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rockondlouie wrote: ↑17 Dec 2025 13:59 pm J.J.W. is going to be the starting 2nd baseman, he's not playing 3rd base where N. Gorman (unless he's traded too) is ticketed once NADO is traded.

Probably correct.

Not a certainty, as I do not think his leash is as long as
it once was.

So, if the gamble of NG fails then move JJ?
Certainly, can be done but it's Gormans bat that will win a position
not his glove. Why jerk JJ around while waiting on a maybe bat to emerge?
His bat is getting less likely not more likely to come around.
my ignorant thoughts.

I also cannot get his throwing errors at 3B out of
my memory. There were also several throws while not errors
also were poor. He's a 1 tool player. A back up with a glove on if he continues
to field like his 2025 -9 OAA at 3B in 400 innings. 1B/DH backup.

Might be the 5-Alarm Beef and Bean burrito I had for lunch, but I’ve got a feelin that our 2026 IF will be:
1B: Burleson
2B: Donovan
3B: Wetherholt
SS: Winn

hornetfb52 wrote: ↑17 Dec 2025 16:02 pm Might be the 5-Alarm Beef and Bean burrito I had for lunch, but I’ve got a feelin that our 2026 IF will be:
1B: Burleson
2B: Donovan
3B: Wetherholt
SS: Winn

I think that to be among the leagues best defensive.

sikeston bulldog2 wrote: ↑17 Dec 2025 16:12 pm

hornetfb52 wrote: ↑17 Dec 2025 16:02 pm Might be the 5-Alarm Beef and Bean burrito I had for lunch, but I’ve got a feelin that our 2026 IF will be:
1B: Burleson
2B: Donovan
3B: Wetherholt
SS: Winn

I think that to be among the leagues best defensive.

If JJW has the arm for 3B...

renostl wrote: ↑17 Dec 2025 14:16 pm

ScotchMIrish wrote: ↑17 Dec 2025 13:52 pm

renostl wrote: ↑17 Dec 2025 13:38 pm

ScotchMIrish wrote: ↑17 Dec 2025 13:18 pm

scoutyjones2 wrote: ↑17 Dec 2025 13:08 pm

ScotchMIrish wrote: ↑17 Dec 2025 12:34 pm

scoutyjones2 wrote: ↑17 Dec 2025 10:27 am

Ronnie Dobbs wrote: ↑17 Dec 2025 10:25 am

scoutyjones2 wrote: ↑17 Dec 2025 10:22 amWho? Who needs playing time at 3b that Nado is blocking, and you can't wait to see play?

Gorman, Saggesse, and Wetherholt.

I'm told JJ is 2b. Doesn't play 3b.

We've seen the abomination that is UniKKKorn, and Saggesse?

What about Saggese? If it's a rebuild then shouldn't he be in the lineup with Wetherholt? One at 2B and the other at 3B.

I want JJ at 3b and not 2b

Sagg's is a lesser Donovan. Good to have on the bench
Not sure he's a starter. Prieto and Vermin I have some curiosity about

Saggese is younger and has the potential for more power than those two. I'd take Fermin over Prieto.

Nothing wrong with an open competition deciding who starts and who backs up. Gorman too
but now he needs to win a spot IMO and a natural RH/LH platoon.

3B is a longer-term issue, It is part of my reason for want JJ at 3B.
He will get what I guess is called a "long runway" now

JJ while having an average SS arm per scouting reports, will
still have the better arm of the group if the reports are true. Lastly adequate to good at 3B
tends to cost more than the same at 2B.

Wetherholt makes sense at 3B but why did they leave him at SS and only 12 games at 3B in 2025? The way this team runs their minor leagues is baffling sometimes. The one position he is guaranteed not to play in St Louis is SS.

We have differed on this question in the past.
You continue to stay with this position. I suggest that SS is the
most difficult, challenging him there is fine IMO
the transfer to either 2B/3B is easy.

It's easier to move from SS to 3B but that doesn't mean there aren't things to learn. Charging a bunt isn't done at SS and the ball gets on a third baseman quicker than at shortstop. The place to learn used to be the minors.

scoutyjones2 wrote: ↑17 Dec 2025 13:08 pmI want JJ at 3b and not 2b

Sagg's is a lesser Donovan. Good to have on the bench
Not sure he's a starter. Prieto and Vermin I have some curiosity about

A lesser Donovan still would be a good piece to have on your team, so it would be nice to see what he can do next year with a good opportunity.

That said, how are you so sure that he's a lesser Donovan? Donovan had 3 years of college and put up a .284 .386 .427 .813 in basically 3 seasons in the minors. Saggese was drafted out of high school and has put up a .288 .358 .485 .842 line in about 4.5 seasons in the minors. He'll be 24 next year, which is a year younger than when Donovan made the majors.

I get don't scout the stat line and all that, but I'd think that's enough to not write him off. And I'm guessing he's going to see a lot of time at 2nd, 3rd, and OF, including maybe CF, according to Derrick Goold. Besides, if you're not sure he's a starter, that even more reason to get rid of Arenado in the season where the team is rebuilding and have Saggese out there as much as possible.

icon wrote: ↑17 Dec 2025 12:46 pm Remember when Mozeliak flew out to Arenado's home in the offseason to persuade him not to opt out? How times have changed.

Coming off a 3rd place in the MVP voting, gold glove, and 7.9 bWAR season.

That same offseason...

- Judge signed his 9/$360m mega deal
- Devers signed his 10/$313m mega extension
- Trea Turner 11/$300m
- Bogaerts 11/$280m
- Correa 6/$200m
- Swanson 5/$185m
- Machado 11/$350 after he opted out of the last 5 years - really just tacked on another 5/$170m

Turner, Bogaerts, and Machado signed through their age 40 season that year. I'd assume Arenado would've done the same. Probably something in the ballpark of 8/$240m for his ages 33-40 seasons. Someone would've done it! Probably one of the NY teams. Or the Phillies instead of Turner.

Instead he's made/will make $144m over the 5 years he opted in through age his 36 season. Can't imagine some team owing NA another $100m at this point. Woof.

WaltsSuccessor wrote: ↑17 Dec 2025 21:17 pm

icon wrote: ↑17 Dec 2025 12:46 pm Remember when Mozeliak flew out to Arenado's home in the offseason to persuade him not to opt out? How times have changed.

Coming off a 3rd place in the MVP voting, gold glove, and 7.9 bWAR season.

That same offseason...

- Judge signed his 9/$360m mega deal
- Devers signed his 10/$313m mega extension
- Trea Turner 11/$300m
- Bogaerts 11/$280m
- Correa 6/$200m
- Swanson 5/$185m
- Machado 11/$350 after he opted out of the last 5 years - really just tacked on another 5/$170m

Turner, Bogaerts, and Machado signed through their age 40 season that year. I'd assume Arenado would've done the same. Probably something in the ballpark of 8/$240m for his ages 33-40 seasons. Someone would've done it! Probably one of the NY teams. Or the Phillies instead of Turner.

Instead he's made/will make $144m over the 5 years he opted in through age his 36 season. Can't imagine some team owing NA another $100m at this point. Woof.

Yep, MO helped out a bunch of teams by misleading Arenado in terms of the Cardinals plans to improve the team. Arenado opting out would have been the best thing for the Cardinals at the time. Just none of us knew it including MO. Arenado has to be a bit bummed about that decision...

ICCFIM2 wrote: ↑17 Dec 2025 21:56 pm

WaltsSuccessor wrote: ↑17 Dec 2025 21:17 pm

icon wrote: ↑17 Dec 2025 12:46 pm Remember when Mozeliak flew out to Arenado's home in the offseason to persuade him not to opt out? How times have changed.

Coming off a 3rd place in the MVP voting, gold glove, and 7.9 bWAR season.

That same offseason...

- Judge signed his 9/$360m mega deal
- Devers signed his 10/$313m mega extension
- Trea Turner 11/$300m
- Bogaerts 11/$280m
- Correa 6/$200m
- Swanson 5/$185m
- Machado 11/$350 after he opted out of the last 5 years - really just tacked on another 5/$170m

Turner, Bogaerts, and Machado signed through their age 40 season that year. I'd assume Arenado would've done the same. Probably something in the ballpark of 8/$240m for his ages 33-40 seasons. Someone would've done it! Probably one of the NY teams. Or the Phillies instead of Turner.

Instead he's made/will make $144m over the 5 years he opted in through age his 36 season. Can't imagine some team owing NA another $100m at this point. Woof.

Yep, MO helped out a bunch of teams by misleading Arenado in terms of the Cardinals plans to improve the team. Arenado opting out would have been the best thing for the Cardinals at the time. Just none of us knew it including MO. Arenado has to be a bit bummed about that decision...

Plenty of blame (and regret) to go around. Mo building rosters on hope. But also, the sharp drop off of Arenado and Goldy contributed just as much to the underperformance of the 2023 and 2024 teams as anything. Both teams stumbled into the trade deadline after hovering around the WC the first half. If they hadn’t, maybe Mo makes a deadline move to sneak into the playoffs.

Doubt Nolan is kicking himself over the money as much as the missed opportunity to join a contender. He probably doesn’t really want to play til age 40 anyway.