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You make a couple good points.RichieRichSTL wrote: ↑19 Jul 2025 20:29 pm You don't stubbornly keep running out Mikolas, Fedde if you care at all. Nor do you keep Helsley.
To me, it was an excuse to lower payroll, while trying to compete, not a true reset.
It was always about getting payroll under $100m by next season and blaming it on attendance. They have made a conscious decision to be a small market team. Glad fans saw it and have responded. If they want attendance they have to spend and win firstRichieRichSTL wrote: ↑19 Jul 2025 20:29 pm You don't stubbornly keep running out Mikolas, Fedde if you care at all. Nor do you keep Helsley.
To me, it was an excuse to lower payroll, while trying to compete, not a true reset.
I would only say in the last month it’s become ‘stubborn.’ Both pitched well the first 10-11 weeks or so.RichieRichSTL wrote: ↑19 Jul 2025 20:29 pm You don't stubbornly keep running out Mikolas, Fedde if you care at all. Nor do you keep Helsley.
To me, it was an excuse to lower payroll, while trying to compete, not a true reset.
I think the firing of Schildt and replacing him with Oli sent a bad signal. Schildt will never be HOF, but he won. After bringing back a mediocre team from the dead and realing off a record streak, they fired him and replaced him with a joke. What BDW said about winning when getting rid of Matheny, turned out to be less about winning and more about following the Mo way and dont you dare even think about raising any concern. Further confirmation it was more about 'the plan' than winningYouboughtit wrote: ↑19 Jul 2025 20:44 pmIt was always about getting payroll under $100m by next season and blaming it on attendance. They have made a conscious decision to be a small market team. Glad fans saw it and have responded. If they want attendance they have to spend and win firstRichieRichSTL wrote: ↑19 Jul 2025 20:29 pm You don't stubbornly keep running out Mikolas, Fedde if you care at all. Nor do you keep Helsley.
To me, it was an excuse to lower payroll, while trying to compete, not a true reset.
Yes, but they will counter and say Look at the Brewers , they spend less than us and their fan attendance is greater than ours this year.Youboughtit wrote: ↑19 Jul 2025 20:44 pmIt was always about getting payroll under $100m by next season and blaming it on attendance. They have made a conscious decision to be a small market team. Glad fans saw it and have responded. If they want attendance they have to spend and win firstRichieRichSTL wrote: ↑19 Jul 2025 20:29 pm You don't stubbornly keep running out Mikolas, Fedde if you care at all. Nor do you keep Helsley.
To me, it was an excuse to lower payroll, while trying to compete, not a true reset.
Besides McGreevey, who will be a #4, exactly what future 100 game winners are being blocked?RichieRichSTL wrote: ↑19 Jul 2025 20:29 pm You don't stubbornly keep running out Mikolas, Fedde if you care at all. Nor do you keep Helsley.
To me, it was an excuse to lower payroll, while trying to compete, not a true reset.
The Brewers don’t have the WS standard. That will no work in STL. Do you remember when Auggie died and his son tried this? There were no fans at all at games until Dewitt bought and spent to bring them back. It actually took STL longer to pull away than I thought it would because Dewitt lost his fastball long ago. That 2011 shouldn’t have allowed 14 years of support but it did and it’s going to get really bad if he doesn’t change course and get some legit superstars in their prime and spend to bring fans back. And by spend I mean $200m per season.ramfandan wrote: ↑19 Jul 2025 22:05 pmYes, but they will counter and say Look at the Brewers , they spend less than us and their fan attendance is greater than ours this year.Youboughtit wrote: ↑19 Jul 2025 20:44 pmIt was always about getting payroll under $100m by next season and blaming it on attendance. They have made a conscious decision to be a small market team. Glad fans saw it and have responded. If they want attendance they have to spend and win firstRichieRichSTL wrote: ↑19 Jul 2025 20:29 pm You don't stubbornly keep running out Mikolas, Fedde if you care at all. Nor do you keep Helsley.
To me, it was an excuse to lower payroll, while trying to compete, not a true reset.
They will always have some reason . That's how teams play the game. Deflect from themselves.
I am not a Mo supporter or apologist. I do think he’s has some bad luck this year. Not being able to complete a trade of Nado was a big blow to his offseason plans. Plus, a lot of guys are either hurt or sucking—Gorman, Walker, Herrera, Mikolas, Fedde. The farm talent is mostly all just replacement level guys. Donnie and Lib have been the only two consistant bright spots on the team.RichieRichSTL wrote: ↑19 Jul 2025 20:29 pm You don't stubbornly keep running out Mikolas, Fedde if you care at all. Nor do you keep Helsley.
To me, it was an excuse to lower payroll, while trying to compete, not a true reset.
It might have to do with the CBA and their plans to have a stoppage. Maybe. They've never spent adequately on this team. It's been a cash cow and they've always cried poor.RichieRichSTL wrote: ↑19 Jul 2025 20:29 pm You don't stubbornly keep running out Mikolas, Fedde if you care at all. Nor do you keep Helsley.
To me, it was an excuse to lower payroll, while trying to compete, not a true reset.
I do think 2-3 of this group will be quality future startersCarp4Cy wrote: ↑19 Jul 2025 22:14 pmBesides McGreevey, who will be a #4, exactly what future 100 game winners are being blocked?RichieRichSTL wrote: ↑19 Jul 2025 20:29 pm You don't stubbornly keep running out Mikolas, Fedde if you care at all. Nor do you keep Helsley.
To me, it was an excuse to lower payroll, while trying to compete, not a true reset.
All our prospects keep getting hurt. We figured out we don’t have anything.
red part 200% correctRichieRichSTL wrote: ↑19 Jul 2025 21:53 pmI think the firing of Schildt and replacing him with Oli sent a bad signal. Schildt will never be HOF, but he won. After bringing back a mediocre team from the dead and realing off a record streak, they fired him and replaced him with a joke. What BDW said about winning when getting rid of Matheny, turned out to be less about winning and more about following the Mo way and dont you dare even think about raising any concern. Further confirmation it was more about 'the plan' than winningYouboughtit wrote: ↑19 Jul 2025 20:44 pmIt was always about getting payroll under $100m by next season and blaming it on attendance. They have made a conscious decision to be a small market team. Glad fans saw it and have responded. If they want attendance they have to spend and win firstRichieRichSTL wrote: ↑19 Jul 2025 20:29 pm You don't stubbornly keep running out Mikolas, Fedde if you care at all. Nor do you keep Helsley.
To me, it was an excuse to lower payroll, while trying to compete, not a true reset.
The got a reprieve with Pujols resurgence and Molina's farewell tour and the energy it brought to the team. But as we saw in the 2022 playoffs and the PR disaster to open the season, fans saw through it. Keeping Oli on, just showed fans it really wasn't about performance aka winning.
They had a meh 2007 and 2008 and Three years of no playoffs 2016-2018, but fans were loyal. With Oli debacle and lying about spending, they told fans, you dont deserve the truth or a competitive product.
BDW in the 1990s and 2000s understood that you spend to build and show commitment fans will come. Just as Whiteyball did in the 1980s. We are falling back to late Brewery ownership vibes now.
I said this in February.RichieRichSTL wrote: ↑19 Jul 2025 20:29 pm You don't stubbornly keep running out Mikolas, Fedde if you care at all. Nor do you keep Helsley.
To me, it was an excuse to lower payroll, while trying to compete, not a true reset.
An Old Friend wrote: ↑16 Feb 2025 14:56 pm Reset, transition... different semantics to describe the same approach, that being they're moving towards a small market approach and resetting their payroll baseline to reflect that new reality.
Basically risk adverse. They'd rather not have to count o selling so many tickets. They'd rather have a lower baseline with 'guaranteed profits' than to count on fans. Whar they'll get is failed product that only the hardcore are interested in.An Old Friend wrote: ↑20 Jul 2025 00:26 amI said this in February.RichieRichSTL wrote: ↑19 Jul 2025 20:29 pm You don't stubbornly keep running out Mikolas, Fedde if you care at all. Nor do you keep Helsley.
To me, it was an excuse to lower payroll, while trying to compete, not a true reset.An Old Friend wrote: ↑16 Feb 2025 14:56 pm Reset, transition... different semantics to describe the same approach, that being they're moving towards a small market approach and resetting their payroll baseline to reflect that new reality.
Interested. But not enough to buy a ticket. And allowing the rot to lay around another year was a horrible decision.RichieRichSTL wrote: ↑20 Jul 2025 00:55 amBasically risk adverse. They'd rather not have to count o selling so many tickets. They'd rather have a lower baseline with 'guaranteed profits' than to count on fans. Whar they'll get is failed product that only the hardcore are interested in.An Old Friend wrote: ↑20 Jul 2025 00:26 amI said this in February.RichieRichSTL wrote: ↑19 Jul 2025 20:29 pm You don't stubbornly keep running out Mikolas, Fedde if you care at all. Nor do you keep Helsley.
To me, it was an excuse to lower payroll, while trying to compete, not a true reset.An Old Friend wrote: ↑16 Feb 2025 14:56 pm Reset, transition... different semantics to describe the same approach, that being they're moving towards a small market approach and resetting their payroll baseline to reflect that new reality.