What many have been arguing for, including me, are 2 things:

1.) Spending money to fill in their missing pieces.
2.) Realize that prices/spending is going up. (So are their revenues.) They need to keep pace and continue to increase their payroll, even if it is incrementally. No way should it go down. So even getting back ro the 179-180M mark is probably not enough. Will need to continue to increase proportionally every year.

Bushiro wrote: ↑27 Dec 2025 13:22 pm

CCard wrote: ↑27 Dec 2025 13:04 pm After looking back through the last 2 decades it's apparent that the Cards have spent money. They're pretty consistently between about 9th to 14th or so. I was a bit surprised at this. Still, payroll is way down right now for no real reason, but they aren't the cheapskates that I thought they were, at least in past years. So this is a mea culpa for not researching sooner and pushing an untruth however unintentional. This probably helps explain why they contended for 2 decades too. So, pile on if you will but the numbers don't lie. They have spent solidly in the upper middle of payroll. The demographics of payroll are changing though. It will require more payroll to stay relevant and I hope after this aberration they'll at least revert back to their norm.

To a degree....my problem was when they quit spending to go for it...bringing a player or two in to put themselves over the top...to show that they think they can win it all....started the wild card is good enough and get in and get lucky with what we have....some of that started when mo started handing out terrible contracts... which hurt the ability to add more...and then it became to where adding a couple big players wouldn't matter...like the situation Bloom took over...hopefully Bloom builds a nice young core that looks promising ...then they do what the cubs did in 2015 2016...where they spent on some quality veterans to go with that young core

Pretty good post, guy! I agree they stopped their willingness to add the final pieces to get them there. Went from wanting to be division champions and WS contenders, to trying to qualify for a wildcard spot.

Money was waisted on the wrong players.

Leake, Fowler, Contreras, just for examples.

No fault in Arenado or Goldschmidt and no one figured Arenado would fall so far so fast.

Cardinals never took a needed step to make the team more than a NL Central hopeful.

They have spent enough just spent it poorly

CCard wrote: ↑27 Dec 2025 13:04 pm After looking back through the last 2 decades it's apparent that the Cards have spent money. They're pretty consistently between about 9th to 14th or so. I was a bit surprised at this. Still, payroll is way down right now for no real reason…

This is what I don’t understand… what do you mean “no real reason”?

St Louis has turned into a small market. Their brand has lost value and their media rights value has plummeted.

It seems a lot of fans are simply in denial about this. I don’t know why.

Jatalk wrote: ↑27 Dec 2025 13:48 pm They have spent enough just spent it poorly

All roads lead back to Moe

Hoosier59 wrote: ↑27 Dec 2025 13:26 pm Yes, it’s been talked about on here a lot. The DeWitts have spent money in the past, however, Mo wasted that money on middle of the road players, who he hoped would fill the voids needed. But, it’s also true that Mo, would stop short of what the team really needed.
I hope Bloom does a better job of distributing the money that he is allowed to spend. In his last interview he stated that he was looking for a right handed power bat. He was looking at possible free agents or trades to accomplish this. When you look at the free agent list, no one really jumps out at you. Andujar, Bader, and McCormick are probably the best, but they don’t really move the needle that much for me. Andujar and Bader both hit decently last year, but neither player is much of a run producer, although both would be an improvement over what we had last year. McCormick could be a change of scenery type guy, but that’s about it.
What they really need probably needs to come via trade.

That was precisely the problem. Mo brought in Ozuna at a high price, which could have been overlooked had he brought in additional talent to put them over the top. The lesson Mo took from 2006 and 2011 is that all you have to do is 'make it in'. So, he didn't shoot aim for a legitimate contender.

Obviously, it's about how well you spend, but some basic facts of the current era require you to be in the top 10 in payroll to compete for a World Series.
The Cards are presently at #19, which I expect to get worse by OD.
They were #20 last year in combined AAV. That isn't terrible because they are in a "shed/rebuild" mode.

But once they get a solid core of young players and (hopefully) sign great international free agents, they need to acquire Tier-1 FAs, which they haven't done in forever, so they at least need to be in that #9-#11 range, likely higher, if they want to compete for a WS. https://www.spotrac.com/mlb/aav/_/year/2025

During their great run in the 2010s:

2019 - lost NLCS - #7
2015 - won 100 games but lost in LDS - #9
2014 - lost NLCS - #12
2013 - lost WS - #10
2012 - lost NLCS - #11
2011 - won WS - #11

The last 10 years has seen this:

2025 Dodgers #1
2024 Dodgers #1
2023 Rangers #4
2022 Astros #8
2021 Braves #10
2020 Dodgers #1
2019 Nationals #3
2018 Red Sox #1
2017 Astros #12
2016 Cubs #4

CCard wrote: ↑27 Dec 2025 13:04 pm After looking back through the last 2 decades it's apparent that the Cards have spent money. They're pretty consistently between about 9th to 14th or so. I was a bit surprised at this. Still, payroll is way down right now for no real reason, but they aren't the cheapskates that I thought they were, at least in past years. So this is a mea culpa for not researching sooner and pushing an untruth however unintentional. This probably helps explain why they contended for 2 decades too. So, pile on if you will but the numbers don't lie. They have spent solidly in the upper middle of payroll. The demographics of payroll are changing though. It will require more payroll to stay relevant and I hope after this aberration they'll at least revert back to their norm.

Payroll isn't down "for no real reason".

An Old Friend wrote: ↑27 Dec 2025 13:57 pm

CCard wrote: ↑27 Dec 2025 13:04 pm After looking back through the last 2 decades it's apparent that the Cards have spent money. They're pretty consistently between about 9th to 14th or so. I was a bit surprised at this. Still, payroll is way down right now for no real reason…

This is what I don’t understand… what do you mean “no real reason”?

St Louis has turned into a small market. Their brand has lost value and their media rights value has plummeted.

It seems a lot of fans are simply in denial about this. I don’t know why.

100%, agreed. I think most of the top end talent will have to come via trade or through the draft, mostly through the draft. Hopefully they can really get good at identifying other peoples good players and making trade for those.

CCard wrote: ↑27 Dec 2025 13:04 pm After looking back through the last 2 decades it's apparent that the Cards have spent money. They're pretty consistently between about 9th to 14th or so. I was a bit surprised at this. Still, payroll is way down right now for no real reason, but they aren't the cheapskates that I thought they were, at least in past years. So this is a mea culpa for not researching sooner and pushing an untruth however unintentional. This probably helps explain why they contended for 2 decades too. So, pile on if you will but the numbers don't lie. They have spent solidly in the upper middle of payroll. The demographics of payroll are changing though. It will require more payroll to stay relevant and I hope after this aberration they'll at least revert back to their norm.

No offense, but why would you argue such a thing? If you didn’t believe it, why not just look it up? There’s an ocean of information available to you.

Like, what would you do when someone told you that the Cardinals spent the way they did? Just deny it for no reason, other than it’s what you believed, and never bother to see if they were correct? That’s very strange.

BDWJr always gave Mo a solid payroll, Mo unfortunately wasn't very good in spending it (poor FA signings & extensions).

Missing the playoffs and declining attendance led to Dewitt going into payroll slashing mode after the 2024 season, he's now in nuclear payroll slashing mode after the 2025 season.

I think he's always had his eye on the the upcoming 2026 season, knowing the new CBA after this coming season could see big changes that would affect his payroll.

Hopefully C. Bloom can turn this team around, attendance jumps sooner rather than later and payroll gets back to being now lower than that 10-15 team range.

CCard wrote: ↑27 Dec 2025 13:04 pm After looking back through the last 2 decades it's apparent that the Cards have spent money. They're pretty consistently between about 9th to 14th or so. I was a bit surprised at this. Still, payroll is way down right now for no real reason, but they aren't the cheapskates that I thought they were, at least in past years. So this is a mea culpa for not researching sooner and pushing an untruth however unintentional. This probably helps explain why they contended for 2 decades too. So, pile on if you will but the numbers don't lie. They have spent solidly in the upper middle of payroll. The demographics of payroll are changing though. It will require more payroll to stay relevant and I hope after this aberration they'll at least revert back to their norm.

We are now getting revenue sharing. The tv deal missed a payment. Payroll is down for a reason.