John Mozeliak

[OldRed]

Red -

The Cardinals style was to trade for players, and if they fit in extend them. They didn’t give longer term contracts to free agents. Then along came the Leake, Fowler and Cecil signings. Which I didn’t like because they were outside the business plan which had been so successful. And none of those 3 fit in well.

When the Cardinals traded Arozarena, he was slashing .358/.435/.593/1,028 at Memphis. I posted at the time that it might have been because he broke the locker room code. What happens in the clubhouse stays in the clubhouse. Then Mo made that strange and revealing comment that they need to “reassess how they rated talent in the minors”.

No need to lecture me. I've been around just about as long as you and Mo has made some good moves and some bad. It is his "better than you" attitude toward fans and lack of honesty that has always bothered me. Just seems he is not of us a fan.

[Bomber1]

Ok, I'll bite.

He's been employed WAY past his expiration date. He's done hardly anything of note for the last many years. The Arenado and Goldschmidt deals were like gimme putts. If any real effort was needed to get what the team needed for postseason success, he usually punted. Dry powder, low hanging fruit and arbitrage. Yeah, that's a word he actually used. And a guy returning from the IL was 'just like making a trade'.

The money our disinterested owner provided for salaries, Moe pretty much wasted on stupid contracts and extensions, too many to mention here. The coaching and minor league system went to hell. Remember the women's softball coach who was hired as the assistant hitting coach? Does that sound like something a proud major league team would do?

He's been the face of the team for many years and has a smug, I know everything attitude about him. He and the owners thought the fans were suckers that would show up for anything. I'll admit, it took a while for most the of the fans to figure out they were being scammed. But look at the attendance now!

I don't get into the personal attacks myself, (in fact I hardly ever post) but I can understand when frustrated fans do. This team went from being a standard bearer of the National League to being just another team to beat up on. On his watch. I won't miss him.

Great post!

[Bomber1]

It's really very simple.

When Mo started, this organization was run by a top baseball man who understood it takes a village of top baseball men to build a successful organization. They had top baseball men at all levels whom they trusted to all work towards the same goal in supporting the organization. This era produced many of the impressive results to which you refer.

As those top baseball men aged out and retired, Mo, fairly young compared to the others, rose in power. He eventually was given the top job and it gradually became evident he did not approach building the organization in the same way.

He continued to phase out the remaining top baseball men - it seemed he wanted to show it could be done without a village. I don't know that it was arrogance, but he certainly approached fans with arrogance. It all gives the appearance of someone who wants everyone to know he is smarter than them.

But in any case, the results began to suffer, calling into question whether he qualified as a top baseball man and he responded by doubling down. He promoted experienced coaches to the majors and then pushed them out when results didn't improve. He only hired people with no experience. He has now admitted they took focus off player development, which is baffling for an organization that has the stated goal of building from within. They knew they couldn't compete with the big spenders but they didn't focus on developing.

Ultimately he's leaving the organization in a worse state than how it was when he became the boss. That has to be part of his legacy.

Agree.

[Goldfan]

And if you walk around ST. LOUIS……dressed like a Harvard elitist ready to board your yacht while doing all the above….perhaps you rub people the wrong way.

All the other stuff should rub people the wrong way, but why this? Seriously, who cares how the man dresses?

Do you think this helps if viewed as an arrogant Azzhole anyway??? And if he were winning and making the correct decisions none of this would matter
Mo tells you not to believe your own eyes

[Bomber1]

Red -

The Cardinals style was to trade for players, and if they fit in extend them. They didn’t give longer term contracts to free agents. Then along came the Leake, Fowler and Cecil signings. Which I didn’t like because they were outside the business plan which had been so successful. And none of those 3 fit in well.

When the Cardinals traded Arozarena, he was slashing .358/.435/.593/1,028 at Memphis. I posted at the time that it might have been because he broke the locker room code. What happens in the clubhouse stays in the clubhouse. Then Mo made that strange and revealing comment that they need to “reassess how they rated talent in the minors”.

You post as if the Leake, Fowler, and Cecil signings were the cause of all the organization’s problems.

They weren’t.

You fail to mention other lousy signings like Gregerson, Andrew Miller, the unnecessary and stupid extension of Carpenter who was toast before the extension even began,
As well as hanging on to prospects until they had absolutely zero value to the Cardinals or any other club, and the failure to even contact Scherzer’s camp during the 2014 offseason.

Strong leaders surround themselves with strong people and aren’t afraid of suggestions or criticism.

Mozeliak is and always has been a terrible leader which has become more evident as time has passed.

He is the single biggest reason this organization has gone from the envy of the league to irrelevance.

[desertrat23]

And if you walk around ST. LOUIS……dressed like a Harvard elitist ready to board your yacht while doing all the above….perhaps you rub people the wrong way.

All the other stuff should rub people the wrong way, but why this? Seriously, who cares how the man dresses?

Do you think this helps if viewed as an arrogant Azzhole anyway??? And if he were winning and making the correct decisions none of this would matter
Mo tells you not to believe your own eyes

I don’t think it helps or hurts. What he wears is totally irrelevant.

[imyourhuckleberry]

After the Cards won the NL pennant in 2013 (without Pujols), Mo had job security for life (if he hadn't already had it prior). At that time, he could have hired a management team and empowered them to make decisions based on their skills and expertise and allowing the club to change with the times and evolve.

Instead, for reasons we'll likely never fully know, he chose to dig a foxhole deep and well-fortified and populate it with only himself. Without fresh ideas and the willingness to recognize that the management style that brought the team so much success for the prior 20-odd years was not going the work going forward, the organization stagnated. While his total body of work is matched by very few of his peers, the last decade's worth of mediocrity is on him, and no one else. Whether or not he chooses to see it that way.

I think he reached job security status in 2011. Solidified it in 2012, 2013 & 2014. Then it went off the rails.

At first I was going to go with 2011, but getting back to the Series in the second season post-Pujols, in my opinion, really cemented Mo's position and reputation.

Either way, the rest of the story remains the same.

[Cranny]

Red -

The Cardinals style was to trade for players, and if they fit in extend them. They didn’t give longer term contracts to free agents. Then along came the Leake, Fowler and Cecil signings. Which I didn’t like because they were outside the business plan which had been so successful. And none of those 3 fit in well.

When the Cardinals traded Arozarena, he was slashing .358/.435/.593/1,028 at Memphis. I posted at the time that it might have been because he broke the locker room code. What happens in the clubhouse stays in the clubhouse. Then Mo made that strange and revealing comment that they need to “reassess how they rated talent in the minors”.

No need to lecture me. I've been around just about as long as you and Mo has made some good moves and some bad. It is his "better than you" attitude toward fans and lack of honesty that has always bothered me. Just seems he is not of us a fan.

I'm not lecturing you at all, Red. I'm just reiterating some of the things I said at the time, since it was many moons ago.

[Alex Reyes Cy Young]

Red -

The Cardinals style was to trade for players, and if they fit in extend them. They didn’t give longer term contracts to free agents. Then along came the Leake, Fowler and Cecil signings. Which I didn’t like because they were outside the business plan which had been so successful. And none of those 3 fit in well.

When the Cardinals traded Arozarena, he was slashing .358/.435/.593/1,028 at Memphis. I posted at the time that it might have been because he broke the locker room code. What happens in the clubhouse stays in the clubhouse. Then Mo made that strange and revealing comment that they need to “reassess how they rated talent in the minors”.

No need to lecture me. I've been around just about as long as you and Mo has made some good moves and some bad. It is his "better than you" attitude toward fans and lack of honesty that has always bothered me. Just seems he is not of us a fan.

I'm not lecturing you at all, Red. I'm just reiterating some of the things I said at the time, since it was many moons ago.

Aroz trade has been a disaster.

[No-Mo-Mo]

I'll be honest here. I used to generally like him and i think his overall career has been very good.

For me he just rubs me the wrong way, the smugness. I know that shouldn't bother me but it always has.

To be fair to him i was at a game last year and he was walking down the concourse. Many people saw him. A boy probably 7 years old or so ran up to him and asked for an autograph. He squatted down, signed the hat and seemed genuinely happy to talk to the boy and his dad.

So he's probably a good guy i just think he could have done a little better over the last few years with his public relations and public image

Its probably because of trades he did and did not make, coupled with recent teams not winning and what the persons perceives as arrogance from a tv interviews. Its consistent human behavior.

[OldRed]

Red -

The Cardinals style was to trade for players, and if they fit in extend them. They didn’t give longer term contracts to free agents. Then along came the Leake, Fowler and Cecil signings. Which I didn’t like because they were outside the business plan which had been so successful. And none of those 3 fit in well.

When the Cardinals traded Arozarena, he was slashing .358/.435/.593/1,028 at Memphis. I posted at the time that it might have been because he broke the locker room code. What happens in the clubhouse stays in the clubhouse. Then Mo made that strange and revealing comment that they need to “reassess how they rated talent in the minors”.

No need to lecture me. I've been around just about as long as you and Mo has made some good moves and some bad. It is his "better than you" attitude toward fans and lack of honesty that has always bothered me. Just seems he is not of us a fan.

I'm not lecturing you at all, Red. I'm just reiterating some of the things I said at the time, since it was many moons ago.

Aroz trade has been a disaster.

Cranny's gate swings both ways. He was very much in favor of trading him after his comments.

[Cranny]

Red -

The Cardinals style was to trade for players, and if they fit in extend them. They didn’t give longer term contracts to free agents. Then along came the Leake, Fowler and Cecil signings. Which I didn’t like because they were outside the business plan which had been so successful. And none of those 3 fit in well.

When the Cardinals traded Arozarena, he was slashing .358/.435/.593/1,028 at Memphis. I posted at the time that it might have been because he broke the locker room code. What happens in the clubhouse stays in the clubhouse. Then Mo made that strange and revealing comment that they need to “reassess how they rated talent in the minors”.

No need to lecture me. I've been around just about as long as you and Mo has made some good moves and some bad. It is his "better than you" attitude toward fans and lack of honesty that has always bothered me. Just seems he is not of us a fan.

I'm not lecturing you at all, Red. I'm just reiterating some of the things I said at the time, since it was many moons ago.

Aroz trade has been a disaster.

Cranny's gate swings both ways. He was very much in favor of trading him after his comments.

Actually what I said is that I wouldn’t be surprised if he was traded after he breached clubhouse etiquette.

[Stlcardsblues]

Let me ask posters a question. Mo came to the Cardinals with Walt in 1995. He’s been with the Cardinals in various capacities up and down the organization for 30 years. During that time, the Cardinals have had four losing seasons. Four. And they have been in the World Series 3 times, winning 2 World Championships. He’s been honored by being named MLB Executive of the Year multiple times.

I’ll fully admit that the Cardinals have been disappointing over the past decade, with an abysmal
playoff record (when they even made the playoffs). Very disappointing to fans, including this one.

Criticize the downslide and various moves that didn’t work out, sure. But why all the vicious personal attacks? Cruel and nasty nicknames, making fun of the way he dresses, etc. One poster even wanted to assault him and smash him in the face. Another talked about bird feces on him.

Express disappointment and display frustration, sure, but why all the other nasty personal stuff? Maybe we should recognize both the good and the bad over 30 years.

I can only talk for myself, but have been one of his longest standing critics. I have been pointing out red flag concerns since November 2014. People were so blinded by Matheny hate they couldn’t see the massive warning signs.

In all those years I never resorted to name calling. I find that childish for adults to do. Also never criticized how he dresses. I never understood the fascinations with bow ties (rejected them being part of my wedding), but I never discuss how others dress. I do find him to be extremely condescending and pompous, but never really posted much on that.

I have always chosen to keep my complaints baseball related. The first warning sign that he could not handle player asset management was November 2014 of which Atlanta schooled him a year later.

People point to Alcantara, Garcia and Alcantara for this. It surfaced long before that.

Where I was wrong was I thought Mo was the only issue. I was slow to see that DeWitt was also becoming an issue.

[OldRed]

Red -

The Cardinals style was to trade for players, and if they fit in extend them. They didn’t give longer term contracts to free agents. Then along came the Leake, Fowler and Cecil signings. Which I didn’t like because they were outside the business plan which had been so successful. And none of those 3 fit in well.

When the Cardinals traded Arozarena, he was slashing .358/.435/.593/1,028 at Memphis. I posted at the time that it might have been because he broke the locker room code. What happens in the clubhouse stays in the clubhouse. Then Mo made that strange and revealing comment that they need to “reassess how they rated talent in the minors”.

No need to lecture me. I've been around just about as long as you and Mo has made some good moves and some bad. It is his "better than you" attitude toward fans and lack of honesty that has always bothered me. Just seems he is not of us a fan.

I'm not lecturing you at all, Red. I'm just reiterating some of the things I said at the time, since it was many moons ago.

Aroz trade has been a disaster.

Cranny's gate swings both ways. He was very much in favor of trading him after his comments.

Actually what I said is that I wouldn’t be surprised if he was traded after he breached clubhouse etiquette.

So, you are back tracking? Just as I figured.

Not that much unusual.

[60 year Cardinal fan]

I am a day late, but after reading through these posts I agree with several others that Ordinary Man summed up my feelings very adequately.

[DickyBennett]

Not sure it's a tradeable offense to break a clubhouse code.

Arozarena never had a chance here.