STLtoday.com

Imperial Capitalist wrote: ↑24 Sep 2025 15:05 pm

Cranny wrote: ↑24 Sep 2025 14:08 pm

Imperial Capitalist wrote: ↑24 Sep 2025 13:58 pm

Cranny wrote: ↑23 Sep 2025 20:08 pm

Imperial Capitalist wrote: ↑23 Sep 2025 16:59 pm

Goldfan wrote: ↑23 Sep 2025 14:57 pm
You’ve stated several times that going forward BDW isn’t going to pay FA $$$ and the team will almost exclusively need to develop from within. So which is it? Signing a 35+yr old end of career starter isn’t going to move the needle. You pen Berkman often. That team had Pujols, Holliday, Molina, Carpenter……so again your strategy doesn’t hold water. If this team were to attempt to compete next season they would require 2 top hitters and 2 top SP…..there will never be a season where at LEAST that percentage of starters wont’t need to come from Prime Vet talent.

Another thing to consider:

Lance Berkman did indeed have an excellent season for STL in 2011 @ age 35.

However, he had a horrible 2012/age 36 season for STL, due to knee surgery, and was out from late May until early September.

His 2013 season (his last) was even statistically worse than his 2012.

In addition, his 2010 season (Hou and NYY) was a 1.4 WAR effort (14 HR, 58 RBI, .248).

We were quite fortunate to have him as a key member of the 2011 squad and he performed admirably, but it'd be wise to recall that we were the beneficiaries of the best (by far) of his final 4 seasons in the majors. Put differently, simply saying that "older vets" is what we need fails to take into account the potential health issues and (esp in today's 95 MPH+ FB world) their ability to substantively contribute.

Maybe some of you didn’t notice the Fowler, Leake, Cecil, Miller, etc. failures. The Cardinals in no way are going to spend huge dollars (long term contracts) on high priced top free agents. Especially with a possible work stoppage looming.

As you said to another poster about embracing "realism", perhaps you should do the same.

Those particular FA acquisitions, by and large, say more about the (lack of) thinking processes of the POBO, whose fan club you chair, than they do the free agent process writ large.

The FA process, as it’s structured right now, doesn’t fit well with middle market teams. Sorry to say.

For a certain middle market team that will have very little long-term salary committed on its future books after 2025 is over, I beg to differ. They may or may not be in "buy" mode at present, but their future contractual obligations won't serve as a valid excuse to bypass the free agent market...when the time is right.

Not that you care one way or the other. As you've peddled here many times, you've witnessed 10 Cardinal WS appearances with 5 wins, and really couldn't care less if you see more of it in the future, telling us quite often: "I just watch baseball for the pure enjoyment of it".

Cranny wrote: ↑24 Sep 2025 15:33 pm

Imperial Capitalist wrote: ↑24 Sep 2025 15:05 pm

Cranny wrote: ↑24 Sep 2025 14:08 pm

Imperial Capitalist wrote: ↑24 Sep 2025 13:58 pm

Cranny wrote: ↑23 Sep 2025 20:08 pm

Imperial Capitalist wrote: ↑23 Sep 2025 16:59 pm

Goldfan wrote: ↑23 Sep 2025 14:57 pm
You’ve stated several times that going forward BDW isn’t going to pay FA $$$ and the team will almost exclusively need to develop from within. So which is it? Signing a 35+yr old end of career starter isn’t going to move the needle. You pen Berkman often. That team had Pujols, Holliday, Molina, Carpenter……so again your strategy doesn’t hold water. If this team were to attempt to compete next season they would require 2 top hitters and 2 top SP…..there will never be a season where at LEAST that percentage of starters wont’t need to come from Prime Vet talent.

Another thing to consider:

Lance Berkman did indeed have an excellent season for STL in 2011 @ age 35.

However, he had a horrible 2012/age 36 season for STL, due to knee surgery, and was out from late May until early September.

His 2013 season (his last) was even statistically worse than his 2012.

In addition, his 2010 season (Hou and NYY) was a 1.4 WAR effort (14 HR, 58 RBI, .248).

We were quite fortunate to have him as a key member of the 2011 squad and he performed admirably, but it'd be wise to recall that we were the beneficiaries of the best (by far) of his final 4 seasons in the majors. Put differently, simply saying that "older vets" is what we need fails to take into account the potential health issues and (esp in today's 95 MPH+ FB world) their ability to substantively contribute.

Maybe some of you didn’t notice the Fowler, Leake, Cecil, Miller, etc. failures. The Cardinals in no way are going to spend huge dollars (long term contracts) on high priced top free agents. Especially with a possible work stoppage looming.

As you said to another poster about embracing "realism", perhaps you should do the same.

Those particular FA acquisitions, by and large, say more about the (lack of) thinking processes of the POBO, whose fan club you chair, than they do the free agent process writ large.

The FA process, as it’s structured right now, doesn’t fit well with middle market teams. Sorry to say.

For a certain middle market team that will have very little long-term salary committed on its future books after 2025 is over, I beg to differ. They may or may not be in "buy" mode at present, but their future contractual obligations won't serve as a valid excuse to bypass the free agent market...when the time is right.

Not that you care one way or the other. As you've peddled here many times, you've witnessed 10 Cardinal WS appearances with 5 wins, and really couldn't care less if you see more of it in the future, telling us quite often: "I just watch baseball for the pure enjoyment of it".

So you only enjoy watching the Cardinals if they win the World Series?

Cranny wrote: ↑24 Sep 2025 15:30 pm

Goldfan wrote: ↑24 Sep 2025 14:50 pm

Cranny wrote: ↑24 Sep 2025 14:44 pm

rockondlouie wrote: ↑24 Sep 2025 14:13 pm

Cranny wrote: ↑23 Sep 2025 20:08 pm Maybe some of you didn’t notice the Fowler, Leake, Cecil, Miller, etc. failures. The Cardinals in no way are going to spend huge dollars (long term contracts) on high priced top free agents. Especially with a possible work stoppage looming.

And maybe you didn't notice those horrible moves were all MO SUGGESTIONS and he's gone in four games!

Plus those aren't "high priced free agents" either, low end to middle of the road deals.

Big deal a potential work stoppage.

NEWS FLASH cranny.......BDWJR will NOT BE PAYING any players during a work stoppage so using that as an excuse not to sign a free agent is LAME.

And what you don’t understand, rock, is that a lot of things may change with a newly negotiated agreement. And many teams are going to wait to see what those changes are. Like number of minimum wage years, number of arbitration years, etc. Things that may change cost projections.

If this org can’t find some people who know what a legit MLB player looks like……the particulars of the new CBA will not matter.
We just wasted an entire season so someone over there could watch the YUTES……some more…..to figure out if they can play in this league.
the answers we all saw this 2025 Season of Yutes were very obvious BEFORE this season started……as I wrote BEFORE the season.
If I can see these things sitting watching games on TV what kind of inferior clowns did BDW have working for him??? Has that improved???

You didn’t enjoy watching Winn?
You didn’t enjoy watching Burleson?
You didn’t enjoy watching Herrra?
You didn’t enjoy watching Liberatore?
You didn’t enjoy watching McGreevy?

Goldfan wrote: ↑24 Sep 2025 17:34 pm

Cranny wrote: ↑24 Sep 2025 15:30 pm

Goldfan wrote: ↑24 Sep 2025 14:50 pm

Cranny wrote: ↑24 Sep 2025 14:44 pm

rockondlouie wrote: ↑24 Sep 2025 14:13 pm

Cranny wrote: ↑23 Sep 2025 20:08 pm Maybe some of you didn’t notice the Fowler, Leake, Cecil, Miller, etc. failures. The Cardinals in no way are going to spend huge dollars (long term contracts) on high priced top free agents. Especially with a possible work stoppage looming.

And maybe you didn't notice those horrible moves were all MO SUGGESTIONS and he's gone in four games!

Plus those aren't "high priced free agents" either, low end to middle of the road deals.

Big deal a potential work stoppage.

NEWS FLASH cranny.......BDWJR will NOT BE PAYING any players during a work stoppage so using that as an excuse not to sign a free agent is LAME.

And what you don’t understand, rock, is that a lot of things may change with a newly negotiated agreement. And many teams are going to wait to see what those changes are. Like number of minimum wage years, number of arbitration years, etc. Things that may change cost projections.

If this org can’t find some people who know what a legit MLB player looks like……the particulars of the new CBA will not matter.
We just wasted an entire season so someone over there could watch the YUTES……some more…..to figure out if they can play in this league.
the answers we all saw this 2025 Season of Yutes were very obvious BEFORE this season started……as I wrote BEFORE the season.
If I can see these things sitting watching games on TV what kind of inferior clowns did BDW have working for him??? Has that improved???

You didn’t enjoy watching Winn?
You didn’t enjoy watching Burleson?
You didn’t enjoy watching Herrra?
You didn’t enjoy watching Liberatore?
You didn’t enjoy watching McGreevy?

Cranny this isn’t tennis. The point of a baseball season is for the TEAM to play well TOGETHER and hopefully be in contention in Oct.
And aside from perhaps Burly and Herrera there was nothing all that wonderful about the others on your list.
You’re attempting to equate seeing something from those players in a losing season that would peak my interest like McGwire in ‘98……that’s one of the only individual players and moments that transcended a losing season…..not even close

Cranny wrote: ↑24 Sep 2025 18:56 pm

Goldfan wrote: ↑24 Sep 2025 17:34 pm

Cranny wrote: ↑24 Sep 2025 15:30 pm

Goldfan wrote: ↑24 Sep 2025 14:50 pm

Cranny wrote: ↑24 Sep 2025 14:44 pm

rockondlouie wrote: ↑24 Sep 2025 14:13 pm

Cranny wrote: ↑23 Sep 2025 20:08 pm Maybe some of you didn’t notice the Fowler, Leake, Cecil, Miller, etc. failures. The Cardinals in no way are going to spend huge dollars (long term contracts) on high priced top free agents. Especially with a possible work stoppage looming.

And maybe you didn't notice those horrible moves were all MO SUGGESTIONS and he's gone in four games!

Plus those aren't "high priced free agents" either, low end to middle of the road deals.

Big deal a potential work stoppage.

NEWS FLASH cranny.......BDWJR will NOT BE PAYING any players during a work stoppage so using that as an excuse not to sign a free agent is LAME.

And what you don’t understand, rock, is that a lot of things may change with a newly negotiated agreement. And many teams are going to wait to see what those changes are. Like number of minimum wage years, number of arbitration years, etc. Things that may change cost projections.

If this org can’t find some people who know what a legit MLB player looks like……the particulars of the new CBA will not matter.
We just wasted an entire season so someone over there could watch the YUTES……some more…..to figure out if they can play in this league.
the answers we all saw this 2025 Season of Yutes were very obvious BEFORE this season started……as I wrote BEFORE the season.
If I can see these things sitting watching games on TV what kind of inferior clowns did BDW have working for him??? Has that improved???

You didn’t enjoy watching Winn?
You didn’t enjoy watching Burleson?
You didn’t enjoy watching Herrra?
You didn’t enjoy watching Liberatore?
You didn’t enjoy watching McGreevy?

Cranny this isn’t tennis. The point of a baseball season is for the TEAM to play well TOGETHER and hopefully be in contention in Oct.
And aside from perhaps Burly and Herrera there was nothing all that wonderful about the others on your list.
You’re attempting to equate seeing something from those players in a losing season that would peak my interest like McGwire in ‘98……that’s one of the only individual players and moments that transcended a losing season…..not even close

I’m afraid you’re going to be wallowing in discontent for a number of years. Until the Cards get lucky again like in 2006 and 2011.

Cranny wrote: ↑24 Sep 2025 19:30 pm I’m not delusional at all. Check the MLB team
power ratings going into both of those seasons.

NYCardsFan wrote: ↑24 Sep 2025 19:54 pm

Cranny wrote: ↑24 Sep 2025 19:30 pm I’m not delusional at all. Check the MLB team
power ratings going into both of those seasons.

What a strange, warped way to look at the question. In that peak 12 year run from 2004 to 2015, they averaged 91.1 wins per season, won their division 7 times, and made the playoffs 9 times. They were a perennial contender. For every 2006, there’s a 2004. For every 2011, there’s a 2013 (or 2015). When you create that many shots on goal, winning 2 WS isn’t exactly lucky. “Lucky” is the Giants making the playoffs only 3 times during that same 12 yr period but coming away with 3 WS titles.

Cranny wrote: ↑24 Sep 2025 19:58 pm

NYCardsFan wrote: ↑24 Sep 2025 19:54 pm

Cranny wrote: ↑24 Sep 2025 19:30 pm I’m not delusional at all. Check the MLB team
power ratings going into both of those seasons.

What a strange, warped way to look at the question. In that peak 12 year run from 2004 to 2015, they averaged 91.1 wins per season, won their division 7 times, and made the playoffs 9 times. They were a perennial contender. For every 2006, there’s a 2004. For every 2011, there’s a 2013 (or 2015). When you create that many shots on goal, winning 2 WS isn’t exactly lucky. “Lucky” is the Giants making the playoffs only 3 times during that same 12 yr period but coming away with 3 WS titles.

They weren’t rated in the top teams going into each one of those years. Everything had to work out just right for them to go all the way at the end of those seasons. Why don’t you look up the preseason power rankings going into both of those seasons, NY, before you shoot your mouth off.

Cranny wrote: ↑24 Sep 2025 19:58 pm

NYCardsFan wrote: ↑24 Sep 2025 19:54 pm

Cranny wrote: ↑24 Sep 2025 19:30 pm I’m not delusional at all. Check the MLB team
power ratings going into both of those seasons.

What a strange, warped way to look at the question. In that peak 12 year run from 2004 to 2015, they averaged 91.1 wins per season, won their division 7 times, and made the playoffs 9 times. They were a perennial contender. For every 2006, there’s a 2004. For every 2011, there’s a 2013 (or 2015). When you create that many shots on goal, winning 2 WS isn’t exactly lucky. “Lucky” is the Giants making the playoffs only 3 times during that same 12 yr period but coming away with 3 WS titles.

They weren’t rated in the top teams going into each one of those years. Everything had to work out just right for them to go all the way at the end of those seasons. Why don’t you look up the preseason power rankings going into both of those seasons, NY, before you shoot your mouth off.

Cranny wrote: ↑24 Sep 2025 19:58 pm

NYCardsFan wrote: ↑24 Sep 2025 19:54 pm

Cranny wrote: ↑24 Sep 2025 19:30 pm I’m not delusional at all. Check the MLB team
power ratings going into both of those seasons.

What a strange, warped way to look at the question. In that peak 12 year run from 2004 to 2015, they averaged 91.1 wins per season, won their division 7 times, and made the playoffs 9 times. They were a perennial contender. For every 2006, there’s a 2004. For every 2011, there’s a 2013 (or 2015). When you create that many shots on goal, winning 2 WS isn’t exactly lucky. “Lucky” is the Giants making the playoffs only 3 times during that same 12 yr period but coming away with 3 WS titles.

They weren’t rated in the top teams going into each one of those years. Everything had to work out just right for them to go all the way at the end of those seasons. Why don’t you look up the preseason power rankings going into both of those seasons, NY, before you shoot your mouth off.

Goldfan wrote: ↑24 Sep 2025 21:44 pm

Cranny wrote: ↑24 Sep 2025 19:58 pm

NYCardsFan wrote: ↑24 Sep 2025 19:54 pm

Cranny wrote: ↑24 Sep 2025 19:30 pm I’m not delusional at all. Check the MLB team
power ratings going into both of those seasons.

What a strange, warped way to look at the question. In that peak 12 year run from 2004 to 2015, they averaged 91.1 wins per season, won their division 7 times, and made the playoffs 9 times. They were a perennial contender. For every 2006, there’s a 2004. For every 2011, there’s a 2013 (or 2015). When you create that many shots on goal, winning 2 WS isn’t exactly lucky. “Lucky” is the Giants making the playoffs only 3 times during that same 12 yr period but coming away with 3 WS titles.

They weren’t rated in the top teams going into each one of those years. Everything had to work out just right for them to go all the way at the end of those seasons. Why don’t you look up the preseason power rankings going into both of those seasons, NY, before you shoot your mouth off.

Preseason Power Rankings???
Give me a team with Molina, Pujols, Edmonds, Rolen, Carpenter, Izzy, Holliday, Berkman, Waino, Allstars
You have MVP, Cy Young, HOFers with TLR/Dunc in the dugout.
And you think with that leadership and talent that it’s LUCK when that squad wins a WS?????
You can take all the luck floating in the world and there is no way in any of our lifetimes that a team like this year or next with OLI and Dusty leading will win a WS. Your concept of baseball reality is greatly distorted

Cranny wrote: ↑24 Sep 2025 19:30 pm I’m not delusional at all. Check the MLB team
power ratings going into both of those seasons.

sikeston bulldog2 wrote: ↑25 Sep 2025 06:39 am

Cranny wrote: ↑24 Sep 2025 19:30 pm I’m not delusional at all. Check the MLB team
power ratings going into both of those seasons.

I read the content of the thread; top to bottom. I’m muffed reference power rankings. What’s that got to do with luck, and final results.

Cranny wrote: ↑25 Sep 2025 06:55 am

sikeston bulldog2 wrote: ↑25 Sep 2025 06:39 am

Cranny wrote: ↑24 Sep 2025 19:30 pm I’m not delusional at all. Check the MLB team
power ratings going into both of those seasons.

I read the content of the thread; top to bottom. I’m muffed reference power rankings. What’s that got to do with luck, and final results.

Because any team needs a little luck to go all the way - momentum going into October, most of their players healthy,
bloop hits dropping in, untimely errors by the other teams, etc.