Just how dumb are the "BFIB" and the local media?

[Ike Hammett]

Sometimes the rot is so bad in a foundation that the only solution is to tear it down and start all over.

So you're a home inspector? You think we need to sell the house and move to a Pirates model because the dishwasher is broken, have a few light bulbs that need changing, a deep clean and maybe a paint job? The St. Louis model house is way better than the Pirates model house.

I think they need to bulldoze the house and rebuild from the ground up because Mozeliak completely (bleep) up the franchise.

How did he mess it up so badly?

Well, we can start with Brett Cecil and go from there.

Bwaaaahahaha!!!! You honestly think Brett Cecil is the reason they Cards are tanking today? Every team makes a few bad signings, you think the Dodgers or Yanks, Pirates never have?

Show me your end if that is the start.

Brandon Moss

What about him? As i recall he was once an MLB all- star that hit a lot of dingers for the Cardinals and wasn't here for very long. Seemed like a decent enough fella. Brandon Moss is why you want to bulldoze the Cardinals? Thanks for proving my thread headline comment.

Jhonny Peralta

So you don't like multiple time all stars that get MVP votes in St. Louis and are all stars with the Cards? They made the playoffs a few years he was here i think. I remember injury issues at the end, it happens.

[Jeff Goldblum]

Sometimes the rot is so bad in a foundation that the only solution is to tear it down and start all over.

So you're a home inspector? You think we need to sell the house and move to a Pirates model because the dishwasher is broken, have a few light bulbs that need changing, a deep clean and maybe a paint job? The St. Louis model house is way better than the Pirates model house.

I think they need to bulldoze the house and rebuild from the ground up because Mozeliak completely (bleep) up the franchise.

How did he mess it up so badly?

Well, we can start with Brett Cecil and go from there.

Bwaaaahahaha!!!! You honestly think Brett Cecil is the reason they Cards are tanking today? Every team makes a few bad signings, you think the Dodgers or Yanks, Pirates never have?

Show me your end if that is the start.

Brandon Moss

What about him? As i recall he was once an MLB all- star that hit a lot of dingers for the Cardinals and wasn't here for very long. Seemed like a decent enough fella. Brandon Moss is why you want to bulldoze the Cardinals? Thanks for proving my thread headline comment.

Jhonny Peralta

So you don't like multiple time all stars that get MVP votes in St. Louis and are all stars with the Cards? They made the playoffs a few years he was here i think. I remember injury issues at the end, it happens.

Randy Choate

[45s]

Okay, let's trade away our best players for prospects. Let's vow to not spend, not even try to be competitive and alienate real fans that want to show up.

Even if your prospects work out, your model is to trade them for more prospects, that only keeps you in a state of infinite rebuilding. Just how many of your lottery tickets will become hall of famers? Show me those stats.

Just how many lottery tickets do you think you will hit the grand prize on? Even if you get a few lottery ticket wins, the people like Warren Buffet and great investors will still beat you.

Good job, you are turning the Cards into the Pirates. Can you quit being dumb please?

Their “best “ players led them to 84 losses and a fourth place finish

What are you clinging to?

What am I clinging too? Great question. Probably the model and people that have brought so much winning, good times and a positive impact on the community.What is the opposite you seek?

Those days are gone amigo.

The dynamics of the entire industry have changed, and the old model is no longer relevant.

For small markets like STL it’s adapt or become irrelevant.

[Basil Shabazz]

If you were a fiscally responsible person and knew a three year recession was on the horizon, what would you do?

[CCard]

Okay, let's trade away our best players for prospects. Let's vow to not spend, not even try to be competitive and alienate real fans that want to show up.

Even if your prospects work out, your model is to trade them for more prospects, that only keeps you in a state of infinite rebuilding. Just how many of your lottery tickets will become hall of famers? Show me those stats.

Just how many lottery tickets do you think you will hit the grand prize on? Even if you get a few lottery ticket wins, the people like Warren Buffet and great investors will still beat you.

Good job, you are turning the Cards into the Pirates. Can you quit being dumb please?

Preaching to the choir brother. I've been screaming this for a long time. It seems that some think the only way the mid market Cards can compete is to field a team of rookies.

[Wattage]

Okay, let's trade away our best players for prospects. Let's vow to not spend, not even try to be competitive and alienate real fans that want to show up.

Even if your prospects work out, your model is to trade them for more prospects, that only keeps you in a state of infinite rebuilding. Just how many of your lottery tickets will become hall of famers? Show me those stats.

Just how many lottery tickets do you think you will hit the grand prize on? Even if you get a few lottery ticket wins, the people like Warren Buffet and great investors will still beat you.

Good job, you are turning the Cards into the Pirates. Can you quit being dumb please?

jesus. we have only startedbthis model for 2 years. they have stated they are lowering payroll for 2 years. we arent gonna keep continuously selking for prospects. we have keot trying to buy veterans until last year and that wasnt worling out. we didnt announce we were rebuilding and trading away veterans for 10 years. get a grip.

[BrummerStealsHome]

Okay, let's trade away our best players for prospects. Let's vow to not spend, not even try to be competitive and alienate real fans that want to show up.

Even if your prospects work out, your model is to trade them for more prospects, that only keeps you in a state of infinite rebuilding. Just how many of your lottery tickets will become hall of famers? Show me those stats.

Just how many lottery tickets do you think you will hit the grand prize on? Even if you get a few lottery ticket wins, the people like Warren Buffet and great investors will still beat you.

Good job, you are turning the Cards into the Pirates. Can you quit being dumb please?

It isn't a "new model." It's what has been deemed necessary to reset the organization after years of poor management. This is not how they'll be operating a year or two from now.

[Ike Hammett]

Okay, let's trade away our best players for prospects. Let's vow to not spend, not even try to be competitive and alienate real fans that want to show up.

Even if your prospects work out, your model is to trade them for more prospects, that only keeps you in a state of infinite rebuilding. Just how many of your lottery tickets will become hall of famers? Show me those stats.

Just how many lottery tickets do you think you will hit the grand prize on? Even if you get a few lottery ticket wins, the people like Warren Buffet and great investors will still beat you.

Good job, you are turning the Cards into the Pirates. Can you quit being dumb please?

jesus. we have only startedbthis model for 2 years. they have stated they are lowering payroll for 2 years. we arent gonna keep continuously selking for prospects. we have keot trying to buy veterans until last year and that wasnt worling out. we didnt announce we were rebuilding and trading away veterans for 10 years. get a grip.

Didn't Fangraphs rank the Cardinals #1 top farm system? They might ever spend again because "fans" are not showing up. Payroll is dependent on attendance. How do you know if "fans" ever come back? Even if they do, the Cardinals will not be generating the same revenues as some teams. With this rebuild, the goal is to get back to what we had already, if it even can be done. So I stand by my headline topic statement

[Youboughtit]

Does the OP have reasonable solutions he wants to offer?
Complaining is easy. Providing answers is not.

Personally I don’t want to see another year like the last few years, and keeping the same players would have led to that. They are long past the ability to fix the plane while it’s in flight.
The only way to significantly improve the team is to take risks with younger players, and to draft/trade in order to develop a young core that Tier One free agents would want to join. No top FA wants to join the hot mess of the past few seasons — and it makes no sense to sign such a free agent until there is solid young core.

I do. Do exactly what they are doing without gutting payroll $100m. Add 2-3 young superstars to draw fans back to the stadium. Why does trading old guys for prospects have to mean cutting payroll? 2 separate issues.

Just how do you propose to add 2-3 young superstars.

Teams almost never trade their young superstars. And by the time superstars reach FA, they typically aren't "young" anymore.

Have to find a way. If waiting on the farm to produce a 30-40HR hitter it will likely be a long time. Last in slug will generate no fanfare

[Youboughtit]

Does the OP have reasonable solutions he wants to offer?
Complaining is easy. Providing answers is not.

Personally I don’t want to see another year like the last few years, and keeping the same players would have led to that. They are long past the ability to fix the plane while it’s in flight.
The only way to significantly improve the team is to take risks with younger players, and to draft/trade in order to develop a young core that Tier One free agents would want to join. No top FA wants to join the hot mess of the past few seasons — and it makes no sense to sign such a free agent until there is solid young core.

I do. Do exactly what they are doing without gutting payroll $100m. Add 2-3 young superstars to draw fans back to the stadium. Why does trading old guys for prospects have to mean cutting payroll? 2 separate issues.

Their revenue is in the tank and they lost their shorts in the Bally's bankruptcy.

Them maybe Dewitt should push for full revenue sharing. Only
Needs 2/3 owners to pass. If owners do that next CBA players may be willing to have a cap and floor once revenue is balanced and known

[RichieRichSTL]

Let's be realists...

Bloom was never going to get the resource he needed to sign enough elite talent to contend in the next couple of year. There was not enough young talent get us the win-now talent we would need to contend in the next couple of years.

[ScotchMIrish]

I would assert the shallowest fans in baseball wanted the DH and the best fans refuse to watch it.

[desertrat23]

I would assert the shallowest fans in baseball wanted the DH and the best fans refuse to watch it.

My God, please move on.

[TXCardsFanX]

The Astros did it. They were lukewarm for years and decided to break it all down, not spend money, load up on prospects. It took 4 years, but they built up a farm system that included many furture All-Stars. Here are some names that came from that era: Altuve, Correa, Springer, Bregman, Keuchel, McCullers.
They also flipped prospects over those years to get MLB talent when they had a strong core built up.

[Ike Hammett]

I would assert the shallowest fans in baseball wanted the DH and the best fans refuse to watch it.

The DH was a huge advantage to the AL in interleage play. They get big hitters and the NL has utility players. Their bullpens don't get worked as much as they don't pinch hit or have double switches to account for a weak hitting pitcher. The game is more and is more exciting with more offense. Is that even debatable at this point? Not sure if it was the right call but things need to be even. AL was better and more liked, the NL was at a disadvantage and wasn't winning that battle neither on the field or with the fans.

[sdaltons]

Okay, let's trade away our best players for prospects. Let's vow to not spend, not even try to be competitive and alienate real fans that want to show up.

Even if your prospects work out, your model is to trade them for more prospects, that only keeps you in a state of infinite rebuilding. Just how many of your lottery tickets will become hall of famers? Show me those stats.

Just how many lottery tickets do you think you will hit the grand prize on? Even if you get a few lottery ticket wins, the people like Warren Buffet and great investors will still beat you.

Good job, you are turning the Cards into the Pirates. Can you quit being dumb please?

jesus. we have only startedbthis model for 2 years. they have stated they are lowering payroll for 2 years. we arent gonna keep continuously selking for prospects. we have keot trying to buy veterans until last year and that wasnt worling out. we didnt announce we were rebuilding and trading away veterans for 10 years. get a grip.

Didn't Fangraphs rank the Cardinals #1 top farm system? They might ever spend again because "fans" are not showing up. Payroll is dependent on attendance. How do you know if "fans" ever come back? Even if they do, the Cardinals will not be generating the same revenues as some teams. With this rebuild, the goal is to get back to what we had already, if it even can be done. So I stand by my headline topic statement

That's a false premise. Fans have a limited amount of entertainment dollars to spend. At the prices the Cardinals charge for tickets, food and bev, merchandise, etc if they can't afford to put a good product on the field, fans will exercise their right to spend their entertainment dollars on other things.

Once the front office decides to put an exciting team on the field, fans will undoubtedly come back in droves.

Your point seems to be that us average middle class people should continue to line the pockets of the billionaire owner, knowing full well he has no interest in reinvesting that money into the team. A hard pass from me.