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imadangman wrote: ↑28 Apr 2025 20:19 pm Oh you cocksugger in what realm is it advisable to trade Donovan or Nootbaar. Everyone knows Helsley, Fedde, Arenado etc will be on the block. But this is not a total punt job, I don't think that's what Bloom is expecting by a "clean slate."

Alex Reyes Cy Young wrote: ↑28 Apr 2025 20:15 pm Noots, Donovan's, really anyone who's clock has started and has years on them.

ST. LOUIS, MO., July 30, 2023 – The St. Louis Cardinals announced this afternoon that they have acquired minor league right-handed pitcher Tekoah Roby, left-handed pitcher John King and infielder Thomas Saggese from the Texas Rangers in exchange for pitchers Jordan Montgomery and Chris Stratton and International Signing Bonus Pool space.

I'd like to see more of these in the not so distant future.

In-turn the vets would be more apt to waive their NTC's.

Clean house give Chaim a blank canvas to work with.

Alex Reyes Cy Young wrote: ↑28 Apr 2025 20:15 pm Noots, Donovan's, really anyone who's clock has started and has years on them.

ST. LOUIS, MO., July 30, 2023 – The St. Louis Cardinals announced this afternoon that they have acquired minor league right-handed pitcher Tekoah Roby, left-handed pitcher John King and infielder Thomas Saggese from the Texas Rangers in exchange for pitchers Jordan Montgomery and Chris Stratton and International Signing Bonus Pool space.

I'd like to see more of these in the not so distant future.

In-turn the vets would be more apt to waive their NTC's.

Clean house give Chaim a blank canvas to work with.

imadangman wrote: ↑28 Apr 2025 20:19 pm Oh you cocksugger in what realm is it advisable to trade Donovan or Nootbaar. Everyone knows Helsley, Fedde, Arenado etc will be on the block. But this is not a total punt job, I don't think that's what Bloom is expecting by a "clean slate."

Alex Reyes Cy Young wrote: ↑28 Apr 2025 20:15 pm Noots, Donovan's, really anyone who's clock has started and has years on them.

ST. LOUIS, MO., July 30, 2023 – The St. Louis Cardinals announced this afternoon that they have acquired minor league right-handed pitcher Tekoah Roby, left-handed pitcher John King and infielder Thomas Saggese from the Texas Rangers in exchange for pitchers Jordan Montgomery and Chris Stratton and International Signing Bonus Pool space.

I'd like to see more of these in the not so distant future.

In-turn the vets would be more apt to waive their NTC's.

Clean house give Chaim a blank canvas to work with.

Red Bird Classic wrote: ↑28 Apr 2025 21:39 pm

Alex Reyes Cy Young wrote: ↑28 Apr 2025 20:15 pm Noots, Donovan's, really anyone who's clock has started and has years on them.

ST. LOUIS, MO., July 30, 2023 – The St. Louis Cardinals announced this afternoon that they have acquired minor league right-handed pitcher Tekoah Roby, left-handed pitcher John King and infielder Thomas Saggese from the Texas Rangers in exchange for pitchers Jordan Montgomery and Chris Stratton and International Signing Bonus Pool space.

I'd like to see more of these in the not so distant future.

In-turn the vets would be more apt to waive their NTC's.

Clean house give Chaim a blank canvas to work with.

If the return is similar to Roby, Saggese, and King, I'd be all for it. But let's not have another Edman for Feddie deal. That deal never made any sense at all.

renostl wrote: ↑28 Apr 2025 21:11 pm

Alex Reyes Cy Young wrote: ↑28 Apr 2025 20:15 pm Noots, Donovan's, really anyone who's clock has started and has years on them.

ST. LOUIS, MO., July 30, 2023 – The St. Louis Cardinals announced this afternoon that they have acquired minor league right-handed pitcher Tekoah Roby, left-handed pitcher John King and infielder Thomas Saggese from the Texas Rangers in exchange for pitchers Jordan Montgomery and Chris Stratton and International Signing Bonus Pool space.

I'd like to see more of these in the not so distant future.

In-turn the vets would be more apt to waive their NTC's.

Clean house give Chaim a blank canvas to work with.

Maybe
Always depends on the return. As you
would agree.

Some sense to this IF BD is a future OFer/UT guy. then move 1 not both, IMO.

As to the NTC's, if the current pace of losing isn't enough motivation to wave their NTC not sure what would. Actually of the NTC's Gray is the one most beneficial is he changed his mind.

Talkin' Baseball wrote: ↑29 Apr 2025 11:01 am

renostl wrote: ↑28 Apr 2025 21:11 pm

Alex Reyes Cy Young wrote: ↑28 Apr 2025 20:15 pm Noots, Donovan's, really anyone who's clock has started and has years on them.

ST. LOUIS, MO., July 30, 2023 – The St. Louis Cardinals announced this afternoon that they have acquired minor league right-handed pitcher Tekoah Roby, left-handed pitcher John King and infielder Thomas Saggese from the Texas Rangers in exchange for pitchers Jordan Montgomery and Chris Stratton and International Signing Bonus Pool space.

I'd like to see more of these in the not so distant future.

In-turn the vets would be more apt to waive their NTC's.

Clean house give Chaim a blank canvas to work with.

Maybe
Always depends on the return. As you
would agree.

Some sense to this IF BD is a future OFer/UT guy. then move 1 not both, IMO.

As to the NTC's, if the current pace of losing isn't enough motivation to wave their NTC not sure what would. Actually of the NTC's Gray is the one most beneficial is he changed his mind.

We should be willing to trade players with control left if the return warrants it. We should not completely start over. For example: I would not want to trade Nootbaar and Donovan. I am not anxious to trade either one of them, but they (along with Winn) have some of the highest trade values on the team. In another thread (Execute The Plan) i suggested Eury Perez of the Marlins as a good target. Would I trade Nootbaar for him? In a heartbeat. Perez is the true #1 pitcher that we can't draft, develop, or trade for. I like Nootbaar, but I would be willing to let Donovan play LF for a time, or try to move Herrera there, or see about Chase Davis, or try someone we might trade for at the deadline, or sign someone presentable in the offseason, or, or, or... The point is the trade (as an example) answers a question not easliy answered and creates a hole that can probably be dealt with.

Others I would be willing to move are Burleson, Gorman, or one of the catchers. Trading these players isn't just a dump- they have to be for meaningful return that address issues. Most controversially (I'm not even sold on the idea yet), I might be willing to trade Tink Hence to a team that views him as a potential high-end starting pitcher. I like him a lot and think he will be a good major league pitcher- I'm just starting to think his ceiling may be as a closer. He can't stay healthy and isn't building innings in a way that could let him be part of a major league rotation. Still valuable, but not as valuable as a starting pitcher.

cardstatman wrote: ↑28 Apr 2025 21:38 pm Should have traded Fedde and Helsley and Burleson during the offseason.

Shockingly, their value has gone down.

Burleson is just helping us lose more.
Fedde is striking out 4.7 per 9 IP and walking 4.4 per 9 IP.
Helsley has no control and what good is a closer if there are no games to save?

renostl wrote: ↑29 Apr 2025 11:39 am

Talkin' Baseball wrote: ↑29 Apr 2025 11:01 am

renostl wrote: ↑28 Apr 2025 21:11 pm

Alex Reyes Cy Young wrote: ↑28 Apr 2025 20:15 pm Noots, Donovan's, really anyone who's clock has started and has years on them.

ST. LOUIS, MO., July 30, 2023 – The St. Louis Cardinals announced this afternoon that they have acquired minor league right-handed pitcher Tekoah Roby, left-handed pitcher John King and infielder Thomas Saggese from the Texas Rangers in exchange for pitchers Jordan Montgomery and Chris Stratton and International Signing Bonus Pool space.

I'd like to see more of these in the not so distant future.

In-turn the vets would be more apt to waive their NTC's.

Clean house give Chaim a blank canvas to work with.

Maybe
Always depends on the return. As you
would agree.

Some sense to this IF BD is a future OFer/UT guy. then move 1 not both, IMO.

As to the NTC's, if the current pace of losing isn't enough motivation to wave their NTC not sure what would. Actually of the NTC's Gray is the one most beneficial is he changed his mind.

We should be willing to trade players with control left if the return warrants it. We should not completely start over. For example: I would not want to trade Nootbaar and Donovan. I am not anxious to trade either one of them, but they (along with Winn) have some of the highest trade values on the team. In another thread (Execute The Plan) i suggested Eury Perez of the Marlins as a good target. Would I trade Nootbaar for him? In a heartbeat. Perez is the true #1 pitcher that we can't draft, develop, or trade for. I like Nootbaar, but I would be willing to let Donovan play LF for a time, or try to move Herrera there, or see about Chase Davis, or try someone we might trade for at the deadline, or sign someone presentable in the offseason, or, or, or... The point is the trade (as an example) answers a question not easliy answered and creates a hole that can probably be dealt with.

Others I would be willing to move are Burleson, Gorman, or one of the catchers. Trading these players isn't just a dump- they have to be for meaningful return that address issues. Most controversially (I'm not even sold on the idea yet), I might be willing to trade Tink Hence to a team that views him as a potential high-end starting pitcher. I like him a lot and think he will be a good major league pitcher- I'm just starting to think his ceiling may be as a closer. He can't stay healthy and isn't building innings in a way that could let him be part of a major league rotation. Still valuable, but not as valuable as a starting pitcher.

I respect the view we may just have different names that we'd deal.
I'd caution that OF has been easy to cover for the Cards and I'd want to keep
players that have shown capable of hitting at the MLB. Donovan Scott and Walker
sound weak to me. Cards or any team expecting too many prospects to produce
at the same time are being unrealistic and not competing. The flaw in rebuilds.

Perez is a great target. Not sure why they'd deal him anytime soon but if they did
I'd be pushing our redundancies and a prospect or 2-3.
Walker, Crooks, Roby or a 2B?