Ozzie on Golden Days HOF Committee….

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russellhammond
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Ozzie on Golden Days HOF Committee….

Post by russellhammond »

…along with, among others, Rod Carew, Ferguson Jenkins and Mike Schmidt. Among the players to be considered for HOF induction are former Cardinals Ken Boyer, Roger Maris, Jim Kaat and Dick Allen.
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Dazepster
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Re: Ozzie on Golden Days HOF Committee….

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I hope they right many a wrong and put Maris in.
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Denny Crane
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Re: Ozzie on Golden Days HOF Committee….

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Dazepster wrote: 01 Dec 2021 12:41 pm I hope they right many a wrong and put Maris Boyer in.
FTFY.

Maris, outside of 61 and maybe 60, has no case whatsoever for induction.
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Re: Ozzie on Golden Days HOF Committee….

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I'd put Allen in, and perhaps Boyer. I guess Kaat is at least in the realm of Early Wynn, Bert Blyleven and that ilk of HOF pitchers. Maris doesn't have enough -- just two great seasons, one of them historic. If Maris gets in, they might as well put Eric Davis in.
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russellhammond
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Re: Ozzie on Golden Days HOF Committee….

Post by russellhammond »

Boyer should be in...hope they finally get this one right. Ozzie played with Kitty Kaat. Not sure if that means anything but 283 wins and 16 Gold Gloves might.
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Re: Ozzie on Golden Days HOF Committee….

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With the stupid voting format they'll probably mostly split the vote.
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Re: Ozzie on Golden Days HOF Committee….

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nighthawk wrote: 01 Dec 2021 13:39 pm I'd put Allen in, and perhaps Boyer. I guess Kaat is at least in the realm of Early Wynn, Bert Blyleven and that ilk of HOF pitchers. Maris doesn't have enough -- just two great seasons, one of them historic. If Maris gets in, they might as well put Eric Davis in.
If you make the majors, you should go in. Look at all the others who never made it out of the minors. Your HOF date on your autograph would be the year of your first game. Stop all the needless speeches and craziness. One game; two games; three games; WHO CARES? LET 'EM ALL IN!! Now - back to my morning Bailey's. And don't bother me.
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Re: Ozzie on Golden Days HOF Committee….

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PSHS Dad wrote: 03 Dec 2021 10:11 am
nighthawk wrote: 01 Dec 2021 13:39 pm I'd put Allen in, and perhaps Boyer. I guess Kaat is at least in the realm of Early Wynn, Bert Blyleven and that ilk of HOF pitchers. Maris doesn't have enough -- just two great seasons, one of them historic. If Maris gets in, they might as well put Eric Davis in.
If you make the majors, you should go in. Look at all the others who never made it out of the minors. Your HOF date on your autograph would be the year of your first game. Stop all the needless speeches and craziness. One game; two games; three games; WHO CARES? LET 'EM ALL IN!! Now - back to my morning Bailey's. And don't bother me.
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The Nard
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Re: Ozzie on Golden Days HOF Committee….

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nighthawk wrote: 01 Dec 2021 13:39 pm I'd put Allen in, and perhaps Boyer. I guess Kaat is at least in the realm of Early Wynn, Bert Blyleven and that ilk of HOF pitchers. Maris doesn't have enough -- just two great seasons, one of them historic. If Maris gets in, they might as well put Eric Davis in.
Jim Kaat's stats were impacted by his latter-years performance outof the pen. For about a 15-year middle perioed, he was oneof the best lefties inthe AL, withthe Twins and White Sox. And as for the magical "300 win" bar, a lot of that depends on the teams your're pitching for. Another candidate in that situation is the White Sox's Billy Pierce.
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Re: Ozzie on Golden Days HOF Committee….

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russellhammond wrote: 01 Dec 2021 15:32 pm Boyer should be in...hope they finally get this one right. Ozzie played with Kitty Kaat. Not sure if that means anything but 283 wins and 16 Gold Gloves might.
He should get in, great player and person:

"He was . . . a fine man," said Bob Gibson, on duty as Braves' pitching coach in Atlanta, of his Cardinal costar in the World Series that capped Ken Boyer's National League MVP year of 1964. "I remember . . . once (when) somebody had said some things about me. He defended me and I never forgot that.
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Denny Crane
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Re: Ozzie on Golden Days HOF Committee….

Post by Denny Crane »

nighthawk wrote: 01 Dec 2021 13:39 pm I'd put Allen in, and perhaps Boyer. I guess Kaat is at least in the realm of Early Wynn, Bert Blyleven and that ilk of HOF pitchers. Maris doesn't have enough -- just two great seasons, one of them historic. If Maris gets in, they might as well put Eric Davis in.
I agree with you on Allen and Boyer, both are deserving.

Kaat might be on the level of Early Wynn, in that both of them have a lot of longevety on their side and less so peak dominance.

Blyleven? After nearly 5000 innings, Blyleven had an ERA that was 15% better than the average pitcher and a FIP that was 18% better and he put up over 100 fWAR (and just missed on the RA9 side with 99.7). Kaat, in about 400 fewer innings, had an ERA and FIP that were less than 10% better than average, with 70 fWAR (all from his innings load) and less than 60 RA9-WAR. Blyleven was a far superior pitcher. Pitchers of his ilk are Hall of Famers, and Kaat is not of his ilk.
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Swuhgen
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Re: Ozzie on Golden Days HOF Committee….

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Roger Maris has no business in the Hall.
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Re: Ozzie on Golden Days HOF Committee….

Post by Stlcardsblues »

lordoffatness wrote: 03 Dec 2021 09:47 am With the stupid voting format they'll probably mostly split the vote.
Not passing judgement on your feeling, just curious how you would change it.
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Re: Ozzie on Golden Days HOF Committee….

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The Nard wrote: 03 Dec 2021 10:16 am
nighthawk wrote: 01 Dec 2021 13:39 pm I'd put Allen in, and perhaps Boyer. I guess Kaat is at least in the realm of Early Wynn, Bert Blyleven and that ilk of HOF pitchers. Maris doesn't have enough -- just two great seasons, one of them historic. If Maris gets in, they might as well put Eric Davis in.
Jim Kaat's stats were impacted by his latter-years performance outof the pen. For about a 15-year middle perioed, he was oneof the best lefties inthe AL, withthe Twins and White Sox. And as for the magical "300 win" bar, a lot of that depends on the teams your're pitching for. Another candidate in that situation is the White Sox's Billy Pierce.
Kaat is a 13-11 pitcher.
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Re: Ozzie on Golden Days HOF Committee….

Post by lordoffatness »

Stlcardsblues wrote: 04 Dec 2021 10:06 am
lordoffatness wrote: 03 Dec 2021 09:47 am With the stupid voting format they'll probably mostly split the vote.
Not passing judgement on your feeling, just curious how you would change it.
Candidates require 12 of 16 votes to get in. Each voter only has 4 votes. It is difficult to get voted in unless the other candidates receive very few votes.

I think it would be better if the voters could just cast a yes/no vote for each candidate.
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The Nard
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Re: Ozzie on Golden Days HOF Committee….

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thetank2 wrote: 04 Dec 2021 10:09 am
The Nard wrote: 03 Dec 2021 10:16 am
nighthawk wrote: 01 Dec 2021 13:39 pm I'd put Allen in, and perhaps Boyer. I guess Kaat is at least in the realm of Early Wynn, Bert Blyleven and that ilk of HOF pitchers. Maris doesn't have enough -- just two great seasons, one of them historic. If Maris gets in, they might as well put Eric Davis in.
Jim Kaat's stats were impacted by his latter-years performance outof the pen. For about a 15-year middle perioed, he was oneof the best lefties inthe AL, withthe Twins and White Sox. And as for the magical "300 win" bar, a lot of that depends on the teams your're pitching for. Another candidate in that situation is the White Sox's Billy Pierce.
Kaat is a 13-11 pitcher.
You’re looking at averages over a long career, not during his peak years, which should count more
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