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The pirates are definitely making better deals than we are. With our "someday in the future" approach, how many years will the Bucs be ahead of us in the final standings of the year?

jccarlson wrote: ↑24 Dec 2025 12:55 pm The pirates are definitely making better deals than we are. With our "someday in the future" approach, how many years will the Bucs be ahead of us in the final standings of the year?

To be fair, they HAVE to spend now while they have Skenes on the cheap. Their window is very narrow.

jccarlson wrote: ↑24 Dec 2025 12:55 pm The pirates are definitely making better deals than we are. With our "someday in the future" approach, how many years will the Bucs be ahead of us in the final standings of the year?

They’ll ride Skenes and pitching staff until they become too expensive. But the way it’s going it will take us 3 years to catch them.

An Old Friend wrote: ↑24 Dec 2025 12:56 pm

jccarlson wrote: ↑24 Dec 2025 12:55 pm The pirates are definitely making better deals than we are. With our "someday in the future" approach, how many years will the Bucs be ahead of us in the final standings of the year?

To be fair, they HAVE to spend now while they have Skenes on the cheap. Their window is very narrow.

This. Their chips all have to be pushed in the pot now. Whatever they do, it will be over by the end of 28 when Paul is free. He may be too expensive for them before that.

zuck698 wrote: ↑24 Dec 2025 13:00 pm

An Old Friend wrote: ↑24 Dec 2025 12:56 pm

jccarlson wrote: ↑24 Dec 2025 12:55 pm The pirates are definitely making better deals than we are. With our "someday in the future" approach, how many years will the Bucs be ahead of us in the final standings of the year?

To be fair, they HAVE to spend now while they have Skenes on the cheap. Their window is very narrow.

This. Their chips all have to be pushed in the pot now. Whatever they do, it will be over by the end of 28 when Paul is free. He may be too expensive for them before that.

They also lived in their "someday in the future" phase for quite a while, and now get to see the fruits. Skenes being one of them.

Plus, if they want any chance of keeping Skenes, they have to show him that they are willing to go the extra mile to have the best team possible. It’s commendable that they have made the efforts they have in trading for Lowe and signing O’Hearn. There already have been rumblings about his pitching and the lack of run support he receives.

Honestly, the only way that Skenes remains a Pirate through FA is if he takes a team friendly deal and the Pirates seem to be trying to make him as happy as possible.

Thing 1) Some of you need to update the way you think of the Pirates. They are not only ahead of us, I would say they are also ahead of the Reds- and for that matter, someone would have to explain to me what makes the Cubs better than the Pirates.

Thing 2) Their pitching staff is a whole lot more than just Paul Skenes. Bubba Chandler. Braxton Ashcraft. Hunter Barco. Jared Jones. Seth Hernandez. Even if they trade Skenes in two years to re-supply the roster this is probably a top 3 rotation in the NL. Think about what a return for Skenes would be like with the pitchers and players they already have.

Thing 3) They have the #1 offensive prospect in baseball coming soon with other quality players coming as well. They have added meaningful players to offset their anemic offense.

Thing 4) Ownership and the front office for the first time in forever are showing a pulse. If they continue to support their product this team will be relevant to what happens in this division for quite awhile. If the ownership continues to show up, this team is here to stay. Others can look down their noses at the Pirates at their own peril.

zuck698 wrote: ↑24 Dec 2025 13:00 pm

An Old Friend wrote: ↑24 Dec 2025 12:56 pm

jccarlson wrote: ↑24 Dec 2025 12:55 pm The pirates are definitely making better deals than we are. With our "someday in the future" approach, how many years will the Bucs be ahead of us in the final standings of the year?

To be fair, they HAVE to spend now while they have Skenes on the cheap. Their window is very narrow.

This. Their chips all have to be pushed in the pot now. Whatever they do, it will be over by the end of 28 when Paul is free. He may be too expensive for them before that.

Skenes needs to be the big piece we look to add in a couple of years.

Whatashame wrote: ↑24 Dec 2025 13:31 pm Plus, if they want any chance of keeping Skenes, they have to show him that they are willing to go the extra mile to have the best team possible. It’s commendable that they have made the efforts they have in trading for Lowe and signing O’Hearn. There already have been rumblings about his pitching and the lack of run support he receives.

Honestly, the only way that Skenes remains a Pirate through FA is if he takes a team friendly deal and the Pirates seem to be trying to make him as happy as possible.

"Bottom line Bob" can certainly afford to pay Skenes fair market value, and Pirates fans will show up.

Whatashame wrote: ↑24 Dec 2025 13:31 pm Plus, if they want any chance of keeping Skenes, they have to show him that they are willing to go the extra mile to have the best team possible. It’s commendable that they have made the efforts they have in trading for Lowe and signing O’Hearn. There already have been rumblings about his pitching and the lack of run support he receives.

Honestly, the only way that Skenes remains a Pirate through FA is if he takes a team friendly deal and the Pirates seem to be trying to make him as happy as possible.

If I were the Pirates, I wouldn't make myself a slave to Skenes. Do your level best to put together a good team. Do your level best to make a good contract offer and do it early. If you don't think you can re-sign him, trade him with 2 years left on his team control. Look at Tarik Skubal as an object lesson. The Tigers are, and will continue, to mess it up. They aren't going to fortify their team, or re-sign him. They are getting a draft pick. Think of the haul they could have had last offseason, or even this offseason with 1 year remaining. Whiff!

The Pirates model is now the Cards model. We have to face it, unless there is a major shift in revenue sharing, cap and floor, or something that levels the playing field, this will be the “Cardinal Way”.

Get used to it. Develop, compete in a small window, then be forced to sell off the good players for future prospects with gaps of garbage in between the competitive years.

Talkin' Baseball wrote: ↑24 Dec 2025 13:40 pm

Whatashame wrote: ↑24 Dec 2025 13:31 pm Plus, if they want any chance of keeping Skenes, they have to show him that they are willing to go the extra mile to have the best team possible. It’s commendable that they have made the efforts they have in trading for Lowe and signing O’Hearn. There already have been rumblings about his pitching and the lack of run support he receives.

Honestly, the only way that Skenes remains a Pirate through FA is if he takes a team friendly deal and the Pirates seem to be trying to make him as happy as possible.

If I were the Pirates, I wouldn't make myself a slave to Skenes. Do your level best to put together a good team. Do your level best to make a good contract offer and do it early. If you don't think you can re-sign him, trade him with 2 years left on his team control. Look at Tarik Skubal as an object lesson. The Tigers are, and will continue, to mess it up. They aren't going to fortify their team, or re-sign him. They are getting a draft pick. Think of the haul they could have had last offseason, or even this offseason with 1 year remaining. Whiff!

Disagree. Generational ace, they gotta take a shot at it while they have him.

Hofikebrucee wrote: ↑24 Dec 2025 14:13 pm The Pirates model is now the Cards model. We have to face it, unless there is a major shift in revenue sharing, cap and floor, or something that levels the playing field, this will be the “Cardinal Way”.

Get used to it. Develop, compete in a small window, then be forced to sell off the good players for future prospects with gaps of garbage in between the competitive years.

This is full of opinions, which I have no problem with, until you try to pass them off as facts. The only word I found here that I could agree with is- Develop. I guess we have that opinion in common.

jccarlson wrote: ↑24 Dec 2025 12:55 pm The pirates are definitely making better deals than we are. With our "someday in the future" approach, how many years will the Bucs be ahead of us in the final standings of the year?

They haven't played a single game yet

The Pirates won 71 games last year, and maybe should have won ~73. They added maybe 3-4 wins in with their FA signings, so are looking at 76-77 wins.

Where are the other 12+ wins coming from that they need to get to the upper 80s?

They are going to need a lot out of Chandler, Ashcraft, etc. in the rotation and a lot more out of Cruz, Reynolds, etc. offensively.

An Old Friend wrote: ↑24 Dec 2025 14:21 pm

Talkin' Baseball wrote: ↑24 Dec 2025 13:40 pm

Whatashame wrote: ↑24 Dec 2025 13:31 pm Plus, if they want any chance of keeping Skenes, they have to show him that they are willing to go the extra mile to have the best team possible. It’s commendable that they have made the efforts they have in trading for Lowe and signing O’Hearn. There already have been rumblings about his pitching and the lack of run support he receives.

Honestly, the only way that Skenes remains a Pirate through FA is if he takes a team friendly deal and the Pirates seem to be trying to make him as happy as possible.

If I were the Pirates, I wouldn't make myself a slave to Skenes. Do your level best to put together a good team. Do your level best to make a good contract offer and do it early. If you don't think you can re-sign him, trade him with 2 years left on his team control. Look at Tarik Skubal as an object lesson. The Tigers are, and will continue, to mess it up. They aren't going to fortify their team, or re-sign him. They are getting a draft pick. Think of the haul they could have had last offseason, or even this offseason with 1 year remaining. Whiff!

Disagree. Generational ace, they gotta take a shot at it while they have him.

Well then they better get to adding so they can make the most of it. I think the Royals have just as good a chance as anyone for that division.