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Banner29 wrote: ↑22 Aug 2025 21:01 pm

ecleme22 wrote: ↑22 Aug 2025 20:25 pm

Banner29 wrote: ↑22 Aug 2025 20:21 pm

ecleme22 wrote: ↑22 Aug 2025 12:34 pm

Banner29 wrote: ↑22 Aug 2025 12:29 pm

ecleme22 wrote: ↑22 Aug 2025 12:21 pm

An Old Friend wrote: ↑22 Aug 2025 11:23 am Ummm... he's ALWAYS been this guy. Totally unhinged and an asssshole... product of his upbringing.

Talented enough to have a long career.
Too big of a jackwagon for anyone to keep him around for any time whatsoever - he's a cancer.

10 teams in 12 seasons

Kimbrel has been with 9 teams in 11 years. Is he a cancer?
Chris Stratton has been with 7 teams in 8 years. Cancer?

Like the ones above, Tommy's career of late has been 1 year deals, then traded to teams in the playoff hunt who want him.

For cancers, see Puig. He hasn't been in the league in 6 years.

Organizations keep signing Pham. And no, it's not because they know less about his personality than you...

1 year deals and playoff contending teams that use him for a quick playoff push then dispose of him

In other words teams that use him to strengthen their farm sent to teams that don’t appear to want to keep him around for very long.

I can agree he’s not on a Yasiel Puig level of cancer, but clearly his reputation hasn’t outweighed his rather high talent level. Hence why he’s never found a “forever home”

'Dispose' is an inaccurate word. The Cards didn't 'dispose of' Mark DeRosa, nor Quintana.

Not exactly sure where you’re going with this. Derosa was not good for the Cardinals and wasn’t good the rest of his career and I remember a lot of us wanting Quintana back. And the Cardinals at the very least expressed interest in it.

These two don’t really compare

Cards never entertained resigning Q.

Pham being brought in as a rental and then not resigned by the team renting him is very common.

Once or maybe even twice sure. But 10 different teams? Not one of them said to themselves “hey we gotta lock this guy up” especially with his skill set. He either signs in the offseason with some scrub team that knows they can use him for prospects or gets traded to contenders that appear to strategically grab him when it’s about time to lock in to playoff baseball. Perhaps to deal with him as little as humanly possible until it’s beneficial. Otherwise why not just sign him in the offseason and have him all year? And why can’t he find himself into a long term deal? I reiterate, with his skill set it shouldn’t be an issue.

I’m not saying he’s a big time cancer. All I’m saying is I’ve never even heard of a teammate or coach to upset about him leaving. Which is odd, considering he has been a pretty solid player

ecleme22 wrote: ↑22 Aug 2025 21:20 pm

Banner29 wrote: ↑22 Aug 2025 21:01 pm

ecleme22 wrote: ↑22 Aug 2025 20:25 pm

Banner29 wrote: ↑22 Aug 2025 20:21 pm

ecleme22 wrote: ↑22 Aug 2025 12:34 pm

Banner29 wrote: ↑22 Aug 2025 12:29 pm

ecleme22 wrote: ↑22 Aug 2025 12:21 pm

An Old Friend wrote: ↑22 Aug 2025 11:23 am Ummm... he's ALWAYS been this guy. Totally unhinged and an asssshole... product of his upbringing.

Talented enough to have a long career.
Too big of a jackwagon for anyone to keep him around for any time whatsoever - he's a cancer.

10 teams in 12 seasons

Kimbrel has been with 9 teams in 11 years. Is he a cancer?
Chris Stratton has been with 7 teams in 8 years. Cancer?

Like the ones above, Tommy's career of late has been 1 year deals, then traded to teams in the playoff hunt who want him.

For cancers, see Puig. He hasn't been in the league in 6 years.

Organizations keep signing Pham. And no, it's not because they know less about his personality than you...

1 year deals and playoff contending teams that use him for a quick playoff push then dispose of him

In other words teams that use him to strengthen their farm sent to teams that don’t appear to want to keep him around for very long.

I can agree he’s not on a Yasiel Puig level of cancer, but clearly his reputation hasn’t outweighed his rather high talent level. Hence why he’s never found a “forever home”

'Dispose' is an inaccurate word. The Cards didn't 'dispose of' Mark DeRosa, nor Quintana.

Not exactly sure where you’re going with this. Derosa was not good for the Cardinals and wasn’t good the rest of his career and I remember a lot of us wanting Quintana back. And the Cardinals at the very least expressed interest in it.

These two don’t really compare

Cards never entertained resigning Q.

Pham being brought in as a rental and then not resigned by the team renting him is very common.

Once or maybe even twice sure. But 10 different teams? Not one of them said to themselves “hey we gotta lock this guy up” especially with his skill set. He either signs in the offseason with some scrub team that knows they can use him for prospects or gets traded to contenders that appear to strategically grab him when it’s about time to lock in to playoff baseball. Perhaps to deal with him as little as humanly possible until it’s beneficial. Otherwise why not just sign him in the offseason and have him all year? And why can’t he find himself into a long term deal? I reiterate, with his skill set it shouldn’t be an issue.

I’m not saying he’s a big time cancer. All I’m saying is I’ve never even heard of a teammate or coach to upset about him leaving. Which is odd, considering he has been a pretty solid player

Blake snell was mad when the Rays traded him.

But with anything, you have to look at context.

Were Oli or teammates upset when Maton was traded? No. Yet did they appreciate his contribution? Yep.

And if Maton signs with a middling team next year and is traded again to a contender at the deadline, will we question his character? No.

Over the last 4 offseasons, Pham has signed w not so good teams. And the first 3 of those seasons, contenders wanted him, with the last one the Cards released him so he could get picked up by a playoff team.

That’s 8 teams in 4 years. Not because he’s a bad character. But because, like Maton, he’s signing with potential deadline sellers.

Ozziesfan41 wrote: ↑22 Aug 2025 21:32 pm

ecleme22 wrote: ↑22 Aug 2025 21:20 pm

Banner29 wrote: ↑22 Aug 2025 21:01 pm

ecleme22 wrote: ↑22 Aug 2025 20:25 pm

Banner29 wrote: ↑22 Aug 2025 20:21 pm

ecleme22 wrote: ↑22 Aug 2025 12:34 pm

Banner29 wrote: ↑22 Aug 2025 12:29 pm

ecleme22 wrote: ↑22 Aug 2025 12:21 pm

An Old Friend wrote: ↑22 Aug 2025 11:23 am Ummm... he's ALWAYS been this guy. Totally unhinged and an asssshole... product of his upbringing.

Talented enough to have a long career.
Too big of a jackwagon for anyone to keep him around for any time whatsoever - he's a cancer.

10 teams in 12 seasons

Kimbrel has been with 9 teams in 11 years. Is he a cancer?
Chris Stratton has been with 7 teams in 8 years. Cancer?

Like the ones above, Tommy's career of late has been 1 year deals, then traded to teams in the playoff hunt who want him.

For cancers, see Puig. He hasn't been in the league in 6 years.

Organizations keep signing Pham. And no, it's not because they know less about his personality than you...

1 year deals and playoff contending teams that use him for a quick playoff push then dispose of him

In other words teams that use him to strengthen their farm sent to teams that don’t appear to want to keep him around for very long.

I can agree he’s not on a Yasiel Puig level of cancer, but clearly his reputation hasn’t outweighed his rather high talent level. Hence why he’s never found a “forever home”

'Dispose' is an inaccurate word. The Cards didn't 'dispose of' Mark DeRosa, nor Quintana.

Not exactly sure where you’re going with this. Derosa was not good for the Cardinals and wasn’t good the rest of his career and I remember a lot of us wanting Quintana back. And the Cardinals at the very least expressed interest in it.

These two don’t really compare

Cards never entertained resigning Q.

Pham being brought in as a rental and then not resigned by the team renting him is very common.

Once or maybe even twice sure. But 10 different teams? Not one of them said to themselves “hey we gotta lock this guy up” especially with his skill set. He either signs in the offseason with some scrub team that knows they can use him for prospects or gets traded to contenders that appear to strategically grab him when it’s about time to lock in to playoff baseball. Perhaps to deal with him as little as humanly possible until it’s beneficial. Otherwise why not just sign him in the offseason and have him all year? And why can’t he find himself into a long term deal? I reiterate, with his skill set it shouldn’t be an issue.

I’m not saying he’s a big time cancer. All I’m saying is I’ve never even heard of a teammate or coach to upset about him leaving. Which is odd, considering he has been a pretty solid player

Blake snell was mad when the Rays traded him.

But with anything, you have to look at context.

Were Oli or teammates upset when Maton was traded? No. Yet did they appreciate his contribution? Yep.

And if Maton signs with a middling team next year and is traded again to a contender at the deadline, will we question his character? No.

Over the last 4 offseasons, Pham has signed w not so good teams. And the first 3 of those seasons, contenders wanted him, with the last one the Cards released him so he could get picked up by a playoff team.

That’s 8 teams in 4 years. Not because he’s a bad character. But because, like Maton, he’s signing with potential deadline sellers.

+1 these GMs talk the players talk everyone knows who and what Tommy Pham is and they want him. From Rosenthals
Article and his teammates comments he’s obviously the kind of guy you don’t want to be going against but want him in
The foxhole with you. Someone mentioned he’s not a good teammate because he called out some mets players for being lazy but the Mets loved him and said they would miss him the most out of verlander scherzer and him and they asked Lindor and lindor agreed because he taught him how to work harder. I’m not saying he is a great guy or someone who people should try to be like he has his issues I’m not even giving him a pass on his behavior because of his bad child hood but those who say he is not a good teammate are wrong at best and liars at worst

hmoss859 wrote: ↑22 Aug 2025 22:03 pm Okay let’s all agree he is real and angry.

Aka

Real angry man

ecleme22 wrote: ↑22 Aug 2025 15:51 pm

An Old Friend wrote: ↑22 Aug 2025 15:39 pm

ecleme22 wrote: ↑22 Aug 2025 15:39 pm He sounds like a good guy from the Rosenthal article.

He does. Don’t know what to tell you.

There are his teammates and GMs that continue to sign him.

And then there’s you and shakey…

ecleme22 wrote: ↑22 Aug 2025 12:21 pm

An Old Friend wrote: ↑22 Aug 2025 11:23 am Ummm... he's ALWAYS been this guy. Totally unhinged and an asssshole... product of his upbringing.

Talented enough to have a long career.
Too big of a jackwagon for anyone to keep him around for any time whatsoever - he's a cancer.

10 teams in 12 seasons

Kimbrel has been with 9 teams in 11 years. Is he a cancer?
Chris Stratton has been with 7 teams in 8 years. Cancer?

Like the ones above, Tommy's career of late has been 1 year deals, then traded to teams in the playoff hunt who want him.

For cancers, see Puig. He hasn't been in the league in 6 years.

Organizations keep signing Pham. And no, it's not because they know less about his personality than you...

RamFan08NY wrote: ↑22 Aug 2025 23:51 pm

ecleme22 wrote: ↑22 Aug 2025 12:21 pm

An Old Friend wrote: ↑22 Aug 2025 11:23 am Ummm... he's ALWAYS been this guy. Totally unhinged and an asssshole... product of his upbringing.

Talented enough to have a long career.
Too big of a jackwagon for anyone to keep him around for any time whatsoever - he's a cancer.

10 teams in 12 seasons

Kimbrel has been with 9 teams in 11 years. Is he a cancer?
Chris Stratton has been with 7 teams in 8 years. Cancer?

Like the ones above, Tommy's career of late has been 1 year deals, then traded to teams in the playoff hunt who want him.

For cancers, see Puig. He hasn't been in the league in 6 years.

Organizations keep signing Pham. And no, it's not because they know less about his personality than you...

Yet, none of these brain trust want him for more than a half season. Hhhmmmm. That spells cancer.

An Old Friend wrote: ↑22 Aug 2025 23:50 pm

ecleme22 wrote: ↑22 Aug 2025 15:51 pm

An Old Friend wrote: ↑22 Aug 2025 15:39 pm

ecleme22 wrote: ↑22 Aug 2025 15:39 pm He sounds like a good guy from the Rosenthal article.

He does. Don’t know what to tell you.

There are his teammates and GMs that continue to sign him.

And then there’s you and shakey…

Wonder how the fan felt that he pretended to jerk off on… ya know… the thing he got suspended for this year.

Totally good guy, just tons of lapses of judgement

imadangman wrote: ↑22 Aug 2025 19:52 pm

An Old Friend wrote: ↑22 Aug 2025 13:27 pm
His mom was 17 when he was born and didn't finish high school
His dad was 19 and incarcerated when he was born
Pham's stepfather stabbed him during a fight

Just stop the post right there. Open ended question: how would you overcome that type of upbringing? You can try to answer the question at face value. You look around a field at kids who came from these richy rich select ball leagues. Their parents drove them around in fancy travelalls with iPads fixed to the dash, and made rude entitled demands to the hotel employees wherever they stay (you know the types). Remember when pham said in a post-game interview he didn't have anyone to play catch with growing up.

A guy like Pham is going to standout as different from his teammates. But he's not going to have time to stop and explain to each and every person what he's been through. I think at that age, it would be hard to expect Pham himself to even fully understand his own childhood through his own eyes, or what it is he's missing. He's not gonna be going to therapy at that point. All he knows is to leave it all out on the field with a chip on his shoulder.

Not trying to justify everything pham did but it makes total sense. Truly, nobody believed in him. It's hard not to project that onto the rest of the world when it's all you know, giving that chip on shoulder. We can say that every MLB player has defied odds just by getting to the big leagues. But it is worth noting that very few of them had to overcome the specific challenges Pham did. By the rest of your post and your failure to connect his childhood to his later actions, you seem like the type of person who would like to see a social credit score in the US.

Yeah, pham has some work to do getting to a point of acceptance and hopefully the end of his playing days will give him the time and space to put focus on that.

Cardinals4Life wrote: ↑23 Aug 2025 00:55 am

imadangman wrote: ↑22 Aug 2025 19:52 pm

An Old Friend wrote: ↑22 Aug 2025 13:27 pm
His mom was 17 when he was born and didn't finish high school
His dad was 19 and incarcerated when he was born
Pham's stepfather stabbed him during a fight

Just stop the post right there. Open ended question: how would you overcome that type of upbringing? You can try to answer the question at face value. You look around a field at kids who came from these richy rich select ball leagues. Their parents drove them around in fancy travelalls with iPads fixed to the dash, and made rude entitled demands to the hotel employees wherever they stay (you know the types). Remember when pham said in a post-game interview he didn't have anyone to play catch with growing up.

A guy like Pham is going to standout as different from his teammates. But he's not going to have time to stop and explain to each and every person what he's been through. I think at that age, it would be hard to expect Pham himself to even fully understand his own childhood through his own eyes, or what it is he's missing. He's not gonna be going to therapy at that point. All he knows is to leave it all out on the field with a chip on his shoulder.

Not trying to justify everything pham did but it makes total sense. Truly, nobody believed in him. It's hard not to project that onto the rest of the world when it's all you know, giving that chip on shoulder. We can say that every MLB player has defied odds just by getting to the big leagues. But it is worth noting that very few of them had to overcome the specific challenges Pham did. By the rest of your post and your failure to connect his childhood to his later actions, you seem like the type of person who would like to see a social credit score in the US.

Yeah, pham has some work to do getting to a point of acceptance and hopefully the end of his playing days will give him the time and space to put focus on that.

Was he not drafted? Was he not taught the game of baseball? I'm sure there were people who believed in him.

At some point you have to grow up, despite your upbringing. You have to rise above it. He is a bigtime punk and thug and was ungrateful specifically of the Cardinals when he was here the first time. Mouthing a franchise that drafted you, BELIEVED in you, and paid you a fortune, setting you up for life is not a good look. Bottom line, he is a punk.

ecleme22 wrote: ↑23 Aug 2025 01:04 am

Cardinals4Life wrote: ↑23 Aug 2025 00:55 am

imadangman wrote: ↑22 Aug 2025 19:52 pm

An Old Friend wrote: ↑22 Aug 2025 13:27 pm
His mom was 17 when he was born and didn't finish high school
His dad was 19 and incarcerated when he was born
Pham's stepfather stabbed him during a fight

Just stop the post right there. Open ended question: how would you overcome that type of upbringing? You can try to answer the question at face value. You look around a field at kids who came from these richy rich select ball leagues. Their parents drove them around in fancy travelalls with iPads fixed to the dash, and made rude entitled demands to the hotel employees wherever they stay (you know the types). Remember when pham said in a post-game interview he didn't have anyone to play catch with growing up.

A guy like Pham is going to standout as different from his teammates. But he's not going to have time to stop and explain to each and every person what he's been through. I think at that age, it would be hard to expect Pham himself to even fully understand his own childhood through his own eyes, or what it is he's missing. He's not gonna be going to therapy at that point. All he knows is to leave it all out on the field with a chip on his shoulder.

Not trying to justify everything pham did but it makes total sense. Truly, nobody believed in him. It's hard not to project that onto the rest of the world when it's all you know, giving that chip on shoulder. We can say that every MLB player has defied odds just by getting to the big leagues. But it is worth noting that very few of them had to overcome the specific challenges Pham did. By the rest of your post and your failure to connect his childhood to his later actions, you seem like the type of person who would like to see a social credit score in the US.

Yeah, pham has some work to do getting to a point of acceptance and hopefully the end of his playing days will give him the time and space to put focus on that.

Was he not drafted? Was he not taught the game of baseball? I'm sure there were people who believed in him.

At some point you have to grow up, despite your upbringing. You have to rise above it. He is a bigtime punk and thug and was ungrateful specifically of the Cardinals when he was here the first time. Mouthing a franchise that drafted you, BELIEVED in you, and paid you a fortune, setting you up for life is not a good look. Bottom line, he is a punk.

I believed him in the SI article. Some on here didn’t.

But he was right.

How can a two year OF vet with a lifetime ops around .780 be demoted for Matt Adams in 2017?

How can a guy who had a .324 ba and .885 ops in Memphis get 2 at bats in 2014?

And don’t me started about 2015 and 2016..,

Cardinals4Life wrote: ↑23 Aug 2025 01:06 am

ecleme22 wrote: ↑23 Aug 2025 01:04 am

Cardinals4Life wrote: ↑23 Aug 2025 00:55 am

imadangman wrote: ↑22 Aug 2025 19:52 pm

An Old Friend wrote: ↑22 Aug 2025 13:27 pm
His mom was 17 when he was born and didn't finish high school
His dad was 19 and incarcerated when he was born
Pham's stepfather stabbed him during a fight

Just stop the post right there. Open ended question: how would you overcome that type of upbringing? You can try to answer the question at face value. You look around a field at kids who came from these richy rich select ball leagues. Their parents drove them around in fancy travelalls with iPads fixed to the dash, and made rude entitled demands to the hotel employees wherever they stay (you know the types). Remember when pham said in a post-game interview he didn't have anyone to play catch with growing up.

A guy like Pham is going to standout as different from his teammates. But he's not going to have time to stop and explain to each and every person what he's been through. I think at that age, it would be hard to expect Pham himself to even fully understand his own childhood through his own eyes, or what it is he's missing. He's not gonna be going to therapy at that point. All he knows is to leave it all out on the field with a chip on his shoulder.

Not trying to justify everything pham did but it makes total sense. Truly, nobody believed in him. It's hard not to project that onto the rest of the world when it's all you know, giving that chip on shoulder. We can say that every MLB player has defied odds just by getting to the big leagues. But it is worth noting that very few of them had to overcome the specific challenges Pham did. By the rest of your post and your failure to connect his childhood to his later actions, you seem like the type of person who would like to see a social credit score in the US.

Yeah, pham has some work to do getting to a point of acceptance and hopefully the end of his playing days will give him the time and space to put focus on that.

Was he not drafted? Was he not taught the game of baseball? I'm sure there were people who believed in him.

At some point you have to grow up, despite your upbringing. You have to rise above it. He is a bigtime punk and thug and was ungrateful specifically of the Cardinals when he was here the first time. Mouthing a franchise that drafted you, BELIEVED in you, and paid you a fortune, setting you up for life is not a good look. Bottom line, he is a punk.

I believed him in the SI article. Some on here didn’t.

But he was right.

How can a two year OF vet with a lifetime ops around .780 be demoted for Matt Adams in 2017?

How can a guy who had a .324 ba and .885 ops in Memphis get 2 at bats in 2014?

And don’t me started about 2015 and 2016..,

I don't know, but maybe his god-awful attitude had something to do with it? Hard to promote guys who have punk attitudes sometimes.

ecleme22 wrote: ↑23 Aug 2025 01:40 am

Cardinals4Life wrote: ↑23 Aug 2025 01:06 am

ecleme22 wrote: ↑23 Aug 2025 01:04 am

Cardinals4Life wrote: ↑23 Aug 2025 00:55 am

imadangman wrote: ↑22 Aug 2025 19:52 pm

An Old Friend wrote: ↑22 Aug 2025 13:27 pm
His mom was 17 when he was born and didn't finish high school
His dad was 19 and incarcerated when he was born
Pham's stepfather stabbed him during a fight

Just stop the post right there. Open ended question: how would you overcome that type of upbringing? You can try to answer the question at face value. You look around a field at kids who came from these richy rich select ball leagues. Their parents drove them around in fancy travelalls with iPads fixed to the dash, and made rude entitled demands to the hotel employees wherever they stay (you know the types). Remember when pham said in a post-game interview he didn't have anyone to play catch with growing up.

A guy like Pham is going to standout as different from his teammates. But he's not going to have time to stop and explain to each and every person what he's been through. I think at that age, it would be hard to expect Pham himself to even fully understand his own childhood through his own eyes, or what it is he's missing. He's not gonna be going to therapy at that point. All he knows is to leave it all out on the field with a chip on his shoulder.

Not trying to justify everything pham did but it makes total sense. Truly, nobody believed in him. It's hard not to project that onto the rest of the world when it's all you know, giving that chip on shoulder. We can say that every MLB player has defied odds just by getting to the big leagues. But it is worth noting that very few of them had to overcome the specific challenges Pham did. By the rest of your post and your failure to connect his childhood to his later actions, you seem like the type of person who would like to see a social credit score in the US.

Yeah, pham has some work to do getting to a point of acceptance and hopefully the end of his playing days will give him the time and space to put focus on that.

Was he not drafted? Was he not taught the game of baseball? I'm sure there were people who believed in him.

At some point you have to grow up, despite your upbringing. You have to rise above it. He is a bigtime punk and thug and was ungrateful specifically of the Cardinals when he was here the first time. Mouthing a franchise that drafted you, BELIEVED in you, and paid you a fortune, setting you up for life is not a good look. Bottom line, he is a punk.

I believed him in the SI article. Some on here didn’t.

But he was right.

How can a two year OF vet with a lifetime ops around .780 be demoted for Matt Adams in 2017?

How can a guy who had a .324 ba and .885 ops in Memphis get 2 at bats in 2014?

And don’t me started about 2015 and 2016..,

I don't know, but maybe his god-awful attitude had something to do with it? Hard to promote guys who have punk attitudes sometimes.

We will never know, but I would've loved to see how LaRussa would've handled Pham. My guess: TLR would've loved him, and Pham would've thrived under him.

TLR had the ability to see talent early and also work with varying personalities. Pham would've thrived under TLR.