STLtoday.com

R. Helsley
+
M. Winn

for

A. Pages
19 HR
63 RBI
.285 .326 .489 .815


-M. Betts goes back to the OF to replace Pages, Dodgers get a great defensive SS and great bullpen piece.

-Then they sign K. Tucker in the offseason to replace Pages.

-While C. Bloom gets the young, cost controlled (not a free agent until 2031) righthanded hitter he needs for the OF and he slides JJW in at SS 2026 opening day.

-WIN-WIN for both teams!

Get er' done.

no thanks

rockondlouie wrote: ↑23 Jul 2025 08:48 am R. Helsley
+
M. Winn

for

A. Pages
19 HR
63 RBI
.285 .326 .489 .815


-M. Betts goes back to the OF to replace Pages, Dodgers get a great defensive SS and great bullpen piece.

-Then they sign K. Tucker in the offseason to replace Pages.

-While C. Bloom gets the young, cost controlled (not a free agent until 2031) righthanded hitter he needs for the OF and he slides JJW in at SS 2026 opening day.

-WIN-WIN for both teams!

Get er' done.

In an instant.

jbrach wrote: ↑23 Jul 2025 08:49 amno thanks

Why?

Why would the Dodgers look to move Pages? Not for a rental and a lesser offense.

I certainly would..

jcgmoi wrote: ↑23 Jul 2025 08:59 am Why would the Dodgers look to move Pages? Not for a rental and a lesser offense.

That was my first thought. To answer the OP…absolutely. I feel like Cards would have to give up more in addition….a Church-type throw in?

Winn is a bona fide defensive superstar at the most premium position on the field. He has 16 OAA and is +5 DRS in 764 innings. And he has only 3 errors this year to date -- almost unheard of at SS. And he's already far better than Ozzie was at his age with the bat. 3.0 fWAR to date. There's little chance JJ would be anywhere near Winn on D at SS.

I'd sub Donovan in that deal for Winn. He's much older with less control and has zero chance to ever be a superstar. Winn still has that chance. And there is a logjam at 2B, not at SS. JJ can be moved in at 2B for Donovan.

Serious question.....why trade Winn? I know you have to give to get, but Winn should be a centerpiece in the Cardinals rebuild.

jcgmoi wrote: ↑23 Jul 2025 08:59 am Why would the Dodgers look to move Pages? Not for a rental and a lesser offense.

1) Winn is NOT a rental

2) They're the DODGERS! You don't think they'd lock Helsley down if he went out there and pitched great?

3) NOT a lesser offense in 2026 (Winn isn't Pages but he's still a solid 101 OPS+)

Ohtani-Betts-Freeman-Smith-Hernandez.............MORE than enough offense this season and again they're the DODGERS and can easily outbid anyone for K. Tucker this offseason to replace Pages.

They get a great young defensive SS and a stud closer.

We get the RHHing outfielder we desperately need.

WIN-WIN

No. Not a defensive whiz at short who will also give years of stellar defense. He’s not even matured yet. Thunk Edgar plus.

Helsley is a fine start.

russellhammond wrote: ↑23 Jul 2025 09:05 am Serious question.....why trade Winn? I know you have to give to get, but Winn should be a centerpiece in the Cardinals rebuild.

This. I would not trade Winn, nor JJ. They are my cornerstones on the IF going forward in the reset/rebuild. Every other player is up for discussion. I would also keep the best of the catching prospects. Everyone seems to think that is Bernal. Of course you keep Doyle. But on the MLB roster, anyone not named Winn. As was posted above, he is already in Ozzie territory defensively, with a much better arm, and he will improve at the plate. Keep him.

russellhammond wrote: ↑23 Jul 2025 09:05 am Serious question.....why trade Winn? I know you have to give to get, but Winn should be a centerpiece in the Cardinals rebuild.

You answered it russell (and the centerpiece of the rebuild is going to be JJW, not Winn)

To get a young, cost controlled for years stud RHHing OFer like Pages it has to hurt.

While JJW may not be Winn w/the glove he's going to more than make up for it by being a vastly superior offensive threat.

And accord to fangraphs he's no worse than a league average SS now (who most likely can improve under J. Oquendo's tutelage).

And for the other poster, Donovan doesn't work in this deal.

He's NOT a SS and that's what the Dodgers need to move Mookie back to the OF.

Dodgers turn that down 100 times out of 100.

rockondlouie wrote: ↑23 Jul 2025 09:11 am

russellhammond wrote: ↑23 Jul 2025 09:05 am Serious question.....why trade Winn? I know you have to give to get, but Winn should be a centerpiece in the Cardinals rebuild.

You answered it russell (and the centerpiece of the rebuild is going to be JJW, not Winn)

To get a young, cost controlled for years stud RHHing OFer like Pages it has to hurt.

While JJW may not be Winn w/the glove he's going to more than make up for it by being a vastly superior offensive threat.

And accord to fangraphs he's no worse than a league average SS now (who most likely can improve under J. Oquendo's tutelage).

And for the other poster, Donovan doesn't work in this deal.

He's NOT a SS and that's what the Dodgers need to move Mookie back to the OF.

While I don't think Winn is going to be a "superstar" or anywhere close to "Ozzie territory" at SS, he will be a great player and a draw for fans. I'm just really reluctant to trade Winn.....I think he's the closest to untouchable as a position player in the organization.

1) Winn is NOT a rental

Do you think I was suggesting he was? Come on.

The Dodgers already have a SS and the young cost-controlled OF you crave. Their relief pitching is fine if thin, but they can and probably will add a reliever without disrupting their team and reducing their offense. They wouldn't be interested in your deal.