So much to do; so little time

[BrummerStealsHome]

What to do to become a competitive team? A lot of people here believe their own bull[shirt], and enjoy the company of others believing the same bull[shirt]. This IS a competitive team. They're a .500 team in a division that's +32. What we want is a team to move up to the top tier, into the high-90s, 100 win range. The good news is that in modern baseball that can happen in a year or two. The bad news is the present crew doesn't have the ability to do it. The incoming regime? We'll see. I have high hopes for them. This frustrating season will pay some dividends towards that end.

Sure, they can make the playoffs in 2026 with a few moves this off season.

Yes, and I think they will. Is there anyone claiming otherwise? It's important to note that the overall goal is not to make the playoffs but field a championship caliber team.

If you and Cranny think this team will make the playoffs in 2026 I want some of what you’re smoking.

2027 maybe, 2028 is more realistic.

Pffft. There are three wild card teams per league; this ain't 1985 or 1968. The Cardinals can easily be a playoff team next year with a good offseason (for a change).

[sdaltons]

Nobody seems to realize that at least some of the players that have helped them to .500 are going to be traded.
Will their replacements play better in 2026 than our traded players (some of Burleson, Gorman, Donovan, Herrera, etc) played this year?

I doubt it because they’re going to trade for younger players and prospects.

If they make the playoffs next year I’ll happily admit i was wrong.

But I don’t think I’ll be proven wrong.

Herrera possibly traded? Don’t think so.

Probably not, but he’s certainly not untouchable.

Isn’t he exactly what they’re looking for in a young player?

A guy who hits for power occasionally and has no position to play?

You must be talking about a different Herrera. He has a high average, high OBP, OPS over .800, has hit 14 home runs in only 89 games, and can play a satisfactory LF.

Lol none of that contradicts what I said. His power comes in spurts. I didn't mention any of the other offensive numbers.

And satisfactory LF is hilarious. He's played 31 innings there and caught a couple fly balls. Your response only addresses what I said if you are prepared to make him the regular LF.

And the power looks decent because of how little we get on this team, but most teams are looking for more than 14 HR from their DH, or their LF, for that matter.

His bat was a major asset when he was a C. It's about average anywhere else.

14 home runs in only 89 games. You forgot to recognize that.

I did because they are come in spurts. It hasn't been consistent production over the 89 games so it's not fair to project it out over 162.

Okay. So if you want to use 14 home runs, it means in a full season he wouldn’t chalk up even one more dinger. Right?

What? No. 15 HR doesn't impress me for a LF or DH, either. And neither does 20.

Well, he's the only Cardinal right now who has an OPS north of .800, and is only 25 years old, so I don't trade him. It would be fair if I don't seasonalize his 14 home runs and you don't use 14 home runs. Deal?

I'm not arguing he's terrible or something. I understand he is a decent hitter. But as you pointed out, his numbers may appear a bit better than they are because we have so little offensive punch.

Keeping him because we have no one better is not a good reason to not trade him if the right deal presents itself.

[The Nard]

This is going to take time. The Cardinals are looking to rebuild along the lines of Tampa and Cleveland. Don’t expect a1996 or 2000 turnaround. They will be busy this offseason clearing a lot of the clutter. I think you’ll see a lot of new faces, but there are no blockbuster deals or FA signings on the horizon. If they are going to increase payroll significantly, it will not be before 2027. Payroll will remain flat as most of the savings will go to Sonny Gray who will make $35 million next year. Even if Gray, Contreras and Arenado waive their NTC’s, the team will be paying most, if not all, of their money.

While Tampa was good at evaluating and using their young talent, Cleveland has been relying for over a decade now, on stellar starting pitching and up-the-middle defense. And offense was a bonus to them, as it was last year when josh Nader had his career year. This year they took a backward step in all 3areas, by trading Nader and Gimemez, and sub-par seasons from their starters, some coming off injuries.

I’m all for focusing on pitching and defense first, and then adding at least one power bat

Josh Naylor, not Nader; I knew something looked off.

[Talkin' Baseball]

It's true that there is a lot to address, but so much can be done even in one offseason. The time it takes is not nearly as big a problem as the problem we have dealt with to this point- the lack of will to address the issues.

[Cranny]

Herrera possibly traded? Don’t think so.

Probably not, but he’s certainly not untouchable.

Isn’t he exactly what they’re looking for in a young player?

A guy who hits for power occasionally and has no position to play?

You must be talking about a different Herrera. He has a high average, high OBP, OPS over .800, has hit 14 home runs in only 89 games, and can play a satisfactory LF.

Lol none of that contradicts what I said. His power comes in spurts. I didn't mention any of the other offensive numbers.

And satisfactory LF is hilarious. He's played 31 innings there and caught a couple fly balls. Your response only addresses what I said if you are prepared to make him the regular LF.

And the power looks decent because of how little we get on this team, but most teams are looking for more than 14 HR from their DH, or their LF, for that matter.

His bat was a major asset when he was a C. It's about average anywhere else.

14 home runs in only 89 games. You forgot to recognize that.

I did because they are come in spurts. It hasn't been consistent production over the 89 games so it's not fair to project it out over 162.

Okay. So if you want to use 14 home runs, it means in a full season he wouldn’t chalk up even one more dinger. Right?

What? No. 15 HR doesn't impress me for a LF or DH, either. And neither does 20.

Well, he's the only Cardinal right now who has an OPS north of .800, and is only 25 years old, so I don't trade him. It would be fair if I don't seasonalize his 14 home runs and you don't use 14 home runs. Deal?

I'm not arguing he's terrible or something. I understand he is a decent hitter. But as you pointed out, his numbers may appear a bit better than they are because we have so little offensive punch.

Keeping him because we have no one better is not a good reason to not trade him if the right deal presents itself.

If you think you can trade him for someone who has a higher BA, higher OBP, higher Slg%, higher OPS, and hits more home runs then sure, make the deal.

[Braund241]

I continue to see posts detailing moves to create a competitive 2026 team. To do so seems like a lot to ask of Bloom and his team. My list of issues to resolve:

Build better starting rotation. There are several holes to fill.

Clear the clutter in the infield. JJ comes up. Several players competing for infield spots. Arenado is taking a roster spot he should not. Donovan should really be at second base IMO. There is some shuffling to do here.

What to do with Gorman and Walker. How do they fit?

Need a big right handed bat ( or two). Need to improve offense in outfield positions.

Need to continue to build depth on roster and in minor leagues

Gray, Arenado, WC NTC. If one or all agree to waive do you trade to fill some of the other holes? Do you keep with hopes of building around?

Do you retain manager and coaches?

Bloom has a long to do list.

Good point. So little time. I probably only have 20 years left. Not one player on this roster will see a world championship if a playoff game. I may not. Organization is a joke.

[ICCFIM2]

Herrera possibly traded? Don’t think so.

Probably not, but he’s certainly not untouchable.

Isn’t he exactly what they’re looking for in a young player?

A guy who hits for power occasionally and has no position to play?

You must be talking about a different Herrera. He has a high average, high OBP, OPS over .800, has hit 14 home runs in only 89 games, and can play a satisfactory LF.

Lol none of that contradicts what I said. His power comes in spurts. I didn't mention any of the other offensive numbers.

And satisfactory LF is hilarious. He's played 31 innings there and caught a couple fly balls. Your response only addresses what I said if you are prepared to make him the regular LF.

And the power looks decent because of how little we get on this team, but most teams are looking for more than 14 HR from their DH, or their LF, for that matter.

His bat was a major asset when he was a C. It's about average anywhere else.

14 home runs in only 89 games. You forgot to recognize that.

I did because they are come in spurts. It hasn't been consistent production over the 89 games so it's not fair to project it out over 162.

Okay. So if you want to use 14 home runs, it means in a full season he wouldn’t chalk up even one more dinger. Right?

What? No. 15 HR doesn't impress me for a LF or DH, either. And neither does 20.

Well, he's the only Cardinal right now who has an OPS north of .800, and is only 25 years old, so I don't trade him. It would be fair if I don't seasonalize his 14 home runs and you don't use 14 home runs. Deal?

I'm not arguing he's terrible or something. I understand he is a decent hitter. But as you pointed out, his numbers may appear a bit better than they are because we have so little offensive punch.

Keeping him because we have no one better is not a good reason to not trade him if the right deal presents itself.

There are 47 ML hitters that are qualified with an 800+ OPS. Herrera is on pace for 25+ HRs and 100 RBIs. Those types of hitters are hard to find. And he is improving. All hitters go through slumps. Herrera struggled after he got off the injured list. He seems to have his timing back now. You don't trade hitters like him unless you are really getting something back. Any team in baseball would be willing to take him off the Cards hands and would play him somewhere...

The key for the Cards is whether Wetherholdt can become another 800+ hitter and whether Burleson can up his game to that level as well. If yes and if Contreras can continue around 800, they have more or less solved the offensive issues internally.

[Bomber1]

What to do to become a competitive team? A lot of people here believe their own bull[shirt], and enjoy the company of others believing the same bull[shirt]. This IS a competitive team. They're a .500 team in a division that's +32. What we want is a team to move up to the top tier, into the high-90s, 100 win range. The good news is that in modern baseball that can happen in a year or two. The bad news is the present crew doesn't have the ability to do it. The incoming regime? We'll see. I have high hopes for them. This frustrating season will pay some dividends towards that end.

Sure, they can make the playoffs in 2026 with a few moves this off season.

Yes, and I think they will. Is there anyone claiming otherwise? It's important to note that the overall goal is not to make the playoffs but field a championship caliber team.

If you and Cranny think this team will make the playoffs in 2026 I want some of what you’re smoking.

2027 maybe, 2028 is more realistic.

Pffft. There are three wild card teams per league; this ain't 1985 or 1968. The Cardinals can easily be a playoff team next year with a good offseason (for a change).

Ok.

It is entirely possible for the Cardinals to have a good offseason and still not make the playoffs next year.

And I think that’s what is going to happen.

We’ll see who’s correct.

[Red7]

What to do to become a competitive team? A lot of people here believe their own bull[shirt], and enjoy the company of others believing the same bull[shirt]. This IS a competitive team. They're a .500 team in a division that's +32. What we want is a team to move up to the top tier, into the high-90s, 100 win range. The good news is that in modern baseball that can happen in a year or two. The bad news is the present crew doesn't have the ability to do it. The incoming regime? We'll see. I have high hopes for them. This frustrating season will pay some dividends towards that end.

Sure, they can make the playoffs in 2026 with a few moves this off season.

Yes, and I think they will. Is there anyone claiming otherwise? It's important to note that the overall goal is not to make the playoffs but field a championship caliber team.

If you and Cranny think this team will make the playoffs in 2026 I want some of what you’re smoking.

2027 maybe, 2028 is more realistic.

The fact that this team is sitting only 4.5 games behind a playoff spot with 18 games to go indicates they are not that far off from making the playoffs. Considering they had about 70 starts made by Mikolas, Fedde and Pallante, that is remarkable. Obtaining two pitchers that are better than those three plus perhaps putting Leahy into the rotation shouldn't be that hard. Plus, a full season of Wetherholdt and it is not hard to see a 10 game improvement, which puts them in the bracket.

Nobody seems to realize that at least some of the players that have helped them to .500 are going to be traded.
Will their replacements play better in 2026 than our traded players (some of Burleson, Gorman, Donovan, Herrera, etc) played this year?

I doubt it because they’re going to trade for younger players and prospects.

If they make the playoffs next year I’ll happily admit i was wrong.

But I don’t think I’ll be proven wrong.

Herrera possibly traded? Don’t think so.

Probably not, but he’s certainly not untouchable.

Isn’t he exactly what they’re looking for in a young player?

Really Cranny?

He has shown he can hit. So did DeJong his first year. But unlike DeJong, Herrera doesn’t have a solid defensive position. And the fact he has hit so far does not guarantee future success.

If Bloom can get a team to offer a young cost-controlled starter that Bloom likes I think you have to pull the trigger.

But Herrera is someone I expect to be on the team next year.

You never trade an everyday player for a pitcher. Ok, maybe if someone offered them a true ace for Herrera.

[BrummerStealsHome]

What to do to become a competitive team? A lot of people here believe their own bull[shirt], and enjoy the company of others believing the same bull[shirt]. This IS a competitive team. They're a .500 team in a division that's +32. What we want is a team to move up to the top tier, into the high-90s, 100 win range. The good news is that in modern baseball that can happen in a year or two. The bad news is the present crew doesn't have the ability to do it. The incoming regime? We'll see. I have high hopes for them. This frustrating season will pay some dividends towards that end.

Sure, they can make the playoffs in 2026 with a few moves this off season.

Yes, and I think they will. Is there anyone claiming otherwise? It's important to note that the overall goal is not to make the playoffs but field a championship caliber team.

If you and Cranny think this team will make the playoffs in 2026 I want some of what you’re smoking.

2027 maybe, 2028 is more realistic.

Pffft. There are three wild card teams per league; this ain't 1985 or 1968. The Cardinals can easily be a playoff team next year with a good offseason (for a change).

Ok.

It is entirely possible for the Cardinals to have a good offseason and still not make the playoffs next year.

And I think that’s what is going to happen.

We’ll see who’s correct.

You are conflating possibilities with probabilities here. I never said the Cardinals will make the playoffs next year. I said they can easily do so. If you think they won't I have no argument. If you think they can't then I do.

[Red7]

This is going to take time. The Cardinals are looking to rebuild along the lines of Tampa and Cleveland. Don’t expect a1996 or 2000 turnaround. They will be busy this offseason clearing a lot of the clutter. I think you’ll see a lot of new faces, but there are no blockbuster deals or FA signings on the horizon. If they are going to increase payroll significantly, it will not be before 2027. Payroll will remain flat as most of the savings will go to Sonny Gray who will make $35 million next year. Even if Gray, Contreras and Arenado waive their NTC’s, the team will be paying most, if not all, of their money.

While Tampa was good at evaluating and using their young talent, Cleveland has been relying for over a decade now, on stellar starting pitching and up-the-middle defense. And offense was a bonus to them, as it was last year when josh Nader had his career year. This year they took a backward step in all 3areas, by trading Nader and Gimemez, and sub-par seasons from their starters, some coming off injuries.

I’m all for focusing on pitching and defense first, and then adding at least one power bat

Josh Naylor, not Nader; I knew something looked off.

No problem. I knew who you meant. The problem is too many people on here think/want the Cardinals can/to wheel and deal themselves into a contender this offseason and that’s simply not what’s happening. They didn’t hire Dave Dombroski or AJ Preller. They hired a system builder. It’s going to take time to get that system up and running. When Whitey made his moves, he dealt high end prospects like Terry Kennedy, Leon Durham, and high end talent like Ted Simmons, Pete Vuckovich, Rollie Fingers, and Garry Templeton. When Jocketty did it, he made some timely deals (also trading high end prospects), drafted Pujols and Molina, and made some great low risk high reward signings. Bloom is not in that position.

[Jatalk]

This is going to take time. The Cardinals are looking to rebuild along the lines of Tampa and Cleveland. Don’t expect a1996 or 2000 turnaround. They will be busy this offseason clearing a lot of the clutter. I think you’ll see a lot of new faces, but there are no blockbuster deals or FA signings on the horizon. If they are going to increase payroll significantly, it will not be before 2027. Payroll will remain flat as most of the savings will go to Sonny Gray who will make $35 million next year. Even if Gray, Contreras and Arenado waive their NTC’s, the team will be paying most, if not all, of their money.

While Tampa was good at evaluating and using their young talent, Cleveland has been relying for over a decade now, on stellar starting pitching and up-the-middle defense. And offense was a bonus to them, as it was last year when josh Nader had his career year. This year they took a backward step in all 3areas, by trading Nader and Gimemez, and sub-par seasons from their starters, some coming off injuries.

I’m all for focusing on pitching and defense first, and then adding at least one power bat

Josh Naylor, not Nader; I knew something looked off.

No problem. I knew who you meant. The problem is too many people on here think/want the Cardinals can/to wheel and deal themselves into a contender this offseason and that’s simply not what’s happening. They didn’t hire Dave Dombroski or AJ Preller. They hired a system builder. It’s going to take time to get that system up and running. When Whitey made his moves, he dealt high end prospects like Terry Kennedy, Leon Durham, and high end talent like Ted Simmons, Pete Vuckovich, Rollie Fingers, and Garry Templeton. When Jocketty did it, he made some timely deals (also trading high end prospects), drafted Pujols and Molina, and made some great low risk high reward signings. Bloom is not in that position.

I was in Little Rock watching the AA team when Whitey took over. Prior to that we literally watched the same players every year with a few exceptions. When Whitey came on the whole organization top to bottom was cleared out.

[rockondlouie]

MLB trades:
Burleson for an MLB starting pitcher. Trade high. Replace with Torres.
Nootbar for an MLB RH outfielder. Replace with that RH outfielder.

40-man roster clearing trades (or nontenders)...
Gorman for a miLB guy. Replace with Wetherholt.
Pozo for a miLB guy (if possible). Replace with Crooks.
King for a miLB guy (if possible). Replace with Raquet.
Fermin for a miLB guy (if possible)
Siani for a miLB guy (if possible)
Roycroft for a miLB guy (if possible)
Veneziano for a miLB guy (if possible)
Koperniak for a miLB guy (if possible)

Mikolas leaves via FA. Replace with Mathews.
Hampson (already a DFA)

Demote to AAA to play everyday:
Walker - replace with Church in RF
Saggese - replace with Prieto

Trade if you can... but you probably can't... and you will still be too lefthanded
Contreras instead of Burleson
Arenado instead of Nootbar (move Donovan to 3B and Nootbar to LF)

Do Not Trade:
Gray: What is the point of trading away your best starting pitcher (and sending cash with him) and then looking for starting pitchers to acquire?

Who is left?
C Crooks and Pages platoon with Bernal in AAA
1B/DH Contreras, Herrera
IF Arenado, Winn, Wetherholt with Prieto and Torres on bench with Saggese and Mendoza in AAA playing every day
OF Donovan, Scott, Church, new RH OF (from Nootbar trade) with Walker and Baez in AAA playing every day
SP Gray, Mathews, Liberatore, McGreevy, new SP (from Burleson trade) with Pallante in BP and Henderson, Mautz, Hansen, Rincon, Winquest in AAA
RRP Leahy, O'Brien, Svanson, Pallante, Alcala, Granillo with Graceffo, Fernandez, Munoz in AAA
LRP Romero, Raquet with Mosqueda in AAA

Best take on the thread, good job statman

[Bomber1]

What to do to become a competitive team? A lot of people here believe their own bull[shirt], and enjoy the company of others believing the same bull[shirt]. This IS a competitive team. They're a .500 team in a division that's +32. What we want is a team to move up to the top tier, into the high-90s, 100 win range. The good news is that in modern baseball that can happen in a year or two. The bad news is the present crew doesn't have the ability to do it. The incoming regime? We'll see. I have high hopes for them. This frustrating season will pay some dividends towards that end.

Sure, they can make the playoffs in 2026 with a few moves this off season.

Yes, and I think they will. Is there anyone claiming otherwise? It's important to note that the overall goal is not to make the playoffs but field a championship caliber team.

If you and Cranny think this team will make the playoffs in 2026 I want some of what you’re smoking.

2027 maybe, 2028 is more realistic.

The fact that this team is sitting only 4.5 games behind a playoff spot with 18 games to go indicates they are not that far off from making the playoffs. Considering they had about 70 starts made by Mikolas, Fedde and Pallante, that is remarkable. Obtaining two pitchers that are better than those three plus perhaps putting Leahy into the rotation shouldn't be that hard. Plus, a full season of Wetherholdt and it is not hard to see a 10 game improvement, which puts them in the bracket.

Nobody seems to realize that at least some of the players that have helped them to .500 are going to be traded.
Will their replacements play better in 2026 than our traded players (some of Burleson, Gorman, Donovan, Herrera, etc) played this year?

I doubt it because they’re going to trade for younger players and prospects.

If they make the playoffs next year I’ll happily admit i was wrong.

But I don’t think I’ll be proven wrong.

Herrera possibly traded? Don’t think so.

Probably not, but he’s certainly not untouchable.

Isn’t he exactly what they’re looking for in a young player?

Really Cranny?

He has shown he can hit. So did DeJong his first year. But unlike DeJong, Herrera doesn’t have a solid defensive position. And the fact he has hit so far does not guarantee future success.

If Bloom can get a team to offer a young cost-controlled starter that Bloom likes I think you have to pull the trigger.

But Herrera is someone I expect to be on the team next year.

You never trade an everyday player for a pitcher. Ok, maybe if someone offered them a true ace for Herrera.

Yes I’m sure many teams will dangle their aces in an attempt to land the Cardinal slugger with 14 homers and no defensive position.

[renostl]

MLB trades:
Burleson for an MLB starting pitcher. Trade high. Replace with Torres.
Nootbar for an MLB RH outfielder. Replace with that RH outfielder.

40-man roster clearing trades (or nontenders)...
Gorman for a miLB guy. Replace with Wetherholt.
Pozo for a miLB guy (if possible). Replace with Crooks.
King for a miLB guy (if possible). Replace with Raquet.
Fermin for a miLB guy (if possible)
Siani for a miLB guy (if possible)
Roycroft for a miLB guy (if possible)
Veneziano for a miLB guy (if possible)
Koperniak for a miLB guy (if possible)

Mikolas leaves via FA. Replace with Mathews.
Hampson (already a DFA)

Demote to AAA to play everyday:
Walker - replace with Church in RF
Saggese - replace with Prieto

Trade if you can... but you probably can't... and you will still be too lefthanded
Contreras instead of Burleson
Arenado instead of Nootbar (move Donovan to 3B and Nootbar to LF)

Do Not Trade:
Gray: What is the point of trading away your best starting pitcher (and sending cash with him) and then looking for starting pitchers to acquire?

Who is left?
C Crooks and Pages platoon with Bernal in AAA
1B/DH Contreras, Herrera
IF Arenado, Winn, Wetherholt with Prieto and Torres on bench with Saggese and Mendoza in AAA playing every day
OF Donovan, Scott, Church, new RH OF (from Nootbar trade) with Walker and Baez in AAA playing every day
SP Gray, Mathews, Liberatore, McGreevy, new SP (from Burleson trade) with Pallante in BP and Henderson, Mautz, Hansen, Rincon, Winquest in AAA
RRP Leahy, O'Brien, Svanson, Pallante, Alcala, Granillo with Graceffo, Fernandez, Munoz in AAA
LRP Romero, Raquet with Mosqueda in AAA

What you effectively have shown is how it is not some impossible
dream to get an improved 26. We don't know what the Cards will do but
it can be done.

[alw80]

Why are blockbuster trades off the table?

Have to trade the few valuable prospects we have and then we have to build thru FA which isn't happening.