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30-60-90
Posted: 07 Apr 2025 07:59 am
by Alex Reyes Cy Young
Assuming if things continue to trend downwards when do you look at moving some of these controlled players, either by forcing them out, DFA or trading them?
I'm thinking if they get rolled 5 - 6 more series it might be time to start looking to move players. I'm not just talking about Mikolas or Nado, but guys who are in their later ARB years. Nootbaar for instance. He gets hurt but he is on a heater now. Assuming he can maintain or regress just slightly he might be someone you consider moving on from to load up some talent in the minors or get someone who has more years of control.
Not really sold on one player, just using Noot as a example, due to his value and his stage in his contract.
Re: 30-60-90
Posted: 07 Apr 2025 08:05 am
by ecleme22
I think you will see (and I look forward to it) some movement in the pitching staff before someone like a Noot would be traded.
They will try and get the staff right before they sell.
I'm hoping this all happens in April.
Re: 30-60-90
Posted: 07 Apr 2025 08:13 am
by Alex Reyes Cy Young
ecleme22 wrote: ↑07 Apr 2025 08:05 am
I think you will see (and I look forward to it) some movement in the pitching staff before someone like a Noot would be traded.
They will try and get the staff right before they sell.
I'm hoping this all happens in April.
Any hopes of competing absolutely need to bring up a pitcher or trade for one. It would be cool if they could package up a deal from the minors and current roster for a solid controlled starter, maybe to a bad team with a ton of holes.
3 solid players for 1 really good pitcher, something like that... It would weaken the team offensively but would in theory get the Cardinals a really good pitcher one for the now and for the future, assuming they are controlled for 4-6 years...
Re: 30-60-90
Posted: 07 Apr 2025 08:19 am
by Alex Reyes Cy Young
Maybe someone like Nootbaar or Donovan along with some minor league player or players. The catching core in the minors is solid so they could theoretically pull from there and package someone like Nootbaar or Donovan to a team to get back a really nice pitcher.
Even moving on from one like Helsley or another relief pitcher to sweeten the deal, assuming this pitcher was projecting to be really good.
Re: 30-60-90
Posted: 07 Apr 2025 08:59 am
by Hoosier59
In my opinion, I think the Cardinals look at Nootbaar as their face of the team. He’s a fan favorite and there would be a serious backlash from most of the fans if the Cardinals were to trade him. He would probably bring back the most return, but still not a, cheap, proven ace type pitcher. Right now, the Cardinal outfield, looks ok, with, Noot, Walker, and Scott each playing pretty well. The playing time crunch is at the infield, and catching positions. Gorman, and Herrera now being injured makes that less true, for now, but when they return it will be even worse if Saggese and Pozo produce. Wetherholt, Crooks, and Bernal are position players of the future, so anyone they would displace are the players that could, or should be available in trade.
Re: 30-60-90
Posted: 07 Apr 2025 09:19 am
by rockondlouie
IF, if they fall 10 games behind the scrubbies (who look like the best of the NLC), then it's time to:
-DFA Mikolas
-Deal Helsley
-Deal Fedde
-Deal Matz
-Deal Burleson
-Deal NADO (if he'll waive the NTC)
-Listen on Donovan but don't just give him away.
Approach Gray and WillyC if teams come calling for them to see if they still want to stay.
Noot & Hererra you build around as well as Winn, Walker and Gorman.
Re: 30-60-90
Posted: 07 Apr 2025 09:25 am
by renostl
Alex Reyes Cy Young wrote: ↑07 Apr 2025 08:19 am
Maybe someone like Nootbaar or Donovan along with some minor league player or players. The catching core in the minors is solid so they could theoretically pull from there and package someone like Nootbaar or Donovan to a team to get back a really nice pitcher.
Even moving on from one like Helsley or another relief pitcher to sweeten the deal, assuming this pitcher was projecting to be really good.
I think at this point in time a team will need to be a little
disparate to give up a really nice pitcher.
Agree that they need to thin the infield and they need pitching.
Honestly, IF Donovan doesn't play in the OF, he'd be at the top of the list
as a trade chip.
The FO was overly consumed by NA when other moves could have happened.
Fedde and/or Matz, Helsley, Pallante, Maton need to throw well in order
to have appeal to a team looking for Now pitching for that nice pitcher in return.
Add a player mentioned in this thread and you may get a good one.
Re: 30-60-90
Posted: 07 Apr 2025 09:25 am
by Jatalk
Why would anything happen until closer to the trade deadline? Other teams are set. They will need to evaluate their needs as the season progresses.
Internally things could happen but that would mean only a few options are really available.
DFA’s? Don’t see that happening.
Re: 30-60-90
Posted: 07 Apr 2025 09:44 am
by 45s
Hoosier59 wrote: ↑07 Apr 2025 08:59 am
In my opinion, I think the Cardinals look at Nootbaar as their face of the team. He’s a fan favorite and there would be a serious backlash from most of the fans if the Cardinals were to trade him. He would probably bring back the most return, but still not a, cheap, proven ace type pitcher. Right now, the Cardinal outfield, looks ok, with, Noot, Walker, and Scott each playing pretty well. The playing time crunch is at the infield, and catching positions. Gorman, and Herrera now being injured makes that less true, for now, but when they return it will be even worse if Saggese and Pozo produce. Wetherholt, Crooks, and Bernal are position players of the future, so anyone they would displace are the players that could, or should be available in trade.
I think you are right about nootbarr…..and that’s a problem
Re: 30-60-90
Posted: 07 Apr 2025 09:53 am
by renostl
Jatalk wrote: ↑07 Apr 2025 09:25 am
Why would anything happen until closer to the trade deadline? Other teams are set. They will need to evaluate their needs as the season progresses.
Internally things could happen but that would mean only a few options are really available.
DFA’s? Don’t see that happening.
Agreement. Especially the DFA's in April.
Wrong month that begins with an A.
A team would need to have some desperation and be wanting to jump
the gun before other teams do.
Now home many Cards players are appealing enough to motivate that
unknown team to do that.
Re: 30-60-90
Posted: 07 Apr 2025 10:01 am
by renostl
Hoosier59 wrote: ↑07 Apr 2025 08:59 am
In my opinion, I think the Cardinals look at Nootbaar as their face of the team. He’s a fan favorite and there would be a serious backlash from most of the fans if the Cardinals were to trade him. He would probably bring back the most return, but still not a, cheap, proven ace type pitcher. Right now, the Cardinal outfield, looks ok, with, Noot, Walker, and Scott each playing pretty well. The playing time crunch is at the infield, and catching positions. Gorman, and Herrera now being injured makes that less true, for now, but when they return it will be even worse if Saggese and Pozo produce. Wetherholt, Crooks, and Bernal are position players of the future, so anyone they would displace are the players that could, or should be available in trade.
How much more backlash could there be?
MO is still focused elsewhere. I'd be shocked if he has any moves
beyond money moves in his thoughts at all. The other teams GM would have to
initiate any deal.
Re: 30-60-90
Posted: 07 Apr 2025 10:03 am
by blackinkbiz
The day we tell Miles Mikolas thank you for your service but that's enough will be a day to remember in St. Louis.
Re: 30-60-90
Posted: 07 Apr 2025 10:12 am
by 45s
renostl wrote: ↑07 Apr 2025 10:01 am
Hoosier59 wrote: ↑07 Apr 2025 08:59 am
In my opinion, I think the Cardinals look at Nootbaar as their face of the team. He’s a fan favorite and there would be a serious backlash from most of the fans if the Cardinals were to trade him. He would probably bring back the most return, but still not a, cheap, proven ace type pitcher. Right now, the Cardinal outfield, looks ok, with, Noot, Walker, and Scott each playing pretty well. The playing time crunch is at the infield, and catching positions. Gorman, and Herrera now being injured makes that less true, for now, but when they return it will be even worse if Saggese and Pozo produce. Wetherholt, Crooks, and Bernal are position players of the future, so anyone they would displace are the players that could, or should be available in trade.
How much more backlash could there be?
MO is still focused elsewhere. I'd be shocked if he has any moves
beyond money moves in his thoughts at all. The other teams GM would have to
initiate any deal.
If moving him improves the club, why would there be any?
Re: 30-60-90
Posted: 07 Apr 2025 10:13 am
by Strummer Jones
blackinkbiz wrote: ↑07 Apr 2025 10:03 am
The day we tell Miles Mikolas thank you for your service but that's enough will be a day to remember in St. Louis.
Agreed. Probably the least talented pitcher on the roster. And probably the least equipped to get the most out of what talent he does have.
Re: 30-60-90
Posted: 07 Apr 2025 10:14 am
by renostl
blackinkbiz wrote: ↑07 Apr 2025 10:03 am
The day we tell Miles Mikolas thank you for your service but that's enough will be a day to remember in St. Louis.
I get a fear that Miles would work cheap enough for the Cardinals
that an extension form MO say 2-3 years/$7 million each will be MO's
last contract handed out with of course a full NTC.
Re: 30-60-90
Posted: 07 Apr 2025 10:19 am
by renostl
45s wrote: ↑07 Apr 2025 10:12 am
renostl wrote: ↑07 Apr 2025 10:01 am
Hoosier59 wrote: ↑07 Apr 2025 08:59 am
In my opinion, I think the Cardinals look at Nootbaar as their face of the team. He’s a fan favorite and there would be a serious backlash from most of the fans if the Cardinals were to trade him. He would probably bring back the most return, but still not a, cheap, proven ace type pitcher. Right now, the Cardinal outfield, looks ok, with, Noot, Walker, and Scott each playing pretty well. The playing time crunch is at the infield, and catching positions. Gorman, and Herrera now being injured makes that less true, for now, but when they return it will be even worse if Saggese and Pozo produce. Wetherholt, Crooks, and Bernal are position players of the future, so anyone they would displace are the players that could, or should be available in trade.
How much more backlash could there be?
MO is still focused elsewhere. I'd be shocked if he has any moves
beyond money moves in his thoughts at all. The other teams GM would have to
initiate any deal.
If moving him improves the club, why would there be any?
You'd have to ask those who would deal the backlash.
The biggest from myself was probably the Simmons trade.
Even that didn't interfere with me going to games. It's part of the game.