STLtoday.com Forums
https://interact.stltoday.com/forums/
https://interact.stltoday.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=1510047
Baseball Savant wrote: ↑17 Mar 2025 21:01 pm Ownership and management somehow killed the Golden Goose
Somebody moved the cheese on BDW and he is lost.
And stubborn.
He and Mo were complicit in HackGate
They deserve their misery
Why are you on here?Stlcardsblues wrote: ↑17 Mar 2025 21:09 pmBaseball Savant wrote: ↑17 Mar 2025 21:01 pm Ownership and management somehow killed the Golden Goose
Somebody moved the cheese on BDW and he is lost.
And stubborn.
He and Mo were complicit in HackGate
They deserve their misery
I was in agreement until hackgate. Everyone forgets one big piece of it which kills the idea they were doing it as an organization.
Show them you’re serious about winning. Build the best player development system in baseball, not let it rot through cost-cutting. Make reasonable offers to free agents, not lowballs. And when they don’t sign, make public statements like “X is a great player, and we wish him the best. We look forward to continuing to try to show premier free agents why we’re the Yankees of the NL and a place people want to play.” Ever notice how when the big boys get signed, Mo always says “we were never really in it?” He’s telling the whole industry that they’re not interested!RamFan08NY wrote: ↑17 Mar 2025 21:13 pm The players have to want to come to your team. How many middle America teams are attracting these guys? If you're not near one of the oceans, players don't want to be there. The Cardinals are in the same non-attractive boat that about 26 other teams arer in. How do you fix it? The only way you even have a chance at them is by extreme over spending, and that might not even work.
LMAO. What a spoiled whiny (buzz)Baseball Savant wrote: ↑17 Mar 2025 21:01 pm Ownership and management somehow killed the Golden Goose
Somebody moved the cheese on BDW and he is lost.
And stubborn.
He and Mo were complicit in HackGate
They deserve their misery
Yawn.. another useless front office (donkey) kisser...why are you on herethetank2 wrote: ↑17 Mar 2025 21:13 pmWhy are you on here?Stlcardsblues wrote: ↑17 Mar 2025 21:09 pmBaseball Savant wrote: ↑17 Mar 2025 21:01 pm Ownership and management somehow killed the Golden Goose
Somebody moved the cheese on BDW and he is lost.
And stubborn.
He and Mo were complicit in HackGate
They deserve their misery
I was in agreement until hackgate. Everyone forgets one big piece of it which kills the idea they were doing it as an organization.
I agree with you, rat. Deliver a winning message to everyone. Strive for greatness. It hasn’t been that long ago. Some of us remember.desertrat23 wrote: ↑17 Mar 2025 21:59 pmShow them you’re serious about winning. Build the best player development system in baseball, not let it rot through cost-cutting. Make reasonable offers to free agents, not lowballs. And when they don’t sign, make public statements like “X is a great player, and we wish him the best. We look forward to continuing to try to show premier free agents why we’re the Yankees of the NL and a place people want to play.” Ever notice how when the big boys get signed, Mo always says “we were never really in it?” He’s telling the whole industry that they’re not interested!RamFan08NY wrote: ↑17 Mar 2025 21:13 pm The players have to want to come to your team. How many middle America teams are attracting these guys? If you're not near one of the oceans, players don't want to be there. The Cardinals are in the same non-attractive boat that about 26 other teams arer in. How do you fix it? The only way you even have a chance at them is by extreme over spending, and that might not even work.
Above all, make every move, every statement, every transaction, send the message that you want to win a championship. Not a wild card, not a division, a ring. Even if you fall short, you’re showing the fans, the other teams, the agents, and the players that you’re serious. We haven’t done that in years.
They strove for greatness when they traded for Goldy and Arenado.BrockFloodMaris wrote: ↑18 Mar 2025 07:13 amI agree with you, rat. Deliver a winning message to everyone. Strive for greatness. It hasn’t been that long ago. Some of us remember.desertrat23 wrote: ↑17 Mar 2025 21:59 pmShow them you’re serious about winning. Build the best player development system in baseball, not let it rot through cost-cutting. Make reasonable offers to free agents, not lowballs. And when they don’t sign, make public statements like “X is a great player, and we wish him the best. We look forward to continuing to try to show premier free agents why we’re the Yankees of the NL and a place people want to play.” Ever notice how when the big boys get signed, Mo always says “we were never really in it?” He’s telling the whole industry that they’re not interested!RamFan08NY wrote: ↑17 Mar 2025 21:13 pm The players have to want to come to your team. How many middle America teams are attracting these guys? If you're not near one of the oceans, players don't want to be there. The Cardinals are in the same non-attractive boat that about 26 other teams arer in. How do you fix it? The only way you even have a chance at them is by extreme over spending, and that might not even work.
Above all, make every move, every statement, every transaction, send the message that you want to win a championship. Not a wild card, not a division, a ring. Even if you fall short, you’re showing the fans, the other teams, the agents, and the players that you’re serious. We haven’t done that in years.
Yes. Those were both fantastic deals. But a couple of things:Cranny wrote: ↑18 Mar 2025 08:26 amThey strove for greatness when they traded for Goldy and Arenado.BrockFloodMaris wrote: ↑18 Mar 2025 07:13 amI agree with you, rat. Deliver a winning message to everyone. Strive for greatness. It hasn’t been that long ago. Some of us remember.desertrat23 wrote: ↑17 Mar 2025 21:59 pmShow them you’re serious about winning. Build the best player development system in baseball, not let it rot through cost-cutting. Make reasonable offers to free agents, not lowballs. And when they don’t sign, make public statements like “X is a great player, and we wish him the best. We look forward to continuing to try to show premier free agents why we’re the Yankees of the NL and a place people want to play.” Ever notice how when the big boys get signed, Mo always says “we were never really in it?” He’s telling the whole industry that they’re not interested!RamFan08NY wrote: ↑17 Mar 2025 21:13 pm The players have to want to come to your team. How many middle America teams are attracting these guys? If you're not near one of the oceans, players don't want to be there. The Cardinals are in the same non-attractive boat that about 26 other teams arer in. How do you fix it? The only way you even have a chance at them is by extreme over spending, and that might not even work.
Above all, make every move, every statement, every transaction, send the message that you want to win a championship. Not a wild card, not a division, a ring. Even if you fall short, you’re showing the fans, the other teams, the agents, and the players that you’re serious. We haven’t done that in years.
The fans don't deserve it though. So, your ire for ownership is well placed but not your ire for the team and the people that help that team on a daily basis.Baseball Savant wrote: ↑17 Mar 2025 21:01 pm Ownership and management somehow killed the Golden Goose
Somebody moved the cheese on BDW and he is lost.
And stubborn.
He and Mo were complicit in HackGate
They deserve their misery
Finish the job by signing more expensive players when it’s not in the budget?desertrat23 wrote: ↑18 Mar 2025 09:01 amYes. Those were both fantastic deals. But a couple of things:Cranny wrote: ↑18 Mar 2025 08:26 amThey strove for greatness when they traded for Goldy and Arenado.BrockFloodMaris wrote: ↑18 Mar 2025 07:13 amI agree with you, rat. Deliver a winning message to everyone. Strive for greatness. It hasn’t been that long ago. Some of us remember.desertrat23 wrote: ↑17 Mar 2025 21:59 pmShow them you’re serious about winning. Build the best player development system in baseball, not let it rot through cost-cutting. Make reasonable offers to free agents, not lowballs. And when they don’t sign, make public statements like “X is a great player, and we wish him the best. We look forward to continuing to try to show premier free agents why we’re the Yankees of the NL and a place people want to play.” Ever notice how when the big boys get signed, Mo always says “we were never really in it?” He’s telling the whole industry that they’re not interested!RamFan08NY wrote: ↑17 Mar 2025 21:13 pm The players have to want to come to your team. How many middle America teams are attracting these guys? If you're not near one of the oceans, players don't want to be there. The Cardinals are in the same non-attractive boat that about 26 other teams arer in. How do you fix it? The only way you even have a chance at them is by extreme over spending, and that might not even work.
Above all, make every move, every statement, every transaction, send the message that you want to win a championship. Not a wild card, not a division, a ring. Even if you fall short, you’re showing the fans, the other teams, the agents, and the players that you’re serious. We haven’t done that in years.
1. Striving for greatness is a constant thing, not an every-few-years thing.
2. They never finished the job! How many of us at the time of each of those deals could tell they were great adds, but weren’t enough to fill the major roster holes, be it pitching or outfield bat? It’s building a team that’s a serious contender to win a ring, not a division.
What’s the one big piece?Stlcardsblues wrote: ↑17 Mar 2025 21:09 pmBaseball Savant wrote: ↑17 Mar 2025 21:01 pm Ownership and management somehow killed the Golden Goose
Somebody moved the cheese on BDW and he is lost.
And stubborn.
He and Mo were complicit in HackGate
They deserve their misery
I was in agreement until hackgate. Everyone forgets one big piece of it which kills the idea they were doing it as an organization.
You are correct. They did. But, looking back, it seems like they were making those trades instead of recommitting to player development. They put all their eggs into the Goldy/Nado basket. It didn’t work, and the farm didn’t help much.Cranny wrote: ↑18 Mar 2025 08:26 amThey strove for greatness when they traded for Goldy and Arenado.BrockFloodMaris wrote: ↑18 Mar 2025 07:13 amI agree with you, rat. Deliver a winning message to everyone. Strive for greatness. It hasn’t been that long ago. Some of us remember.desertrat23 wrote: ↑17 Mar 2025 21:59 pmShow them you’re serious about winning. Build the best player development system in baseball, not let it rot through cost-cutting. Make reasonable offers to free agents, not lowballs. And when they don’t sign, make public statements like “X is a great player, and we wish him the best. We look forward to continuing to try to show premier free agents why we’re the Yankees of the NL and a place people want to play.” Ever notice how when the big boys get signed, Mo always says “we were never really in it?” He’s telling the whole industry that they’re not interested!RamFan08NY wrote: ↑17 Mar 2025 21:13 pm The players have to want to come to your team. How many middle America teams are attracting these guys? If you're not near one of the oceans, players don't want to be there. The Cardinals are in the same non-attractive boat that about 26 other teams arer in. How do you fix it? The only way you even have a chance at them is by extreme over spending, and that might not even work.
Above all, make every move, every statement, every transaction, send the message that you want to win a championship. Not a wild card, not a division, a ring. Even if you fall short, you’re showing the fans, the other teams, the agents, and the players that you’re serious. We haven’t done that in years.
In Goldie’s first year with the Cardinals, they had home grown players Molina, Wong, DeJong, Carpenter, Bader Edman, Flaherty, Hudson, Wacha, etc. Seems like the farm had helped at that time.BrockFloodMaris wrote: ↑18 Mar 2025 09:22 amYou are correct. They did. But, looking back, it seems like they were making those trades instead of recommitting to player development. They put all their eggs into the Goldy/Nado basket. It didn’t work, and the farm didn’t help much.Cranny wrote: ↑18 Mar 2025 08:26 amThey strove for greatness when they traded for Goldy and Arenado.BrockFloodMaris wrote: ↑18 Mar 2025 07:13 amI agree with you, rat. Deliver a winning message to everyone. Strive for greatness. It hasn’t been that long ago. Some of us remember.desertrat23 wrote: ↑17 Mar 2025 21:59 pmShow them you’re serious about winning. Build the best player development system in baseball, not let it rot through cost-cutting. Make reasonable offers to free agents, not lowballs. And when they don’t sign, make public statements like “X is a great player, and we wish him the best. We look forward to continuing to try to show premier free agents why we’re the Yankees of the NL and a place people want to play.” Ever notice how when the big boys get signed, Mo always says “we were never really in it?” He’s telling the whole industry that they’re not interested!RamFan08NY wrote: ↑17 Mar 2025 21:13 pm The players have to want to come to your team. How many middle America teams are attracting these guys? If you're not near one of the oceans, players don't want to be there. The Cardinals are in the same non-attractive boat that about 26 other teams arer in. How do you fix it? The only way you even have a chance at them is by extreme over spending, and that might not even work.
Above all, make every move, every statement, every transaction, send the message that you want to win a championship. Not a wild card, not a division, a ring. Even if you fall short, you’re showing the fans, the other teams, the agents, and the players that you’re serious. We haven’t done that in years.
Yes, and I’m sure that you are sharp enough and insightful enough to see that the well that delivered those players has run nearly dry and has for some time now. This is not a history class. For me, this is a discussion about where we are and how do we build a sustainable model to play deep into October every year.Cranny wrote: ↑18 Mar 2025 09:35 amIn Goldie’s first year with the Cardinals, they had home grown players Molina, Wong, DeJong, Carpenter, Bader Edman, Flaherty, Hudson, Wacha, etc. Seems like the farm had helped at that time.BrockFloodMaris wrote: ↑18 Mar 2025 09:22 amYou are correct. They did. But, looking back, it seems like they were making those trades instead of recommitting to player development. They put all their eggs into the Goldy/Nado basket. It didn’t work, and the farm didn’t help much.Cranny wrote: ↑18 Mar 2025 08:26 amThey strove for greatness when they traded for Goldy and Arenado.BrockFloodMaris wrote: ↑18 Mar 2025 07:13 amI agree with you, rat. Deliver a winning message to everyone. Strive for greatness. It hasn’t been that long ago. Some of us remember.desertrat23 wrote: ↑17 Mar 2025 21:59 pmShow them you’re serious about winning. Build the best player development system in baseball, not let it rot through cost-cutting. Make reasonable offers to free agents, not lowballs. And when they don’t sign, make public statements like “X is a great player, and we wish him the best. We look forward to continuing to try to show premier free agents why we’re the Yankees of the NL and a place people want to play.” Ever notice how when the big boys get signed, Mo always says “we were never really in it?” He’s telling the whole industry that they’re not interested!RamFan08NY wrote: ↑17 Mar 2025 21:13 pm The players have to want to come to your team. How many middle America teams are attracting these guys? If you're not near one of the oceans, players don't want to be there. The Cardinals are in the same non-attractive boat that about 26 other teams arer in. How do you fix it? The only way you even have a chance at them is by extreme over spending, and that might not even work.
Above all, make every move, every statement, every transaction, send the message that you want to win a championship. Not a wild card, not a division, a ring. Even if you fall short, you’re showing the fans, the other teams, the agents, and the players that you’re serious. We haven’t done that in years.