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2-3 right of center of the 12.craviduce wrote: ↑31 Jul 2025 11:18 am compilation of Blaze's HR's this year
https://x.com/CardsPlayerDev/status/1950949598572240960
I don't buy that.renostl wrote: ↑31 Jul 2025 11:47 amIt's less about how the Cardinals used a player and more about how the acquiring team sees him.Strummer Jones wrote: ↑31 Jul 2025 09:46 amNope, sorry.
I don't know how anyone can argue that three A guys (and the headliner struggling in A-ball with a bum knee) is a good return for a guy who just last year was one of, if not THE most dominant closers in the game. And while he was not as dominant this year, was also not bombing either. I get the the return wasn't going to be Francisco Lindor or Juan Soto. But could it at least be ONE kid in AA with some helium? And not three kids scuffling in A-ball?
But, man, it needs to be more than three dudes in A-ball who very likely might not put it all together. Yeah, they've got some tools, but I'm tired of tools. Tools are nice, but for Helsley, I think it needs to be kids with those tools that are showing that they can use them at a level higher than A-ball. We've got enough of those guys already.
That we got someone who could even help out this year for Steven Matz, who's been hurt a lot, and not terribly effective when he was healthy over the course of this contract is a steal.
IF Hels is seen as a setup guy and not a closer wherever he was wanted then that levels the value of both
pitchers. Both have been hit by RHB an OPS >.800. Matz better vs LHB by .442 OPS vs .580.
Add Matz is a in demand LHP and can start, it was always possible that he could return more
when going to a contender who may already have their closer, 100% opinion.
That's just how rankings work when you're basically a 1-2 tool player. The path to being valuable is much narrower - you have to hit, a lot, as a DH/1B only.
I'm not 100% sure of your point, isn't conversation better?Strummer Jones wrote: ↑31 Jul 2025 11:54 amI don't buy that.renostl wrote: ↑31 Jul 2025 11:47 amIt's less about how the Cardinals used a player and more about how the acquiring team sees him.Strummer Jones wrote: ↑31 Jul 2025 09:46 amNope, sorry.
I don't know how anyone can argue that three A guys (and the headliner struggling in A-ball with a bum knee) is a good return for a guy who just last year was one of, if not THE most dominant closers in the game. And while he was not as dominant this year, was also not bombing either. I get the the return wasn't going to be Francisco Lindor or Juan Soto. But could it at least be ONE kid in AA with some helium? And not three kids scuffling in A-ball?
But, man, it needs to be more than three dudes in A-ball who very likely might not put it all together. Yeah, they've got some tools, but I'm tired of tools. Tools are nice, but for Helsley, I think it needs to be kids with those tools that are showing that they can use them at a level higher than A-ball. We've got enough of those guys already.
That we got someone who could even help out this year for Steven Matz, who's been hurt a lot, and not terribly effective when he was healthy over the course of this contract is a steal.
IF Hels is seen as a setup guy and not a closer wherever he was wanted then that levels the value of both
pitchers. Both have been hit by RHB an OPS >.800. Matz better vs LHB by .442 OPS vs .580.
Add Matz is a in demand LHP and can start, it was always possible that he could return more
when going to a contender who may already have their closer, 100% opinion.
Let's say we were REALLY going to tear down to the studs, Rockies-style. We're going to part off ANYTHING that has ANY value.
And some team has a Luken Baker-type player that will play first base. Big time power, but absolutely cannot and will not make enough contact to make a difference with it. That's going to be our guy while we tank and accrue draft picks. He'll probably be our #3 hitter.
You gonna pay MOTO bat prices for a AAAA guy?
Without the incessant whining I hope. He should get some credit for a great baseball name.retiredscout1 wrote: ↑30 Jul 2025 23:28 pm Another player I've scouted in person numerous times when he was in HS and a couple times in 2023.This is a really good pull for the Cards given they gave up pretty much nothing to get him.This is your future starting 1B.Think a RH version of Tino Martinez.
.
Two months.Strummer Jones wrote: ↑31 Jul 2025 09:46 amNope, sorry.
I don't know how anyone can argue that three A guys (and the headliner struggling in A-ball with a bum knee) is a good return for a guy who just last year was one of, if not THE most dominant closers in the game. And while he was not as dominant this year, was also not bombing either. I get the the return wasn't going to be Francisco Lindor or Juan Soto. But could it at least be ONE kid in AA with some helium? And not three kids scuffling in A-ball?
But, man, it needs to be more than three dudes in A-ball who very likely might not put it all together. Yeah, they've got some tools, but I'm tired of tools. Tools are nice, but for Helsley, I think it needs to be kids with those tools that are showing that they can use them at a level higher than A-ball. We've got enough of those guys already.
That we got someone who could even help out this year for Steven Matz, who's been hurt a lot, and not terribly effective when he was healthy over the course of this contract is a steal.
Well, for the two month rental of the Ghost of Jon Lester, we traded Lane Thomas. A player who had been in the majors, but hadn't gotten much traction. He had some good time in Washington. I see the Matz trade as similar to that. Not a perfect parallel, but similar. Lester was clearly on his last run. Lane hadn't really broken through here.okcardfan wrote: ↑31 Jul 2025 14:21 pmTwo months.Strummer Jones wrote: ↑31 Jul 2025 09:46 amNope, sorry.
I don't know how anyone can argue that three A guys (and the headliner struggling in A-ball with a bum knee) is a good return for a guy who just last year was one of, if not THE most dominant closers in the game. And while he was not as dominant this year, was also not bombing either. I get the the return wasn't going to be Francisco Lindor or Juan Soto. But could it at least be ONE kid in AA with some helium? And not three kids scuffling in A-ball?
But, man, it needs to be more than three dudes in A-ball who very likely might not put it all together. Yeah, they've got some tools, but I'm tired of tools. Tools are nice, but for Helsley, I think it needs to be kids with those tools that are showing that they can use them at a level higher than A-ball. We've got enough of those guys already.
That we got someone who could even help out this year for Steven Matz, who's been hurt a lot, and not terribly effective when he was healthy over the course of this contract is a steal.
TWO MONTHS! What did you expect for giving up a two-month rental (whom you can re-sign if you wish and aren't too frickin stingy)??!!
Jeez Louise . . .
Ha. As if you’ve personally scouted him and watched him play a lot!Cranny wrote: ↑31 Jul 2025 11:52 amBest do your homework on Blaze.ClassicO wrote: ↑31 Jul 2025 10:10 am I don't see how Blaze could be that good if he's still the 20th or 24th prospect for the Red Sox. But Matz was an injury-prone, lousy soon-FA pitcher, so it's a good return.
As for Helsley, I'm surprised they got what appears to be not a good return, but Hels' fastball has been hammered. Do people really think there were a lot better offers out there, and the Cards said, "nah, we love Baez?"
Agree. And the Cards have a lot of those already.An Old Friend wrote: ↑31 Jul 2025 11:59 amThat's just how rankings work when you're basically a 1-2 tool player. The path to being valuable is much narrower - you have to hit, a lot, as a DH/1B only.
