Sorry it's not on the ownership

[Youboughtit]

yanks are a game and a half better than the cards FWIIW,brewers have a better record than the yanks and the same as the mets...

Injuries are the reason for that. Not quality of roster. With 162 games and half the teams making the playoffs some absolutely loaded teams may underperform until Aug and Sept then win a WS. Like 2006 the Cardinals were projected for 100 wins and had 3 HOFers and pitching injuries the got heathy and won it all.

[Barking Lion]

yanks are a game and a half better than the cards FWIIW,brewers have a better record than the yanks and the same as the mets...

Injuries are the reason for that. Not quality of roster. With 162 games and half the teams making the playoffs some absolutely loaded teams may underperform until Aug and Sept then win a WS. Like 2006 the Cardinals were projected for 100 wins and had 3 HOFers and pitching injuries the got heathy and won it all.

Injuries can be blamed for all sorts of things. Remember TON? How about Matz? Injuries are a part of the equation. The Yanks through so much money around that they have nothing behind the pashas. Money must be spent wisely, whether there is a lot or not as much. The Rays do it better than the Cards and I hope Bloom brings that next year. If you are one of those boycotting this year, you are hurting not only the dollars to spend on free agents, but also the willingness of the FO to do so. Do you want Dierbergs' to lower their prices, boycott them and see if it works.

[Barking Lion]

I'll admit that I have no ideas for a solution to change the disparity in revenue. If the League found a way to socialize the team and divide all income, then the players would still go to large markets because that is where they can make the most off endorsements. Play for the Cards and endorse Busch and BJC or play in LA and endorse Busch, Hollywood and international conglomerates.

Let's accept the challenge of being a midmajor market and build a winning team. it is done by building up a farm that readies a lineup of at least six young stars on the way up, signs one to two top end free agents with healthy records, and add 3-4 role players who may be either AAAA-type young players or dirtball veterans who play hard and want to win. This team is at least two seasons from any possibility of that. They are in the down cycle.

[desertrat23]

yanks are a game and a half better than the cards FWIIW,brewers have a better record than the yanks and the same as the mets...

Injuries are the reason for that. Not quality of roster. With 162 games and half the teams making the playoffs some absolutely loaded teams may underperform until Aug and Sept then win a WS. Like 2006 the Cardinals were projected for 100 wins and had 3 HOFers and pitching injuries the got heathy and won it all.

Injuries can be blamed for all sorts of things. Remember TON? How about Matz? Injuries are a part of the equation. The Yanks through so much money around that they have nothing behind the pashas. Money must be spent wisely, whether there is a lot or not as much. The Rays do it better than the Cards and I hope Bloom brings that next year. If you are one of those boycotting this year, you are hurting not only the dollars to spend on free agents, but also the willingness of the FO to do so. Do you want Dierbergs' to lower their prices, boycott them and see if it works.

So, keep spending on an inferior product in hopes they’ll make it a better one? Trust them? They’ve used up all the equity they have with the fanbase.

[Barking Lion]

yanks are a game and a half better than the cards FWIIW,brewers have a better record than the yanks and the same as the mets...

Injuries are the reason for that. Not quality of roster. With 162 games and half the teams making the playoffs some absolutely loaded teams may underperform until Aug and Sept then win a WS. Like 2006 the Cardinals were projected for 100 wins and had 3 HOFers and pitching injuries the got heathy and won it all.

Injuries can be blamed for all sorts of things. Remember TON? How about Matz? Injuries are a part of the equation. The Yanks through so much money around that they have nothing behind the pashas. Money must be spent wisely, whether there is a lot or not as much. The Rays do it better than the Cards and I hope Bloom brings that next year. If you are one of those boycotting this year, you are hurting not only the dollars to spend on free agents, but also the willingness of the FO to do so. Do you want Dierbergs' to lower their prices, boycott them and see if it works.

So, keep spending on an inferior product in hopes they’ll make it a better one? Trust them? They’ve used up all the equity they have with the fanbase.

That is not what I said. I don't trust Mo. He has mismanaged and should have been gone before this season. A few years back, the Cards moved on a guy who wasn't performing. He eventually ended up performing for the Rangers and so he became prime evidence that the Cards give up on young players too soon. Now, they are waiting. I presume that there will be some young players gone after this season because they didn't perform. But, obviously, the Yanks are not doing much better than us right now. They spent all that money for guys to watch the game from the injured list.

[Youboughtit]

yanks are a game and a half better than the cards FWIIW,brewers have a better record than the yanks and the same as the mets...

Injuries are the reason for that. Not quality of roster. With 162 games and half the teams making the playoffs some absolutely loaded teams may underperform until Aug and Sept then win a WS. Like 2006 the Cardinals were projected for 100 wins and had 3 HOFers and pitching injuries the got heathy and won it all.

Injuries can be blamed for all sorts of things. Remember TON? How about Matz? Injuries are a part of the equation. The Yanks through so much money around that they have nothing behind the pashas. Money must be spent wisely, whether there is a lot or not as much. The Rays do it better than the Cards and I hope Bloom brings that next year. If you are one of those boycotting this year, you are hurting not only the dollars to spend on free agents, but also the willingness of the FO to do so. Do you want Dierbergs' to lower their prices, boycott them and see if it works.

I am a consumer. I will buy a product ai want to watch. A legit WS contender or Elite superstars in their prime. When the owner provides that I will go. Spend then fans will attend. Not the other way arround. It’s called vesting in your product so someone wants to buy it.

[desertrat23]

yanks are a game and a half better than the cards FWIIW,brewers have a better record than the yanks and the same as the mets...

Injuries are the reason for that. Not quality of roster. With 162 games and half the teams making the playoffs some absolutely loaded teams may underperform until Aug and Sept then win a WS. Like 2006 the Cardinals were projected for 100 wins and had 3 HOFers and pitching injuries the got heathy and won it all.

Injuries can be blamed for all sorts of things. Remember TON? How about Matz? Injuries are a part of the equation. The Yanks through so much money around that they have nothing behind the pashas. Money must be spent wisely, whether there is a lot or not as much. The Rays do it better than the Cards and I hope Bloom brings that next year. If you are one of those boycotting this year, you are hurting not only the dollars to spend on free agents, but also the willingness of the FO to do so. Do you want Dierbergs' to lower their prices, boycott them and see if it works.

So, keep spending on an inferior product in hopes they’ll make it a better one? Trust them? They’ve used up all the equity they have with the fanbase.

That is not what I said. I don't trust Mo. He has mismanaged and should have been gone before this season. A few years back, the Cards moved on a guy who wasn't performing. He eventually ended up performing for the Rangers and so he became prime evidence that the Cards give up on young players too soon. Now, they are waiting. I presume that there will be some young players gone after this season because they didn't perform. But, obviously, the Yanks are not doing much better than us right now. They spent all that money for guys to watch the game from the injured list.

I guess I don't understand what this means then: "If you are one of those boycotting this year, you are hurting not only the dollars to spend on free agents, but also the willingness of the FO to do so. Do you want Dierbergs' to lower their prices, boycott them and see if it works."

They haven't earned attendance and deserve to be boycotted. If they want to earn attendance, put out a better product. Yeah, you may have to spend the money first. That's how entertainment works.

[Rojo Johnson]

Baseball is broke and it's not getting fixed. The days of doing development better than the big clubs is gone as all the big clubs took notice and invested accordingly. The only teams really in contention are leading their respective division in payroll. Same as last year and will be the same next year. Tampa is the best at small market competition and even they are struggling the last two years. At this point the Cardinals are in no mans land, they can't spend enough to compete and the market they live in will demand competitive teams... not sustainable in todays landscape.

NL East Top payroll Mets & Phillies . First place Phillies followed closely by Mets.
NL Central top payroll Cubs First place Cubs
NL West top payroll Dodgers (followed by Giants) first place Dodgers (followed by Giants)
AL East top payroll Bluejays & Yankees (both top 5) first place Bluejays followed by Yankees
AL Central top payroll tie Tigers and Twins first place Tigers
AL West top payroll Astros first place Astros.

The smoke and mirrors of adding another wildcard to make teams think they are competitive doesn’t do it for me. Baseball just continues to run the sport without the fans in mind. Sad, I’ve been a lifelong baseball fan but I can’t get myself to care much anymore. Ownership has no real chance to have a consistent winner unless you are in a large market. The Dodgers can pay its whole ridiculous payroll with the difference in revenue between the Cardinals and Dodgers. I wish I could just hate DeWitt... instead I hate how baseball is run. Sad

So, you’re saying that it’s Manfred’s fault that Miles received a $55.75 million, 3 year contract from Moe? If you keep making deals like that, it doesn’t matter what “baseball” does to the game. You will never compete if you are as dumb as a rock and you waste your boss’ money by chasing below mediocrity instead of quality. It’s also helpful if your POBO knows something about baseball, which ours does not.

[Barking Lion]

yanks are a game and a half better than the cards FWIIW,brewers have a better record than the yanks and the same as the mets...

Injuries are the reason for that. Not quality of roster. With 162 games and half the teams making the playoffs some absolutely loaded teams may underperform until Aug and Sept then win a WS. Like 2006 the Cardinals were projected for 100 wins and had 3 HOFers and pitching injuries the got heathy and won it all.

Injuries can be blamed for all sorts of things. Remember TON? How about Matz? Injuries are a part of the equation. The Yanks through so much money around that they have nothing behind the pashas. Money must be spent wisely, whether there is a lot or not as much. The Rays do it better than the Cards and I hope Bloom brings that next year. If you are one of those boycotting this year, you are hurting not only the dollars to spend on free agents, but also the willingness of the FO to do so. Do you want Dierbergs' to lower their prices, boycott them and see if it works.

So, keep spending on an inferior product in hopes they’ll make it a better one? Trust them? They’ve used up all the equity they have with the fanbase.

That is not what I said. I don't trust Mo. He has mismanaged and should have been gone before this season. A few years back, the Cards moved on a guy who wasn't performing. He eventually ended up performing for the Rangers and so he became prime evidence that the Cards give up on young players too soon. Now, they are waiting. I presume that there will be some young players gone after this season because they didn't perform. But, obviously, the Yanks are not doing much better than us right now. They spent all that money for guys to watch the game from the injured list.

I guess I don't understand what this means then: "If you are one of those boycotting this year, you are hurting not only the dollars to spend on free agents, but also the willingness of the FO to do so. Do you want Dierbergs' to lower their prices, boycott them and see if it works."

They haven't earned attendance and deserve to be boycotted. If they want to earn attendance, put out a better product. Yeah, you may have to spend the money first. That's how entertainment works.

Every individual is a consumer. Each person will choose whether they want to pay to see this team (or any team, for that matter). I salute those choices every day. But last season there was a vocal group here that called for a boycott, telling everyone that leaving the seats empty was the only way to get through to ownership. That is what my comment addresses.

[desertrat23]

yanks are a game and a half better than the cards FWIIW,brewers have a better record than the yanks and the same as the mets...

Injuries are the reason for that. Not quality of roster. With 162 games and half the teams making the playoffs some absolutely loaded teams may underperform until Aug and Sept then win a WS. Like 2006 the Cardinals were projected for 100 wins and had 3 HOFers and pitching injuries the got heathy and won it all.

Injuries can be blamed for all sorts of things. Remember TON? How about Matz? Injuries are a part of the equation. The Yanks through so much money around that they have nothing behind the pashas. Money must be spent wisely, whether there is a lot or not as much. The Rays do it better than the Cards and I hope Bloom brings that next year. If you are one of those boycotting this year, you are hurting not only the dollars to spend on free agents, but also the willingness of the FO to do so. Do you want Dierbergs' to lower their prices, boycott them and see if it works.

So, keep spending on an inferior product in hopes they’ll make it a better one? Trust them? They’ve used up all the equity they have with the fanbase.

That is not what I said. I don't trust Mo. He has mismanaged and should have been gone before this season. A few years back, the Cards moved on a guy who wasn't performing. He eventually ended up performing for the Rangers and so he became prime evidence that the Cards give up on young players too soon. Now, they are waiting. I presume that there will be some young players gone after this season because they didn't perform. But, obviously, the Yanks are not doing much better than us right now. They spent all that money for guys to watch the game from the injured list.

I guess I don't understand what this means then: "If you are one of those boycotting this year, you are hurting not only the dollars to spend on free agents, but also the willingness of the FO to do so. Do you want Dierbergs' to lower their prices, boycott them and see if it works."

They haven't earned attendance and deserve to be boycotted. If they want to earn attendance, put out a better product. Yeah, you may have to spend the money first. That's how entertainment works.

Every individual is a consumer. Each person will choose whether they want to pay to see this team (or any team, for that matter). I salute those choices every day. But last season there was a vocal group here that called for a boycott, telling everyone that leaving the seats empty was the only way to get through to ownership. That is what my comment addresses.

Gotcha. And I agree with the boycotters. Clearly it’s not hurting the DeWitts enough yet.

[Barking Lion]

yanks are a game and a half better than the cards FWIIW,brewers have a better record than the yanks and the same as the mets...

Injuries are the reason for that. Not quality of roster. With 162 games and half the teams making the playoffs some absolutely loaded teams may underperform until Aug and Sept then win a WS. Like 2006 the Cardinals were projected for 100 wins and had 3 HOFers and pitching injuries the got heathy and won it all.

Injuries can be blamed for all sorts of things. Remember TON? How about Matz? Injuries are a part of the equation. The Yanks through so much money around that they have nothing behind the pashas. Money must be spent wisely, whether there is a lot or not as much. The Rays do it better than the Cards and I hope Bloom brings that next year. If you are one of those boycotting this year, you are hurting not only the dollars to spend on free agents, but also the willingness of the FO to do so. Do you want Dierbergs' to lower their prices, boycott them and see if it works.

So, keep spending on an inferior product in hopes they’ll make it a better one? Trust them? They’ve used up all the equity they have with the fanbase.

That is not what I said. I don't trust Mo. He has mismanaged and should have been gone before this season. A few years back, the Cards moved on a guy who wasn't performing. He eventually ended up performing for the Rangers and so he became prime evidence that the Cards give up on young players too soon. Now, they are waiting. I presume that there will be some young players gone after this season because they didn't perform. But, obviously, the Yanks are not doing much better than us right now. They spent all that money for guys to watch the game from the injured list.

I guess I don't understand what this means then: "If you are one of those boycotting this year, you are hurting not only the dollars to spend on free agents, but also the willingness of the FO to do so. Do you want Dierbergs' to lower their prices, boycott them and see if it works."

They haven't earned attendance and deserve to be boycotted. If they want to earn attendance, put out a better product. Yeah, you may have to spend the money first. That's how entertainment works.

Every individual is a consumer. Each person will choose whether they want to pay to see this team (or any team, for that matter). I salute those choices every day. But last season there was a vocal group here that called for a boycott, telling everyone that leaving the seats empty was the only way to get through to ownership. That is what my comment addresses.

Gotcha. And I agree with the boycotters. Clearly it’s not hurting the DeWitts enough yet.

You can agree with them all you want. It certainly helps your bottom line to not go to games. But it is foolish to think that it will help provide more revenue to spend on players.

[desertrat23]

yanks are a game and a half better than the cards FWIIW,brewers have a better record than the yanks and the same as the mets...

Injuries are the reason for that. Not quality of roster. With 162 games and half the teams making the playoffs some absolutely loaded teams may underperform until Aug and Sept then win a WS. Like 2006 the Cardinals were projected for 100 wins and had 3 HOFers and pitching injuries the got heathy and won it all.

Injuries can be blamed for all sorts of things. Remember TON? How about Matz? Injuries are a part of the equation. The Yanks through so much money around that they have nothing behind the pashas. Money must be spent wisely, whether there is a lot or not as much. The Rays do it better than the Cards and I hope Bloom brings that next year. If you are one of those boycotting this year, you are hurting not only the dollars to spend on free agents, but also the willingness of the FO to do so. Do you want Dierbergs' to lower their prices, boycott them and see if it works.

So, keep spending on an inferior product in hopes they’ll make it a better one? Trust them? They’ve used up all the equity they have with the fanbase.

That is not what I said. I don't trust Mo. He has mismanaged and should have been gone before this season. A few years back, the Cards moved on a guy who wasn't performing. He eventually ended up performing for the Rangers and so he became prime evidence that the Cards give up on young players too soon. Now, they are waiting. I presume that there will be some young players gone after this season because they didn't perform. But, obviously, the Yanks are not doing much better than us right now. They spent all that money for guys to watch the game from the injured list.

I guess I don't understand what this means then: "If you are one of those boycotting this year, you are hurting not only the dollars to spend on free agents, but also the willingness of the FO to do so. Do you want Dierbergs' to lower their prices, boycott them and see if it works."

They haven't earned attendance and deserve to be boycotted. If they want to earn attendance, put out a better product. Yeah, you may have to spend the money first. That's how entertainment works.

Every individual is a consumer. Each person will choose whether they want to pay to see this team (or any team, for that matter). I salute those choices every day. But last season there was a vocal group here that called for a boycott, telling everyone that leaving the seats empty was the only way to get through to ownership. That is what my comment addresses.

Gotcha. And I agree with the boycotters. Clearly it’s not hurting the DeWitts enough yet.

You can agree with them all you want. It certainly helps your bottom line to not go to games. But it is foolish to think that it will help provide more revenue to spend on players.

Well, attendance is earned. So we’re at impasse…

[Ozziesfan41]

yanks are a game and a half better than the cards FWIIW,brewers have a better record than the yanks and the same as the mets...

Injuries are the reason for that. Not quality of roster. With 162 games and half the teams making the playoffs some absolutely loaded teams may underperform until Aug and Sept then win a WS. Like 2006 the Cardinals were projected for 100 wins and had 3 HOFers and pitching injuries the got heathy and won it all.

Injuries can be blamed for all sorts of things. Remember TON? How about Matz? Injuries are a part of the equation. The Yanks through so much money around that they have nothing behind the pashas. Money must be spent wisely, whether there is a lot or not as much. The Rays do it better than the Cards and I hope Bloom brings that next year. If you are one of those boycotting this year, you are hurting not only the dollars to spend on free agents, but also the willingness of the FO to do so. Do you want Dierbergs' to lower their prices, boycott them and see if it works.

So, keep spending on an inferior product in hopes they’ll make it a better one? Trust them? They’ve used up all the equity they have with the fanbase.

That is not what I said. I don't trust Mo. He has mismanaged and should have been gone before this season. A few years back, the Cards moved on a guy who wasn't performing. He eventually ended up performing for the Rangers and so he became prime evidence that the Cards give up on young players too soon. Now, they are waiting. I presume that there will be some young players gone after this season because they didn't perform. But, obviously, the Yanks are not doing much better than us right now. They spent all that money for guys to watch the game from the injured list.

I guess I don't understand what this means then: "If you are one of those boycotting this year, you are hurting not only the dollars to spend on free agents, but also the willingness of the FO to do so. Do you want Dierbergs' to lower their prices, boycott them and see if it works."

They haven't earned attendance and deserve to be boycotted. If they want to earn attendance, put out a better product. Yeah, you may have to spend the money first. That's how entertainment works.

Every individual is a consumer. Each person will choose whether they want to pay to see this team (or any team, for that matter). I salute those choices every day. But last season there was a vocal group here that called for a boycott, telling everyone that leaving the seats empty was the only way to get through to ownership. That is what my comment addresses.

Gotcha. And I agree with the boycotters. Clearly it’s not hurting the DeWitts enough yet.

You can agree with them all you want. It certainly helps your bottom line to not go to games. But it is foolish to think that it will help provide more revenue to spend on players.

Well, attendance is earned. So we’re at impasse…

+1 sell a substandard product people aren’t going to buy it. Sell a good product they will. The cards attendance was down when Dewitt and company bought the team he was hungry then cards went on spending spree made exciting moves hired a great manger and fans came back you would think he would remember that but I guess he doesn’t

[desertrat23]

yanks are a game and a half better than the cards FWIIW,brewers have a better record than the yanks and the same as the mets...

Injuries are the reason for that. Not quality of roster. With 162 games and half the teams making the playoffs some absolutely loaded teams may underperform until Aug and Sept then win a WS. Like 2006 the Cardinals were projected for 100 wins and had 3 HOFers and pitching injuries the got heathy and won it all.

Injuries can be blamed for all sorts of things. Remember TON? How about Matz? Injuries are a part of the equation. The Yanks through so much money around that they have nothing behind the pashas. Money must be spent wisely, whether there is a lot or not as much. The Rays do it better than the Cards and I hope Bloom brings that next year. If you are one of those boycotting this year, you are hurting not only the dollars to spend on free agents, but also the willingness of the FO to do so. Do you want Dierbergs' to lower their prices, boycott them and see if it works.

So, keep spending on an inferior product in hopes they’ll make it a better one? Trust them? They’ve used up all the equity they have with the fanbase.

That is not what I said. I don't trust Mo. He has mismanaged and should have been gone before this season. A few years back, the Cards moved on a guy who wasn't performing. He eventually ended up performing for the Rangers and so he became prime evidence that the Cards give up on young players too soon. Now, they are waiting. I presume that there will be some young players gone after this season because they didn't perform. But, obviously, the Yanks are not doing much better than us right now. They spent all that money for guys to watch the game from the injured list.

I guess I don't understand what this means then: "If you are one of those boycotting this year, you are hurting not only the dollars to spend on free agents, but also the willingness of the FO to do so. Do you want Dierbergs' to lower their prices, boycott them and see if it works."

They haven't earned attendance and deserve to be boycotted. If they want to earn attendance, put out a better product. Yeah, you may have to spend the money first. That's how entertainment works.

Every individual is a consumer. Each person will choose whether they want to pay to see this team (or any team, for that matter). I salute those choices every day. But last season there was a vocal group here that called for a boycott, telling everyone that leaving the seats empty was the only way to get through to ownership. That is what my comment addresses.

Gotcha. And I agree with the boycotters. Clearly it’s not hurting the DeWitts enough yet.

You can agree with them all you want. It certainly helps your bottom line to not go to games. But it is foolish to think that it will help provide more revenue to spend on players.

Well, attendance is earned. So we’re at impasse…

+1 sell a substandard product people aren’t going to buy it. Sell a good product they will. The cards attendance was down when Dewitt and company bought the team he was hungry then cards went on spending spree made exciting moves hired a great manger and fans came back you would think he would remember that but I guess he doesn’t

Yes, the winter of 1995-96. They went out and got Tony, Ron Gant, Gary Gaetti, Andy Benes, Todd Stottlemyre, Dennis Eckersley, etc. They sent a message to the fanbase that they were serious and were rewarded with a jump from 7th in the NL in attendance in 1995 to 4th.

It ain't hard to win over Cardinals fans. All you gotta do is try, even a little bit.

[shebashab]

Long term it seems like MLB will combine local tv rights into one pool so they can sell them together rather than each team selling them. If that’s the case I’d assume tv revenue would be shared more evenly than it currently is which fixes the revenue disparity issue. Salary cap isn’t the answer.

In the meantime there’s no reason why the cardinals can’t spend in the 8-12 place payroll range which is enough to put together playoff teams regularly with a competent front office. That last part is what’s missing but that change is a month away.

So….the Dodgers and Yankees are going to share their enormous T V revenue with small markets?

Not going to happen…..but, I am interested is hearing what their motivation would be.

That's the problem the motivation for every Major League Baseball club owner is their own pocketbook. Other leagues function with the league in mind. That's not the case for baseball

[shebashab]

RE:

TAMPA RAYS

I live an hour from Tampa, sadly they aren't as competitive and the are going to be relocated soon. But they played small ball the longest and best.

Where are they going?

Tampa has been threatening to play half of their games in Canada for years. The hurricane ruined to their stadium and the City will not build them a new one. They had an air conditioned stadium that was absolutely great to watch games in and yet nobody came.